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For several (3) years now I have had no reason to update my desktop with a i7-6700k because single core performance has remained relatively flat (in fact my par

For several (3) years now I have had no reason to update my desktop with a i7-6700k because single core performance has remained relatively flat (in fact my particular processor has quite good single core rating still). I would have liked increased cores but the reduction in single-threaded performance wasn't worth it. Zen 2 changed all of that... Now EVERY single Zen 2 chip is at least smidge faster than my 6700k in single threaded benchmarks AND close to 100% faster in multi-core benchmarks. So for $180 I can buy something that takes a huge meaningful shit on my (fairly nice at the time) 6700k (~$350 when I purchased it). That's just crazy to me how much performance I can get for so little. I'm going to buy something beastly with at least 16 cores, but! I also plan on building a little cluster using mini-itx B550 boards and the 3300x. In fact, I'll probably build the little cluster first, because each 3300X is still faster than my 6700k and the total cost per system will be like $450!!one! It hasn't been since the orig Core-2-Duo days I've gotten such a meaningful upgrade for so little. Plus, when Zen 3 comes out it's a drop in upgrade. AMD is delivering insane value to their consumers, and I love it. I just wish I could buy a Zen 2 chip in a laptop that doesn't look like it was made for a fourteen year old (no offense to any fourteen year olds). I heard someone say the lack of 4k and more professional style laptops could be Intel back-channel fuckery, but... there's also a chance no-one expected AMD, in a single fucking generation of CPUs, to sweep every single market.

edraferi 6y ago
> I just wish I could buy a Zen 2 chip in a laptop that doesn't look like it was made for a fourteen year old (no offense to any fourteen year olds). I heard someone say the lack of 4k and more professional style laptops could be Intel back-channel fuckery, Lenovo just released a couple ThinkPads peered by AMD Ryzen 7 Pro CPUs: T495, T495s and X395. They don’t have 4K screens though. https://arstechnica.com/gadgets/2019/05/lenovo-adds-amd-ryzen-pro-powered-laptops-to-its-thinkpad-family/ https://arstechnica.com/gadgets/2019/05/lenovo-adds-amd-ryze...
- BoysenberryPi 6y ago
  4K screens on laptops don't make sense to me. They are too small to get maximum value out of. 1440p is more than enough.
  - 0xffff2 6y ago
    I absolutely benefit from a 4k screen even in a small form factor. 768p is "enough" in the sense that we all got stuff done on such screens for many years, but the increase in text rendering quality with higher PPI screens is tremendously worth it to me for the reduced eyestrain. 4k is still noticeably better than 1440p. I wouldn't be surprised if 8k is noticeably better still (although with swiftly diminishing returns of course).
    - londons_explore 6y ago
      The reverse is also kinda true... Many people when they say "I like high resolution" mean "I like to fit lots of stuff on the screen at once". If you're in the latter crowd, you can configure X or Wayland to render to a 4k screen buffer, and then downscale to fit the actual screen. Yes, downscaling no longer means 1 pixel=1 pixel, which introduces some blur, but unless you're a 20/20 vision kind of person, I doubt you'd be able to tell without your nose touching the screen...
  - dboreham 6y ago
    Hmm. You might want to get an eye test. Not being snarky: when I was 45 or so, having had "perfect" eyesight, someone suggested I get mine tested. Turns out most people loose the ability to focus at short distances with age, but the brain doesn't clue you in. Not being able to tell the difference between 1440 and 4k would be consistent with this. For me even at 13" screen size 4k is very obviously better for coding.
    - Dahoon 6y ago
      With a 55" screen you'd have to be within 3.5 feet to be able to see a difference with 4k. So no eye test needed. Your brain is either lying to you or the 4k screen you tested with is better than the non-4k you used. http://carltonbale.com/does-4k-resolution-matter/ http://carltonbale.com/does-4k-resolution-matter/
- effable 6y ago
  The T495 / X395 series is based on Zen+ (Ryzen 3000 mobile) chips and not Zen 2 (Ryzen 4000 mobile) - I know the naming is confusing given that the 3000 series desktop chips are Zen 2. However, Lenovo has announced ThinkPads based on Zen 2, such as models in the rebranded T14 lineup, but they have not been released yet. https://www.anandtech.com/show/15772/new-lenovo-thinkpad-range-with-ryzen-4000-4000-pro-mobile https://www.anandtech.com/show/15772/new-lenovo-thinkpad-ran...
bufferoverflow 6y ago
> i7-6700k because single core performance has remained relatively flat Well, it hasn't improved tremendously, but it hasn't remained flat. You can get around 20% more in single core performance, if it's so important to you. https://www.cpubenchmark.net/singleThread.html https://www.cpubenchmark.net/singleThread.html https://browser.geekbench.com/processor-benchmarks https://browser.geekbench.com/processor-benchmarks https://www.cpu-monkey.com/en/cpu_benchmark-cinebench_r15_single_core-7 https://www.cpu-monkey.com/en/cpu_benchmark-cinebench_r15_si...
- jsf01 6y ago
  20% over 3 years—ouch.
  - baq 6y ago
    Probably more with meltdown mitigations on.
kushalpandya 6y ago
Lack of "acceptable high end" Zen 2 laptops is my gripe too. From what I understand, it is following 2 reasons; 1. Intel/nVidia Contracts have OEMs their hands tied (which explains capped GPU in most Zen 2 laptops). 2. Lack of widespread Thunderbolt 3 support on AMD. While I'm fully bought on reason 1., reason 2. is still hard to digest as one can still ship laptop with USB-C port supporting PD and DisplayPort (w/ alternate mode) and call it a day, and most users won't mind. I hope Zen 3 causes the power shift on laptops.
- johncalvinyoung 6y ago
  I also noticed that the current Ryzen mobile 4000 series tops out at 32GB of memory supported, which sadly excludes them from even possibly being in the 2020 16” MBP since Apple’s already been selling 64GB systems. :/
  - chupasaurus 6y ago
    All desktop Ryzen CPUs as well as mobos with 4 DDR slots support 128GB of memory (and there are reports that dmidecode shows the support of 256GB on some) but sadly there is no info on that for the laptops.
- dlevine 6y ago
  Have been thinking strongly about the ROG Zephyrus 14 (cheaper and better than the 13" MBP in almost every way). But don't think I can stomach not having the webcam built-in (do way too many Zoom calls).
- zihotki 6y ago
  Lack of Thunderbolt is caused solely by Intel not sharing it.
Roritharr 6y ago
I don't know what's wrong with me, but I want to atleast buy a 1400€ 24core 3960x Threadripper, because of the insane upgradability. The idea that in 2-3 years i could just buy a used 3970 or even a 3990 to more than double the core count is amazing to me, and knowing that prohibits me from having my mind blown by the insane value of the smaller Ryzens.
btgeekboy 6y ago
I too was rocking the Skylake series (6600K for me though). However, I upgraded for two reasons - I went to the 3700X for twice as many cores, and the 6th gen Intel series can’t keep up with h265 like 7th gen plus.
sandworm101 6y ago
>> I just wish I could buy a Zen 2 chip in a laptop that doesn't look like it was made for a fourteen year old (no offense to any fourteen year olds) I just wish I could buy a decent motherboard that doesn't look like a 14yo's first attempt at drawing an f-35. My current rig does this weird glowing thing at night when it is supposed to be off. For my next machine I would honestly pay more to NOT have RGB support.
- frostburg 6y ago
  You can, but it's surprisingly hard to do so. There is the Asus Pro WS X570-ACE for current AMD consumer parts, but try to find a sTRX4 one for your 4000$ cpu that doesn't look like it's going to transform into a giant robot.
- m0zg 6y ago
  I agree it's annoying, but you _can_ turn it off in the bios.
- vetinari 6y ago
  Check Asrock Rack series motherboards, like https://www.asrockrack.com/general/productdetail.asp?Model=X470D4U https://www.asrockrack.com/general/productdetail.asp?Model=X... (am4) or https://www.asrockrack.com/general/productdetail.asp?Model=X399D8A-2T https://www.asrockrack.com/general/productdetail.asp?Model=X... (tr4). It is minus the RGB and plus IPMI.
  - sandworm101 6y ago
    Those are server boards. They lack some basic 'desktop' features like AIO control. I also need more than a pair of USB connections. I did get a laugh out of the integrated graphics, probably the lowest specs on the market: "DDR4 16MB" - that's not a typo. I'm a little interested in how that is accomplished. Can one allocated a 16MB chunk of DDR4?
    - vetinari 6y ago
      Server or workstation; AIO falls gently into RGB gamer territory. The integrated graphics is for BMC, not for the console.
deleted 6y ago
[deleted]
zaat 6y ago
Pro tip: sell your used 6700k on ebay. Somewhere, someone can put it to good use, and judging by the latest closed deals on this model, you can easily sell it for something like $225.
Synaesthesia 6y ago
But what are you going to do that your 6700K couldn’t do already? It’s only slightly faster in aI by le threaded. More cores, great, if you’re rendering video or 3D or compiling all day.
- pbowyer 6y ago
  You're a welcome voice of reason in this thread :)
burnte 6y ago
I upgraded to a 3600X. I use an 8th gen 6 core chip at work. This 3600X murders the Intel daily. The speed is insane. At work I run off an SSD with Optane acceleration, my home machines with the 3600X and NVME just kills my work machine, which itself is no slouch. I've never been so impressed with a brand new machine, and I've been building them since 1990.

edraferi 6y ago

> I just wish I could buy a Zen 2 chip in a laptop that doesn't look like it was made for a fourteen year old (no offense to any fourteen year olds). I heard someone say the lack of 4k and more professional style laptops could be Intel back-channel fuckery, Lenovo just released a couple ThinkPads peered by AMD Ryzen 7 Pro CPUs: T495, T495s and X395. They don’t have 4K screens though. https://arstechnica.com/gadgets/2019/05/lenovo-adds-amd-ryzen-pro-powered-laptops-to-its-thinkpad-family/ https://arstechnica.com/gadgets/2019/05/lenovo-adds-amd-ryze...

BoysenberryPi 6y ago
4K screens on laptops don't make sense to me. They are too small to get maximum value out of. 1440p is more than enough.
- 0xffff2 6y ago
  I absolutely benefit from a 4k screen even in a small form factor. 768p is "enough" in the sense that we all got stuff done on such screens for many years, but the increase in text rendering quality with higher PPI screens is tremendously worth it to me for the reduced eyestrain. 4k is still noticeably better than 1440p. I wouldn't be surprised if 8k is noticeably better still (although with swiftly diminishing returns of course).
  - londons_explore 6y ago
    The reverse is also kinda true... Many people when they say "I like high resolution" mean "I like to fit lots of stuff on the screen at once". If you're in the latter crowd, you can configure X or Wayland to render to a 4k screen buffer, and then downscale to fit the actual screen. Yes, downscaling no longer means 1 pixel=1 pixel, which introduces some blur, but unless you're a 20/20 vision kind of person, I doubt you'd be able to tell without your nose touching the screen...
- dboreham 6y ago
  Hmm. You might want to get an eye test. Not being snarky: when I was 45 or so, having had "perfect" eyesight, someone suggested I get mine tested. Turns out most people loose the ability to focus at short distances with age, but the brain doesn't clue you in. Not being able to tell the difference between 1440 and 4k would be consistent with this. For me even at 13" screen size 4k is very obviously better for coding.
  - Dahoon 6y ago
    With a 55" screen you'd have to be within 3.5 feet to be able to see a difference with 4k. So no eye test needed. Your brain is either lying to you or the 4k screen you tested with is better than the non-4k you used. http://carltonbale.com/does-4k-resolution-matter/ http://carltonbale.com/does-4k-resolution-matter/
effable 6y ago
The T495 / X395 series is based on Zen+ (Ryzen 3000 mobile) chips and not Zen 2 (Ryzen 4000 mobile) - I know the naming is confusing given that the 3000 series desktop chips are Zen 2. However, Lenovo has announced ThinkPads based on Zen 2, such as models in the rebranded T14 lineup, but they have not been released yet. https://www.anandtech.com/show/15772/new-lenovo-thinkpad-range-with-ryzen-4000-4000-pro-mobile https://www.anandtech.com/show/15772/new-lenovo-thinkpad-ran...

bufferoverflow 6y ago

> i7-6700k because single core performance has remained relatively flat Well, it hasn't improved tremendously, but it hasn't remained flat. You can get around 20% more in single core performance, if it's so important to you. https://www.cpubenchmark.net/singleThread.html https://www.cpubenchmark.net/singleThread.html https://browser.geekbench.com/processor-benchmarks https://browser.geekbench.com/processor-benchmarks https://www.cpu-monkey.com/en/cpu_benchmark-cinebench_r15_single_core-7 https://www.cpu-monkey.com/en/cpu_benchmark-cinebench_r15_si...

jsf01 6y ago
20% over 3 years—ouch.
- baq 6y ago
  Probably more with meltdown mitigations on.

kushalpandya 6y ago

Lack of "acceptable high end" Zen 2 laptops is my gripe too. From what I understand, it is following 2 reasons; 1. Intel/nVidia Contracts have OEMs their hands tied (which explains capped GPU in most Zen 2 laptops). 2. Lack of widespread Thunderbolt 3 support on AMD. While I'm fully bought on reason 1., reason 2. is still hard to digest as one can still ship laptop with USB-C port supporting PD and DisplayPort (w/ alternate mode) and call it a day, and most users won't mind. I hope Zen 3 causes the power shift on laptops.

johncalvinyoung 6y ago
I also noticed that the current Ryzen mobile 4000 series tops out at 32GB of memory supported, which sadly excludes them from even possibly being in the 2020 16” MBP since Apple’s already been selling 64GB systems. :/
- chupasaurus 6y ago
  All desktop Ryzen CPUs as well as mobos with 4 DDR slots support 128GB of memory (and there are reports that dmidecode shows the support of 256GB on some) but sadly there is no info on that for the laptops.
dlevine 6y ago
Have been thinking strongly about the ROG Zephyrus 14 (cheaper and better than the 13" MBP in almost every way). But don't think I can stomach not having the webcam built-in (do way too many Zoom calls).
zihotki 6y ago
Lack of Thunderbolt is caused solely by Intel not sharing it.

Roritharr 6y ago

I don't know what's wrong with me, but I want to atleast buy a 1400€ 24core 3960x Threadripper, because of the insane upgradability. The idea that in 2-3 years i could just buy a used 3970 or even a 3990 to more than double the core count is amazing to me, and knowing that prohibits me from having my mind blown by the insane value of the smaller Ryzens.

btgeekboy 6y ago

I too was rocking the Skylake series (6600K for me though). However, I upgraded for two reasons - I went to the 3700X for twice as many cores, and the 6th gen Intel series can’t keep up with h265 like 7th gen plus.

sandworm101 6y ago

>> I just wish I could buy a Zen 2 chip in a laptop that doesn't look like it was made for a fourteen year old (no offense to any fourteen year olds) I just wish I could buy a decent motherboard that doesn't look like a 14yo's first attempt at drawing an f-35. My current rig does this weird glowing thing at night when it is supposed to be off. For my next machine I would honestly pay more to NOT have RGB support.

frostburg 6y ago
You can, but it's surprisingly hard to do so. There is the Asus Pro WS X570-ACE for current AMD consumer parts, but try to find a sTRX4 one for your 4000$ cpu that doesn't look like it's going to transform into a giant robot.
m0zg 6y ago
I agree it's annoying, but you _can_ turn it off in the bios.
vetinari 6y ago
Check Asrock Rack series motherboards, like https://www.asrockrack.com/general/productdetail.asp?Model=X470D4U https://www.asrockrack.com/general/productdetail.asp?Model=X... (am4) or https://www.asrockrack.com/general/productdetail.asp?Model=X399D8A-2T https://www.asrockrack.com/general/productdetail.asp?Model=X... (tr4). It is minus the RGB and plus IPMI.
- sandworm101 6y ago
  Those are server boards. They lack some basic 'desktop' features like AIO control. I also need more than a pair of USB connections. I did get a laugh out of the integrated graphics, probably the lowest specs on the market: "DDR4 16MB" - that's not a typo. I'm a little interested in how that is accomplished. Can one allocated a 16MB chunk of DDR4?
  - vetinari 6y ago
    Server or workstation; AIO falls gently into RGB gamer territory. The integrated graphics is for BMC, not for the console.

deleted 6y ago

[deleted]

zaat 6y ago

Pro tip: sell your used 6700k on ebay. Somewhere, someone can put it to good use, and judging by the latest closed deals on this model, you can easily sell it for something like $225.

Synaesthesia 6y ago

But what are you going to do that your 6700K couldn’t do already? It’s only slightly faster in aI by le threaded. More cores, great, if you’re rendering video or 3D or compiling all day.

pbowyer 6y ago
You're a welcome voice of reason in this thread :)

burnte 6y ago

I upgraded to a 3600X. I use an 8th gen 6 core chip at work. This 3600X murders the Intel daily. The speed is insane. At work I run off an SSD with Optane acceleration, my home machines with the 3600X and NVME just kills my work machine, which itself is no slouch. I've never been so impressed with a brand new machine, and I've been building them since 1990.