23 ms·

Surface Go 2, Surface Book 3, Surface Headphones 2 and Surface Earbuds

261 points by caution 6y ago

deathhand 6y ago
The Surface Book 3 may give the XPS 7390 a run for the money for the high end enterprise users. My initial concerns will be heat, weight and build quality. XPS metal body feels great and is durable. I wonder how this will compare.
- kevingadd 6y ago
  Heat has always been the problem with Surfaces, for whatever reason the firmware always has massive power/thermal management issues. When the firmware is working right the thermals and noise level are great (especially if you're using the dGPU in the keyboard base, because it spreads the heat across the whole machine), but it's so frequently not... I hope they get it right this time.
- Ididntdothis 6y ago
  I use a Book 2 as daily driver but to be honest I would prefer the HP ZBook I had before. The Book is very unstable with multiple monitors, the docking station constantly runs out of USB resources, when I detach the tablet and reconnect the display settings get messed up and I spend ten minutes reconfiguring and overall it lacks speed compared to its configuration. Really not a good experience for a pricey high end laptop.
  - RankingMember 6y ago
    I've had the same experience, the thing eventually becomes a nightmare with display issues if you're using the dock, which I think most are. We also have had multiple people's Surface Book 2 batteries start to swell to the point that the lid is parabola when you close it. I've recently had a show-stopper charging issue too, which is very obnoxious when you're in the middle of work.
- slezyr 6y ago
  But you need to compare it with future XPS 9300 or XPS 9700.
  - deathhand 6y ago
    I will never endorse the "nostril camera" of XPS 9XXX series considering they have now released better.
    - extr 6y ago
      They've gone back to the 9XXX numbering scheme but those are the newest models. Ex: For the 13" line the 9300 is the newest iteration with above-screen camera replacement
- koverda 6y ago
  I think the laptop to beat is the X1 Carbon. Feels completely solid and uncompromised.
- acolumb 6y ago
  I have a Book v1, and let me tell you, that thing is riddled with issues. The hinge is the biggest thing. Because it connects over PCIe to the base, the Book is very sensitive after a decent amount of time. If I adjust the screen, the hinge disconnects and reconnects. Also, if I unplug my headphones while it's sleeping in laptop mode (which I use 99% of the time), the audio cuts out and I have to restart the machine. That's why I'm typing this on a Dell Latitude with the same 6300u that's inside the book and with a worse screen -- at least it generally works even if I had to re-uninstall Candy Crush...
  - missosoup 6y ago
    Long term surface book user. Can confirm the hinge becomes absolute trash after a while, and MS will wash their hands of you after the warranty period. Doing anything to the lid will cause the PCIE bus to disconnect and freak the laptop out, sometimes repeatedly. Cute concept, garbage execution.
- freeone3000 6y ago
  What draws the high end to a surfacebook or an XPS instead of saving $1000 per laptop and going with the similar-specced Lenovo T543?
lvspiff 6y ago
Microsoft appears to be pricing their hardware in line with Apple now? $1599 starting price for the Book? I get the quality and the features are up there but the price is unappealing. the surface Go even starts at a reasonable $399 but then to add a dock is $250? The dock is is 62.5% the cost of the computer? That seems rather steep
- kevingadd 6y ago
  I think with the docks it's a no-win situation, from what I can tell the surface docks contain a display adapter (maybe 2 now for the new one since it supports multiple displays?), a NIC, a USB hub, charging circuitry, and some other random stuff. The price of all that seems to add up. I originally assumed the video out on the surface dock was just passthrough but it's not, it has its own display hardware with its own quirks and you update the firmware on it to change the behavior in some cases. In my experience a comparable USB-C dock of decent quality for my macbook is pretty expensive too, though certainly not surface dock level. I think this is just the situation we're in with how laptops and docks interact now. If more of the smarts were in the laptop than the dock the dock would probably be a lot cheaper, but that seems like it might drive up the price of the laptops.
  - munchbunny 6y ago
    The original Surface Dock supplies power, two USB ports, two mini-displayport plugs, a headphone jack, and an ethernet port. (I'm using one right now.) With my first gen Surface Book, I'm able to drive two external screens through the dock, or use the laptop screen plus one more. Haven't tried with a Surface Book 2 yet. The nice part is that it just reuses the charging port. As far as docking stations go, it's a substantial step up from most docks. That new price tag is still pretty steep though.
- justaguyhere 6y ago
  Reminds me of the $999 Apple stand
  - notRobot 6y ago
flyGuyOnTheSly 6y ago
Whoa whoa whoa, hold your horses their Microsoft. 4 new products in one blog post? And the blog post is pretty plain at that. Where's the sexy animations? The over the top presentation? If you're going to try and fuck me to the tune of $1,600 for a laptop, at least take me to out to dinner first. Microsoft could really stand to learn a few things from Google/Apple product presentation imho.
- whateveracct 6y ago
  Million dollar move, five dollar finish
- bgroins 6y ago
  I'd rather just focus on the 10% that is the detailed content, versus 90% hype, but to each their own. I don't need to be told for 3 hours that every minor feature is an Earth-shattering event.
  - eugeniub 6y ago
    Honestly this blog post is 90% gibberish. Skimming over it, I just see meaningless word salads like "navigat[ing] the current environment", "design[ing] a Surface for every person", and "stay[ing] connected to the people and content that matters".
- save_ferris 6y ago
  Not only that, but I can’t find any review videos for the Surface headphones 2 on YouTube, and I’m looking for new headphones. Whenever a new Sony/Bose/Apple product drops, the reviewers are all over it. No wonder the first Surface headphones flew under the radar so hard.
- enumjorge 6y ago
  Yeah I’m confused by what their marketing team did here. It’s a super text heavy page with a just a couple of pictures showing the products from far away. Odd way to announce a hardware lineup.
ArtWomb 6y ago
I got to play with the 50" Surface Hub and it blew my mind. Even if a bit laggy and not altogether precise with gestures. 4K video, pressure sensitive drawing, handwriting recognition and indexing. Going back to a 15" screen felt strange afterwards. Very "Minority Report". I believe there is a large format 85" Surface due shortly ;)
harrygeez 6y ago
I was really hoping that Microsoft would tweak the design of Surface Book 3 and change the hinge, this spec bump is a little underwhelming after all this wait
- cercatrova 6y ago
  Time to wait another 3 years.
ArmandGrillet 6y ago
I got a Magic Keyboard for my iPad Pro 2018 and sent it back, now I'm thinking about selling the iPad to buy a Surface Go 2: kickstand included, WSL 2 when needed, keyboard with a function row. My only worry is that the experience in tablet mode is gonna be subpar.
- hn_check 6y ago
  And? What's your point?
- balls187 6y ago
  > My only worry is that the experience in tablet mode is gonna be subpar. That was my experience with the Surface Go. The battery life was much worse than my ipad mini 2. There are far less dedicated apps for Windows 10, so much of my tablet workflow involved using the web browser to access services. For batter life alone, I returned the surface go, and bought and ipad pro.
  - loyukfai 6y ago
    Meanwhile, MS is touting the "bigger" battery in the Go 2. That's, 27Wh [1] vs 26.12Wh [2] of the original. Go figure. [1] https://youtu.be/kVAa-I8s9V0?t=180 https://youtu.be/kVAa-I8s9V0?t=180 [2] https://surfacetip.com/how-much-surface-battery-capacity-in-mah/ https://surfacetip.com/how-much-surface-battery-capacity-in-...
- mey 6y ago
  Things to consider when pricing the Go 2, upgrading from Windows S to Windows Pro and for make sure to get a drive bigger than 64gb. Windows isn't really a comfortable experience with so little storage space over the years.
- whywhywhywhy 6y ago
  Surface Go and iPad Pro are not comparable products. I have a Surface Go and it's a great little machine for what it is but iPad Pro should be compared to the Surface X.
- 6y ago
_xander 6y ago
The base Surface Go 2 seems like an attractive option for those looking to do a bit of real computing alongside iPad-esque media consumption.
jordanthoms 6y ago
Interested to try the new Surface Go - we brought one of the original ones as a test device and was quite disappointed. The performance, especially for web browsing, is far behind that of cheaper Chromebooks, even though it had more powerful hardware.
- freeone3000 6y ago
  Upgrading from the pentium to the m3 should put it on par with a $300 Chromebook. If you want a Chromebook, get a Chromebook.
- disabled 6y ago
  Agree with the other reply 100%. If you payed for the upgraded Surface Go, it works excellently, and runs pretty well when you break out of Windows S mode. I use it for travel and more portable uses. I specifically use it to read via screenreader (Kurzweil 3000--works best on Windows), when I need something more portable. I even got one for my mom for Mother's Day last year and she uses it as her primary Windows laptop. It is better than spending $180 for the cheapest Windows laptop that you can get, due to the tablet form factor, durability, and portability. Sure, the battery is not replaceable but this is livable.
  - nailer 6y ago
    > If you payed for the upgraded Surface Go, it works excellently Personally, just using the new Edge and a few tabs on the high-end, 8G Surface Go 1, it still lags.
- turtlebits 6y ago
  The base model still uses a Pentium gold, so you're probably not going to like it either. You'll have to pay $629 for a better processor.
Eduard 6y ago
Those Earbuds look like a piercing plug / flesh tunnel. Hard to imagine they will sell well.
- matsemann 6y ago
  An ugly look didn't stop Airpods from selling like crazy, though.
  - partiallypro 6y ago
    Airpods are a status symbol (somehow, even though everyone has them?) So I doubt Microsoft will get the same appeal.
    - lotsofpulp 6y ago
      You are claiming AirPods are a status symbol, and you’re claiming everyone has them. Which is a contradiction. They are not a status symbols. I see people working at fast food restaurants, in college, and other lower paid occupations with them. I also see them with iPhones and MacBooks and apple watches. But these devices aren’t that expensive. I don’t see them and think “this person must have access to a lot of credit or be related to someone rich”. That might be reserved for having a nice home in an expensive neighborhood. And in my experience, the utility and longevity derived from most Apple products far outweighed the extra few hundred dollars spent initially, so the amortized cost is much lower. I type this from an iPhone 6 bought in 2014, which at the time was the most expensive phone. But I didn’t buy it to be a status symbol.
      - partiallypro 6y ago
        Yes, they are a status symbol, just like the "blue bubble" v "green bubble" on SMS on iPhone. Blue bubbles mean the person has an iPhone, green bubbles mean the person doesn't have an iPhone. Do you honestly think Apple did that not knowing it would become a status symbol?
        6y ago
vvanders 6y ago
Shame on the Surface Book 3 using Intel, after seeing what the new Ryzen 4800 looks like I don't think anyone serious about performance would be looking at Intel.
- hmottestad 6y ago
  At least it's ice lake (10nm). From what Anandtech has said previously, it's got good graphics and AVX512....but other than that it's not faster than the 14nm processors because Intel still can't push the frequency as high. Here are some benchmarks. Intel can mostly keep up with AMD. It's not great though...multicore AMD is pulling ahead by quite a lot. https://www.anandtech.com/show/15762/the-acer-swift-3-sf314-review-swift-gets-swifter-with-ryzen-4000/4 https://www.anandtech.com/show/15762/the-acer-swift-3-sf314-...
dragonsh 6y ago
This hardware is a good choice for people in Windows Eco-system. But for people on MacOS or Linux these prices doesn't make sense given they can get better bang for bucks. Also based on previous experience with Surface Book and Surface Pro will not touch microsoft hardware or software (except for testing cross-platform application). Indeed haven't used Windows extensively for quite sometime since Windows 7. Still using a Macbook Pro bought in 2014, but do not use Surface book bought few years later as it's not as usable and nice condition compared to Macbook Pro, which is still chugging along very nicely.
- BoysenberryPi 6y ago
  Can you name better hardware for people in the Linux ecosystem that all work together well? The appeal of all of these products is that all of the Apple stuff works flawlessly together and all of the Windows stuff works flawlessly together. I personally have a hell of a time just getting bluetooth to work on my Linux thinkpad so definitely open to suggestions.
  - diffeomorphism 6y ago
    Dell xps developer edition or thinkpad preinstalled with linux? Have someone else spend the time to get it to work just like you would with windows or macOS. > all of the Windows stuff works flawlessly together. Did you mean all surface stuff? What is it supposed to work together with? Headphones better work with everything and the pen and dial are kinda neat but don't scream "ecosystem".
  - klohto 6y ago
    Another soul! I’m in the exact same boat and after this release, I just might jump on the surface book wagon. Sleek looking, great battery, WSL first class citizen. I just want a good touchpad, the damn fans to stop spinning randomly, bluetooth pairing to work and good battery life without tweaking TLP for few days.
- diffeomorphism 6y ago
  > these prices doesn't make sense given they can get better bang for bucks. Like what? A nice high resolution 3:2 screen seems great and difficult to find anywhere else. The drawbacks are the awful non-Windows compatibility (e.g. see reddits /r/surfacelinux) and the non-Wacom pen.
cercatrova 6y ago
More information and links from /r/surface: Introducing Surface Go 2, Surface Book 3, Surface Headphones 2 and Surface Earbuds https://preview.redd.it/15gbamema5x41.jpg?width=1024&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=7b1e7cc7cccc40f4f92f3b6b895534061a126c9f https://preview.redd.it/15gbamema5x41.jpg?width=1024&format=... Official blog post: https://blogs.windows.com/devices/2020/05/06/introducing-surface-go-2-surface-book-3-surface-headphones-2-and-surface-earbuds/ https://blogs.windows.com/devices/2020/05/06/introducing-sur... Pre-orders for most products start today (May 6th), and some devices launch starting May 12. --- Surface Go 2 - starting at $399 Release date: May 12, 2020 (US) Product launch video - https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NUw8jZl1hX0 https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NUw8jZl1hX0 Business product page - https://www.microsoft.com/en-us/surface/business/surface-go-2 https://www.microsoft.com/en-us/surface/business/surface-go-... Microsoft Mechanics overview - https://youtu.be/kVAa-I8s9V0 https://youtu.be/kVAa-I8s9V0 --- Surface Book 3 - starting at $1599 Release date: May 21, 2020 (US) Product launch video - https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kYFnAnmwG5c https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kYFnAnmwG5c Business product page - https://www.microsoft.com/en-us/surface/business/surface-book-3 https://www.microsoft.com/en-us/surface/business/surface-boo... Microsoft Mechanics overview - https://youtu.be/rGOQYX5etG8 https://youtu.be/rGOQYX5etG8 --- Surface Earbuds - priced at $199.99 Release date: May 12, 2020 (US) Pre-order page - https://www.microsoft.com/en-us/p/surface-earbuds/8r9cpq146064 https://www.microsoft.com/en-us/p/surface-earbuds/8r9cpq1460... (US) Product launch video - https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hMk7wnybXLM https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hMk7wnybXLM --- Surface Headphones 2 - priced at $249.99 Release date: May 12, 2020 (US) https://preview.redd.it/rv7uekkqf5x41.png?width=890&format=png&auto=webp&s=a0392ba956a9bbfe39a7a0a359b162b8af4b3197 https://preview.redd.it/rv7uekkqf5x41.png?width=890&format=p... --- Surface Dock 2 - priced at $259.99 Release date: Later this month in select markets Microsoft Mechanics overview - https://youtu.be/qaCHITOuWPw https://youtu.be/qaCHITOuWPw --- Surface USB-C Travel Hub - priced at $99.99 Release date: Later this month in select markets https://preview.redd.it/0b3u3dpxd5x41.jpg?width=1440&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=0bcfda84bd09d776cd7dfe196ca5b33d91891f81 https://preview.redd.it/0b3u3dpxd5x41.jpg?width=1440&format=... --- Other new accessories: Surface Go Sleeve - https://www.microsoft.com/en-us/p/surface-go-sleeve/8x1tzlkclxtb https://www.microsoft.com/en-us/p/surface-go-sleeve/8x1tzlkc... Microsoft Ergonomic Desktop bundle - priced at $89.99 Microsoft Bluetooth Desktop bundle - priced at $59.99
blakesterz 6y ago
Those earbuds look like they'd fit worse than Apple's. I wonder if I have funny shaped ears, but nothing fits right. Those Pixel Buds look like things that would fit with the way they have those hooks or whatever they're called. It must be really hard to design these things to fit a wide range of ears.
- StreakyCobra 6y ago
  > I wonder if I have funny shaped ears, but nothing fits right That's what U.S. air force discovered after WWII [1] (discussed on HN recently [2]). Also known as flaw of averages, curse of dimensionality, etc. > There was no such thing as an average pilot. If you’ve designed a cockpit to fit the average pilot, you’ve actually designed it to fit no one. [1] https://www.thestar.com/news/insight/2016/01/16/when-us-air-force-discovered-the-flaw-of-averages.html https://www.thestar.com/news/insight/2016/01/16/when-us-air-... [2] https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=22956832 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=22956832
- PascLeRasc 6y ago
  Have you tried IEMs? I have ears where regular earbuds don't fit well too, Apple's are incredibly uncomfortable for me. But IEMs like the Shure SE215 fit really well and I barely notice them. The Meelectronics X6 works great for a pair of cheap Bluetooth gym headphones too.
  - texasbigdata 6y ago
    Or even better CIEMs if fit is a goal :)
- bound008 6y ago
  1. At first I resented AirPods for not sealing out background noise, or fitting securely. But then I realized its a feature and not a bug. You can be in a private space while not fully disconnected from the public space. Just another tool in the arsenal 2. People have mentioned IEMs. If you feel discomfort from most headphones, you can get custom ear molds made for IEMs. In the US, this is generally a co-pay to an audiologist for a visit, around $50 for the audiologist to make the impressions, and around $100 for the custom plugs. IEM technology has not changed drastically, so you can buy used or older models. A 10 year old triple driver IEM will likely sound better than any non-IEM option. Make sure your IEM choice has detachable cables, as life happens. Plus, you can then use something like the FiiO UTWS1 to turn your IEMs into a more modern experience. There will be a downgrade in quality but it will be worth it for convenience. 3. Microsoft likely made a mistake with the size of these buds. They look like gauges that people put into their ears. This will either be a failure, or in the modern world of branding, an unlikely success. FWIW, FiiO has cheap IEMs that are pretty good. For under $200 you can get a pair with 3 drivers in each ear (F9 Pro), and the aforementioned bluetooth “true wireless” adapter. Add another $200 and you have custom ear molds.
dsalzman 6y ago
...Featuring an ultra-comfortable and stable fit, Surface Earbuds offer intuitive touch controls so you can start a phone call or change the song without taking out your phone....Screen-free integration with Microsoft 365 lets you catch up on emails with Play My Emails in the Outlook Mobile App for iOS or allow you to dictate in Word, Outlook or PowerPoint. -- Woooah. I can listen to Powerpoint decks! TAKE MY MONEY!
freewizard 6y ago
Maybe I've been using macOS with default wallpapers for too long but the Windows wallpaper in this post feels so familiar.
tdhttt 6y ago
They featured WSL in the Surface Book video! And terminal is in the dock!
whywhywhywhy 6y ago
From the Surface Book 3 launch video: "Rendered on Surface Book 3". That's how you sell a Pro machine.
ripley12 6y ago
It’s disappointing that the SB3 seems to have the same screen and trackpad as the SB2. The screen has so much glare compared to the MBP and XPS, it makes dark mode unusable in most lighting situations. The trackpad is small and mediocre, it can’t reliably pick up two-finger right clicks. It’s a shame because I think the hardware is otherwise great.
vorpalhex 6y ago
I have a Surface Pro 7, their oversized tablet, after ditching my ipad pro out of frustration. I wanted something that had a nice pen but still had a real filesystem and I could easily load comics and movies on, use ssh, and was full featured enough that I wasn't required to lug a laptop with me. And the surface pro is.. fine. Hardware wise it's great even, but my issue is overwhelmingly that Microsoft's default software makes a sad tablet experience. Their screen keyboards are garbage, the store is lackluster and the tablet mode does not play nicely with most apps leading to weird issues like not being able to leave the kindle app once it's fullscreened. If Microsoft invested a bit more in improving the tablet experience, they could really eat some of Apple's marketshare.
- gazelle21 6y ago
  Interesting. I had the exact opposite issue, I was tired of the buggy and laggy features. I just needed something for media consumption with ssh for my pi's. Ipad has been working flawlessly, but all my other devices are windows/androids so the lack of compatibility is a pain at time.
- paulcole 6y ago
  Are you considering switching back to the iPad Pro? Or is fine good enough for your use?
  - vorpalhex 6y ago
    If the iPad let me stick in a usb drive and copy over comics, and load open source software from outside the Apple store - yes. Since that will never happen in our lifetime, probably not. For what it's worth, the iPad feels great in terms of size and construction, it has a fantastic screen and the overall UX/UI is pleasant. Unfortunately, it's not usable as a short term laptop replacement and basic computer tasks are just not possible, especially not offline.
    - snalty 6y ago
      For what it's worth, you might be able to copy over comics using a USB drive now. You can definitely copy comics over a network share as an alternative, as the Files app supports mounting samba shares. EDIT: of course that doesn't help with the loading of open source software on the device.
intopieces 6y ago
The thing that always bothered me about the Surface Go was that it didn’t feel like a cohesive device. More like a tablet with accessories. The way the fin awkwardly sticks out of the back is an admission that it can’t stand on its own because it’s a tablet, and the keyboard has an odd angle that makes it look unstable, like typing on a piece of cardboard. When I see it, I just see compromises, like a tablet trying its best to make it in a world where sometimes you need a laptop.
- kbd 6y ago
  > The way the fin awkwardly sticks out of the back By "fin" you mean... the stand? So, the stand means that it doesn't stand on its own? What? You clearly haven't tried one because the built-in stand is fantastic and the keyboard cover works very well.
  - intopieces 6y ago
    > By "fin" you mean... the stand? So, the stand means that it doesn't stand on its own? What? Yeah. It needs the stand because it doesn’t support itself with the keyboard (like a laptop). It just doesn’t seem very lap friendly. Previous to the iPad Pro keyboard I didn’t find any solution to this problem tablets that didn’t involve some ugly clamps. I haven’t tried it, so I am interested in others’ experience with it, since it’s an interesting design.
    - kbd 6y ago
      > It needs the stand because it doesn’t support itself with the keyboard (like a laptop). Yeah it's primarily a tablet form factor and doesn't come with a keyboard. But that makes it a tablet that stands on its own with the built-in stand. Then, plug in one USB-C cable and it's a full computer with access to all my peripherals that can drive my 3840x1600 monitor. Add the keyboard cover (which is fantastic for how thin it is, the trackpad works well, etc.) and it becomes a laptop. There are lots of problems with the Go. It's slow! Battery life is mediocre. Windows itself is a mess. Because it's a tablet that's a full computer, it's bulkier than an ipad. But it's such a neat little device.
uallo 6y ago
The Surface Go 2 looks interesting but I'm too deeply invested in macOS, unfortunately. I wish Apple offered something similar (i.e. a real computer, not a tablet). I really liked the MacBook Air 11" and regret that I sold it years ago.
- davidcollantes 6y ago
  Get an Apple laptop?
  - deleted 6y ago
    [deleted]
  - uallo 6y ago
    A 13" laptop is not really comparable to a 10.5" detachable.
    - eanzenberg 6y ago
      There’s also the 12” macbook that they will update soon I believe.
      - uallo 6y ago
        That has been discontinued last year. Do you have a link regarding the supposed update? Edit: I found some rumors that claim that Apple might revive the 12" MacBook in 2020. I hope they actually do but can't really see it happening as it might cannibalize their iPad sales.
- Marsymars 6y ago
  I've got a 12" MB that I'll keep until Apple releases another fanless laptop, or until it stops getting macOS updates.
  - EForEndeavour 6y ago
    Serious question: why is fanlessness the defining criterion for you? Is it the noise? Or the impression that having a fan is a sign of poor thermal design somehow?
no_wizard 6y ago
Is it weird I'm absolutely excited over the new desktop bundle for the erognomic keyboard and mouse? I have absolutely come to love the Microsoft erognomic keyboard and mouse set, so I look forward to snapping it up so that I can replace my much much older version of those products. When it comes to those two accessories, for me at least, I think they're such a great value for such a low price!
- reaperducer 6y ago
  Is it weird I'm absolutely excited over the new desktop bundle for the erognomic keyboard and mouse? I don't know if weird is the word. Some people just are really into this sort of thing. Like when the hard-core Apple fans lost their coolant when the black keyboard and mouse came out. I think it's normal because these are things we interact with physically every day. We become attached to real, tangible things. It's part of why keychains, mobile phones, and jewelry are so personal to us.
- showerst 6y ago
  You're not the only one. Especially because the last generation sculpt mouse was mechanically junk (i'm on my third one in 2 years...) but in a great form factor.
- EForEndeavour 6y ago
  Is the new mouse still used with the palm facing down? What specifically makes it ergonomic? I'm looking to stave off some looming wrist RSI, and have latched onto the idea that a vertical mouse (Evoluent, Anker, and Logitech are probably the most popular manufacturers) is the best solution short of switching to a different device type, like a trackball.
  - ModernMech 6y ago
    I've got the Logitech vertical mouse and it's the best thing I've done for my wrists lately. Highly recommended. Also got the Logitech ergo keyboard and that has been great as well.
  - Marsymars 6y ago
Roritharr 6y ago
If they are still refusing to put Thunderbolt 3 ports in, they could have put the far better Ryzen Chips in...
- wslh 6y ago
  What is the reason to not putting Thunderbolt 3? I still prefer the XPS 13 with 2 TB port + 1 USB Type-C.
  - partiallypro 6y ago
    I believe it has to do with the amount of lanes available on the board, because they want to keep the Surface connector (and I don't blame them.)
  - nimish 6y ago
    Apparently DMA attacks (thunderclap et al).
    - whereistimbo 6y ago
      But Windows 10 in 2019 included Kernel DMA Protection to mitigate thunderclap etc
- cogman10 6y ago
  I think the battery story just barely got better with AMD CPUs. Intel's mobile CPUs (used to) do much better at keeping power usage low. IDK how the new 4000 series compares.
bcrosby95 6y ago
From what I can tell, you can only get 4 cores on the Surface Book 3? Kinda unfortunate if true.
maelito 6y ago
The perfect device for me : the Surface Pro X's hybrid tablet format, with no chip inside, as your smpartphone is the chip, that lets you use Android (for everyday tasks and some pro tasks) or a full GNU/Linux. A poor version of this, but already worth using : Samsung Dex with a portable monitor, with UserLand or Andronix. Portable monitors are way behind the Surface Pro X (e.g. for pencil management), Samsung doesn't invest enough money on Dex and UserLand / Andronix lack some features (a good VNC client seamlessly integrated / hardware acceleration)
- agentdrtran 6y ago
  This was tried by Motorola a while ago but it didn't really take off.
  - maelito 6y ago
    My phone is now more powerful than the XPS 13 I used in 2017. Same with the SPX. It changes everything.
bluedino 6y ago
>> Our active noise cancellation is adjustable through intuitive on-ear dials My only real complaint about my Sony noise-cancelling headphones are the stupid touch controls, why would Microsoft copy those?
- kbumsik 6y ago
  They are physical dials, not touch though.
- virvar 6y ago
  If they actually worked they might not be so bad. I’ve never gotten my otherwise beloved mx3s to do one single thing I wanted them to do while using the touch controls, but I can see how pausing a song, adjusting volume or forwarding might be nice if it actually worked.
- partiallypro 6y ago
  It's not a touch control, it's a physical dial like on a stereo. It actually feels really nice. You can adjust the volume on one ear, and the noise cancellation on the other. There are touch controls, like stop, start, skip etc; but not volume/noise cancellation.
- mey 6y ago
  I use Sony WH-CH700N's because they fold flat, have physical buttons, noise cancelling and have good enough sound quality. (It's bluetooth, can only ask so much) https://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/product/1389412-REG/sony_whch700n_b_ch700n_wireless_noise_cancelling_headphones.html https://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/product/1389412-REG/sony_whch...
halotrope 6y ago
As a former Surface Book 2 user I really hope this update includes good antireflective coating or even a laminated display. The Surface devices are great but the display while beautiful on its own is just too damn reflective. Ultimately abandoned the device because of the reflectivity.
GekkePrutser 6y ago
Would the Go 2 run Linux OK? I had a Surface Pro 3 for a while and though I got Linux running on it, I never managed all the tablety stuff working properly. Rotation, Pen + Touch input (at the same time without randomly cutting out!!), auto keyboard popup on input fields with no keyboard connecting, the keyboard actually working after being removed and reconnected, etc etc... It was a great machine but Linux lacked support for this type of support in many ways. I wonder if this has improved as this was many years ago when the SP3 was just out.
- fheld 6y ago
  this subreddit has some good information on the topic: https://www.reddit.com/r/surfacelinux https://www.reddit.com/r/surfacelinux and for the Go 1 it seems to work pretty well: https://www.reddit.com/r/SurfaceLinux/comments/gclaqi/surface_go_8_gb128_with_ubuntu_20_and/ https://www.reddit.com/r/SurfaceLinux/comments/gclaqi/surfac...
- freeone3000 6y ago
  It's gotten better, in that you now have wifi and can detach the keyboard. Pen and ink is still bad. Do not recommend running Linux.
  - GekkePrutser 6y ago
    Oh, WiFi worked fine for me even then! Thanks for the feedback!
dougmwne 6y ago
I was looking at the Surface Book 3 specs and it hit me that the value proposition for discrete graphics has changed significantly if you want to game on your laptop. Since Stadia, Geforce Now and other cloud gaming services have launched, I suddenly have no interest in paying hundreds extra for a gaming capable laptop, just to make a compromise on weight, battery life or GPU power. I've been gaming on the cloud services for the past few months, and as long as you're within a few hundred miles of a cloud rendering location, you're going to get a far better mobile gaming experience on a thin, light and cheap laptop than you would on mobile graphics. I've been enjoying fast-paced platformers, online shooters and action-RPGs on a 5 year old laptop and wouldn't want to downgrade to mobile graphics. This actually shocks me that my hardware preferences could have changed so rapidly. I would have been salivating over the gaming specs of the surface book 6 months ago.
- shimylining 6y ago
  What has been your primary cloud gaming service? I've been wanting to give it a go during this WFH period.
  - dougmwne 6y ago
    I'm signed up for both Stadia and Gforce Now. Both have lengthy free trials right now. They have different game libraries, so I've been switching back and forth depending on the game. I recommend both. If you want to try the absolute smoothest user experience, give Stadia a try as it will come with a selection of free games and there's nothing to install. If you already have a large Steam library and want to play some of those games, give Geforce Now a try.
    - ShamelessC 6y ago
      The ability to play many of my existing Steam games made GeForce Now the clear winner for me. Don't have to repurchase any games and if I decided to get a better gaming PC in the future (which I did when HL: Alyx came out), I can play any games I purchased prior on that PC. The latency for multiplayer was just barely acceptable. I tried both Rocket League and Destiny 2 and was able to notice that I wasn't playing as well in either compared to playing locally. I still struggle to see how Google plans to make Stadia successful when they're asking developers to port to their platform and players to pay for games they can't play locally. It would be interesting if they released a console offering that just replicated one of the Stadia servers but I don't see that happening.
rayshan 6y ago
There's a picture of the new Microsoft Ergonomic Desktop on The Verge. So sad that the keyboard is wired and not TKL :( Somewhat normal function keys though compared to the Sculpt. Mouse is also wired. https://www.theverge.com/2020/5/6/21247234/microsoft-surface-dock-2-usb-c-hub-keyboard-mouse-price https://www.theverge.com/2020/5/6/21247234/microsoft-surface... https://cdn.vox-cdn.com/thumbor/W1Uqdi9jgOACKGZQ_CEJVgGbxdw=/0x0:2040x1360/1720x0/filters:focal(0x0:2040x1360):format(webp):no_upscale()/cdn.vox-cdn.com/uploads/chorus_asset/file/19946363/ergonomickeyboardbundle.jpg https://cdn.vox-cdn.com/thumbor/W1Uqdi9jgOACKGZQ_CEJVgGbxdw=...
- zozbot234 6y ago
  Wired devices are way less fiddly for serious and professional use. No need to ever bother with pairing with the host, keeping a battery charged, or anything else; they will just work out of the box, and will keep working for the foreseeable future.
  - GekkePrutser 6y ago
    Yes and it's not like they're going anywhere. Especially on the keyboard the cable is a non-issue IMO. I highly prefer wired keyboards. The only reason to have a wireless keyboard is liking the look of a total wire-free desk (which I don't care about). And with the mouse it's just a minor annoyance (empty batteries are a bigger one so I have that wired too).
  - three_seagrass 6y ago
    Wireless is also an attack vector. Bad actors can potentially listen in on what's being typed. For the average user it's NBD, but for large companies it's different.
- vxNsr 6y ago
  Hmmm... Interesting, they have dedicated emoji and office keys... I wonder what the office key does? also they got rid of shared function keys which is great, shared fn keys never made sense on a large full layout desktop keyboard, no one is getting this keyboard because it looks compact.
xiphias2 6y ago
Isn't it better to go with a 7nm AMD Ryzen 4000 based laptop nowdays? For example a Ryzen 5 4500U is also Quad-core with 8 hyperthreads, but has a 2.3GHz base clock.
nimish 6y ago
Still no TB3 -- https://twitter.com/h0x0d/status/1253917701719769088 https://twitter.com/h0x0d/status/1253917701719769088 -- but I am surprised Microsoft is admitted defeat and is unable to come up with secure a secure DMA implementation. There have to be enough kernel and firmware developers there to do it, right? Or has that org wasted away...
- AshamedCaptain 6y ago
  I am sure the proprietary dock -- whose price keeps increasing -- has absolutely nothing to do with the decision not to use TB3.
richardlblair 6y ago
I have a 15" Surface book 2. The spine on it is absolutely massive and it is heavy as all hell. Got a comparable dell 13" and im not going to look back
hypersoar 6y ago
Caveat emptores: With a couple exceptions, Surface devices cannot be repaired, nor have the battery replaced. Not even by Microsoft. iFixit's repair scores on all the devices, except the Pro X, range from 0/10 to 1/10. If you have a problem that would require repair, you need to instead get it replaced with a refurbished machine. This means you have to back up your machine and set it all up again on a new one. If you're out of warranty, you also need to pay hundreds of dollars for this: $250 for a Go, $450 for a Pro or Laptop, and $600 for the Book or older Pro 4. It's unavailable altogether for anything older. They trumpeted improved repairability for the Pro X (edit: and Laptop 3), but I can't find anything suggesting a similar effort for the Book. I like my Surface Pro 4 a lot. I initially got it for the pen when I was a math Ph.D. student. It was great for taking notes and giving lectures. I don't do that anymore, but the Surface machines still appeal to me as potential upgrades. But it's tough for me to justify spending north of $1,500 on a laptop when I can only expect a few years of life from it. So, please, other laptop makers, make some 3:2 laptops. Dell, good job with that new 16:10 XPS. Microsoft, at least make the damn batteries replaceable.
- thwave 6y ago
  just a nitpick: the proper plural is "caveant emptores".
  - LoveMortuus 6y ago
    cave-ant They're everywhere~
  - hypersoar 6y ago
    Thanks! Part of me knew that I was gonna burn myself by going for the Latin.
- skuthus 6y ago
  This is only partially true now. The surface laptop line has made huge strides in repair-ability. https://www.theverge.com/2019/10/23/20929530/microsoft-surface-laptop-3-easy-open-up-repair-fix-ifixit-teardown https://www.theverge.com/2019/10/23/20929530/microsoft-surfa... That being said, the surface pro, go, and book lines have yet to attain the same level of repair-ability.
awinder 6y ago
"People tell us that putting on headphones is today’s equivalent of shutting the office door to focus and connect in any setting" 1. What's an office 2. What's an office door
- oblio 6y ago
  0. What are open plan offices? 0'. What are the most popular office plans?
odiroot 6y ago
> Our active noise cancellation is adjustable through intuitive on-ear dials and specifically tuned to [..] block out [..] human voices. If only someone confirmed this working, I'll be buying them in an instant.
sneak 6y ago
It's amazing that after all of these years, Microsoft's best work is still ripping off Apple's design flourishes. That blog post is straight out of Apple's marketing style about 3 years ago. White void background, dramatic landscape desktops, parallel array of flat devices inclined on the diagonal, high contrast background/model skin color, et c. I'd bet the packaging for these devices follows the Apple model as well (just as Google did for the Pixelbook).
throwawaysea 6y ago
I am really disappointed that the Surface Books do not have a stronger GPU. After waiting two years for an update, I was hoping to see strong GPUs that would make this a swiss army knife laptop - something that is portable, has great battery life, but can also be used for gaming or machine learning work. Unfortunately it appears that Microsoft will not sell the Quadro version of this laptop to individuals and only make it available through their commercial channels (https://www.microsoft.com/en-us/surface/business/surface-book-3 https://www.microsoft.com/en-us/surface/business/surface-boo...). I verified this in a chat with a sales rep.
- phonon 6y ago
  It will probably show up here eventually. https://www.microsoft.com/en-us/store/b/surfaceforbusiness https://www.microsoft.com/en-us/store/b/surfaceforbusiness
atarian 6y ago
The new hardware looks impressive, but I think it's still being held back by Windows; I say this as someone who uses Windows 10 on a daily basis. Given how responsive Microsoft has been to the market, I wouldn't be surprised if they scrapped Windows in favor of something web-based like Chrome OS.
- msh 6y ago
  Thats windows 10x which is annouced earlier.
madjam002 6y ago
I have a Surface Book 2 15” with the max specs and it is not worth the price to me. Compared to the new MacBooks I much prefer the Surface Book’s ergonomics and keyboard, but the performance is just too unreliable, it frequently thermal throttles and also randomly slows down to a snails pace. Plus now the back has been getting unusually warm even when idling on both my Windows 10 and Linux dual boot, it never used to do that. I’ve only had it for 13 months and it’s already showing its age. I don’t understand how my desktop i5 4690k with an old SATA SSD is SO much faster than this laptop that has an 8th gen i7 8650u, DDR4, NVMe SSD, even for basic tasks like having more than 20 browser tabs open and just surfing the web.
- cmenge 6y ago
  I totally agree, I have the 13.5" and suffer from the same problem. MS Teams warns me that my audio quality will degrade because of the CPU load - on a machine that is essentially idling. Sometimes it takes tens of seconds to react to clicks (we're talking Outlook, not Paraview) when I'm in a conference etc.
  - MauranKilom 6y ago
    Outlook can also take a second to react to a click on a high end PC. It feels terrible no matter what. You always have to bring an extra bucket of patience when doing anything with it.
- Infinitesimus 6y ago
  > I don’t understand how my desktop i5 4690k with an old SATA SSD is SO much faster than this laptop that has an 8th gen i7 8650u, DDR4, NVMe SSD, even for basic tasks like having more than 20 browser tabs open and just surfing the web. The surface book is in a strange bind. the 8650 is much much weaker than your 4690k and has very little thermal room to play with. The thermals are particularly tricky because the CPU lives in the tablet portion; meaning there is a tension between cooling it properly, providing a touch screen and keeping it thin and light enough to not have awkward weight distribution.
  - 6y ago
juped 6y ago
Microsoft has been trying to make pen input "a thing" since at least 2000 when they started selling "tablet PCs", and as a result their pen input has become really excellent over the years. The segmentation of the Surface brand is confusing as hell and I'm still not sure which is which despite being invested in it.
epmaybe 6y ago
I wish we had device convergence without fancy tricks like Android/Windows link or iOS/Mac Handoff. I'd love to be working on a document on my phone, put it in laptop mode to write in a more desktop-like environment for multitasking or putting PDFs side by side, and then docking at home for a full desktop experience. So far, it seems like Samsung DeX (is the X capitalized?) is the closest for me, but with them killing Linux on DeX, it seems like it won't come to pass. Or maybe I just need to suck it up and get LTE data plans for all of my devices.
- WorldMaker 6y ago
  Windows Phone 10 "Continuum" was pretty great, as brief as it lasted. It is too bad Microsoft gave up on trying for phones running Windows.
  - epmaybe 6y ago
    Yeah, I had the opportunity to try it out as well and was impressed. I just wish there were more staying power in features like that. DeX is nice too but again we run a risk of the company shutting it down due to a lack of users.
dboreham 6y ago
Hmm. Aspect ratio on the Go2 looks not right.
skocznymroczny 6y ago
I'm still not sold on the kickstand. I bought the original Surface Go because I loved the form factor and all, but the kickstand I dislike. I wish it was a more traditional clamshell design instead, making it more usable on the lap or when held in hand.
galkk 6y ago
If only there were tablets of 15" Surface Book size or larger . I don't need laptop, but I'd be happy to have larger ipad or Surface Book
deleted 6y ago
[deleted]

261 points by caution 6y ago

The Surface Book 3 may give the XPS 7390 a run for the money for the high end enterprise users. My initial concerns will be heat, weight and build quality. XPS metal body feels great and is durable. I wonder how this will compare.

kevingadd 6y ago
Heat has always been the problem with Surfaces, for whatever reason the firmware always has massive power/thermal management issues. When the firmware is working right the thermals and noise level are great (especially if you're using the dGPU in the keyboard base, because it spreads the heat across the whole machine), but it's so frequently not... I hope they get it right this time.
Ididntdothis 6y ago
I use a Book 2 as daily driver but to be honest I would prefer the HP ZBook I had before. The Book is very unstable with multiple monitors, the docking station constantly runs out of USB resources, when I detach the tablet and reconnect the display settings get messed up and I spend ten minutes reconfiguring and overall it lacks speed compared to its configuration. Really not a good experience for a pricey high end laptop.
- RankingMember 6y ago
  I've had the same experience, the thing eventually becomes a nightmare with display issues if you're using the dock, which I think most are. We also have had multiple people's Surface Book 2 batteries start to swell to the point that the lid is parabola when you close it. I've recently had a show-stopper charging issue too, which is very obnoxious when you're in the middle of work.
slezyr 6y ago
But you need to compare it with future XPS 9300 or XPS 9700.
- deathhand 6y ago
  I will never endorse the "nostril camera" of XPS 9XXX series considering they have now released better.
  - extr 6y ago
    They've gone back to the 9XXX numbering scheme but those are the newest models. Ex: For the 13" line the 9300 is the newest iteration with above-screen camera replacement
koverda 6y ago
I think the laptop to beat is the X1 Carbon. Feels completely solid and uncompromised.
acolumb 6y ago
I have a Book v1, and let me tell you, that thing is riddled with issues. The hinge is the biggest thing. Because it connects over PCIe to the base, the Book is very sensitive after a decent amount of time. If I adjust the screen, the hinge disconnects and reconnects. Also, if I unplug my headphones while it's sleeping in laptop mode (which I use 99% of the time), the audio cuts out and I have to restart the machine. That's why I'm typing this on a Dell Latitude with the same 6300u that's inside the book and with a worse screen -- at least it generally works even if I had to re-uninstall Candy Crush...
- missosoup 6y ago
  Long term surface book user. Can confirm the hinge becomes absolute trash after a while, and MS will wash their hands of you after the warranty period. Doing anything to the lid will cause the PCIE bus to disconnect and freak the laptop out, sometimes repeatedly. Cute concept, garbage execution.
freeone3000 6y ago
What draws the high end to a surfacebook or an XPS instead of saving $1000 per laptop and going with the similar-specced Lenovo T543?

lvspiff 6y ago

Microsoft appears to be pricing their hardware in line with Apple now? $1599 starting price for the Book? I get the quality and the features are up there but the price is unappealing. the surface Go even starts at a reasonable $399 but then to add a dock is $250? The dock is is 62.5% the cost of the computer? That seems rather steep

kevingadd 6y ago
I think with the docks it's a no-win situation, from what I can tell the surface docks contain a display adapter (maybe 2 now for the new one since it supports multiple displays?), a NIC, a USB hub, charging circuitry, and some other random stuff. The price of all that seems to add up. I originally assumed the video out on the surface dock was just passthrough but it's not, it has its own display hardware with its own quirks and you update the firmware on it to change the behavior in some cases. In my experience a comparable USB-C dock of decent quality for my macbook is pretty expensive too, though certainly not surface dock level. I think this is just the situation we're in with how laptops and docks interact now. If more of the smarts were in the laptop than the dock the dock would probably be a lot cheaper, but that seems like it might drive up the price of the laptops.
- munchbunny 6y ago
  The original Surface Dock supplies power, two USB ports, two mini-displayport plugs, a headphone jack, and an ethernet port. (I'm using one right now.) With my first gen Surface Book, I'm able to drive two external screens through the dock, or use the laptop screen plus one more. Haven't tried with a Surface Book 2 yet. The nice part is that it just reuses the charging port. As far as docking stations go, it's a substantial step up from most docks. That new price tag is still pretty steep though.
justaguyhere 6y ago
Reminds me of the $999 Apple stand
- notRobot 6y ago

flyGuyOnTheSly 6y ago

Whoa whoa whoa, hold your horses their Microsoft. 4 new products in one blog post? And the blog post is pretty plain at that. Where's the sexy animations? The over the top presentation? If you're going to try and fuck me to the tune of $1,600 for a laptop, at least take me to out to dinner first. Microsoft could really stand to learn a few things from Google/Apple product presentation imho.

whateveracct 6y ago
Million dollar move, five dollar finish
bgroins 6y ago
I'd rather just focus on the 10% that is the detailed content, versus 90% hype, but to each their own. I don't need to be told for 3 hours that every minor feature is an Earth-shattering event.
- eugeniub 6y ago
  Honestly this blog post is 90% gibberish. Skimming over it, I just see meaningless word salads like "navigat[ing] the current environment", "design[ing] a Surface for every person", and "stay[ing] connected to the people and content that matters".
save_ferris 6y ago
Not only that, but I can’t find any review videos for the Surface headphones 2 on YouTube, and I’m looking for new headphones. Whenever a new Sony/Bose/Apple product drops, the reviewers are all over it. No wonder the first Surface headphones flew under the radar so hard.
enumjorge 6y ago
Yeah I’m confused by what their marketing team did here. It’s a super text heavy page with a just a couple of pictures showing the products from far away. Odd way to announce a hardware lineup.

ArtWomb 6y ago

I got to play with the 50" Surface Hub and it blew my mind. Even if a bit laggy and not altogether precise with gestures. 4K video, pressure sensitive drawing, handwriting recognition and indexing. Going back to a 15" screen felt strange afterwards. Very "Minority Report". I believe there is a large format 85" Surface due shortly ;)

harrygeez 6y ago

I was really hoping that Microsoft would tweak the design of Surface Book 3 and change the hinge, this spec bump is a little underwhelming after all this wait

cercatrova 6y ago
Time to wait another 3 years.

ArmandGrillet 6y ago

I got a Magic Keyboard for my iPad Pro 2018 and sent it back, now I'm thinking about selling the iPad to buy a Surface Go 2: kickstand included, WSL 2 when needed, keyboard with a function row. My only worry is that the experience in tablet mode is gonna be subpar.

hn_check 6y ago
And? What's your point?
balls187 6y ago
> My only worry is that the experience in tablet mode is gonna be subpar. That was my experience with the Surface Go. The battery life was much worse than my ipad mini 2. There are far less dedicated apps for Windows 10, so much of my tablet workflow involved using the web browser to access services. For batter life alone, I returned the surface go, and bought and ipad pro.
- loyukfai 6y ago
  Meanwhile, MS is touting the "bigger" battery in the Go 2. That's, 27Wh [1] vs 26.12Wh [2] of the original. Go figure. [1] https://youtu.be/kVAa-I8s9V0?t=180 https://youtu.be/kVAa-I8s9V0?t=180 [2] https://surfacetip.com/how-much-surface-battery-capacity-in-mah/ https://surfacetip.com/how-much-surface-battery-capacity-in-...
mey 6y ago
Things to consider when pricing the Go 2, upgrading from Windows S to Windows Pro and for make sure to get a drive bigger than 64gb. Windows isn't really a comfortable experience with so little storage space over the years.
whywhywhywhy 6y ago
Surface Go and iPad Pro are not comparable products. I have a Surface Go and it's a great little machine for what it is but iPad Pro should be compared to the Surface X.
6y ago

_xander 6y ago

The base Surface Go 2 seems like an attractive option for those looking to do a bit of real computing alongside iPad-esque media consumption.

jordanthoms 6y ago

Interested to try the new Surface Go - we brought one of the original ones as a test device and was quite disappointed. The performance, especially for web browsing, is far behind that of cheaper Chromebooks, even though it had more powerful hardware.

freeone3000 6y ago
Upgrading from the pentium to the m3 should put it on par with a $300 Chromebook. If you want a Chromebook, get a Chromebook.
disabled 6y ago
Agree with the other reply 100%. If you payed for the upgraded Surface Go, it works excellently, and runs pretty well when you break out of Windows S mode. I use it for travel and more portable uses. I specifically use it to read via screenreader (Kurzweil 3000--works best on Windows), when I need something more portable. I even got one for my mom for Mother's Day last year and she uses it as her primary Windows laptop. It is better than spending $180 for the cheapest Windows laptop that you can get, due to the tablet form factor, durability, and portability. Sure, the battery is not replaceable but this is livable.
- nailer 6y ago
  > If you payed for the upgraded Surface Go, it works excellently Personally, just using the new Edge and a few tabs on the high-end, 8G Surface Go 1, it still lags.
turtlebits 6y ago
The base model still uses a Pentium gold, so you're probably not going to like it either. You'll have to pay $629 for a better processor.

Eduard 6y ago

Those Earbuds look like a piercing plug / flesh tunnel. Hard to imagine they will sell well.

matsemann 6y ago
An ugly look didn't stop Airpods from selling like crazy, though.
- partiallypro 6y ago
  Airpods are a status symbol (somehow, even though everyone has them?) So I doubt Microsoft will get the same appeal.
  - lotsofpulp 6y ago
    You are claiming AirPods are a status symbol, and you’re claiming everyone has them. Which is a contradiction. They are not a status symbols. I see people working at fast food restaurants, in college, and other lower paid occupations with them. I also see them with iPhones and MacBooks and apple watches. But these devices aren’t that expensive. I don’t see them and think “this person must have access to a lot of credit or be related to someone rich”. That might be reserved for having a nice home in an expensive neighborhood. And in my experience, the utility and longevity derived from most Apple products far outweighed the extra few hundred dollars spent initially, so the amortized cost is much lower. I type this from an iPhone 6 bought in 2014, which at the time was the most expensive phone. But I didn’t buy it to be a status symbol.
    - partiallypro 6y ago
      Yes, they are a status symbol, just like the "blue bubble" v "green bubble" on SMS on iPhone. Blue bubbles mean the person has an iPhone, green bubbles mean the person doesn't have an iPhone. Do you honestly think Apple did that not knowing it would become a status symbol?
      - 6y ago

vvanders 6y ago

Shame on the Surface Book 3 using Intel, after seeing what the new Ryzen 4800 looks like I don't think anyone serious about performance would be looking at Intel.

hmottestad 6y ago
At least it's ice lake (10nm). From what Anandtech has said previously, it's got good graphics and AVX512....but other than that it's not faster than the 14nm processors because Intel still can't push the frequency as high. Here are some benchmarks. Intel can mostly keep up with AMD. It's not great though...multicore AMD is pulling ahead by quite a lot. https://www.anandtech.com/show/15762/the-acer-swift-3-sf314-review-swift-gets-swifter-with-ryzen-4000/4 https://www.anandtech.com/show/15762/the-acer-swift-3-sf314-...

dragonsh 6y ago

This hardware is a good choice for people in Windows Eco-system. But for people on MacOS or Linux these prices doesn't make sense given they can get better bang for bucks. Also based on previous experience with Surface Book and Surface Pro will not touch microsoft hardware or software (except for testing cross-platform application). Indeed haven't used Windows extensively for quite sometime since Windows 7. Still using a Macbook Pro bought in 2014, but do not use Surface book bought few years later as it's not as usable and nice condition compared to Macbook Pro, which is still chugging along very nicely.

BoysenberryPi 6y ago
Can you name better hardware for people in the Linux ecosystem that all work together well? The appeal of all of these products is that all of the Apple stuff works flawlessly together and all of the Windows stuff works flawlessly together. I personally have a hell of a time just getting bluetooth to work on my Linux thinkpad so definitely open to suggestions.
- diffeomorphism 6y ago
  Dell xps developer edition or thinkpad preinstalled with linux? Have someone else spend the time to get it to work just like you would with windows or macOS. > all of the Windows stuff works flawlessly together. Did you mean all surface stuff? What is it supposed to work together with? Headphones better work with everything and the pen and dial are kinda neat but don't scream "ecosystem".
- klohto 6y ago
  Another soul! I’m in the exact same boat and after this release, I just might jump on the surface book wagon. Sleek looking, great battery, WSL first class citizen. I just want a good touchpad, the damn fans to stop spinning randomly, bluetooth pairing to work and good battery life without tweaking TLP for few days.
diffeomorphism 6y ago
> these prices doesn't make sense given they can get better bang for bucks. Like what? A nice high resolution 3:2 screen seems great and difficult to find anywhere else. The drawbacks are the awful non-Windows compatibility (e.g. see reddits /r/surfacelinux) and the non-Wacom pen.

cercatrova 6y ago

More information and links from /r/surface: Introducing Surface Go 2, Surface Book 3, Surface Headphones 2 and Surface Earbuds https://preview.redd.it/15gbamema5x41.jpg?width=1024&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=7b1e7cc7cccc40f4f92f3b6b895534061a126c9f https://preview.redd.it/15gbamema5x41.jpg?width=1024&format=... Official blog post: https://blogs.windows.com/devices/2020/05/06/introducing-surface-go-2-surface-book-3-surface-headphones-2-and-surface-earbuds/ https://blogs.windows.com/devices/2020/05/06/introducing-sur... Pre-orders for most products start today (May 6th), and some devices launch starting May 12. --- Surface Go 2 - starting at $399 Release date: May 12, 2020 (US) Product launch video - https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NUw8jZl1hX0 https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NUw8jZl1hX0 Business product page - https://www.microsoft.com/en-us/surface/business/surface-go-2 https://www.microsoft.com/en-us/surface/business/surface-go-... Microsoft Mechanics overview - https://youtu.be/kVAa-I8s9V0 https://youtu.be/kVAa-I8s9V0 --- Surface Book 3 - starting at $1599 Release date: May 21, 2020 (US) Product launch video - https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kYFnAnmwG5c https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kYFnAnmwG5c Business product page - https://www.microsoft.com/en-us/surface/business/surface-book-3 https://www.microsoft.com/en-us/surface/business/surface-boo... Microsoft Mechanics overview - https://youtu.be/rGOQYX5etG8 https://youtu.be/rGOQYX5etG8 --- Surface Earbuds - priced at $199.99 Release date: May 12, 2020 (US) Pre-order page - https://www.microsoft.com/en-us/p/surface-earbuds/8r9cpq146064 https://www.microsoft.com/en-us/p/surface-earbuds/8r9cpq1460... (US) Product launch video - https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hMk7wnybXLM https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hMk7wnybXLM --- Surface Headphones 2 - priced at $249.99 Release date: May 12, 2020 (US) https://preview.redd.it/rv7uekkqf5x41.png?width=890&format=png&auto=webp&s=a0392ba956a9bbfe39a7a0a359b162b8af4b3197 https://preview.redd.it/rv7uekkqf5x41.png?width=890&format=p... --- Surface Dock 2 - priced at $259.99 Release date: Later this month in select markets Microsoft Mechanics overview - https://youtu.be/qaCHITOuWPw https://youtu.be/qaCHITOuWPw --- Surface USB-C Travel Hub - priced at $99.99 Release date: Later this month in select markets https://preview.redd.it/0b3u3dpxd5x41.jpg?width=1440&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=0bcfda84bd09d776cd7dfe196ca5b33d91891f81 https://preview.redd.it/0b3u3dpxd5x41.jpg?width=1440&format=... --- Other new accessories: Surface Go Sleeve - https://www.microsoft.com/en-us/p/surface-go-sleeve/8x1tzlkclxtb https://www.microsoft.com/en-us/p/surface-go-sleeve/8x1tzlkc... Microsoft Ergonomic Desktop bundle - priced at $89.99 Microsoft Bluetooth Desktop bundle - priced at $59.99

blakesterz 6y ago

Those earbuds look like they'd fit worse than Apple's. I wonder if I have funny shaped ears, but nothing fits right. Those Pixel Buds look like things that would fit with the way they have those hooks or whatever they're called. It must be really hard to design these things to fit a wide range of ears.

StreakyCobra 6y ago
> I wonder if I have funny shaped ears, but nothing fits right That's what U.S. air force discovered after WWII [1] (discussed on HN recently [2]). Also known as flaw of averages, curse of dimensionality, etc. > There was no such thing as an average pilot. If you’ve designed a cockpit to fit the average pilot, you’ve actually designed it to fit no one. [1] https://www.thestar.com/news/insight/2016/01/16/when-us-air-force-discovered-the-flaw-of-averages.html https://www.thestar.com/news/insight/2016/01/16/when-us-air-... [2] https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=22956832 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=22956832
PascLeRasc 6y ago
Have you tried IEMs? I have ears where regular earbuds don't fit well too, Apple's are incredibly uncomfortable for me. But IEMs like the Shure SE215 fit really well and I barely notice them. The Meelectronics X6 works great for a pair of cheap Bluetooth gym headphones too.
- texasbigdata 6y ago
  Or even better CIEMs if fit is a goal :)
bound008 6y ago
1. At first I resented AirPods for not sealing out background noise, or fitting securely. But then I realized its a feature and not a bug. You can be in a private space while not fully disconnected from the public space. Just another tool in the arsenal 2. People have mentioned IEMs. If you feel discomfort from most headphones, you can get custom ear molds made for IEMs. In the US, this is generally a co-pay to an audiologist for a visit, around $50 for the audiologist to make the impressions, and around $100 for the custom plugs. IEM technology has not changed drastically, so you can buy used or older models. A 10 year old triple driver IEM will likely sound better than any non-IEM option. Make sure your IEM choice has detachable cables, as life happens. Plus, you can then use something like the FiiO UTWS1 to turn your IEMs into a more modern experience. There will be a downgrade in quality but it will be worth it for convenience. 3. Microsoft likely made a mistake with the size of these buds. They look like gauges that people put into their ears. This will either be a failure, or in the modern world of branding, an unlikely success. FWIW, FiiO has cheap IEMs that are pretty good. For under $200 you can get a pair with 3 drivers in each ear (F9 Pro), and the aforementioned bluetooth “true wireless” adapter. Add another $200 and you have custom ear molds.

dsalzman 6y ago

...Featuring an ultra-comfortable and stable fit, Surface Earbuds offer intuitive touch controls so you can start a phone call or change the song without taking out your phone....Screen-free integration with Microsoft 365 lets you catch up on emails with Play My Emails in the Outlook Mobile App for iOS or allow you to dictate in Word, Outlook or PowerPoint. -- Woooah. I can listen to Powerpoint decks! TAKE MY MONEY!

freewizard 6y ago

Maybe I've been using macOS with default wallpapers for too long but the Windows wallpaper in this post feels so familiar.

tdhttt 6y ago

They featured WSL in the Surface Book video! And terminal is in the dock!

whywhywhywhy 6y ago

From the Surface Book 3 launch video: "Rendered on Surface Book 3". That's how you sell a Pro machine.

ripley12 6y ago

It’s disappointing that the SB3 seems to have the same screen and trackpad as the SB2. The screen has so much glare compared to the MBP and XPS, it makes dark mode unusable in most lighting situations. The trackpad is small and mediocre, it can’t reliably pick up two-finger right clicks. It’s a shame because I think the hardware is otherwise great.

vorpalhex 6y ago

I have a Surface Pro 7, their oversized tablet, after ditching my ipad pro out of frustration. I wanted something that had a nice pen but still had a real filesystem and I could easily load comics and movies on, use ssh, and was full featured enough that I wasn't required to lug a laptop with me. And the surface pro is.. fine. Hardware wise it's great even, but my issue is overwhelmingly that Microsoft's default software makes a sad tablet experience. Their screen keyboards are garbage, the store is lackluster and the tablet mode does not play nicely with most apps leading to weird issues like not being able to leave the kindle app once it's fullscreened. If Microsoft invested a bit more in improving the tablet experience, they could really eat some of Apple's marketshare.

gazelle21 6y ago
Interesting. I had the exact opposite issue, I was tired of the buggy and laggy features. I just needed something for media consumption with ssh for my pi's. Ipad has been working flawlessly, but all my other devices are windows/androids so the lack of compatibility is a pain at time.
paulcole 6y ago
Are you considering switching back to the iPad Pro? Or is fine good enough for your use?
- vorpalhex 6y ago
  If the iPad let me stick in a usb drive and copy over comics, and load open source software from outside the Apple store - yes. Since that will never happen in our lifetime, probably not. For what it's worth, the iPad feels great in terms of size and construction, it has a fantastic screen and the overall UX/UI is pleasant. Unfortunately, it's not usable as a short term laptop replacement and basic computer tasks are just not possible, especially not offline.
  - snalty 6y ago
    For what it's worth, you might be able to copy over comics using a USB drive now. You can definitely copy comics over a network share as an alternative, as the Files app supports mounting samba shares. EDIT: of course that doesn't help with the loading of open source software on the device.

intopieces 6y ago

The thing that always bothered me about the Surface Go was that it didn’t feel like a cohesive device. More like a tablet with accessories. The way the fin awkwardly sticks out of the back is an admission that it can’t stand on its own because it’s a tablet, and the keyboard has an odd angle that makes it look unstable, like typing on a piece of cardboard. When I see it, I just see compromises, like a tablet trying its best to make it in a world where sometimes you need a laptop.

kbd 6y ago
> The way the fin awkwardly sticks out of the back By "fin" you mean... the stand? So, the stand means that it doesn't stand on its own? What? You clearly haven't tried one because the built-in stand is fantastic and the keyboard cover works very well.
- intopieces 6y ago
  > By "fin" you mean... the stand? So, the stand means that it doesn't stand on its own? What? Yeah. It needs the stand because it doesn’t support itself with the keyboard (like a laptop). It just doesn’t seem very lap friendly. Previous to the iPad Pro keyboard I didn’t find any solution to this problem tablets that didn’t involve some ugly clamps. I haven’t tried it, so I am interested in others’ experience with it, since it’s an interesting design.
  - kbd 6y ago
    > It needs the stand because it doesn’t support itself with the keyboard (like a laptop). Yeah it's primarily a tablet form factor and doesn't come with a keyboard. But that makes it a tablet that stands on its own with the built-in stand. Then, plug in one USB-C cable and it's a full computer with access to all my peripherals that can drive my 3840x1600 monitor. Add the keyboard cover (which is fantastic for how thin it is, the trackpad works well, etc.) and it becomes a laptop. There are lots of problems with the Go. It's slow! Battery life is mediocre. Windows itself is a mess. Because it's a tablet that's a full computer, it's bulkier than an ipad. But it's such a neat little device.

uallo 6y ago

The Surface Go 2 looks interesting but I'm too deeply invested in macOS, unfortunately. I wish Apple offered something similar (i.e. a real computer, not a tablet). I really liked the MacBook Air 11" and regret that I sold it years ago.

davidcollantes 6y ago
Get an Apple laptop?
- deleted 6y ago
  [deleted]
- uallo 6y ago
  A 13" laptop is not really comparable to a 10.5" detachable.
  - eanzenberg 6y ago
    There’s also the 12” macbook that they will update soon I believe.
    - uallo 6y ago
      That has been discontinued last year. Do you have a link regarding the supposed update? Edit: I found some rumors that claim that Apple might revive the 12" MacBook in 2020. I hope they actually do but can't really see it happening as it might cannibalize their iPad sales.
Marsymars 6y ago
I've got a 12" MB that I'll keep until Apple releases another fanless laptop, or until it stops getting macOS updates.
- EForEndeavour 6y ago
  Serious question: why is fanlessness the defining criterion for you? Is it the noise? Or the impression that having a fan is a sign of poor thermal design somehow?

no_wizard 6y ago

Is it weird I'm absolutely excited over the new desktop bundle for the erognomic keyboard and mouse? I have absolutely come to love the Microsoft erognomic keyboard and mouse set, so I look forward to snapping it up so that I can replace my much much older version of those products. When it comes to those two accessories, for me at least, I think they're such a great value for such a low price!

reaperducer 6y ago
Is it weird I'm absolutely excited over the new desktop bundle for the erognomic keyboard and mouse? I don't know if weird is the word. Some people just are really into this sort of thing. Like when the hard-core Apple fans lost their coolant when the black keyboard and mouse came out. I think it's normal because these are things we interact with physically every day. We become attached to real, tangible things. It's part of why keychains, mobile phones, and jewelry are so personal to us.
showerst 6y ago
You're not the only one. Especially because the last generation sculpt mouse was mechanically junk (i'm on my third one in 2 years...) but in a great form factor.
EForEndeavour 6y ago
Is the new mouse still used with the palm facing down? What specifically makes it ergonomic? I'm looking to stave off some looming wrist RSI, and have latched onto the idea that a vertical mouse (Evoluent, Anker, and Logitech are probably the most popular manufacturers) is the best solution short of switching to a different device type, like a trackball.
- ModernMech 6y ago
  I've got the Logitech vertical mouse and it's the best thing I've done for my wrists lately. Highly recommended. Also got the Logitech ergo keyboard and that has been great as well.
- Marsymars 6y ago

Roritharr 6y ago

If they are still refusing to put Thunderbolt 3 ports in, they could have put the far better Ryzen Chips in...

wslh 6y ago
What is the reason to not putting Thunderbolt 3? I still prefer the XPS 13 with 2 TB port + 1 USB Type-C.
- partiallypro 6y ago
  I believe it has to do with the amount of lanes available on the board, because they want to keep the Surface connector (and I don't blame them.)
- nimish 6y ago
  Apparently DMA attacks (thunderclap et al).
  - whereistimbo 6y ago
    But Windows 10 in 2019 included Kernel DMA Protection to mitigate thunderclap etc
cogman10 6y ago
I think the battery story just barely got better with AMD CPUs. Intel's mobile CPUs (used to) do much better at keeping power usage low. IDK how the new 4000 series compares.

bcrosby95 6y ago

From what I can tell, you can only get 4 cores on the Surface Book 3? Kinda unfortunate if true.

maelito 6y ago

The perfect device for me : the Surface Pro X's hybrid tablet format, with no chip inside, as your smpartphone is the chip, that lets you use Android (for everyday tasks and some pro tasks) or a full GNU/Linux. A poor version of this, but already worth using : Samsung Dex with a portable monitor, with UserLand or Andronix. Portable monitors are way behind the Surface Pro X (e.g. for pencil management), Samsung doesn't invest enough money on Dex and UserLand / Andronix lack some features (a good VNC client seamlessly integrated / hardware acceleration)

agentdrtran 6y ago
This was tried by Motorola a while ago but it didn't really take off.
- maelito 6y ago
  My phone is now more powerful than the XPS 13 I used in 2017. Same with the SPX. It changes everything.

bluedino 6y ago

>> Our active noise cancellation is adjustable through intuitive on-ear dials My only real complaint about my Sony noise-cancelling headphones are the stupid touch controls, why would Microsoft copy those?

kbumsik 6y ago
They are physical dials, not touch though.
virvar 6y ago
If they actually worked they might not be so bad. I’ve never gotten my otherwise beloved mx3s to do one single thing I wanted them to do while using the touch controls, but I can see how pausing a song, adjusting volume or forwarding might be nice if it actually worked.
partiallypro 6y ago
It's not a touch control, it's a physical dial like on a stereo. It actually feels really nice. You can adjust the volume on one ear, and the noise cancellation on the other. There are touch controls, like stop, start, skip etc; but not volume/noise cancellation.
mey 6y ago
I use Sony WH-CH700N's because they fold flat, have physical buttons, noise cancelling and have good enough sound quality. (It's bluetooth, can only ask so much) https://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/product/1389412-REG/sony_whch700n_b_ch700n_wireless_noise_cancelling_headphones.html https://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/product/1389412-REG/sony_whch...

halotrope 6y ago

As a former Surface Book 2 user I really hope this update includes good antireflective coating or even a laminated display. The Surface devices are great but the display while beautiful on its own is just too damn reflective. Ultimately abandoned the device because of the reflectivity.

GekkePrutser 6y ago

Would the Go 2 run Linux OK? I had a Surface Pro 3 for a while and though I got Linux running on it, I never managed all the tablety stuff working properly. Rotation, Pen + Touch input (at the same time without randomly cutting out!!), auto keyboard popup on input fields with no keyboard connecting, the keyboard actually working after being removed and reconnected, etc etc... It was a great machine but Linux lacked support for this type of support in many ways. I wonder if this has improved as this was many years ago when the SP3 was just out.

fheld 6y ago
this subreddit has some good information on the topic: https://www.reddit.com/r/surfacelinux https://www.reddit.com/r/surfacelinux and for the Go 1 it seems to work pretty well: https://www.reddit.com/r/SurfaceLinux/comments/gclaqi/surface_go_8_gb128_with_ubuntu_20_and/ https://www.reddit.com/r/SurfaceLinux/comments/gclaqi/surfac...
freeone3000 6y ago
It's gotten better, in that you now have wifi and can detach the keyboard. Pen and ink is still bad. Do not recommend running Linux.
- GekkePrutser 6y ago
  Oh, WiFi worked fine for me even then! Thanks for the feedback!

dougmwne 6y ago

I was looking at the Surface Book 3 specs and it hit me that the value proposition for discrete graphics has changed significantly if you want to game on your laptop. Since Stadia, Geforce Now and other cloud gaming services have launched, I suddenly have no interest in paying hundreds extra for a gaming capable laptop, just to make a compromise on weight, battery life or GPU power. I've been gaming on the cloud services for the past few months, and as long as you're within a few hundred miles of a cloud rendering location, you're going to get a far better mobile gaming experience on a thin, light and cheap laptop than you would on mobile graphics. I've been enjoying fast-paced platformers, online shooters and action-RPGs on a 5 year old laptop and wouldn't want to downgrade to mobile graphics. This actually shocks me that my hardware preferences could have changed so rapidly. I would have been salivating over the gaming specs of the surface book 6 months ago.

shimylining 6y ago
What has been your primary cloud gaming service? I've been wanting to give it a go during this WFH period.
- dougmwne 6y ago
  I'm signed up for both Stadia and Gforce Now. Both have lengthy free trials right now. They have different game libraries, so I've been switching back and forth depending on the game. I recommend both. If you want to try the absolute smoothest user experience, give Stadia a try as it will come with a selection of free games and there's nothing to install. If you already have a large Steam library and want to play some of those games, give Geforce Now a try.
  - ShamelessC 6y ago
    The ability to play many of my existing Steam games made GeForce Now the clear winner for me. Don't have to repurchase any games and if I decided to get a better gaming PC in the future (which I did when HL: Alyx came out), I can play any games I purchased prior on that PC. The latency for multiplayer was just barely acceptable. I tried both Rocket League and Destiny 2 and was able to notice that I wasn't playing as well in either compared to playing locally. I still struggle to see how Google plans to make Stadia successful when they're asking developers to port to their platform and players to pay for games they can't play locally. It would be interesting if they released a console offering that just replicated one of the Stadia servers but I don't see that happening.

rayshan 6y ago

There's a picture of the new Microsoft Ergonomic Desktop on The Verge. So sad that the keyboard is wired and not TKL :( Somewhat normal function keys though compared to the Sculpt. Mouse is also wired. https://www.theverge.com/2020/5/6/21247234/microsoft-surface-dock-2-usb-c-hub-keyboard-mouse-price https://www.theverge.com/2020/5/6/21247234/microsoft-surface... https://cdn.vox-cdn.com/thumbor/W1Uqdi9jgOACKGZQ_CEJVgGbxdw=/0x0:2040x1360/1720x0/filters:focal(0x0:2040x1360):format(webp):no_upscale()/cdn.vox-cdn.com/uploads/chorus_asset/file/19946363/ergonomickeyboardbundle.jpg https://cdn.vox-cdn.com/thumbor/W1Uqdi9jgOACKGZQ_CEJVgGbxdw=...

zozbot234 6y ago
Wired devices are way less fiddly for serious and professional use. No need to ever bother with pairing with the host, keeping a battery charged, or anything else; they will just work out of the box, and will keep working for the foreseeable future.
- GekkePrutser 6y ago
  Yes and it's not like they're going anywhere. Especially on the keyboard the cable is a non-issue IMO. I highly prefer wired keyboards. The only reason to have a wireless keyboard is liking the look of a total wire-free desk (which I don't care about). And with the mouse it's just a minor annoyance (empty batteries are a bigger one so I have that wired too).
- three_seagrass 6y ago
  Wireless is also an attack vector. Bad actors can potentially listen in on what's being typed. For the average user it's NBD, but for large companies it's different.
vxNsr 6y ago
Hmmm... Interesting, they have dedicated emoji and office keys... I wonder what the office key does? also they got rid of shared function keys which is great, shared fn keys never made sense on a large full layout desktop keyboard, no one is getting this keyboard because it looks compact.

xiphias2 6y ago

Isn't it better to go with a 7nm AMD Ryzen 4000 based laptop nowdays? For example a Ryzen 5 4500U is also Quad-core with 8 hyperthreads, but has a 2.3GHz base clock.

nimish 6y ago

Still no TB3 -- https://twitter.com/h0x0d/status/1253917701719769088 https://twitter.com/h0x0d/status/1253917701719769088 -- but I am surprised Microsoft is admitted defeat and is unable to come up with secure a secure DMA implementation. There have to be enough kernel and firmware developers there to do it, right? Or has that org wasted away...

AshamedCaptain 6y ago
I am sure the proprietary dock -- whose price keeps increasing -- has absolutely nothing to do with the decision not to use TB3.

richardlblair 6y ago

I have a 15" Surface book 2. The spine on it is absolutely massive and it is heavy as all hell. Got a comparable dell 13" and im not going to look back

hypersoar 6y ago

Caveat emptores: With a couple exceptions, Surface devices cannot be repaired, nor have the battery replaced. Not even by Microsoft. iFixit's repair scores on all the devices, except the Pro X, range from 0/10 to 1/10. If you have a problem that would require repair, you need to instead get it replaced with a refurbished machine. This means you have to back up your machine and set it all up again on a new one. If you're out of warranty, you also need to pay hundreds of dollars for this: $250 for a Go, $450 for a Pro or Laptop, and $600 for the Book or older Pro 4. It's unavailable altogether for anything older. They trumpeted improved repairability for the Pro X (edit: and Laptop 3), but I can't find anything suggesting a similar effort for the Book. I like my Surface Pro 4 a lot. I initially got it for the pen when I was a math Ph.D. student. It was great for taking notes and giving lectures. I don't do that anymore, but the Surface machines still appeal to me as potential upgrades. But it's tough for me to justify spending north of $1,500 on a laptop when I can only expect a few years of life from it. So, please, other laptop makers, make some 3:2 laptops. Dell, good job with that new 16:10 XPS. Microsoft, at least make the damn batteries replaceable.

thwave 6y ago
just a nitpick: the proper plural is "caveant emptores".
- LoveMortuus 6y ago
  cave-ant They're everywhere~
- hypersoar 6y ago
  Thanks! Part of me knew that I was gonna burn myself by going for the Latin.
skuthus 6y ago
This is only partially true now. The surface laptop line has made huge strides in repair-ability. https://www.theverge.com/2019/10/23/20929530/microsoft-surface-laptop-3-easy-open-up-repair-fix-ifixit-teardown https://www.theverge.com/2019/10/23/20929530/microsoft-surfa... That being said, the surface pro, go, and book lines have yet to attain the same level of repair-ability.

awinder 6y ago

"People tell us that putting on headphones is today’s equivalent of shutting the office door to focus and connect in any setting" 1. What's an office 2. What's an office door

oblio 6y ago
0. What are open plan offices? 0'. What are the most popular office plans?

odiroot 6y ago

> Our active noise cancellation is adjustable through intuitive on-ear dials and specifically tuned to [..] block out [..] human voices. If only someone confirmed this working, I'll be buying them in an instant.

sneak 6y ago

It's amazing that after all of these years, Microsoft's best work is still ripping off Apple's design flourishes. That blog post is straight out of Apple's marketing style about 3 years ago. White void background, dramatic landscape desktops, parallel array of flat devices inclined on the diagonal, high contrast background/model skin color, et c. I'd bet the packaging for these devices follows the Apple model as well (just as Google did for the Pixelbook).

throwawaysea 6y ago

I am really disappointed that the Surface Books do not have a stronger GPU. After waiting two years for an update, I was hoping to see strong GPUs that would make this a swiss army knife laptop - something that is portable, has great battery life, but can also be used for gaming or machine learning work. Unfortunately it appears that Microsoft will not sell the Quadro version of this laptop to individuals and only make it available through their commercial channels (https://www.microsoft.com/en-us/surface/business/surface-book-3 https://www.microsoft.com/en-us/surface/business/surface-boo...). I verified this in a chat with a sales rep.

phonon 6y ago
It will probably show up here eventually. https://www.microsoft.com/en-us/store/b/surfaceforbusiness https://www.microsoft.com/en-us/store/b/surfaceforbusiness

atarian 6y ago

The new hardware looks impressive, but I think it's still being held back by Windows; I say this as someone who uses Windows 10 on a daily basis. Given how responsive Microsoft has been to the market, I wouldn't be surprised if they scrapped Windows in favor of something web-based like Chrome OS.

msh 6y ago
Thats windows 10x which is annouced earlier.

madjam002 6y ago

I have a Surface Book 2 15” with the max specs and it is not worth the price to me. Compared to the new MacBooks I much prefer the Surface Book’s ergonomics and keyboard, but the performance is just too unreliable, it frequently thermal throttles and also randomly slows down to a snails pace. Plus now the back has been getting unusually warm even when idling on both my Windows 10 and Linux dual boot, it never used to do that. I’ve only had it for 13 months and it’s already showing its age. I don’t understand how my desktop i5 4690k with an old SATA SSD is SO much faster than this laptop that has an 8th gen i7 8650u, DDR4, NVMe SSD, even for basic tasks like having more than 20 browser tabs open and just surfing the web.

cmenge 6y ago
I totally agree, I have the 13.5" and suffer from the same problem. MS Teams warns me that my audio quality will degrade because of the CPU load - on a machine that is essentially idling. Sometimes it takes tens of seconds to react to clicks (we're talking Outlook, not Paraview) when I'm in a conference etc.
- MauranKilom 6y ago
  Outlook can also take a second to react to a click on a high end PC. It feels terrible no matter what. You always have to bring an extra bucket of patience when doing anything with it.
Infinitesimus 6y ago
> I don’t understand how my desktop i5 4690k with an old SATA SSD is SO much faster than this laptop that has an 8th gen i7 8650u, DDR4, NVMe SSD, even for basic tasks like having more than 20 browser tabs open and just surfing the web. The surface book is in a strange bind. the 8650 is much much weaker than your 4690k and has very little thermal room to play with. The thermals are particularly tricky because the CPU lives in the tablet portion; meaning there is a tension between cooling it properly, providing a touch screen and keeping it thin and light enough to not have awkward weight distribution.
- 6y ago

juped 6y ago

Microsoft has been trying to make pen input "a thing" since at least 2000 when they started selling "tablet PCs", and as a result their pen input has become really excellent over the years. The segmentation of the Surface brand is confusing as hell and I'm still not sure which is which despite being invested in it.

epmaybe 6y ago

I wish we had device convergence without fancy tricks like Android/Windows link or iOS/Mac Handoff. I'd love to be working on a document on my phone, put it in laptop mode to write in a more desktop-like environment for multitasking or putting PDFs side by side, and then docking at home for a full desktop experience. So far, it seems like Samsung DeX (is the X capitalized?) is the closest for me, but with them killing Linux on DeX, it seems like it won't come to pass. Or maybe I just need to suck it up and get LTE data plans for all of my devices.

WorldMaker 6y ago
Windows Phone 10 "Continuum" was pretty great, as brief as it lasted. It is too bad Microsoft gave up on trying for phones running Windows.
- epmaybe 6y ago
  Yeah, I had the opportunity to try it out as well and was impressed. I just wish there were more staying power in features like that. DeX is nice too but again we run a risk of the company shutting it down due to a lack of users.

dboreham 6y ago

Hmm. Aspect ratio on the Go2 looks not right.

skocznymroczny 6y ago

I'm still not sold on the kickstand. I bought the original Surface Go because I loved the form factor and all, but the kickstand I dislike. I wish it was a more traditional clamshell design instead, making it more usable on the lap or when held in hand.

galkk 6y ago

If only there were tablets of 15" Surface Book size or larger . I don't need laptop, but I'd be happy to have larger ipad or Surface Book

deleted 6y ago

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