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Lead-Free Solder Is Better for You

399 points by luu 7y ago

dmoy 7y ago
Wow I just realized that I did not practice good safety years ago when I used to solder stuff. Now I have p100 filters for working with solvents and de-lead soap and all that. But that picture of the solder scourer made my brain tickle in that really uncomfortable way when you realize you fd up. Now I should go look up whether or not smoke from melting/burning diodes is really bad for you. Probably it is :(
throwanem 7y ago
Good analysis. That said, this is one of those things where, yeah, if I soldered more than a few times a year, I'd probably worry about it. As it is, cumulatively speaking I probably breathe in more hazardous crap when I'm driving than when I'm soldering with a fan blowing the smoke away from my face.
- 3fe9a03ccd14ca5 7y ago
  Leaded solder just way easier to work with, unfortunately. I agree. I’ll stick with it because some simple precautions make just about every “danger” involved moot.
  - exmadscientist 7y ago
    WASH YOUR HANDS. It's the most important thing to do! Both lead and coronavirus hate it!
    - weinzierl 7y ago
      This and don't eat, drink or smoke in the lab. I remember my material sciences professor relating the story that blood lead levels for a certain group of pieceworkers dropped considerably when they banned smoking at the workplace.
whatshisface 7y ago
It's better for you if you aren't breathing the rosin smoke which comes out in greater quantities at the higher temperature you have to use. Since there are an awful lot of people breathing rosin smoke maybe there's still a place for lead solder. (Pragmatically, vents are not very common, and few people will buy a vent when switching to lead free.) Rosin smoke is a serious danger and the number one cause of occupational asthma.
- docandrew 7y ago
  I hadn't heard about rosin fumes being dangerous until this thread. I'll definitely have to learn more and work on some better ventilation in the future. I do love that smell though!
- irjustin 7y ago
  > people breathing rosin smoke maybe there's still a place for lead solder This statement is what the author is trying to shoot down. "Thoughts that sounds safe" when in reality they aren't and hurt people along the way. There are times when pragmatism isn't the way to go. Pragmatically, leaded gasoline was everywhere, it's too difficult to change. Pragmatically, emissions are so expensive to deal with, we shouldn't. If you are exposed to rosin smoke, you need good ventilation, not switch to leaded solder which is what you're implying here because when you switch to solder you've got a whole host of other problems to deal with that are way worse. For those do this regularly to gain asthma, OSHA (or equal) needs to step in. Articles like these and activists push us towards better legislation when pragmatism does not.
  - whatshisface 7y ago
    >If you are exposed to rosin smoke, you need good ventilation, not switch to leaded solder which is what you're implying here That's not what I'm trying to imply. I'm saying that you should buy a vent before you switch to lead-free because even though you need a vent or a mask for any kind of solder, your need increases when you switch. If you switch and don't buy a vent your total health might actually go down.
- moron4hire 7y ago
metroholografix 7y ago
Tin whiskers are a fact [1] and a reason why military and space applications only use leaded solder. I want my electronics to be reliable and last a long time, which is why I'll never use lead-free solder. Leaded solder is safe as long as you take basic precautions (e.g. use a fume extractor, wear gloves, don't lick the solder [2]). [1] https://nepp.nasa.gov/whisker/ https://nepp.nasa.gov/whisker/ [2] https://www.edn.com/analog-guru-jim-williams-dies-after-stroke/ https://www.edn.com/analog-guru-jim-williams-dies-after-stro...
- deleted 7y ago
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- postalrat 7y ago
  I figured the fume extractor is for flux fumes. Do the fumes also contain lead?
  - deleted 7y ago
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  - metroholografix 7y ago
    No, lead vaporizes at much higher temperatures than ones used for soldering. But the flux/rosin fumes are major lung irritants and can exasperate or even cause asthma.
    - shawnz 7y ago
      So where does the danger come from with leaded solder then? Skin contact?
      - foldr 7y ago
        Skin contact if you don't wash your hands. But more seriously, ingestion of small pieces of solder. Little balls of solder get everywhere in the surrounding environment.
- 7y ago
docandrew 7y ago
I never heeded much caution when soldering using lead solder growing up. When I got to university, the department employed a long-time soldering professional, with NASA certifications, etc. She was very knowledgeable, but visibly suffered from what I assumed was chronic heavy metal poisoning - hair loss and visible skin problems. It was a pretty big wake up call for me that I needed to treat solder with more caution. Especially for people introducing children to electronics, make sure you're using lead-free materials. If for whatever reason lead is unavoidable in a project, make sure you're using good ventilation and wash thoroughly before going around your kids after you've handled lead.
- tmh88j 7y ago
  >If for whatever reason lead is unavoidable in a project, make sure you're using good ventilation and wash thoroughly before going around your kids after you've handled lead. I worked for a welding company and a significant portion of the engineering training involved attending welding school, which also included classes about the chemistry and physics of welding. They drilled into our heads the dangers from long term exposure to elements and chemicals in the fumes such as manganese and cadmium, and I even recall them mentioning lawsuits brought upon them that the company won, which I guess somehow disproves the danger. Anyway, if there's one thing I learned it's that I'd never allow my family members to become professional welders if I have a say. That stuff is nasty and a dirty "secret". Not to mention, a huge number of welders develop cataracts, but that could be due to incorrect shade usage and one one's fault to blame but the weldor....which I guess you could point back and say that's a result of improper training. Either way, I think welding is fun and a great skill to have, but I'd never do it for a living regardless of the pay. edit - I should add this mostly applies to flux based welding such as stick and FCAW
  - adreamingsoul 7y ago
    I was a welder for two years and after the first year I already started to notice a mental and physical decline in my health. Unfortunately, I was not a union welder and the company that I worked for did not educate or enforce proper use of safety gear. It was an eye opening experience for me and I’m glad to have experienced it, but knowing that my health was being put at risk is frustrating.
NikolaeVarius 7y ago
Don't really care. Leaded solder is much easier to work with.
- dade_ 7y ago
  Wash your hands and lead is fine for hobbyists and far more people enjoyable to work with. The problem that ROHS solves is landfills full of manufactured goods not full of lead.
  - postalrat 7y ago
    That's what I always figured. I do so little soldering that I doubt it wouldn't make any difference for my health. And lead based solder saves a lot of time and frustration.
- atoav 7y ago
  Depends on the iron. If you have a powerful one with temperature sensing in the tip (instead of the heating element), the lead free is not worse, just different. If you have a beaten down cheap soldering iron, leaded is still much easier to work with.
  - serf 7y ago
    >Depends on the iron. tin-lead eutetic is light years ahead of any ROHS stuff i've used with regards to flow performance, regardless of my iron -- a cheap 12v automotive unit or my hundreds of dollars hakko. I've always used ROHS stuff no problem for bigger less sensitive things. Whenever anything gets near SMD level the hakko and the tin-lead eutetic kester solder come out. It makes the work so much easier for me; not because of the tips on the hakko either, but because eutetic tin-lead flows where you want and locks when you want. I've yet to find a good ROHS solder that works with me for smd stuff without a LOT of brute force and pcb over-heating. 8 times out of 10 if I don't have lead-tin solder when attempting SMD work, i'll just say 'screw it' and use solder paste and a reflow gun or oven. ROHS solder paste acts fine, but reflow soldering sucks when you can normally just zip components on easily with an iron.
oceanghost 7y ago
I agree that lead is unsafe. However, I'd like to point out that this new solder just doesn't flow.
- exmadscientist 7y ago
  Have you tried Sn100C? It's supposed to be better than SAC305, but we mostly stick to 63/37 around here, so I haven't had a chance to compare.
  - oceanghost 7y ago
    I will look into that thank you :)
- atoav 7y ago
  Maybe your iron needs some inspection — older and less powerful irons don't manage to prevent temperature dips as effectively as new ones where the temperature sensing is integrated in the tip. I solder lead free mostly for over a decade now and getting a good modern soldering station was hands down the best thing ever for lead free
  - oceanghost 7y ago
    I have a Weller WT2M. I believe that should be sufficient? Perhaps I'll review my technique.
exmadscientist 7y ago
Just because you can get solders both leaded and lead-free having the same flux, does not mean that is usually the case. Your typical lead-free alloy will have a nastier flux. Is this a big effect? No. The real reason to stick with leaded is simply that it's much, much easier to use. If you get a joint done in half the time, that's half the exposure to nasty stuff. For hobbyist stuff, it doesn't really matter. A moderately skilled operator can do the job about as quickly with either type of solder. For the really hard stuff, like fine-pitch QFNs and 0201s or worse... give me 63/37 any day. (But only if I can't have a skilled soldering technician instead!)
ReactiveJelly 7y ago
Reminds me of the post about LED traffic lights. "But they accumulate snow!" Of course they do. And that's an easier problem to solve than having bulky, heavy, power-hungry lights that die quickly. Having a little trouble soldering is an easier problem to deal with than having lead poisoning. Personally, I'm pretty bad at soldering, so maybe it's time to finally swear off hardware projects.
- StavrosK 7y ago
  How does the type of bulb used affect snow accumulation?
  - andai 7y ago
    Incandescent bulbs produce a lot of heat, melting the snow. LEDs run fairly cool.
    - StavrosK 7y ago
      Ah, didn't think of that, thanks.
    - Yizahi 7y ago
      Powerful LEDs also run rather hot, more specifically their power circuits. My pocket size flashlight would easily run up to 100 degrees I think but it has protection built-in and steps down brightness when overheated. And it only has 1 LED and 1 lithium cell for power. So it probably would have been easy to design external radiators for traffic lights internals, with a heatpipe or similar solution. But they would be more expensive that way.
  - severak_cz 7y ago
    LED light does not produce enough heat to melt snow like old light bulbs.
    - thesmok 7y ago
      My bathroom mirror is LED-backlit. Old halogen-backlit mirrors do not fog because they get warm. When ordering my LED mirror I had an option to get it with a heating element built in. They just glued a heating film on the back of the mirror, and my mirror is not fogged after showering.
leggomylibro 7y ago
Am I the only weirdo who prefers lead-free solders because they don't flow as much? They dry almost as soon as you take the heat off, which keeps parts from moving off their pads while it dries. And the iron doesn't seem to "pull" globs of the stuff around as much. I get really frustrated doing finicky work with leaded solders, but I'll happily do 0.5mm pitches by hand with lead-free. Maybe it's just because I learned with the stuff?
- KC8ZKF 7y ago
  Try 63/37 tin/lead instead of 60/40. 63/37 alloy is eutectic, meaning its melting and solidifying temperature is the same (183C). 60/40 has a semisolid state around its melting point (~=190C).
  - deleted 7y ago
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  - unethical_ban 7y ago
    This guy hams! With your solder knowledge and call sign, I'm surprised you're just a tech!
    - KC8ZKF 7y ago
      Maybe this isolation we’re going through will give me time to upgrade. -73-
  - serf 7y ago
    totally agree. I use kester 66/44 eutetic tin-lead solder on anything I care about. It's said that light-dark auto helmets make someone a welder nearly overnight; I think that same way about eutetic solder and soldering, it makes the job so much easier that the quality of the work skyrockets.
    - KMag 7y ago
      Any idea why, if the parts don't add to 100, they don't reduce the fraction in the solder name from 66/44 to 3/2? Un-reduced portions are handy if they're percentages, but if they're not going to be percentages, why not reduce the fraction?
zerof1l 7y ago
There are people who have been using lead solder for years who swear by it and refuse to use lead-free because it produces crappy joints. I tend to be on their side. What you need is proper filtering for air and you'll be fine.
- tartoran 7y ago
  Hey, let them have it if they want it so badly. But they should not convince younger ones that it’s not a danger though!!!
- reportingsjr 7y ago
  If you get the chance, try out some modern lead free alloys at some point. K100LD has ended up being my favorite solder, absolutely fantastic to use!
deleted 7y ago
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snvzz 7y ago
I'd spend my effort elsewhere. Specifically, rather than fighting over which type of solder is less dangerous to inhale, I'd focus on promoting the use of solder fume extractors. Even basic models purchasable on platforms like aliexpress, which are as you'd expect inexpensive, do make a world of a difference on exposure to fumes. Yet most people solder without these.
nrp 7y ago
I’m surprised by the number of commenters who believe lead-free solder is difficult to work with. When it comes to soldering, it being easy comes down to: 1. Using good soldering techniques and practicing a bit. 2. Using good quality flux. 3. Using an iron with consistent temperature control and a tip that isn’t corroded. 4. Lastly, the actual solder alloy.
- atoav 7y ago
  I think the iron part gets overlooked a lot, cheap/old irons see a huge temperature dip when soldering. Leaded solder handles that a little better and this is what people perceive as "the difference". Once you use propper technique and a decent iron lead-free isn't worse, just different
  - moron4hire 7y ago
    I struggled with soldering for years, thinking I was just bad at soldering. Then I got to use a basic Hakko iron and it was infinitely easier. I immediately threw away the Radio Shack iron I had and bought my own Hakko. The cheapo irons are such a waste of time and money. Unfortunately, I think they tend to set-point people for what to expect for iron prices. Going from $10-15 for a junky iron to $65-80 for a good one seems like a big leap. But this is a tool that should last you forever, if you take care of it, and the productivity improvement is well worth the cost. Consider, you’ll spend hundreds on components for a hobby project of any moderate size. Just buy a good iron already. It reminds me of how much I hate the phrase, “it is a poor Workman who blames his tools”. Yeah, yeah, skilled people can get good results out of junky tools. But you won’t actually ever see it happen, because skilled people care about their work enough to only use good tools. The only time a skilled person uses junky tools is when there is literally no other option (and no, having to wait for a delivery is not one of those cases).
    - atoav 7y ago
      There are bad tools, and then there are tools that just aren't fit for purpose. If you are trying to melt metal with a machine and that machine cannot translate energy into the required amount of heat fast enough, it might just be the wrong machine to begin with. Soldering with a bad iron is the equivalent of trying to chisel wood with a flat screwdriver: sure you can do something to the wood – it just might not be the thing you want.
jhoechtl 7y ago
Lead free solder is better for your health, that's clear. It requires new tools (solder iron) as lead free solder has a higher melting point than lead free. In Europe lead free solder is the standard since many (10+) years, you can't get leaded solder as an option to buy.
- stdbrouw 7y ago
  That's nonsense, it is still very easy to get leaded solder in Europe.
  - jdmoreira 7y ago
    Not in Sweden that’s for sure. It took me a long search to find some a while back when I needed it
    - unwind 7y ago
      Wow, I was going to post some trivial links to common national shops that were full of the stuff last time I looked, but ... nothing. It seems to be due to a EU regulation that became active March 1 2018 here in Sweden, it's no longer legal to sell metal alloys containing more than 0.3% (!) lead to individuals [1]. I had no idea, thanks! [1]: https://www.kemi.se/lagar-och-regler/reach-forordningen/begransning/forbjudet-att-salja-lodtenn-med-bly-till-privatpersoner https://www.kemi.se/lagar-och-regler/reach-forordningen/begr...
    - stdbrouw 7y ago
      Actually, yes, it looks like I didn't have the full truth either: as recently as 2 or 3 years ago you could still buy leaded solder in most places (in Europe), but the store in Germany where I used to order it, doesn't sell any anymore.
  - cientifico 7y ago
    Not in Spain. I remember the change at around 2003/2005, where the seller just gave me the lead free version. For what I remember, the lead free had a higher melting temperature. At least back in the days. Took one week to get used to.
finolex1 7y ago
The article makes it seem like lead-free solder is indisputably healthier, but in reality the conclusion seems to be based off of just the MSDS of the products. I presume these are generated simply based on the chemical composition of the solder, but do not take into account the actual exposure that really occurs when one is soldering.
cientifico 7y ago
I think Lead Solder is Ban in Europe since 2003 or around. I remember the change, where I was not able to buy the old one. I remember that it had a slightly higher melt temperature. Can you buy it in America?
- Kuinox 7y ago
  Yes, the melt temperature is slightly higher, and i have difficulties to melt it with my old solderer.
- varjag 7y ago
  It's not banned, it's restricted. There are still applications where it's allowed in manufacture, even in the EU. Prototyping/R&D is excepted as well.
- jdietrich 7y ago
  You can still buy leaded solder in the EU. Lead is restricted in most consumer applications, but it's still perfectly legal in a lot of industrial products. https://eu.mouser.com/ProductDetail/MG-Chemicals/4884-227G?qs=sGAEpiMZZMuQDxh7mFZIafA0CFytvp0Pd%2F2cRJbJTcY%3D https://eu.mouser.com/ProductDetail/MG-Chemicals/4884-227G?q...
- cientifico 7y ago
  Ok. When I said ban, I meant that back in the time, I went to the shop and they didn't sell it.
helsinkiandrew 7y ago
It's not just bad for the solderer. It will contaminate areas around your solder area (do your kids ever do a project on your workbench?) And at end of life, lead is a problem in land fill sites and in e-waste recycling. Indians (including children) desoldering components from imported e-waste have high blood lead levels: https://journals.lww.com/epidem/fulltext/2011/01001/High_Blood_Lead_Levels_in_E_waste_Recyclers.909.aspx https://journals.lww.com/epidem/fulltext/2011/01001/High_Blo...
Causality1 7y ago
I'm a little surprised someone with as solid a reputation as Ben Hencke wrote all that and didn't bother to dedicate a single solitary sentence to supporting the claim that leaded solder represents an actual threat to its user. Here I was, getting ready to point out flaws in his sources but not only doesn't he have sources he doesn't even have claims. The whole article is him disproving the myth that lead-free solder is more dangerous than leaded, which, granted, is a good point but he forgot to back up his thesis at all. Leaded solder is not even slightly dangerous to its user unless you make a daily habit of soldering for hours and then eating without washing your hands. Leaded solder does represent an environmental threat. Fortunately most manufacturers have switched to lead-free solder and the amount of lead put into the environment by hobbyist solder is best described as "fucking infinitesimal".
- lolc 7y ago
  Maybe you're so used to the safety warnings that you always skip them when you encounter them? Here, extracted just for you: > Compare that to the leaded version with the same rosin formulation. This also creates fumes that are not great to breathe (the same fumes), plus a bunch of really bad stuff because of the lead: > [Long list of bad stuff] > I think most of this speaks for itself, but I’d like to point out a subtle upgrade from P261 to P260 for the leaded stuff. It goes from “avoid” to “don’t” and I think this this is worth calling out specifically. Remember leaded paint? The stuff we banned in ‘78? The primary cause of lead-poisoning isn’t eating paint chips, it is breathing lead laced paint dust. https://www.mayoclinic.org/diseases-conditions/lead-poisoning/symptoms-causes/syc-20354717 https://www.mayoclinic.org/diseases-conditions/lead-poisonin... > “But solder dust? ‘Cmon, really? How can that even be?” I can hear someone typing already… Have you seen one of these? > [Picture of solder tip cleaner]
  - Causality1 7y ago
    Putting aside the need of a citation or at least an explanation as to how tip cleaners create lead dust, that's a reason to use sponges with leaded solder, not a reason not to use lead solder at all.
temptemptemp111 7y ago
Lead free bullets are better to train with long-term.
mehrdadn 7y ago
Question: if you have some solder around and don't know if it's leaded... and you don't have enough practice to be able to tell the difference from the way it flows... is there an easy way to tell?
- 6nf 7y ago
  If you hate soldering with it, it's lead free
- OJFord 7y ago
  By mass is probably the easiest way - if you also have some that is known lead-free and it's 'significantly' lighter (per equal volume), the other's probably leaded. If it's close, you could probably work it out by pouring over Wikipedia and making assumptions like 'if it's leaded, it will be at minimum 30% lead'... but at that point the 'easy way to tell' is probably to replace it with known solder (assuming the goal was not to use leaded solder inadvertently).
- lukego 7y ago
  Guessing in practice you would melt some and see if it's shiny (leaded) or chalky (lead free.) Surely not foolproof for all alloys though. Otherwise you could see how hot your iron needs to be to make it melt.
keithnz 7y ago
as aside, took me a while ( a while ago when the internet was a much smaller place) to work out the american pronunciation of solder actually meant "solder" which is said "soul der" around these parts.
oldandtired 7y ago
There are a lot of different products in use which will cause health problems, if you don't take care (something that we should all have been taught). There have been some good suggestions in relation to the environmental situation to mitigate contamination. I will add another suggestion to all of these as well. If you work with various heavy metals, you might want to consider adding beetroot to your diet on a daily basis. My father was a printer using lead type for many years. It got to the point that his health was being affected by lead poisoning. His GP told him to start eating beetroot every day. The reasoning was to stimulate the liver. Interestingly enough, his health improved and the quantity of lead in his system decreased till he was basically free of it after six months. A few years later, the printing works he was at dispensed with lead usage completely, but my father has continued to eat beetroot on a regular basis (not every day, but certainly a couple of time a week). Now of course this is anecdotal and you can take it or leave it. But it can't hurt and for those who have a need, it may help. Of course, the beetroot mentioned is what we call beetroot in Australia, it may have some other name in other places in the world.
- KarlKemp 7y ago
  A fitting username if there ever was... Seeing the replies in this thread, I’m wondering if the narrative that only incompetent people need leaded solder might not be quite powerful in convincing people. More so than any warnings about health risks.
  - Dylan16807 7y ago
    Convincing people of what? I openly acknowledge that I'm incompetent at soldering. Are you encouraging me to use leaded solder?
    - oldandtired 7y ago
      Not at all. Simply that if you have had some previous contamination, this might help clear up the problem. I said it was anecdotal but as it worked for my father, it might work for you. Why would I want to convince anyone to follow this regime? It is there for you to make a judgement call and do your own research into the matter. If it helps just one other person then it was useful. If you are not at all interested then don't investigate. That is entirely up to you. I actually find it funny that when any kind of suggestion is made that might (notice the use of the word "might") help with some pre-existing condition, people make the immediate assumption that the person making the suggestion is then advocating to continue the activity that caused the pre-existing condition. In today's atmosphere, it almost appears that people have stopped trying to think for themselves. All I can suggest it that people stop jumping to conclusions and if something is unclear then ask some questions. Sure, there are people who are "trolls" (so to speak). But there are also many who are not. Just yesterday, I came across a youtube comment that, in the context it was written it was meant to be sarcastic, was treated as if the the person making the comment was supporting what they were not. Essentially, there were only two of us who recognised the sarcasm, the other participants essentially treated the person as if they were an idiot. Go figure. As far as soldering with non-lead based solder is concerned, it has been a good source for my son-in-law's repair business. The most common source of problems he has found has been the solder joints failing because of non-lead solder. He has also received quite a bit of equipment that was essentially being thrown out because of some unknown failure, which he often found boiled down again to faulty solder joints due to non-lead solder. Is this an advocation for using lead solder? No. It is simply recognising that the processes for using non-lead solder will be a bit different. There are always consequences for changing to using different materials if the former are found to have health problems. However, I have seen that people don't always take that a change in processes is also required and so we get other problems arising. At any rate, during this time of isolation, everyone keep safe and take the necessary precautions for the health of you and your loved ones.
kys229 7y ago
Website doesn't not show content with javascript disabled. This clearly means whatever is written there is not worth out time.
mnw21cam 7y ago
Okay, so this link loads up to a blank page. You have to edit the CSS and remove the "opacity: 0" to see the content. Presumably there's some Javascript in there that does this after the page has loaded. So, talking about a hill to die on - can we please stop doing this? There was absolutely nothing else in that web page that required Javascript to be able to view the content. It was completely unnecessary to pull a trick like that.
- mk89 7y ago
  Confirmed. You'll have to temporarily allow javascript for that. What for? Just some text. Come on, people.
- KarlKemp 7y ago
  But I run a custom patched browser and turn HTML off for most sites, unless it is inserted by JavaScript. Can we please all cater to the quirks of my specific setup? I don’t trust HTML, because it is used by a lot of advertisements, and there were lots of security holes in HTML parsers in the 1990s.
  - sidpatil 7y ago
    Oh, come on. A sizable amount of undesirable functionality is implemented using JavaScript—ads, tracking, cryptominers, etc. It doesn't seem unreasonable to have some expectations about where JavaScript should and shouldn't be used. Imagine if the majority of PDF authors started following the same logic. Would you really want to run arbitrary code just to read a journal article or ebook?
    - sidpatil 7y ago
      As if on cue: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=22742476 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=22742476
- chrisseaton 7y ago
  Maybe the unnecessary thing was you disabling JavaScript?
econcon 7y ago
Why isn't there alternative to soldering? Laser for fusing component leads to PCB?
- cartoonfoxes 7y ago
  For mass production, most work is done with automated methods like wave soldering which spot methods like soldering irons (or lasers) can't hope to match for throughput or repeatability. The kind of hand work that's being discussed here is almost non-representative of most industry practice.
k__ 7y ago
I once read that getting rid of lead in gas made some seemingly unrelated illnesses go away over the decades. Let's see how our lifes get better when we remove combustion engines entirely from our cities.
- KarlKemp 7y ago
  Not just illness. Elimination of lead is a prime suspect for the decrease of violent crime over the last 40 or so years.
amelius 7y ago
Curious, what is your preferred method of dispensing the right amount of solderpaste for SMT work? I find the manual syringe technique quite difficult but perhaps I should consider a smaller tip size. I've seen people using compressed air based approaches, but these seem expensive and take a lot of desk space.
- exmadscientist 7y ago
  First choice: stencil. Stainless steel stencils are cheap these days and fantastic. No good for rework, though. Second choice: manual syringe. As you've noticed, it's difficult. Some pastes are thixotropic, so shaking the tube before dispensing can help a little. Or maybe that's just my imagination. Third choice: stick a stainless steel pick or even just a toothpick into a little pile of paste and dispense it by hand. This is surprisingly useful for those really fine-pitch pads... but it's tedious.
upofadown 7y ago
MSDS data sheets are only intended to list the hazards associated with a particular material for an employee of a company using that material. You can't really use them to determine the relative risks of two materials. Often times a MSDS is simply wrong and no one cares enough to get it corrected. A second MSDS issued by the same manufacturer for the same material can be different than the first.
- mauvehaus 7y ago
  Minor point of order: They're now SDS, not MSDS. Knowing such things is a well-known hazard of being married to an environmental engineer.
  - hprotagonist 7y ago
    since when? i was about to be a pedant and add the M...
    - mauvehaus 7y ago
      Wikipedia says mid-2015: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Safety_data_sheet#United_States https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Safety_data_sheet#United_State... In practice, a lot of smaller companies are still distributing MSDS rather than SDS.
  - myself248 7y ago
    Yeah, but if I say SDS everyone thinks I'm talking about a hammerdrill. Say MSDS and everyone knows what you mean, even if the name technically changed.
bbarn 7y ago
After I got out of the military (in Electronics) I did a few years as a rework tech at a big telecom company soldering literally 8 hours a day. I got really good at it. We had very little safety equipment, and used leaded exclusively. Vent hoods, but that's about it. Many people turned them off because the shake and rattle of the fans made it difficult to work on precise things like surface mount components. There was even a big CPU changing station which was effectively a molten vat of solder that you'd dip all 144 leads into to remove huge square I.C.s This was in my early 20's, and I had that job for about 2 years. Despite perfect dental hygiene, most of my teeth had decayed and had to be crowned or replaced by the time I was 30. Most people I still talk to from that time in my life have chronic problems directly associated with lead poisoning (tooth decay is sort of loosely correlated, and I don't have any other typical symptoms into my 40s) All of this is to say, the US Navy barely even mentioned lead safety in school, and a billion dollar (at the time) company didn't seem to care enough to train its employees, so the attitude that it's "not a big deal" was well and alive in the 90s, and I wouldn't be surprised if it still is today. Also - Why is rosin-core solder so popular? I never used anything but raw spool solder and liquid flux. Rosin core makes a huge mess.
- foofoo55 7y ago
  The older military and aviation boards we make still all use lead. Changing to lead-free requires an extensive re-certification process for each board, and no one at any level wants to do that. Which seems to create a belief that lead is manageable and okay. Interestingly, the board assembly shop still prefers lead because the boards are apparently easier to make. Rosin-core is popular because it's a 1-step process. No need to put on the liquid, which seems to make at least the same mess. [edit:grammar]
  - cglace 7y ago
    There are liquids that are much less messy than rosin core.
- 14 7y ago
  When I was in high school rosin core was used and the teacher talked about it like it was some great forgiving stuff that even if you didn’t use enough flux the core would help you but I agreed messy. I am however used to working on a poor mans budget and only do home electronics, last thing I did was solder and hack a Xbox 360 and rosin core is the only solder around here you can find so I make do. Also can’t buy flux without ordering online so I ended up collecting pine sap and soaking it in alcohol then filtering and evaporate the alcohol to make my own flux. It actually works just as well as any commercial flux I have used.
prostheticvamp 7y ago
I think of woodworking as a very similar discussion. People would wear N95s when working with a shit-ton of visible particulates, but otherwise are constantly leaving their lungs unprotected. The resultant progressive loss of long function is pronounced. But try to convince woodworkers that N95s should be a de facto daily driver. “My daddy worked wood all his life and was healthy as a horse until the day he dropped dead”
- PragmaticPulp 7y ago
  Agreed on the dangers of sawdust, but in my experience most hobbyist woodworkers these days are very aware of dust and particulate management. Particle counters are reasonably cheap, so many woodworkers use them to measure and optimize the air cleaning systems in their woodworking areas. It helps that the most popular Woodworking YouTubers frequently produce videos about improvements to their dust collection setups. It also helps that cheap Chinese air filtration units have become widely available. Dust collection and air filtration are probably the most common tool talk in my local woodworking groups. In contrast, it's rare to see electronics hobbyists taking air filtration seriously. Kudos to Ben Heck for writing about it.
- tibbon 7y ago
  I think too many people (myself included) have thought incorrect things like, "Ah, wood is natural and can't hurt you". Not that wood is any more natural than lead, or arsenic. But it doesn't seem bad like inhaling smoke from things... and yet, it clearly is not good for you in the long term!
  - dotancohen 7y ago
    Whenever I hear that something is "natural" and thus not a health danger, I ask the person if they would bite into a camel turd. Those are natural too. Don't even get me started on "chemical free".
  - hammock 7y ago
    Don't forget treated wood does have arsenic...and fumes from poly, stains and varnishes can be pretty bad.
bnolsen 7y ago
Since lead is a stabilizing agent for tin whiskers has that been dealt with yet by solder manufacturers or have we just decided that early failure is acceptable?
S_A_P 7y ago
My dad used to solder a lot as a kid and I always loved the smell of it. My dads advice to me was "you probably shouldnt do that. It will slowly poison you." I dont know that it really stopped me though.. He also (still) has a mason jar full of mercury that he let my brother and I play with...
pravda 7y ago
Whenever someone has difficulty soldering, and I find out they are using unleaded solder, I always give the same advice: USE LEADED SOLDER USE LEADED SOLDER USE LEADED SOLDER Lead-free solder is a disaster. Stay away from it.
- reportingsjr 7y ago
  This is seriously old school advice from someone who clearly hasn't done research or used modern solders. There are quite a few very good lead free alloys that are basically as good as any leaded alloy. I use Kester K100LD and it is absolutely fantastic. Unless you really know your stuff you can't tell a difference. Please stop giving outdated advice like this.
  - pravda 7y ago
    > There are quite a few very good lead free alloys that are basically as good as any leaded alloy. You know what is 100% as good as leaded solder? Actual leaded solder! You remember that giant class-action against the Heathkit company for all the people they poisoned with leaded solder? Don't remember it? That's because it never happened! If your soldering consists of soldering pins onto Arduino nano boards, or whipping up a prototype or two with your JLCPCB boards, you'll be fine with leaded solder.
    - reportingsjr 7y ago
      If all you're soldering is some pins on an Arduino nano or some simple jlc prototypes then you'll also be totally fine with lead free solder. The only time I've seen a reasonable excuse to use leaded solder at home is when working with very temperature sensitive devices such as connectors with plastic in them. Even then leaded isn't /that/ much better.
0culus 7y ago
This is from the perspective of a hobbyist who does _not_ do industrial quantities of soldering, but rather the occasional build or the occasional repair of a piece of old test equipment. I use eutectic 63/37 Kester solder in several sizes for everything. With my temp controlled Weller station, it's the bee's knees for making quality joints quickly. As far as worrying about safety, it's really down to common sense. In long time scales, the survival rate for everyone drops to zero. If you apply common sense, you can have fun while you're around and not have problems from lead solder. Here's my "hot takes": 1) There's a reason why food and drink isn't allowed in professional labs of various kinds. Follow their example. Don't use your kitchen table as a workbench. Don't eat and drink in your work area. Don't lick solder. etc. etc. If your living arrangement is so small that you can't separate them adequately, seek out a local hacker space or a friend who does have space. 2) Wash your hands thoroughly after soldering (and if you are doing projects with your kids, instill in them the instinct to wash their hands, too!) If I'm finding myself doing a lot of soldering/desoldering for a repair, I take frequent breaks and wash then, too. It also helps reduce mistakes. 3) At a minimum, use a desk fan to blow fumes away from your face. Better yet, invest in a fume extractor unit. I'd say the latter it's a necessity if you do a lot of soldering. The bottom line is, choose what you prefer and what you are willing to risk using, and take appropriate precautions. Chances are, even if you eliminate lead solder from your hobby work, there's likely something equally as hazardous in your local environment that you are more systemically exposed to. Radon gas, naturally occurring drinking water contaminants (or sometimes unnaturally...), etc.
- sneak 7y ago
  Externalities matter. Eventually that stuff is going to be handled by other people, in a year or ten or a hundred. The risk is not just to you, and is not just based on your own safety procedures. Please stop advocating for people to use leaded solder at hackerspaces, which are generally frequented by children.
  - 0culus 7y ago
    Scale matters too. As I clearly stated, I am not making electronics at industrial scales, nor am I generating large quantities of e-waste. As for hacker spaces, why on earth would anyone in their right mind assume that it would be ok to not wash hands, eat, drink, etc in that environment _and_ let their kids work there without the same precautions, leaded solder or no?
mark-r 7y ago
I still have a tiny bit of the spool of lead solder I bought in the 1980's.
nimbius 7y ago
i dont know... ive been eating a roll a week and let me tell you, i can definitely taste a difference in the lead-free solder.
awkward 7y ago
While the solders on through hole stuff come out messier, I find the goopyness of lead free solder to be superior for point to point connections.
mdszy 7y ago
Why does it sound like so many people here literally eat lead solder. Practice proper lab safety for chrissakes. Wash your hands after dealing with chemicals and/or dangerous materials, such as flux or lead. Don't let your small children near it. Don't eat or drink in the lab. The spread of the hobby through cheap dev kits and stuff has made people ignorant to the fact that, yes, these are potentially dangerous chemicals like any other, with MSDS documentation and proper handling precautions that must be taken. You don't get lead poisoning unless you're improperly handling the stuff. Give me a break. Arguing that "lead free solder is better for you" is absolutely terrible. That's like saying "drinking straight bleach is better for you than drinking bleach with arsenic mixed in." None of these should even be coming into your body in any way, shape, or form and if they are, you're doing something horribly wrong.
- cmrdporcupine 7y ago
  I remember seeing somewhere a video of Steve Wozniak showing off his old soldering technique, which involved holding a length of solder in his mouth so both his hands could be free... In the days before lead free solder...
  - mdszy 7y ago
    Pair of helping hands: $10 Lead poisoning: Priceless
  - cmrdporcupine 7y ago
    Found the video: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pJif4i9NRdI https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pJif4i9NRdI See him solder @ 3:08.
- yAak 7y ago
  Melting lead also creates lead vapor, so it doesn't require that you touch or eat it.
  - mdszy 7y ago
    Not in any signifnicant way, no. The vapor pressure of lead is incredibly incredibly low. The vapor amounts that would be given off during normal soldering would be miniscule, and would remain incredibly close to the work. You'd basically have to shove the molten lead directly into your nose and snort it to have an effect, if any. Lead is incredibly dense. I hope it's pretty easy to understand that you have to put a whole lot of energy into it in order to actually get the particles to fly up into your nose or mouth for you to aspirate them. Much more energy than is imparted by the process of soldering.
nojvek 7y ago
If Lead is terrible, thanks to getting it out of petrol, why are we still selling lead solders which will easily poison you? I have done some soldering with zero education on how to properly do it or the safety implications. I've most likely poisoned myself. Can we not ban lead for non-certified use? Like I don't see home depot selling liquid nitrogen wily nily. Same with oxygen tanks. Isn't playing with Lead in the same ballpark?
- Dylan16807 7y ago
  Lead solder isn't really more dangerous than the soldering iron you're applying it with. And lead-free solder can poison you too. The problems caused by lead are from it filling the environment, not touching tiny amounts. We'd probably get much more benefit by finally banning it in aviation gas.
- kube-system 7y ago
  The simple reason for the difference is that poisons are only dangerous if they end up somewhere they shouldn't be. When we put lead in gasoline, it was going everywhere in the environment, including the air. Lead which is in a large enough chunk that it doesn't spontaneously become airborne is much less likely to end up inside of a human. Brass also contains lead, which you almost certainly have inside of your house in a few places. Even 'lead-free' brass for plumbing contains some lead. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Brass#Lead_content https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Brass#Lead_content The key is that it has to be in low enough concentrations that it doesn't end up leaving the part and ending up in dangerous amounts inside of humans. Unless you have occupational exposure, you have most likely not even come close to poisoning yourself even if you didn't follow any safety precautions. Lead is pretty bad, but it's not something that causes issues with any amount of exposure... you body can tolerate some lead exposure. A hobbyist that solders a dozen PCBs per year has a way different potential exposure than someone who solders a dozen per hour for 2000 hours per year. > Like I don't see home depot selling liquid nitrogen wily nily. Same with oxygen tanks. https://www.homedepot.com/p/Bernzomatic-1-4-oz-Oxygen-Gas-Cylinder-304179/202044702 https://www.homedepot.com/p/Bernzomatic-1-4-oz-Oxygen-Gas-Cy...
- exmadscientist 7y ago
Cartonju 7y ago
I 100% agree, on all accounts lead-free solder is better.
yAak 7y ago
> "the same fumes" But, they're not the same. I had to dig around a bit to verify, but melting lead creates lead fumes: https://www.cdc.gov/niosh/topics/lead/exposure.html https://www.cdc.gov/niosh/topics/lead/exposure.html You do not have to bring lead to boiling create lead fumes (aka vapor). Here's the OSHA documentation on lead: https://www.osha.gov/chemicaldata/chemResult.html?recNo=500 https://www.osha.gov/chemicaldata/chemResult.html?recNo=500 They have specifications for testing lead (and other metal) content in the air from soldering operations: https://www.osha.gov/dts/sltc/methods/inorganic/id206/id206.pdf https://www.osha.gov/dts/sltc/methods/inorganic/id206/id206....
nimish 7y ago
SN100C is finally a thing but it's really hard to give up 63/37

399 points by luu 7y ago

dmoy 7y ago

Wow I just realized that I did not practice good safety years ago when I used to solder stuff. Now I have p100 filters for working with solvents and de-lead soap and all that. But that picture of the solder scourer made my brain tickle in that really uncomfortable way when you realize you fd up. Now I should go look up whether or not smoke from melting/burning diodes is really bad for you. Probably it is :(

throwanem 7y ago

Good analysis. That said, this is one of those things where, yeah, if I soldered more than a few times a year, I'd probably worry about it. As it is, cumulatively speaking I probably breathe in more hazardous crap when I'm driving than when I'm soldering with a fan blowing the smoke away from my face.

3fe9a03ccd14ca5 7y ago
Leaded solder just way easier to work with, unfortunately. I agree. I’ll stick with it because some simple precautions make just about every “danger” involved moot.
- exmadscientist 7y ago
  WASH YOUR HANDS. It's the most important thing to do! Both lead and coronavirus hate it!
  - weinzierl 7y ago
    This and don't eat, drink or smoke in the lab. I remember my material sciences professor relating the story that blood lead levels for a certain group of pieceworkers dropped considerably when they banned smoking at the workplace.

whatshisface 7y ago

It's better for you if you aren't breathing the rosin smoke which comes out in greater quantities at the higher temperature you have to use. Since there are an awful lot of people breathing rosin smoke maybe there's still a place for lead solder. (Pragmatically, vents are not very common, and few people will buy a vent when switching to lead free.) Rosin smoke is a serious danger and the number one cause of occupational asthma.

docandrew 7y ago
I hadn't heard about rosin fumes being dangerous until this thread. I'll definitely have to learn more and work on some better ventilation in the future. I do love that smell though!
irjustin 7y ago
> people breathing rosin smoke maybe there's still a place for lead solder This statement is what the author is trying to shoot down. "Thoughts that sounds safe" when in reality they aren't and hurt people along the way. There are times when pragmatism isn't the way to go. Pragmatically, leaded gasoline was everywhere, it's too difficult to change. Pragmatically, emissions are so expensive to deal with, we shouldn't. If you are exposed to rosin smoke, you need good ventilation, not switch to leaded solder which is what you're implying here because when you switch to solder you've got a whole host of other problems to deal with that are way worse. For those do this regularly to gain asthma, OSHA (or equal) needs to step in. Articles like these and activists push us towards better legislation when pragmatism does not.
- whatshisface 7y ago
  >If you are exposed to rosin smoke, you need good ventilation, not switch to leaded solder which is what you're implying here That's not what I'm trying to imply. I'm saying that you should buy a vent before you switch to lead-free because even though you need a vent or a mask for any kind of solder, your need increases when you switch. If you switch and don't buy a vent your total health might actually go down.
moron4hire 7y ago

metroholografix 7y ago

Tin whiskers are a fact [1] and a reason why military and space applications only use leaded solder. I want my electronics to be reliable and last a long time, which is why I'll never use lead-free solder. Leaded solder is safe as long as you take basic precautions (e.g. use a fume extractor, wear gloves, don't lick the solder [2]). [1] https://nepp.nasa.gov/whisker/ https://nepp.nasa.gov/whisker/ [2] https://www.edn.com/analog-guru-jim-williams-dies-after-stroke/ https://www.edn.com/analog-guru-jim-williams-dies-after-stro...

deleted 7y ago
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postalrat 7y ago
I figured the fume extractor is for flux fumes. Do the fumes also contain lead?
- deleted 7y ago
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- metroholografix 7y ago
  No, lead vaporizes at much higher temperatures than ones used for soldering. But the flux/rosin fumes are major lung irritants and can exasperate or even cause asthma.
  - shawnz 7y ago
    So where does the danger come from with leaded solder then? Skin contact?
    - foldr 7y ago
      Skin contact if you don't wash your hands. But more seriously, ingestion of small pieces of solder. Little balls of solder get everywhere in the surrounding environment.
7y ago

docandrew 7y ago

I never heeded much caution when soldering using lead solder growing up. When I got to university, the department employed a long-time soldering professional, with NASA certifications, etc. She was very knowledgeable, but visibly suffered from what I assumed was chronic heavy metal poisoning - hair loss and visible skin problems. It was a pretty big wake up call for me that I needed to treat solder with more caution. Especially for people introducing children to electronics, make sure you're using lead-free materials. If for whatever reason lead is unavoidable in a project, make sure you're using good ventilation and wash thoroughly before going around your kids after you've handled lead.

tmh88j 7y ago
>If for whatever reason lead is unavoidable in a project, make sure you're using good ventilation and wash thoroughly before going around your kids after you've handled lead. I worked for a welding company and a significant portion of the engineering training involved attending welding school, which also included classes about the chemistry and physics of welding. They drilled into our heads the dangers from long term exposure to elements and chemicals in the fumes such as manganese and cadmium, and I even recall them mentioning lawsuits brought upon them that the company won, which I guess somehow disproves the danger. Anyway, if there's one thing I learned it's that I'd never allow my family members to become professional welders if I have a say. That stuff is nasty and a dirty "secret". Not to mention, a huge number of welders develop cataracts, but that could be due to incorrect shade usage and one one's fault to blame but the weldor....which I guess you could point back and say that's a result of improper training. Either way, I think welding is fun and a great skill to have, but I'd never do it for a living regardless of the pay. edit - I should add this mostly applies to flux based welding such as stick and FCAW
- adreamingsoul 7y ago
  I was a welder for two years and after the first year I already started to notice a mental and physical decline in my health. Unfortunately, I was not a union welder and the company that I worked for did not educate or enforce proper use of safety gear. It was an eye opening experience for me and I’m glad to have experienced it, but knowing that my health was being put at risk is frustrating.

NikolaeVarius 7y ago

Don't really care. Leaded solder is much easier to work with.

dade_ 7y ago
Wash your hands and lead is fine for hobbyists and far more people enjoyable to work with. The problem that ROHS solves is landfills full of manufactured goods not full of lead.
- postalrat 7y ago
  That's what I always figured. I do so little soldering that I doubt it wouldn't make any difference for my health. And lead based solder saves a lot of time and frustration.
atoav 7y ago
Depends on the iron. If you have a powerful one with temperature sensing in the tip (instead of the heating element), the lead free is not worse, just different. If you have a beaten down cheap soldering iron, leaded is still much easier to work with.
- serf 7y ago
  >Depends on the iron. tin-lead eutetic is light years ahead of any ROHS stuff i've used with regards to flow performance, regardless of my iron -- a cheap 12v automotive unit or my hundreds of dollars hakko. I've always used ROHS stuff no problem for bigger less sensitive things. Whenever anything gets near SMD level the hakko and the tin-lead eutetic kester solder come out. It makes the work so much easier for me; not because of the tips on the hakko either, but because eutetic tin-lead flows where you want and locks when you want. I've yet to find a good ROHS solder that works with me for smd stuff without a LOT of brute force and pcb over-heating. 8 times out of 10 if I don't have lead-tin solder when attempting SMD work, i'll just say 'screw it' and use solder paste and a reflow gun or oven. ROHS solder paste acts fine, but reflow soldering sucks when you can normally just zip components on easily with an iron.

oceanghost 7y ago

I agree that lead is unsafe. However, I'd like to point out that this new solder just doesn't flow.

exmadscientist 7y ago
Have you tried Sn100C? It's supposed to be better than SAC305, but we mostly stick to 63/37 around here, so I haven't had a chance to compare.
- oceanghost 7y ago
  I will look into that thank you :)
atoav 7y ago
Maybe your iron needs some inspection — older and less powerful irons don't manage to prevent temperature dips as effectively as new ones where the temperature sensing is integrated in the tip. I solder lead free mostly for over a decade now and getting a good modern soldering station was hands down the best thing ever for lead free
- oceanghost 7y ago
  I have a Weller WT2M. I believe that should be sufficient? Perhaps I'll review my technique.

exmadscientist 7y ago

Just because you can get solders both leaded and lead-free having the same flux, does not mean that is usually the case. Your typical lead-free alloy will have a nastier flux. Is this a big effect? No. The real reason to stick with leaded is simply that it's much, much easier to use. If you get a joint done in half the time, that's half the exposure to nasty stuff. For hobbyist stuff, it doesn't really matter. A moderately skilled operator can do the job about as quickly with either type of solder. For the really hard stuff, like fine-pitch QFNs and 0201s or worse... give me 63/37 any day. (But only if I can't have a skilled soldering technician instead!)

ReactiveJelly 7y ago

Reminds me of the post about LED traffic lights. "But they accumulate snow!" Of course they do. And that's an easier problem to solve than having bulky, heavy, power-hungry lights that die quickly. Having a little trouble soldering is an easier problem to deal with than having lead poisoning. Personally, I'm pretty bad at soldering, so maybe it's time to finally swear off hardware projects.

StavrosK 7y ago
How does the type of bulb used affect snow accumulation?
- andai 7y ago
  Incandescent bulbs produce a lot of heat, melting the snow. LEDs run fairly cool.
  - StavrosK 7y ago
    Ah, didn't think of that, thanks.
  - Yizahi 7y ago
    Powerful LEDs also run rather hot, more specifically their power circuits. My pocket size flashlight would easily run up to 100 degrees I think but it has protection built-in and steps down brightness when overheated. And it only has 1 LED and 1 lithium cell for power. So it probably would have been easy to design external radiators for traffic lights internals, with a heatpipe or similar solution. But they would be more expensive that way.
- severak_cz 7y ago
  LED light does not produce enough heat to melt snow like old light bulbs.
  - thesmok 7y ago
    My bathroom mirror is LED-backlit. Old halogen-backlit mirrors do not fog because they get warm. When ordering my LED mirror I had an option to get it with a heating element built in. They just glued a heating film on the back of the mirror, and my mirror is not fogged after showering.

leggomylibro 7y ago

Am I the only weirdo who prefers lead-free solders because they don't flow as much? They dry almost as soon as you take the heat off, which keeps parts from moving off their pads while it dries. And the iron doesn't seem to "pull" globs of the stuff around as much. I get really frustrated doing finicky work with leaded solders, but I'll happily do 0.5mm pitches by hand with lead-free. Maybe it's just because I learned with the stuff?

KC8ZKF 7y ago
Try 63/37 tin/lead instead of 60/40. 63/37 alloy is eutectic, meaning its melting and solidifying temperature is the same (183C). 60/40 has a semisolid state around its melting point (~=190C).
- deleted 7y ago
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- unethical_ban 7y ago
  This guy hams! With your solder knowledge and call sign, I'm surprised you're just a tech!
  - KC8ZKF 7y ago
    Maybe this isolation we’re going through will give me time to upgrade. -73-
- serf 7y ago
  totally agree. I use kester 66/44 eutetic tin-lead solder on anything I care about. It's said that light-dark auto helmets make someone a welder nearly overnight; I think that same way about eutetic solder and soldering, it makes the job so much easier that the quality of the work skyrockets.
  - KMag 7y ago
    Any idea why, if the parts don't add to 100, they don't reduce the fraction in the solder name from 66/44 to 3/2? Un-reduced portions are handy if they're percentages, but if they're not going to be percentages, why not reduce the fraction?

zerof1l 7y ago

There are people who have been using lead solder for years who swear by it and refuse to use lead-free because it produces crappy joints. I tend to be on their side. What you need is proper filtering for air and you'll be fine.

tartoran 7y ago
Hey, let them have it if they want it so badly. But they should not convince younger ones that it’s not a danger though!!!
reportingsjr 7y ago
If you get the chance, try out some modern lead free alloys at some point. K100LD has ended up being my favorite solder, absolutely fantastic to use!

deleted 7y ago

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snvzz 7y ago

I'd spend my effort elsewhere. Specifically, rather than fighting over which type of solder is less dangerous to inhale, I'd focus on promoting the use of solder fume extractors. Even basic models purchasable on platforms like aliexpress, which are as you'd expect inexpensive, do make a world of a difference on exposure to fumes. Yet most people solder without these.

nrp 7y ago

I’m surprised by the number of commenters who believe lead-free solder is difficult to work with. When it comes to soldering, it being easy comes down to: 1. Using good soldering techniques and practicing a bit. 2. Using good quality flux. 3. Using an iron with consistent temperature control and a tip that isn’t corroded. 4. Lastly, the actual solder alloy.

atoav 7y ago
I think the iron part gets overlooked a lot, cheap/old irons see a huge temperature dip when soldering. Leaded solder handles that a little better and this is what people perceive as "the difference". Once you use propper technique and a decent iron lead-free isn't worse, just different
- moron4hire 7y ago
  I struggled with soldering for years, thinking I was just bad at soldering. Then I got to use a basic Hakko iron and it was infinitely easier. I immediately threw away the Radio Shack iron I had and bought my own Hakko. The cheapo irons are such a waste of time and money. Unfortunately, I think they tend to set-point people for what to expect for iron prices. Going from $10-15 for a junky iron to $65-80 for a good one seems like a big leap. But this is a tool that should last you forever, if you take care of it, and the productivity improvement is well worth the cost. Consider, you’ll spend hundreds on components for a hobby project of any moderate size. Just buy a good iron already. It reminds me of how much I hate the phrase, “it is a poor Workman who blames his tools”. Yeah, yeah, skilled people can get good results out of junky tools. But you won’t actually ever see it happen, because skilled people care about their work enough to only use good tools. The only time a skilled person uses junky tools is when there is literally no other option (and no, having to wait for a delivery is not one of those cases).
  - atoav 7y ago
    There are bad tools, and then there are tools that just aren't fit for purpose. If you are trying to melt metal with a machine and that machine cannot translate energy into the required amount of heat fast enough, it might just be the wrong machine to begin with. Soldering with a bad iron is the equivalent of trying to chisel wood with a flat screwdriver: sure you can do something to the wood – it just might not be the thing you want.

jhoechtl 7y ago

Lead free solder is better for your health, that's clear. It requires new tools (solder iron) as lead free solder has a higher melting point than lead free. In Europe lead free solder is the standard since many (10+) years, you can't get leaded solder as an option to buy.

stdbrouw 7y ago
That's nonsense, it is still very easy to get leaded solder in Europe.
- jdmoreira 7y ago
  Not in Sweden that’s for sure. It took me a long search to find some a while back when I needed it
  - unwind 7y ago
    Wow, I was going to post some trivial links to common national shops that were full of the stuff last time I looked, but ... nothing. It seems to be due to a EU regulation that became active March 1 2018 here in Sweden, it's no longer legal to sell metal alloys containing more than 0.3% (!) lead to individuals [1]. I had no idea, thanks! [1]: https://www.kemi.se/lagar-och-regler/reach-forordningen/begransning/forbjudet-att-salja-lodtenn-med-bly-till-privatpersoner https://www.kemi.se/lagar-och-regler/reach-forordningen/begr...
  - stdbrouw 7y ago
    Actually, yes, it looks like I didn't have the full truth either: as recently as 2 or 3 years ago you could still buy leaded solder in most places (in Europe), but the store in Germany where I used to order it, doesn't sell any anymore.
- cientifico 7y ago
  Not in Spain. I remember the change at around 2003/2005, where the seller just gave me the lead free version. For what I remember, the lead free had a higher melting temperature. At least back in the days. Took one week to get used to.

finolex1 7y ago

The article makes it seem like lead-free solder is indisputably healthier, but in reality the conclusion seems to be based off of just the MSDS of the products. I presume these are generated simply based on the chemical composition of the solder, but do not take into account the actual exposure that really occurs when one is soldering.

cientifico 7y ago

I think Lead Solder is Ban in Europe since 2003 or around. I remember the change, where I was not able to buy the old one. I remember that it had a slightly higher melt temperature. Can you buy it in America?

Kuinox 7y ago
Yes, the melt temperature is slightly higher, and i have difficulties to melt it with my old solderer.
varjag 7y ago
It's not banned, it's restricted. There are still applications where it's allowed in manufacture, even in the EU. Prototyping/R&D is excepted as well.
jdietrich 7y ago
You can still buy leaded solder in the EU. Lead is restricted in most consumer applications, but it's still perfectly legal in a lot of industrial products. https://eu.mouser.com/ProductDetail/MG-Chemicals/4884-227G?qs=sGAEpiMZZMuQDxh7mFZIafA0CFytvp0Pd%2F2cRJbJTcY%3D https://eu.mouser.com/ProductDetail/MG-Chemicals/4884-227G?q...
cientifico 7y ago
Ok. When I said ban, I meant that back in the time, I went to the shop and they didn't sell it.

helsinkiandrew 7y ago

It's not just bad for the solderer. It will contaminate areas around your solder area (do your kids ever do a project on your workbench?) And at end of life, lead is a problem in land fill sites and in e-waste recycling. Indians (including children) desoldering components from imported e-waste have high blood lead levels: https://journals.lww.com/epidem/fulltext/2011/01001/High_Blood_Lead_Levels_in_E_waste_Recyclers.909.aspx https://journals.lww.com/epidem/fulltext/2011/01001/High_Blo...

Causality1 7y ago

I'm a little surprised someone with as solid a reputation as Ben Hencke wrote all that and didn't bother to dedicate a single solitary sentence to supporting the claim that leaded solder represents an actual threat to its user. Here I was, getting ready to point out flaws in his sources but not only doesn't he have sources he doesn't even have claims. The whole article is him disproving the myth that lead-free solder is more dangerous than leaded, which, granted, is a good point but he forgot to back up his thesis at all. Leaded solder is not even slightly dangerous to its user unless you make a daily habit of soldering for hours and then eating without washing your hands. Leaded solder does represent an environmental threat. Fortunately most manufacturers have switched to lead-free solder and the amount of lead put into the environment by hobbyist solder is best described as "fucking infinitesimal".

lolc 7y ago
Maybe you're so used to the safety warnings that you always skip them when you encounter them? Here, extracted just for you: > Compare that to the leaded version with the same rosin formulation. This also creates fumes that are not great to breathe (the same fumes), plus a bunch of really bad stuff because of the lead: > [Long list of bad stuff] > I think most of this speaks for itself, but I’d like to point out a subtle upgrade from P261 to P260 for the leaded stuff. It goes from “avoid” to “don’t” and I think this this is worth calling out specifically. Remember leaded paint? The stuff we banned in ‘78? The primary cause of lead-poisoning isn’t eating paint chips, it is breathing lead laced paint dust. https://www.mayoclinic.org/diseases-conditions/lead-poisoning/symptoms-causes/syc-20354717 https://www.mayoclinic.org/diseases-conditions/lead-poisonin... > “But solder dust? ‘Cmon, really? How can that even be?” I can hear someone typing already… Have you seen one of these? > [Picture of solder tip cleaner]
- Causality1 7y ago
  Putting aside the need of a citation or at least an explanation as to how tip cleaners create lead dust, that's a reason to use sponges with leaded solder, not a reason not to use lead solder at all.

temptemptemp111 7y ago

Lead free bullets are better to train with long-term.

mehrdadn 7y ago

Question: if you have some solder around and don't know if it's leaded... and you don't have enough practice to be able to tell the difference from the way it flows... is there an easy way to tell?

6nf 7y ago
If you hate soldering with it, it's lead free
OJFord 7y ago
By mass is probably the easiest way - if you also have some that is known lead-free and it's 'significantly' lighter (per equal volume), the other's probably leaded. If it's close, you could probably work it out by pouring over Wikipedia and making assumptions like 'if it's leaded, it will be at minimum 30% lead'... but at that point the 'easy way to tell' is probably to replace it with known solder (assuming the goal was not to use leaded solder inadvertently).
lukego 7y ago
Guessing in practice you would melt some and see if it's shiny (leaded) or chalky (lead free.) Surely not foolproof for all alloys though. Otherwise you could see how hot your iron needs to be to make it melt.

keithnz 7y ago

as aside, took me a while ( a while ago when the internet was a much smaller place) to work out the american pronunciation of solder actually meant "solder" which is said "soul der" around these parts.

oldandtired 7y ago

There are a lot of different products in use which will cause health problems, if you don't take care (something that we should all have been taught). There have been some good suggestions in relation to the environmental situation to mitigate contamination. I will add another suggestion to all of these as well. If you work with various heavy metals, you might want to consider adding beetroot to your diet on a daily basis. My father was a printer using lead type for many years. It got to the point that his health was being affected by lead poisoning. His GP told him to start eating beetroot every day. The reasoning was to stimulate the liver. Interestingly enough, his health improved and the quantity of lead in his system decreased till he was basically free of it after six months. A few years later, the printing works he was at dispensed with lead usage completely, but my father has continued to eat beetroot on a regular basis (not every day, but certainly a couple of time a week). Now of course this is anecdotal and you can take it or leave it. But it can't hurt and for those who have a need, it may help. Of course, the beetroot mentioned is what we call beetroot in Australia, it may have some other name in other places in the world.

KarlKemp 7y ago
A fitting username if there ever was... Seeing the replies in this thread, I’m wondering if the narrative that only incompetent people need leaded solder might not be quite powerful in convincing people. More so than any warnings about health risks.
- Dylan16807 7y ago
  Convincing people of what? I openly acknowledge that I'm incompetent at soldering. Are you encouraging me to use leaded solder?
  - oldandtired 7y ago
    Not at all. Simply that if you have had some previous contamination, this might help clear up the problem. I said it was anecdotal but as it worked for my father, it might work for you. Why would I want to convince anyone to follow this regime? It is there for you to make a judgement call and do your own research into the matter. If it helps just one other person then it was useful. If you are not at all interested then don't investigate. That is entirely up to you. I actually find it funny that when any kind of suggestion is made that might (notice the use of the word "might") help with some pre-existing condition, people make the immediate assumption that the person making the suggestion is then advocating to continue the activity that caused the pre-existing condition. In today's atmosphere, it almost appears that people have stopped trying to think for themselves. All I can suggest it that people stop jumping to conclusions and if something is unclear then ask some questions. Sure, there are people who are "trolls" (so to speak). But there are also many who are not. Just yesterday, I came across a youtube comment that, in the context it was written it was meant to be sarcastic, was treated as if the the person making the comment was supporting what they were not. Essentially, there were only two of us who recognised the sarcasm, the other participants essentially treated the person as if they were an idiot. Go figure. As far as soldering with non-lead based solder is concerned, it has been a good source for my son-in-law's repair business. The most common source of problems he has found has been the solder joints failing because of non-lead solder. He has also received quite a bit of equipment that was essentially being thrown out because of some unknown failure, which he often found boiled down again to faulty solder joints due to non-lead solder. Is this an advocation for using lead solder? No. It is simply recognising that the processes for using non-lead solder will be a bit different. There are always consequences for changing to using different materials if the former are found to have health problems. However, I have seen that people don't always take that a change in processes is also required and so we get other problems arising. At any rate, during this time of isolation, everyone keep safe and take the necessary precautions for the health of you and your loved ones.

kys229 7y ago

Website doesn't not show content with javascript disabled. This clearly means whatever is written there is not worth out time.

mnw21cam 7y ago

Okay, so this link loads up to a blank page. You have to edit the CSS and remove the "opacity: 0" to see the content. Presumably there's some Javascript in there that does this after the page has loaded. So, talking about a hill to die on - can we please stop doing this? There was absolutely nothing else in that web page that required Javascript to be able to view the content. It was completely unnecessary to pull a trick like that.

mk89 7y ago
Confirmed. You'll have to temporarily allow javascript for that. What for? Just some text. Come on, people.
KarlKemp 7y ago
But I run a custom patched browser and turn HTML off for most sites, unless it is inserted by JavaScript. Can we please all cater to the quirks of my specific setup? I don’t trust HTML, because it is used by a lot of advertisements, and there were lots of security holes in HTML parsers in the 1990s.
- sidpatil 7y ago
  Oh, come on. A sizable amount of undesirable functionality is implemented using JavaScript—ads, tracking, cryptominers, etc. It doesn't seem unreasonable to have some expectations about where JavaScript should and shouldn't be used. Imagine if the majority of PDF authors started following the same logic. Would you really want to run arbitrary code just to read a journal article or ebook?
  - sidpatil 7y ago
    As if on cue: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=22742476 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=22742476
chrisseaton 7y ago
Maybe the unnecessary thing was you disabling JavaScript?

econcon 7y ago

Why isn't there alternative to soldering? Laser for fusing component leads to PCB?

cartoonfoxes 7y ago
For mass production, most work is done with automated methods like wave soldering which spot methods like soldering irons (or lasers) can't hope to match for throughput or repeatability. The kind of hand work that's being discussed here is almost non-representative of most industry practice.

k__ 7y ago

I once read that getting rid of lead in gas made some seemingly unrelated illnesses go away over the decades. Let's see how our lifes get better when we remove combustion engines entirely from our cities.

KarlKemp 7y ago
Not just illness. Elimination of lead is a prime suspect for the decrease of violent crime over the last 40 or so years.

amelius 7y ago

Curious, what is your preferred method of dispensing the right amount of solderpaste for SMT work? I find the manual syringe technique quite difficult but perhaps I should consider a smaller tip size. I've seen people using compressed air based approaches, but these seem expensive and take a lot of desk space.

exmadscientist 7y ago
First choice: stencil. Stainless steel stencils are cheap these days and fantastic. No good for rework, though. Second choice: manual syringe. As you've noticed, it's difficult. Some pastes are thixotropic, so shaking the tube before dispensing can help a little. Or maybe that's just my imagination. Third choice: stick a stainless steel pick or even just a toothpick into a little pile of paste and dispense it by hand. This is surprisingly useful for those really fine-pitch pads... but it's tedious.

upofadown 7y ago

MSDS data sheets are only intended to list the hazards associated with a particular material for an employee of a company using that material. You can't really use them to determine the relative risks of two materials. Often times a MSDS is simply wrong and no one cares enough to get it corrected. A second MSDS issued by the same manufacturer for the same material can be different than the first.

mauvehaus 7y ago
Minor point of order: They're now SDS, not MSDS. Knowing such things is a well-known hazard of being married to an environmental engineer.
- hprotagonist 7y ago
  since when? i was about to be a pedant and add the M...
  - mauvehaus 7y ago
    Wikipedia says mid-2015: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Safety_data_sheet#United_States https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Safety_data_sheet#United_State... In practice, a lot of smaller companies are still distributing MSDS rather than SDS.
- myself248 7y ago
  Yeah, but if I say SDS everyone thinks I'm talking about a hammerdrill. Say MSDS and everyone knows what you mean, even if the name technically changed.

bbarn 7y ago

After I got out of the military (in Electronics) I did a few years as a rework tech at a big telecom company soldering literally 8 hours a day. I got really good at it. We had very little safety equipment, and used leaded exclusively. Vent hoods, but that's about it. Many people turned them off because the shake and rattle of the fans made it difficult to work on precise things like surface mount components. There was even a big CPU changing station which was effectively a molten vat of solder that you'd dip all 144 leads into to remove huge square I.C.s This was in my early 20's, and I had that job for about 2 years. Despite perfect dental hygiene, most of my teeth had decayed and had to be crowned or replaced by the time I was 30. Most people I still talk to from that time in my life have chronic problems directly associated with lead poisoning (tooth decay is sort of loosely correlated, and I don't have any other typical symptoms into my 40s) All of this is to say, the US Navy barely even mentioned lead safety in school, and a billion dollar (at the time) company didn't seem to care enough to train its employees, so the attitude that it's "not a big deal" was well and alive in the 90s, and I wouldn't be surprised if it still is today. Also - Why is rosin-core solder so popular? I never used anything but raw spool solder and liquid flux. Rosin core makes a huge mess.

foofoo55 7y ago
The older military and aviation boards we make still all use lead. Changing to lead-free requires an extensive re-certification process for each board, and no one at any level wants to do that. Which seems to create a belief that lead is manageable and okay. Interestingly, the board assembly shop still prefers lead because the boards are apparently easier to make. Rosin-core is popular because it's a 1-step process. No need to put on the liquid, which seems to make at least the same mess. [edit:grammar]
- cglace 7y ago
  There are liquids that are much less messy than rosin core.
14 7y ago
When I was in high school rosin core was used and the teacher talked about it like it was some great forgiving stuff that even if you didn’t use enough flux the core would help you but I agreed messy. I am however used to working on a poor mans budget and only do home electronics, last thing I did was solder and hack a Xbox 360 and rosin core is the only solder around here you can find so I make do. Also can’t buy flux without ordering online so I ended up collecting pine sap and soaking it in alcohol then filtering and evaporate the alcohol to make my own flux. It actually works just as well as any commercial flux I have used.

prostheticvamp 7y ago

I think of woodworking as a very similar discussion. People would wear N95s when working with a shit-ton of visible particulates, but otherwise are constantly leaving their lungs unprotected. The resultant progressive loss of long function is pronounced. But try to convince woodworkers that N95s should be a de facto daily driver. “My daddy worked wood all his life and was healthy as a horse until the day he dropped dead”

PragmaticPulp 7y ago
Agreed on the dangers of sawdust, but in my experience most hobbyist woodworkers these days are very aware of dust and particulate management. Particle counters are reasonably cheap, so many woodworkers use them to measure and optimize the air cleaning systems in their woodworking areas. It helps that the most popular Woodworking YouTubers frequently produce videos about improvements to their dust collection setups. It also helps that cheap Chinese air filtration units have become widely available. Dust collection and air filtration are probably the most common tool talk in my local woodworking groups. In contrast, it's rare to see electronics hobbyists taking air filtration seriously. Kudos to Ben Heck for writing about it.
tibbon 7y ago
I think too many people (myself included) have thought incorrect things like, "Ah, wood is natural and can't hurt you". Not that wood is any more natural than lead, or arsenic. But it doesn't seem bad like inhaling smoke from things... and yet, it clearly is not good for you in the long term!
- dotancohen 7y ago
  Whenever I hear that something is "natural" and thus not a health danger, I ask the person if they would bite into a camel turd. Those are natural too. Don't even get me started on "chemical free".
- hammock 7y ago
  Don't forget treated wood does have arsenic...and fumes from poly, stains and varnishes can be pretty bad.

bnolsen 7y ago

Since lead is a stabilizing agent for tin whiskers has that been dealt with yet by solder manufacturers or have we just decided that early failure is acceptable?

S_A_P 7y ago

My dad used to solder a lot as a kid and I always loved the smell of it. My dads advice to me was "you probably shouldnt do that. It will slowly poison you." I dont know that it really stopped me though.. He also (still) has a mason jar full of mercury that he let my brother and I play with...

pravda 7y ago

Whenever someone has difficulty soldering, and I find out they are using unleaded solder, I always give the same advice: USE LEADED SOLDER USE LEADED SOLDER USE LEADED SOLDER Lead-free solder is a disaster. Stay away from it.

reportingsjr 7y ago
This is seriously old school advice from someone who clearly hasn't done research or used modern solders. There are quite a few very good lead free alloys that are basically as good as any leaded alloy. I use Kester K100LD and it is absolutely fantastic. Unless you really know your stuff you can't tell a difference. Please stop giving outdated advice like this.
- pravda 7y ago
  > There are quite a few very good lead free alloys that are basically as good as any leaded alloy. You know what is 100% as good as leaded solder? Actual leaded solder! You remember that giant class-action against the Heathkit company for all the people they poisoned with leaded solder? Don't remember it? That's because it never happened! If your soldering consists of soldering pins onto Arduino nano boards, or whipping up a prototype or two with your JLCPCB boards, you'll be fine with leaded solder.
  - reportingsjr 7y ago
    If all you're soldering is some pins on an Arduino nano or some simple jlc prototypes then you'll also be totally fine with lead free solder. The only time I've seen a reasonable excuse to use leaded solder at home is when working with very temperature sensitive devices such as connectors with plastic in them. Even then leaded isn't /that/ much better.

0culus 7y ago

This is from the perspective of a hobbyist who does _not_ do industrial quantities of soldering, but rather the occasional build or the occasional repair of a piece of old test equipment. I use eutectic 63/37 Kester solder in several sizes for everything. With my temp controlled Weller station, it's the bee's knees for making quality joints quickly. As far as worrying about safety, it's really down to common sense. In long time scales, the survival rate for everyone drops to zero. If you apply common sense, you can have fun while you're around and not have problems from lead solder. Here's my "hot takes": 1) There's a reason why food and drink isn't allowed in professional labs of various kinds. Follow their example. Don't use your kitchen table as a workbench. Don't eat and drink in your work area. Don't lick solder. etc. etc. If your living arrangement is so small that you can't separate them adequately, seek out a local hacker space or a friend who does have space. 2) Wash your hands thoroughly after soldering (and if you are doing projects with your kids, instill in them the instinct to wash their hands, too!) If I'm finding myself doing a lot of soldering/desoldering for a repair, I take frequent breaks and wash then, too. It also helps reduce mistakes. 3) At a minimum, use a desk fan to blow fumes away from your face. Better yet, invest in a fume extractor unit. I'd say the latter it's a necessity if you do a lot of soldering. The bottom line is, choose what you prefer and what you are willing to risk using, and take appropriate precautions. Chances are, even if you eliminate lead solder from your hobby work, there's likely something equally as hazardous in your local environment that you are more systemically exposed to. Radon gas, naturally occurring drinking water contaminants (or sometimes unnaturally...), etc.

sneak 7y ago
Externalities matter. Eventually that stuff is going to be handled by other people, in a year or ten or a hundred. The risk is not just to you, and is not just based on your own safety procedures. Please stop advocating for people to use leaded solder at hackerspaces, which are generally frequented by children.
- 0culus 7y ago
  Scale matters too. As I clearly stated, I am not making electronics at industrial scales, nor am I generating large quantities of e-waste. As for hacker spaces, why on earth would anyone in their right mind assume that it would be ok to not wash hands, eat, drink, etc in that environment _and_ let their kids work there without the same precautions, leaded solder or no?

mark-r 7y ago

I still have a tiny bit of the spool of lead solder I bought in the 1980's.

nimbius 7y ago

i dont know... ive been eating a roll a week and let me tell you, i can definitely taste a difference in the lead-free solder.

awkward 7y ago

While the solders on through hole stuff come out messier, I find the goopyness of lead free solder to be superior for point to point connections.

mdszy 7y ago

Why does it sound like so many people here literally eat lead solder. Practice proper lab safety for chrissakes. Wash your hands after dealing with chemicals and/or dangerous materials, such as flux or lead. Don't let your small children near it. Don't eat or drink in the lab. The spread of the hobby through cheap dev kits and stuff has made people ignorant to the fact that, yes, these are potentially dangerous chemicals like any other, with MSDS documentation and proper handling precautions that must be taken. You don't get lead poisoning unless you're improperly handling the stuff. Give me a break. Arguing that "lead free solder is better for you" is absolutely terrible. That's like saying "drinking straight bleach is better for you than drinking bleach with arsenic mixed in." None of these should even be coming into your body in any way, shape, or form and if they are, you're doing something horribly wrong.

cmrdporcupine 7y ago
I remember seeing somewhere a video of Steve Wozniak showing off his old soldering technique, which involved holding a length of solder in his mouth so both his hands could be free... In the days before lead free solder...
- mdszy 7y ago
  Pair of helping hands: $10 Lead poisoning: Priceless
- cmrdporcupine 7y ago
  Found the video: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pJif4i9NRdI https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pJif4i9NRdI See him solder @ 3:08.
yAak 7y ago
Melting lead also creates lead vapor, so it doesn't require that you touch or eat it.
- mdszy 7y ago
  Not in any signifnicant way, no. The vapor pressure of lead is incredibly incredibly low. The vapor amounts that would be given off during normal soldering would be miniscule, and would remain incredibly close to the work. You'd basically have to shove the molten lead directly into your nose and snort it to have an effect, if any. Lead is incredibly dense. I hope it's pretty easy to understand that you have to put a whole lot of energy into it in order to actually get the particles to fly up into your nose or mouth for you to aspirate them. Much more energy than is imparted by the process of soldering.

nojvek 7y ago

If Lead is terrible, thanks to getting it out of petrol, why are we still selling lead solders which will easily poison you? I have done some soldering with zero education on how to properly do it or the safety implications. I've most likely poisoned myself. Can we not ban lead for non-certified use? Like I don't see home depot selling liquid nitrogen wily nily. Same with oxygen tanks. Isn't playing with Lead in the same ballpark?

Dylan16807 7y ago
Lead solder isn't really more dangerous than the soldering iron you're applying it with. And lead-free solder can poison you too. The problems caused by lead are from it filling the environment, not touching tiny amounts. We'd probably get much more benefit by finally banning it in aviation gas.
kube-system 7y ago
The simple reason for the difference is that poisons are only dangerous if they end up somewhere they shouldn't be. When we put lead in gasoline, it was going everywhere in the environment, including the air. Lead which is in a large enough chunk that it doesn't spontaneously become airborne is much less likely to end up inside of a human. Brass also contains lead, which you almost certainly have inside of your house in a few places. Even 'lead-free' brass for plumbing contains some lead. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Brass#Lead_content https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Brass#Lead_content The key is that it has to be in low enough concentrations that it doesn't end up leaving the part and ending up in dangerous amounts inside of humans. Unless you have occupational exposure, you have most likely not even come close to poisoning yourself even if you didn't follow any safety precautions. Lead is pretty bad, but it's not something that causes issues with any amount of exposure... you body can tolerate some lead exposure. A hobbyist that solders a dozen PCBs per year has a way different potential exposure than someone who solders a dozen per hour for 2000 hours per year. > Like I don't see home depot selling liquid nitrogen wily nily. Same with oxygen tanks. https://www.homedepot.com/p/Bernzomatic-1-4-oz-Oxygen-Gas-Cylinder-304179/202044702 https://www.homedepot.com/p/Bernzomatic-1-4-oz-Oxygen-Gas-Cy...
exmadscientist 7y ago

Cartonju 7y ago

I 100% agree, on all accounts lead-free solder is better.

yAak 7y ago

> "the same fumes" But, they're not the same. I had to dig around a bit to verify, but melting lead creates lead fumes: https://www.cdc.gov/niosh/topics/lead/exposure.html https://www.cdc.gov/niosh/topics/lead/exposure.html You do not have to bring lead to boiling create lead fumes (aka vapor). Here's the OSHA documentation on lead: https://www.osha.gov/chemicaldata/chemResult.html?recNo=500 https://www.osha.gov/chemicaldata/chemResult.html?recNo=500 They have specifications for testing lead (and other metal) content in the air from soldering operations: https://www.osha.gov/dts/sltc/methods/inorganic/id206/id206.pdf https://www.osha.gov/dts/sltc/methods/inorganic/id206/id206....

nimish 7y ago

SN100C is finally a thing but it's really hard to give up 63/37