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Studies find having kids makes people less happy
- ivankirigin 18y agoHappiness studies aren't worth your time. Also, generalizations about the lives of others make bad advice.
- DaniFong 18y agoAre self-filled surveys accurate in finding out whether someone is happy? I my experience, verbal responses, action and body language often contradict each other. Which is right?
- newt0311 18y agowrong. See http://econlog.econlib.org/archives/2008/06/selection_bias_1.html http://econlog.econlib.org/archives/2008/06/selection_bias_1...
- Tichy 18y agoDon't forget cognitive dissonance: if you have paid a price for something, you have to tell yourself it was worthwhile, or you would feel like an idiot. Hence I am not sure if statements of parents about their happiness can be believed. Much better to measure these things indirectly (without a questionnaire). I don't know how the cited study did it.
- smanek 18y agoYou're wrong. The article cites longitudinal studies showing randomly selected couples are happier before they have kids and after kids leave the house than while the kids are home. It shows a significant portion of randomly selected parents would rather do chores (e.g., grocery shopping) than spend time with their kids. Neither of those is adequately explained by selection bias. Selection bias may explain why childless couples, on average, are happier than couples with children. But not any of the dozens of corroborating data points presented in the article.
- electromagnetic 18y agoAgreed, happiness has been proven to be subjective. Paraplegics are happy 1 year after their disability causing accident, so wouldn't parents of newborns be the same? It's not a change in circumstances that makes the paraplegics happy, they're still disabled, they didn't magically gain the ability to walk and just not mention it so they keep getting disability. No the paraplegics happiness is subjective, they become happy being a paraplegic just as a parent of a newborn will become happy being a parent. It's also safe to assume you'll only be happy for a year after your kids leave, and this likely explains the newlywed syndrome that they're happy for the first year and then reality kicks in.
- qaexl 18y agoGoing further with this, it also subtly screws up the kid when the kid feels he is responsible for his parents' happiness. This study shouldn't be that surprising. It is adequately explained by Fruedian/Jungnian psychological theories.
- electromagnetic 18y agoHappiness is subjective, and frankly my happiness is dependent on what I achive in life, as I expect most people on here are. People on here are trying to set up companies, most of whom will likely fail as most start-ups do in the first couple of years and they bring a lot of stress and depression, but everyone on here seems positively extatic that they're doing something that in two decades they can say they did something with their life. I would hate myself if I got to 80 and realised I'd never accomplished anything. If I have kids, I know I'll have done at least _something_ with my life, I'll be able to say 'I raised my 2.4 kids well' and be proud of it. Just like I'm proud that I've moved to a different country. I'm proud of my life already and I'm only in my 20's, having kids is only going to make me more proud of my life, just as many other things I aim to accomplish will. So I really don't care if I'm not as smiley happy for a few years as I'll be happy that I've done things other people haven't.
- notauser 18y agoIt always amuses me when people point to their kids as their proudest achievement. It puts me in mind of this: function generation(input) { output = input + 0; generation(output); } Lots of activity, no progress. Your greatest achievement should be something you did that any kids you have would be proud of. Merely spwaning offspring is something that anyone can do - and some of the best kids in every generation come from the worst homes so 'doing it right' is hardly a value added activity.
- qaexl 18y agoSadly, in some cases it is function generation(input) { output = input - 1; generation(output); } ... particularly in cases of dysfunctional families.
- a10 18y agoRaising a child is a lot more than "spwaning offspring." You're obviously not a parent and have no appreciation for what your parents have done for you. In the meantime keep playing halo and wanking to online porn.
- davidw 18y agoYour first sentence is accurate, the second is kind of nasty and distracts from your message: > Raising a child is a lot more than "spwaning offspring." which is very important. Most anyone can reproduce, but raising a child is something that takes skill and effort.
- notauser 18y agoInsisting that only parents can have opinions on the subject of kids is a bit odd. I would bet that you have an opinion on nuclear power, despite never having built a reactor in your back yard. Society pays quite a lot towards the cost of children as well (depending on where you are). For example here roughly 10% of income is taxed to pay for universal healthcare, of which a large chunk goes to subsidised and free care for children. If society is picking up part of the bills it should get part of the credit. (And I don't play Halo, nor am I single. I'm not even that young. Ad hominem is the lowest form of argument.)
- electric 18y agoI'm waiting for this one to show up here..."Studies find having startups makes people less happy." ;)
- mechanical_fish 18y agoActually, I think I remember an article claiming that having a startup does make entrepreneurs happy. It's everything else (income, social life, stress level) that gets worse for entrepreneurs when they start their own business. Working for myself has definitely lowered my income, at least for the short term. But I'm fairly happy.
- geuis 18y agoWell let's hand it to Newsweek for enforcing a crappy version of the page because I'm viewing it from my iPhone. It doesn't take me to a mobile version of the story, just a mini-list of "mobile stories". Dear Newsweek, get a clue.
- deleted 18y ago[deleted]
- axod 18y agoStudies can show anything if you cherry pick the right statistics out. Personal experience says being a parent is one of the coolest and most enjoyable things you can do with your life. You could also say that "being in a relationship makes people less happy" - quite likely true if you pick out the right statistics.
- bayareaguy 18y agoI strongly suspect there are probably a few comparable studies out there that draw quite different conclusions and I think it's too bad the author didn't do a better job of covering the actual details of the studies as well as the results of the overall research in this area.
- silverlake 18y agoWouldn't it make sense to first check if there are different conclusions before you declare "it's too bad" the writer failed to mention them? Google has this new feature called Search. You might like it. I strongly suspect our happiness is controlled by drugs in our water system, but the author failed to cover research in the area of "I make shit up on the internet".
- timr 18y agoIt's pretty funny when you criticize "cherry picking", then immediately cite "personal experience" as evidence for a position.
- axod 18y agoYeah but the difference is, I labelled it as "personal experience", and not some sort of "study". I also did not state it was in any way evidence for anything. I simply said that in my experience, it's been great fun... It's up to you though. Don't have kids.. Don't buy a house. Go travelling. Just don't get to 80 and wish you had done things differently.
- krschultz 18y ago
- gscott 18y agoThis article is a positive. Those people who read it and decide not to have children, they are at least not replicating there DNA meaning future generations will not have to deal with those who only have love for themselves. Reminds me of the story of Narcissus where Narcissus fell in love with himself once he saw his reflection. He was so in love with his reflection he didn't leave to eat and died.
- khafra 18y agoI would characterize a person who decides to make partial copies of himself to care for as more self-loving than a person who takes a sober look at resource depletion and decides to seek other means of self-fulfilment, whether that means taking care of already-existing humans or just self-actualizing in solitude.
- gscott 18y agoI am not sure if you have ever flown over the United States... it is mostly empty land. It is not depleted. I happen to live in San Diego, we happen to have thousands of new people moving in every day from Mexico. So if you are not going to use it, it looks like others will.
- gscott 18y agoI just found this article, maybe this is your next town? http://www.nytimes.com/2008/06/29/magazine/29Birth-t.html?em&ex=1214971200&en=bedbd5447077b8c3&ei=5087%0A http://www.nytimes.com/2008/06/29/magazine/29Birth-t.html?em...
- tx 18y agoAt my old job we used to play basketball once a week after work. I can't say either this article is true or not, but one thing for sure: guys with kids were much less eager to leave the court and go home. They were the last to leave and first to beg others (kidless) to stay and play a little longer.
- Tichy 18y agoScariest remark so far. I have long had the same suspicion about those co-workers who love the extra-long hours: they are simply afraid to go home and meet the family(?). That might also (among other things) be the reason employers love to hear that you have a family.
- jimbokun 18y agoBurying the lede: "Parents still report feeling a greater sense of purpose and meaning in their lives than those who've never had kids." So "happiness" or "sense of purpose and meaning." Take your pick.
- sygzzy 18y agoSchopenhauer knew this - fulfilling our biological urges (to pair off and multiply) is in no way related to human happiness. Where biology and happiness butt heads biology is more likely to win.
- reazalun 18y agoEven having a very beautiful girlfriend can't make you happy all the time. You can still cry while you are at the Disney Land. All those studies failed to recognize that the state of happiness is not something infinite. And how can you understand and appreciate the happiness if you have never taste the wrath of sadness? Yes, the studies show us the correlation between having kids and less happiness in people. But remember, correlation does not imply causation.
- blurry 18y agoEvery single study on couples that choose not to have children confirms that they tend to be well-educated and well-off. If you pick a group that's better off than most in every important category (money, social rank, health, etc), you would expect them to be happier, duh. Correlating one of their many choices with happiness is a classic example of selection bias.
- ericb 18y agoWhat this leaves out is the elder years. I believe there is evidence that looking back on an achievements like raising a family lead to happier grey years. Additionally, having someone to care for you when your spouse is gone, and having family to be a part of seems pretty likely to increase happiness. I'd be willing to bet that having grandkids makes people happier. (all play, no work!) None of this was covered in the study.