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Google can use Bluetooth to track phones even with Bluetooth turned off (2018)
- rvz 6y agoWell if this comes as a surprise to you if you're a regular here, perhaps you need to read this article in its entirety, because it's clear that a sentence like "Privacy by Google" is a valid oxymoron. Luckily I have a throwaway dual SIM dumbphone to use, so I should be covered...
- acruns 6y agoShocked! I wouldn't really care if they were upfront about it, but when they try to hide it, it makes it adversarial and since I consider myself technical, I must do as my cat does and make it stop.
- culopatin 6y agoThey are upfront about it, it’s right there in the settings. When you first set up a Google phone, it will Warm you that WiFi does scanning for location services, and the Bluetooth setting is in the same page.
- pfalafel 6y ago> The Pixel 4 and 4 XL received generally positive reviews from critics [...] but were criticized for their poor battery life https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pixel_4#Reception https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pixel_4#Reception
- phipples 6y agoIn the bluetooth settings it literally states: "To improve device experience, apps and services can still scan for nearby devices at any time, even when Bluetooth is off." This can be completely turned off in scanning settings. The article title is kind of clickbaity.
- thefounder 6y agoI wonder, what apps and services it helps improve? Why would you want to turn bluetooth off but not really turn it off?
- bryanrasmussen 6y agoPerhaps one loves Google and would like to help them increase their understanding of the world. on edit: changed you to one and your to the.
- mtgx 6y agoFair point. So what would be the percentage of people that buy Android phones and can identify themselves as "loving Google" AND wanting to allow Google to track everything about what they do to "improve the world"? 5%? Less? If so, then maybe this should be opt-in for those who love the company so much, rather than opt-out?
- kuzimoto 6y agoI don't think anyone should "love" Google. Sure I enjoy using some of their services, but at the end of the day they will sell every single detail they can gather about you to make money. That's not something to "love" even if they are using it for other interesting things.
- bryanrasmussen 6y agoneither do I, but the question was why anyone would want to track bluetooth devices available even when bluetooth turned off and that extremely unlikely reason was the only one I could think of.
- newscracker 6y agoIs this similar to Apple’s “off but not really off” modes for Bluetooth and WiFi where the toggle in Control Center keeps them active for certain purposes on iOS (and making it “really off” requires going to Settings)? Or is it different from that? I couldn’t really distinguish even after reading this article fully. The way to turn it off, described in the article, did seem very messy, and as with Android, the steps depend on the device and what (customized) Android it’s running. I was so sick of this from iOS (because I don’t want WiFi to connect automatically in a different location or at 5 a.m.) that I have shortcuts readily accessible as widgets that turn these off, really off, when I want to.
- nimajneb 6y agoMy Pixel 3a XL does this with WiFi, I'm convinced it's never actually off. It will auto connect to remembered WiFi networks even when I "turn WiFi off".
- sergers 6y agoTurn off location services with turning off wifi
- tjoff 6y agoMine don't. Maybe Settings->Location->Wi-Fi and Bluetooth scanning is the setting that does it. There you can disable whether apps and services are allowed to scan wifi and/or bluetooth even if they are turned off.
- megous 6y agoMaybe it's PNO https://source.android.com/devices/tech/connect/wifi-scan https://source.android.com/devices/tech/connect/wifi-scan > On devices running Android 9 or lower, when the device is disconnected from Wi-Fi and the screen is off, PNO scans occur at 20 second intervals for the first three scans, then slow down to one scan every 60 seconds for all subsequent scans. PNO scanning stops when a saved network is found or the screen is turned on.
- rvz 6y agoIt's similar and it is used for "Find My" and other Apple services. There's enough reason why Apple won't change this and will plan to keep it on for other purposes though unless you completely turn it off in the settings "cough" "contact tracing" "cough".
- markstos 6y agoThe article says turning off Location History "cripples" certain features of Android and Google. That's a stretch. I have had Location History disabled for years and have yet to notice what crippled experience I suffered from, but I did learn today that my location is not being sent to Google when Bluetooth is turned off. Disabling Location History seems like it has significant upside to me. Think about it this way. If Location History had defaulted to "off" instead and "on", would you have opted in? For what feature or benefit? With what risks?
- kibwen 6y agoThere was a time when Google Maps would simply refuse to work without having Location History turned on; not sure if that has changed by now.
- izacus 6y agoThat was never true. It was annoyingly aggresive, had some annoying UI limitations (e.g. it wouldn't remember past trips) but it was never fully unable to function.
- cptskippy 6y agoI remember it not working.
- nitrogen 6y agoIt still only shows "home" and "work" addresses in one obscure part of the UI with history off, while the rest of the UI won't let you change or add saved addresses without turning history back on.
- markstos 6y agoThis is a false requirement. Google doesn't need to track my real-time location to allow me to tell it the location of my home or work.
- tracker1 6y agoThey do the same thing with wifi.
- tgafpc2 6y agoI'm starting to think...so what? The ads I see are either comically irrelevant or easily explained by the search terms or video I selected. This targeted claim is just to dupe their customers.
- izacus 6y agoThis is the exact same behaviour iOS shows - the BT stays on to allow for fast bluetooth pairing, indoor precise location, nearby communications and a few other things. Last I checked the details, the data didn't leave the device but it was awhile ago.
- Causality1 6y agoWhat's all this data about me worth to Google? It can't be that much. I've never bought something from an internet ad in my life. With the whole world going SaaS I'm amazed there's no "Google Private" subscription where I can pay them five dollars a month to give me what they already do without collecting data about me. Frankly I think personal data is every bit as much of an addiction as heroin.
- catalogia 6y ago> What's all this data about me worth to Google? It can't be that much. I've never bought something from an internet ad in my life. Just spitballing here, but it seems conceivable that information about you could help them improve their behavior modelling and consequently help them advertise more effectively to other people.
- ohmyblock 6y agoWhen you consider this fact together with news such as this one is when it starts getting scary: https://www.theguardian.com/world/2020/apr/13/nhs-coronavirus-app-memo-discussed-giving-ministers-power-to-de-anonymise-users https://www.theguardian.com/world/2020/apr/13/nhs-coronaviru...
- kwhitefoot 6y agoTo paraphrase Arthur Dent: "This must be a meaning of the word off with which I was previously unaware" Both the title and Google are misleading: Bluetooth is not off; it is not participating in Bluetooth transactions but it is still listening.
- kerng 6y agoGiven the big security threat Bluetooth provides, this seems pretty bad. If someone wants it off, there is a reason they want it off.
- fsflover 6y agoIf you are tired of constant lies from Google Android, consider Librem 5 phone by Purism. It has hardware kill switches and is based on GNU/Linux, not Android. https://puri.sm/products/librem-5/ https://puri.sm/products/librem-5/
- zelly 6y agoI really got to get around to compiling one of those Android forks with telemetry turned off. As much as people like to criticize G, at least they released the code. The world would be a much worse place if both members of the phone duopoly hid their source code.
- LatteLazy 6y agoIt amazes me there are not more scandals yet with Google senior staff abusing the incredible data access they have. When it happens at the NSA, they can cover it up. But Google must be working very hard to keep it hush hush.
- notRobot 6y ago> A third option on Android called “Device only” location allows a user to utilize only GPS to determine location, rather than “High accuracy,” which uses GPS, wifi, Bluetooth, and cellular signals. But even when a phone is in Device-only mode, beacon information is sent to Google when Bluetooth is off (though not when scanning is also disabled). If Location is turned off entirely, and then re-enabled, the phone resets to the High accuracy mode, making the setting hard to rely on. This was removed in Android P, unfortunately.
- WhyNotHugo 6y agoThis is precisely why you shouldn't buy phones with an OS developed by a company who's main business is tracking people.
- icheckedthe 6y agoAnother reason to choose Huawei with removed google apps.