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KolibriOS – operating system written entirely in assembly language
- tr33house 7y agoThis is an amazing engineering effort. All the best!!
- xvilka 7y agoSee also the sources in their Subversion repository[1] and their discussion board[2]. [1] http://websvn.kolibrios.org/ http://websvn.kolibrios.org/ [2] https://board.kolibrios.org/ https://board.kolibrios.org/
- jbritton 7y agoWhen clicking the first link I get a warning that the site is not secure, that it maybe impersonating websvn.kolibrios.org. using: iOS Safari
- xvilka 7y agoOh, sorry - it seems the site is HTTP-only. Fixed the link, thanks!
- themodelplumber 7y agoSeems to be heavily...Russian? Ukrainian? Not that I mind, but I wish there was a universal language for code comments :-)
- xvilka 7y agoYeah, most developers speak Russian.
- saagarjha 7y agoAs a native English speaker, I think the situation leans fairly in my favor already.
- themodelplumber 7y agoAs a frequent coment typo maker I'm conflicted about others reading my comment's in general
- michaelg7x 7y agoBien joué ;)
- barbs 7y agoHow does this differ from the project it forked from (MenuetOS)?
- snvzz 7y agoThe most important difference is that kolibrios is a team effort, and open source. Menuetos abandoned its 32bit version (the one that was open) to focus on 64bit, which is not, and even has a clause in the license that prohibits disassembly.
- hackerbabz 7y agoWhat is the commercial value of an artisinal OS like this?
- apiguy 7y agoLikely low powered computing scenarios. Think set-top boxes, kiosks, cash registers, etc. Anywhere you want to use very cheap hardware basically.
- unnouinceput 7y agoCheaper then Raspberry Pi? With $15 for Zero variant? How much cheaper then that you can do really? I'd say RPI it's the best in that regard. Also fully fledged Linux there, not some pet project OS.
- exikyut 7y agoVery cheap _x86_ hardware, to be specific. I'm not sure if it's actually more expensive to find VIA et al based systems for cheaper than NUCs?
- snvzz 7y agoI don't know if VIA still does any of that. But there's Vortex86.
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- deleted 7y ago[deleted]
- mysterydip 7y agoI don't mean this as a slight because I love the project and other light fast OSes... but with modern compilers, what does assembly get you over just using C or another language and having it handle the translation? I was under the impression compilers nowadays have lots of optimizations that would take a lot of work for a human to do by hand, as well as creating less readable/maintainable code.
- haolez 7y agoIt gives you a very close understanding of your CPU's instruction set and features. It's not necessary to write performant code, since compilers can do this very well.
- abnry 7y ago"We choose to write an OS in asm, not because it is easy, but because it is hard"
- MR4D 7y agoMake Assembly Great Again! LOL!!
- pjmlp 7y agoWell, C still doesn't offer the same macro capabilities as 90's macro assemblers were capable of. Thankfully in C++ we have constexpr for that.
- higerordermap 7y agoCan you elaborate which capabilities to those of us interested to know?
- pjmlp 7y agoYes, here is the manual for MASM. https://docs.microsoft.com/en-us/cpp/assembler/masm/directives-reference?view=vs-2019 https://docs.microsoft.com/en-us/cpp/assembler/masm/directiv... Basically already back in the Amiga/MS-DOS days, you could define: - procedures and functions like higher level languages - structures - make use of looping constructs (repeat/while) and conditional logic (if/else) - create hygienic labels for variables and jump targets TASM and the FOSS clones, yasm and fasm do support similar macro capabilities. On the Amiga side, Devpac was the goto Macro Assembler, https://www.amigagamedev.com/Downloads/DevPac_v3.00.Manual.pdf https://www.amigagamedev.com/Downloads/DevPac_v3.00.Manual.p... Only the UNIX Assemblers have been traditionally quite poor in macro capabilities, as they have been mostly used as yet another stage for generating code from C compilers. A good example how to take advantage of such macros is to implement a poor man's compiler, or the first stage of a bootstraped compiler. Generate bytecodes that can be easily mapped into macros, and then just by having your macro library for the target platform you get the compiler very quickly up and running.
- datajack 7y agoMalwarebytes Premium is blocking the download(s) and access to board.kolibrios.org. Unable to download any images.
- hardekore 7y agothis is beautiful
- bprajapa 7y agoTitle seams kinda of skeptical, I'll believe it when I see the source code.
- konart 7y agoGo ahead http://websvn.kolibrios.org/ http://websvn.kolibrios.org/
- longtermd 7y agoExciting! Please be much more specific on your webpage "much faster" (so... 2X, or 10X, ... or just 10%)? Also for "requires only few MB". What are "few MB" for you? 1? 10? 100? :) Please be specific with all your claims and measure everything, to be more credible and useful.
- wumms 7y agoLive CD is ~65MB (the website says the core fits on a 1.44MB floppy). It boots in less than one second (VirtualBox using defaults for "unknown OS"). Mouse and keyboard are working but are not fit for real use. "If you really want guest addons for KolibriOS to be available, you may offer your help in porting them" http://wiki.kolibrios.org/wiki/Setting_up_VirtualBox http://wiki.kolibrios.org/wiki/Setting_up_VirtualBox
- projektfu 7y agoI didn’t like the event model in Kolibri so I gave up on it after poking around programming for a while. There are a couple interesting games. I like the Lawnmower game that’s like a house painting game I once typed in for the C64.
- 72deluxe 7y agoOut of interest, what was wrong with the event model?
- projektfu 7y agoI wish I could remember exactly. Too much preprocessing of input? Inflexible calling of the program by the OS? Not sure but it was either live with it or rewrite everything to change it.
- projektfu 7y agoWhile I’m at it, I’ll just mention that I see a ton more C code in the repository than it used to have.
- the100rabh 7y agoSo we are replacing the efficiency of the compiler with humans ?
- pyuser583 7y agoWhy? What’s the point?
- mmariani 7y agoRead the second paragraph on the posted link. “Have you ever dreamed of a system that boots in less than 10 seconds from power-on to working GUI, on $100 PC?”
- unnouinceput 7y agoHave you seen Windows 10 IOT booting in less then 5 seconds on a $50 Raspberry Pi? Because I do.
- mhd 7y agoYou're reading this on Hacker news. Too show it's possible, to have some fun. I think they're perfectly aware that this won't replace their current browser-host.
- mrzool 7y agoIs it Unix? Does it ship with a standard shell? Would I be able to build and install standard packages on it?
- diggan 7y agoI only find "unix-like" mentioned in the documentation, so probably not. Sounds like you're looking for Tiny Core Linux or similar projects.
- rvz 7y agoNo. It is its own OS from scratch. Not POSIX either.
- kwhitefoot 7y agoNo it isn't and the shell is quite limited it seems although it does look like it could be extended. If this could run Bash, rclone, and whatever Ethernet hardware I have in my old laptops I think it would be really useful. I wonder how much effort would be needed to port the GNU Core Utilities? Probably well outside my comfort zone. Still it should be worth a look!
- anta40 7y agoNo. It's not "yet another UNIX/POSIX-based OS". It's completey written from scratch. I haven't followed Menuet for a few years. Not sure if now they have GCC or not. If not, probably you won't see your favourite apps run on it.
- andai 7y agoI wonder to what degree software written in assembly is faster precisely because it's harder to write. The result is that you end up with a lot less of it. Everything's fast in the early stages, when there's not so much of it yet.
- stef-13013 7y agoNice proof of concept, really. The challenge is quite interesting... But in the real world, it won't fit at all.
- mixmastamyk 7y agoReminds me of minuet, wonder how it compares.
- prox 7y agoIt says it is a fork of minuet (2004)
- infamousebrave 7y agoDoes this OS have linux shell?
- infamousebrave 7y agoDoes this OS have Linux Shell?
- palant 7y agoNo. It has a shell albeit a pretty limited one - it's pretty rudimentary, like pretty much all the applications available.
- MaxBarraclough 7y agoYes, it runs DOOM. A good milestone for these sorts of OSs. http://wiki.kolibrios.org/wiki/Doom http://wiki.kolibrios.org/wiki/Doom
- palant 7y agoIt's really fast, and it has a nice retro touch to it. But claiming that is has a web browser is clearly an exaggeration. It's a text-based browser, and for some websites it cannot even display the text (crashes). So as a consumer operating system it isn't really good for anything. Unless you want to play retro games all day long of course. The website also claims that the operating system has a "word processor." A more appropriate term for it would be "text editor," it appears to be less functional than Notepad on Windows.
- deleted 7y ago[deleted]
- stefanve 7y agoreminds me of menuet OS http://menuetos.net/ http://menuetos.net/
- boudin 7y agoIt's a fork of menuetos actually
- omginternets 7y agoWhat niche is this supposed to occupy? I can't seem to find any information on when/why KolibriOS would be a good choice over more traditional OSes. Stated differently: is this a useful thing, or is it an exercise in "how far can we push a pure-assembly project"? The latter would of course be fine, but I'm quite curious to know which it is.
- malinens 7y agohow about the tiny niche called fun which increasingly is harder to find around? (:
- omginternets 7y ago> Stated differently: is this a useful thing, or is it an exercise in "how far can we push a pure-assembly project"? The latter would of course be fine, but I'm quite curious to know which it is. ;)
- IvanK_net 7y agoTo try KolibriOS without installing anything, you can emulate it in your web browser here: https://copy.sh/v86/ https://copy.sh/v86/ .
- tomcam 7y agoThis is amazing. A lot of it works on my iPad.
- anthk 7y agoDoes it have a Gopher client?
- znpy 7y agoI remember trying MenuetOS about 12-13 years ago and being surprised by how much stuff they were able to deliver in so little space. At the time the whole system booted off a floppy disk in a split second (despite the slow read rates and seek time of floppy disks!)
- aforty 7y ago*written almost entirely in assembly language, he says so himself in the video.
- 0xTJ 7y agoI've tried writing an OS purely in assembly before, but gave up while writing the virtual file system.
- lebuffon 7y agoSometimes I get the sense that people think CPU is short for "C" Processing Unit. :)
- alexandercrohde 7y agoNot to be a buzzkill, but I'd like the exact opposite. An operating system with no asm, no C. Processors are over 1,000x what they were when I was young, I wish I could trade some of that 1000x for fewer security holes.
- plumbus420 7y agoI know back in the day there were talks of having Linux (or some other OS?) being re-written in Java, but it never panned out. At least that's what my professor told me, but I can't seem to find any info about it. But there is an OS being written in Rust. https://www.redox-os.org/ https://www.redox-os.org/
- anta40 7y agoThe downside of being written completely in assembly language: what if someone wanted to port Kolibri to, say, ARM CPU? Hmm...
- squarefoot 7y agoWell done, now port it to ARM!:) Seriously, if there's a platform to which a so tightly packed OS could be immensely beneficial, are all those small Linux-capable ARM boards that cost like two beers. Even the most hardware limited ones (256 MB RAM, 32bit single core, etc.) that still can run a complete Linux environment in some contexts would literally scream when served something that fast and tight.
- xet7 7y agoFor ARM RasPi1-3, RasPi Zero etc there is Risc OS https://www.riscosopen.org https://www.riscosopen.org From https://www.raspberrypi.org/forums/viewtopic.php?f=55&t=22093 https://www.raspberrypi.org/forums/viewtopic.php?f=55&t=2209... : What is RISC OS? RISC OS is a new and different OS for the Pi. It isn't Linux, it isn't Unix, it isn't based on any other OS. It's the first ARM OS, begun in 1987 by the team who designed the original ARM processor. It's also a descendant of the OS used on the early 1980s BBC Micro... those who remember the BBC Micro might find some of its commands familiar. BBC BASIC is only a few keypresses away. What's interesting about RISC OS? It's small. It's fast. RISC OS is a full desktop OS, where the core system including windowing system and a few apps fits inside 6MB. It was developed at a time when the fastest desktop computer was an 8MHz ARM2 with 512KB of RAM. That means it's fast and responsive on modern hardware. The memory taken by apps is usually counted in the kilobytes. A 700MHz 256MB Raspberry Pi is luxury - what to do with all that memory? RISC OS is also a lot simpler than modern OSes such as Linux. The pace of development has been a little slower than other OSes, which means there are fewer layers getting between you and the system. It's much easier to get stuck in and change things. It's also easier to understand. As a formerly closed-source OS, most of the interfaces are documented in a series of books called the Programmers' Reference Manuals (PRMs) which are included on the RISC OS Pi distro. That means you can change a lot of things without having to work on the OS code itself (which is available if you want it). It's very modular, so you can mix and match components, and the communications between modules are carefully documented. RISC OS gets out of the way. It's a 'co-operatively multi-tasked' OS. While that means one misbehaving application can stall the system until you kill it, it also means you easily write apps that take over the whole machine - for example controlling hardware where you need predictable timing. RISC OS is a single-user OS, which means there's very little security - not great for internet banking, but very handy when you want to dig around and program the internals of the OS. As a full desktop OS, there's also plenty of traditional desktop software available like drawing programs and desktop publishers. Features you've come to expect on a desktop like scalable fonts and printing are supported. RISC OS was big in UK education in the 1990s, and there's a large back catalogue of educational software.
- tau255 7y agoIs there a way to boot it from systemd-boot?