8 ms·

About 6 weeks ago, I had a cold. I didn't think much about it, because at that time the virus wasn't supposed to have arrived here (reports started a week later

About 6 weeks ago, I had a cold. I didn't think much about it, because at that time the virus wasn't supposed to have arrived here (reports started a week later). I had a dry cough initially, chills on two nights, but without fever, and some light trouble of breathing, which isn't that unusual for me in Winter and I blamed on my allergic asthma. However, when it was mostly over, I noticed that I wasn't able to smell my daughter's dirty diapers. Usually I am pretty good at smelling her even if she's in another room, but I smelled absolutely nothing, even when changing the diaper. That was long before I read the first reports of anosmia. Ever since I wonder whether I already got it.. I guess I will never know..

janekm 7y ago
Antibody tests that can detect whether you have the antibodies that the immune system develops while combating the disease already exist and will become common-place and cheap at some point. So then you will be able to know...
deleted 7y ago
[deleted]
throwanem 7y ago
Pay attention to the rollout of antibody tests. When available, those will tell you whether your blood contains immunoglobulins targeting the virus, and thus whether you've had it. If you have, consider also paying attention to news about serum transfusion projects in your area. That's a process by which an immune person donates antibody-containing plasma, which is then transfused into patients with active disease or at-risk people to supplement their immune system with "targeting data" for the disease. It can significantly improve people's chances, and is one of the longer-term (and admittedly less likely, since no one is really certain yet whether or how well it'll work) possibilities I'm looking at for how to effectively volunteer as an immune person once my own COVID-19 case resolves.
- m463 7y ago
  Poor college student story. Years ago when I was in college, a friend of mine was overjoyed when he got mono. Turns out a place in town would let you sell your blood, and they gave you a lot if you had just had it.
- epmaybe 7y ago
  trials are starting, here's hoping it works out!
ageitgey 7y ago
I had pretty bad Corona-like symptoms in late January/Feb in London. There was documented community transmission at that point, but it was very early (single digits) so it's technically possible but not mathematically likely that I had it. The more I've mentioned this to people, the more I've heard people bring up their own stories and theories that they all had super bad flus this year unlike any other year and are all convinced they already had COVID. So everyone has convinced themselves that they already got it, no matter what city they were in at the time and whether they got sick in November or February. This is hard to grapple with because I'm sure that any give year, a lot of people randomly get a bad flu like they've never had before with unique symptoms. And if you happen to be that person this year, then of course you would think you had this new disease that matches the symptoms. But given the lack of secondary community effects at the same time (other hospitalizations in your area), it's more likely that most of us are wrong and it's just a co-incidence. But if you are the person suffering the coincidence, it appears the same as if you are the person who actually got infected. So who knows? I guess until antibody tests are widely available, none of us will know for sure.
- roenxi 7y ago
  The basic theory is most people have a bad flu every year then forget about it. As far as I recall I've had the flu exactly twice in my life. Once this year, once last year.
- cataflam 7y ago
  I don't have a source handy, I think it was Prof. Drosten, but I've read that in Germany, there were many such anecdotal stories as well. The blood serum of these people got tested, and there was no indication that any of them had already had covid-19. Of course, that's Germany, not London or the US, but at least there, the evidence currently points to a bad flu or something else for all these people from November to February.
- pmiller2 7y ago
  > ...sick in November.... An acquaintance of mine was actually sick in November with COVID-like symptoms. They had a dry cough that was so nasty, doctors tested them for whooping cough (pertussis) and it was negative. And, it actually was not too long after their office got a visit from some overseas partners from China. IIRC, they even said one of the Chinese visitors had a bit of a cough at the time. I think this is pretty strong circumstantial evidence that they may have had the virus. At the very least, it's enough evidence that this person should definitely get an antibody test as soon as practical. Edit: I initially forgot to include that the pertussis test was negative, although that was certainly implied.
garmaine 7y ago
Did your sense of smell return?
- tjansen 7y ago
  Yes, I believe it's still weaker, but could also be that my daughters diapers are just not as smelly anymore :)
  - russfink 7y ago
    Use Nasicort for a few weeks. Smell came back in about a week for me. (Previously, stuck my nose in fresh coffee grounds, nothing at all. Scary.)
oefrha 7y ago
> because at that time the virus wasn't supposed to have arrived here I heard that’s why several countries denied testing initially even when symptoms matched: “you can’t have coronavirus because there’s no coronavirus in <country>.” Which is rather stupid considering <country> can’t “have” coronavirus if they just deny testing.
- pmiller2 7y ago
  > there's no coronavirus in <country>. Reminds me of stuff like "there are no gay people in $COUNTRY." [0] --- [0]: https://www.cnn.com/2019/03/07/asia/malaysia-tourism-minister-gay-denial-intl/index.html https://www.cnn.com/2019/03/07/asia/malaysia-tourism-ministe...
- tjansen 7y ago
  I just didn't feel bad enough to go to a doctor. Back then fever was still considered one of the symptoms, and I didn't have any. I should add that I live in Germany and our first major outbreak was in Heinsberg, not too far away from here, and my symptoms started about 4 days after being at the local kids carnival, the same kind of event that caused the outbreak in Heinsberg. On the other hand, only my kids got sick roughly at the same time, but no one I know had similar symptoms...
  - flotzam 7y ago
    > Back then fever was still considered one of the symptoms, and I didn't have any. Wikipedia still lists fever as the most common symptom (87.9%), before dry cough (67.7%). But their data is from a middle of February WHO report. Is there a more recent list of symptom frequency? https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Coronavirus_disease_2019#Signs_and_symptoms https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Coronavirus_disease_2019#Signs...
pmlnr 7y ago
I have similar story, end of February in my case. Runny nose, juicy, rather ordinary amount of cough, no fever, but loss of smell and taste for a few days, which is usually not part of it.
not_a_moth 7y ago
Yeah I'm in an Asian country and a lot of people I know think they had it two months ago. For anyone watching government reactions from January, it's clear that testing was not thorough in any meaningful way in Asian nations for at least 3 months after the outbreak began in Wuhan, including truly minimal screening at airports over those months. In other words there's an order of magnitude greater undiagnosed cases out there than reported, and I believe that fact is so clear that it should be part of mainstream coverage.
- MobileVet 7y ago
  The exception being South Korea. They have been demonstrating an optimal response to this pandemic. Test everyone as fast as possible, isolate those who are positive.
  - not_a_moth 7y ago
    No, I'm talking about the literal months before the first case was even announced in SK.
  - Ntrails 7y ago
    That assumes that in 100 years optimality of response will be defined as fewest possible deaths in this outbreak? (I am not saying that is not going to be true, but if the virus doesn't get effectively eradicated then it may well not end up being so? Not An Expert At All, just spitballing)
    - throwaway_pdp09 7y ago
      What else might 'optimal' be?
      - jakear 7y ago
        I think GP is saying that SK might be trading short term death rate for long term death rate.
distant_hat 7y ago
You can do a serological test (IgG/IgM) that looks for antibodies to the Coronavirus. It is a fast test and will tell you if you have had it in the past and you can safely be around people who have an active infection.
baxtr 7y ago
You should definitely do a simple blood Antibody test once they’re available. It’s definitely worth a lot to know if you already had it or not
goldenCeasar 7y ago
Same for me and my wife, we had these symptoms prior to the reported first case at the time, but this week the government (Brazil) discovered that a person who died in late January has tested positive, this is one month before the previously announced first case.
deleted 7y ago
[deleted]
dominotw 7y ago
> I guess I will never know.. Isn't there a covid immunity test coming soon. I am in the same boat.
jonathanstrange 7y ago
Same for me. I've had one of the worst colds of my life in mid January. Symptoms were sore throat (very briefly), light nose congestion, a very strong and long-lasting dry cough, chills for about 2 nights, light fever and light chest pains. Then, I was worried about developing a bacterial pneumonia. When I heard about the coronavirus in the beginning of February, I dismissed the possibility because of the timeline. How could it have arrived so early in Portugal? I still don't think it was Covid-19, but recently got doubts when I heard it might have been circulating in Italy before January. We also had one of the first Covid-19 cases in the region of Lisbon in an institute co-located with ours. Many of my colleagues are Italian and most of them visited Italy during Christmas until New Year. So I'm no longer sure.
sf_rob 7y ago
I lost my sense of smell and was very tired 3 weeks ago, but otherwise I had no symptoms. I'm super curious to find out whether I had it already, although my SO was asymptomatic in the same timeframe so it seems unlikely.
HSO 7y ago
> guess I will never know.. Well, you could take an antibody test when they become available. The first occurrence of the virus in Europe (I suppose?) is almost certainly underestimated. I'll add a reference to the paper if I find it again later. EDIT: Found it: [1] J. Lourenc ̧o, R. Paton, M. Ghafari, M. Kraemer, C. Thompson, P. Simmonds, P. Klenerman, and S. Gupta. Fundamental principles of epidemic spread highlight the immediate need for large-scale serological surveys to assess the stage of the sars-cov-2 epidemic. 2020.

janekm 7y ago

Antibody tests that can detect whether you have the antibodies that the immune system develops while combating the disease already exist and will become common-place and cheap at some point. So then you will be able to know...

deleted 7y ago

[deleted]

throwanem 7y ago

Pay attention to the rollout of antibody tests. When available, those will tell you whether your blood contains immunoglobulins targeting the virus, and thus whether you've had it. If you have, consider also paying attention to news about serum transfusion projects in your area. That's a process by which an immune person donates antibody-containing plasma, which is then transfused into patients with active disease or at-risk people to supplement their immune system with "targeting data" for the disease. It can significantly improve people's chances, and is one of the longer-term (and admittedly less likely, since no one is really certain yet whether or how well it'll work) possibilities I'm looking at for how to effectively volunteer as an immune person once my own COVID-19 case resolves.

m463 7y ago
Poor college student story. Years ago when I was in college, a friend of mine was overjoyed when he got mono. Turns out a place in town would let you sell your blood, and they gave you a lot if you had just had it.
epmaybe 7y ago
trials are starting, here's hoping it works out!

ageitgey 7y ago

I had pretty bad Corona-like symptoms in late January/Feb in London. There was documented community transmission at that point, but it was very early (single digits) so it's technically possible but not mathematically likely that I had it. The more I've mentioned this to people, the more I've heard people bring up their own stories and theories that they all had super bad flus this year unlike any other year and are all convinced they already had COVID. So everyone has convinced themselves that they already got it, no matter what city they were in at the time and whether they got sick in November or February. This is hard to grapple with because I'm sure that any give year, a lot of people randomly get a bad flu like they've never had before with unique symptoms. And if you happen to be that person this year, then of course you would think you had this new disease that matches the symptoms. But given the lack of secondary community effects at the same time (other hospitalizations in your area), it's more likely that most of us are wrong and it's just a co-incidence. But if you are the person suffering the coincidence, it appears the same as if you are the person who actually got infected. So who knows? I guess until antibody tests are widely available, none of us will know for sure.

roenxi 7y ago
The basic theory is most people have a bad flu every year then forget about it. As far as I recall I've had the flu exactly twice in my life. Once this year, once last year.
cataflam 7y ago
I don't have a source handy, I think it was Prof. Drosten, but I've read that in Germany, there were many such anecdotal stories as well. The blood serum of these people got tested, and there was no indication that any of them had already had covid-19. Of course, that's Germany, not London or the US, but at least there, the evidence currently points to a bad flu or something else for all these people from November to February.
pmiller2 7y ago
> ...sick in November.... An acquaintance of mine was actually sick in November with COVID-like symptoms. They had a dry cough that was so nasty, doctors tested them for whooping cough (pertussis) and it was negative. And, it actually was not too long after their office got a visit from some overseas partners from China. IIRC, they even said one of the Chinese visitors had a bit of a cough at the time. I think this is pretty strong circumstantial evidence that they may have had the virus. At the very least, it's enough evidence that this person should definitely get an antibody test as soon as practical. Edit: I initially forgot to include that the pertussis test was negative, although that was certainly implied.

garmaine 7y ago

Did your sense of smell return?

tjansen 7y ago
Yes, I believe it's still weaker, but could also be that my daughters diapers are just not as smelly anymore :)
- russfink 7y ago
  Use Nasicort for a few weeks. Smell came back in about a week for me. (Previously, stuck my nose in fresh coffee grounds, nothing at all. Scary.)

oefrha 7y ago

> because at that time the virus wasn't supposed to have arrived here I heard that’s why several countries denied testing initially even when symptoms matched: “you can’t have coronavirus because there’s no coronavirus in <country>.” Which is rather stupid considering <country> can’t “have” coronavirus if they just deny testing.

pmiller2 7y ago
> there's no coronavirus in <country>. Reminds me of stuff like "there are no gay people in $COUNTRY." [0] --- [0]: https://www.cnn.com/2019/03/07/asia/malaysia-tourism-minister-gay-denial-intl/index.html https://www.cnn.com/2019/03/07/asia/malaysia-tourism-ministe...
tjansen 7y ago
I just didn't feel bad enough to go to a doctor. Back then fever was still considered one of the symptoms, and I didn't have any. I should add that I live in Germany and our first major outbreak was in Heinsberg, not too far away from here, and my symptoms started about 4 days after being at the local kids carnival, the same kind of event that caused the outbreak in Heinsberg. On the other hand, only my kids got sick roughly at the same time, but no one I know had similar symptoms...
- flotzam 7y ago
  > Back then fever was still considered one of the symptoms, and I didn't have any. Wikipedia still lists fever as the most common symptom (87.9%), before dry cough (67.7%). But their data is from a middle of February WHO report. Is there a more recent list of symptom frequency? https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Coronavirus_disease_2019#Signs_and_symptoms https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Coronavirus_disease_2019#Signs...

pmlnr 7y ago

I have similar story, end of February in my case. Runny nose, juicy, rather ordinary amount of cough, no fever, but loss of smell and taste for a few days, which is usually not part of it.

not_a_moth 7y ago

Yeah I'm in an Asian country and a lot of people I know think they had it two months ago. For anyone watching government reactions from January, it's clear that testing was not thorough in any meaningful way in Asian nations for at least 3 months after the outbreak began in Wuhan, including truly minimal screening at airports over those months. In other words there's an order of magnitude greater undiagnosed cases out there than reported, and I believe that fact is so clear that it should be part of mainstream coverage.

MobileVet 7y ago
The exception being South Korea. They have been demonstrating an optimal response to this pandemic. Test everyone as fast as possible, isolate those who are positive.
- not_a_moth 7y ago
  No, I'm talking about the literal months before the first case was even announced in SK.
- Ntrails 7y ago
  That assumes that in 100 years optimality of response will be defined as fewest possible deaths in this outbreak? (I am not saying that is not going to be true, but if the virus doesn't get effectively eradicated then it may well not end up being so? Not An Expert At All, just spitballing)
  - throwaway_pdp09 7y ago
    What else might 'optimal' be?
    - jakear 7y ago
      I think GP is saying that SK might be trading short term death rate for long term death rate.

distant_hat 7y ago

You can do a serological test (IgG/IgM) that looks for antibodies to the Coronavirus. It is a fast test and will tell you if you have had it in the past and you can safely be around people who have an active infection.

baxtr 7y ago

You should definitely do a simple blood Antibody test once they’re available. It’s definitely worth a lot to know if you already had it or not

goldenCeasar 7y ago

Same for me and my wife, we had these symptoms prior to the reported first case at the time, but this week the government (Brazil) discovered that a person who died in late January has tested positive, this is one month before the previously announced first case.

deleted 7y ago

[deleted]

dominotw 7y ago

> I guess I will never know.. Isn't there a covid immunity test coming soon. I am in the same boat.

jonathanstrange 7y ago

Same for me. I've had one of the worst colds of my life in mid January. Symptoms were sore throat (very briefly), light nose congestion, a very strong and long-lasting dry cough, chills for about 2 nights, light fever and light chest pains. Then, I was worried about developing a bacterial pneumonia. When I heard about the coronavirus in the beginning of February, I dismissed the possibility because of the timeline. How could it have arrived so early in Portugal? I still don't think it was Covid-19, but recently got doubts when I heard it might have been circulating in Italy before January. We also had one of the first Covid-19 cases in the region of Lisbon in an institute co-located with ours. Many of my colleagues are Italian and most of them visited Italy during Christmas until New Year. So I'm no longer sure.

sf_rob 7y ago

I lost my sense of smell and was very tired 3 weeks ago, but otherwise I had no symptoms. I'm super curious to find out whether I had it already, although my SO was asymptomatic in the same timeframe so it seems unlikely.

HSO 7y ago

> guess I will never know.. Well, you could take an antibody test when they become available. The first occurrence of the virus in Europe (I suppose?) is almost certainly underestimated. I'll add a reference to the paper if I find it again later. EDIT: Found it: [1] J. Lourenc ̧o, R. Paton, M. Ghafari, M. Kraemer, C. Thompson, P. Simmonds, P. Klenerman, and S. Gupta. Fundamental principles of epidemic spread highlight the immediate need for large-scale serological surveys to assess the stage of the sars-cov-2 epidemic. 2020.