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... what doubt here? They kidnapped people - this guy recorded his “arrest”, unlike the people who did the kidnapping. At no point did these people identify t
by olliej 6y ago
... what doubt here?
They kidnapped people - this guy recorded his “arrest”, unlike the people who did the kidnapping.
At no point did these people identify themselves or their agency - no names, no badge numbers.
At no point did they say what they were arresting people for.
I am genuinely curious: what is your “doubt” here? What part of this seems legal, let alone ethical?
- tptacek 6y agoAre the police required to tell you why they're arresting you? Here's a resource on your rights if you're confronted by the police (or any agent of the government, one supposes): https://www.aclu.org/know-your-rights/stopped-by-police/#ive-been-stopped-by-the-police-in-public https://www.aclu.org/know-your-rights/stopped-by-police/#ive...
- stonogo 6y agoWhat evidence do you have that these are police?
- JoeSmithson 6y agoIt says "POLICE" on their uniforms
- stonogo 6y agoLike this? https://www.amazon.com/dp/B085485BKV https://www.amazon.com/dp/B085485BKV That's sufficient for you?
- JoeSmithson 6y agoIt's always possible to impersonate police, I'm not sure what your point is? Wearing what the officers in the video are wearing - uniform with a prominent POLICE label - is sufficient to be identifying yourself as police, and would be impersonating a police officer if a member of the public did it.
- olliej 6y agoSo you agree that they're breaking the law by impersonating police?
- JoeSmithson 6y agoIf they don't have police powers, then yes.
- olliej 6y agoNo, a badge that says "police" is not a police badge. Police badges have the name of the police department, and the badge number. These are clearly toys. And if you were to say "this is reasonably interpreted as police" then you have federal agents committing a felony - pretending to be police officers.
- pstuart 6y agoIt feels like an enhanced version of "you can beat the rap but you can't beat the ride". I think this is practice for a national program.
- pstuart 6y agoI'm not the only one: https://www.esquire.com/news-politics/politics/a33347230/portland-oregon-protesters-detained/ https://www.esquire.com/news-politics/politics/a33347230/por...
- olliej 6y agoThey are required to tell you that they're arresting you (it's unclear if they were actually saying that), they're required to tell you who is arresting you, they're required to have probably cause, they're required to document it.
- tptacek 6y agoAre they required to tell you who is arresting you at the moment of your arrest? Is that a local rule?
- SpicyLemonZest 6y agoAgain, I agree the video looks pretty bad, but these aren't peaceful protests that the article is describing. The protesters have repeatedly attacked officers and tried to destroy the courthouse. In such a volatile situation, I can imagine reasons why military police might need to quickly and urgently arrest the guy - maybe someone who looked similar had a weapon or explosive.
- pstuart 6y agoWhen you keep framing the protests as riots you delegitimize what's going on. US Police forces are out of control and unaccountable for their actions. We've seen reporters arrested live on the air for simply reporting on the scene. There's plenty of evidence linking lots of police to the white nationalist movement, so lets stop pretending like they're all impartial enforcers of justice. There's also the issue of agents provocateur. It's definitely happening and in fact having "riots" is exactly what the police want, because it gives them literal license to shut down any protest. So just stop with the "but the riots!" A quick search brings up the following but I'm sure there's plenty more info if one were to dig deeper: https://www.marketwatch.com/story/us-officials-investigate-protest-disinformation-possible-agents-provocateur-2020-05-31 https://www.marketwatch.com/story/us-officials-investigate-p...
- SpicyLemonZest 6y agoI've been asked not to get into shouting matches on this site, so I'll stop at agreeing with your first line. I intend to delegitimize what's going on, since anyone protesting in Portland right now is providing cover for bad actors trying to do real harm.
- pstuart 6y agoI too don't want to get in a shouting match but you interestingly disregarded my second point (let alone the others). Here is a clip of a notable instance (CNN reporter and crew arrested, live): https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TIClA57jWmQ https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TIClA57jWmQ If this doesn't bother you, then you are beyond reasoning with.
- tunesmith 6y agoThe detained this guy, then had no records of detaining him and denied they detained him. So I'm not even sure you can say they are law enforcement.