6 ms·

> There are some drawbacks such as Windows edition is based on IE etc. What does this mean?

untog 7y ago
It uses whatever the system webview is. So on Windows that is IE, on Mac it’s WKWebView, not sure about Linux. It’s a trade off: it’s much more lightweight but loses cross platform consistency. For some that might be absolutely fine, for others it may not.
- pjmlp 7y ago
  Just like the Web stack. If that isn't desired, then doing native apps is the way.
- vorpalhex 7y ago
  I wish we had a step inbetween. Something more than "just a webview" but something less than, well, all of electron. Give me like a really cut down browser that's consistent across platforms and embed it.
  - untog 7y ago
    It's a shame Sciter hasn't seen more adoption: https://sciter.com/ https://sciter.com/ But a) it's a commercial product and b) uses it's own scripting language instead of JavaScript. But from some initial noodling around with it the browser engine is very capable and the footprint small.
    - api 7y ago
      The weird language is the big turn-off for me, not the license. This is also a turn-off for Flutter and Lazarus. WHY do these projects insist on doing this? What is it about UI that leads people to think this is a good idea? Do not make me learn yet another language just to use your UI library. It's not that FreePascal or Dart are bad languages. It's that they're another language to consume yet more precious attention and head space, and there's nothing compelling enough about them vs. C++, Rust, Go, Python, JS/TypeScript, etc. to make it worthwhile.
      - vips7L 7y ago
        I've been looking at Dart lately and it seems like a pretty awesome language. A weird mashup of Java + JavaScript, but I agree its something else that has to be learned. I think flutter would probably have better adoption if they chose something more mainstream.
      - c-smile 7y ago
        You can use Sciter in C++, Rust, Go, Python, Delphi, C# and D projects : https://github.com/sciter-sdk https://github.com/sciter-sdk
        api 7y ago
        You can't write your GUI in those languages.
        c-smile 7y ago
        > You can't write your GUI in those languages. What do you mean by "write GUI"? If to declare DOM structure then HTML is for that. If to initialize DOM structure from code at runtime then this (C++ here): use namespace sciter; element root = window.get_root(); element div = element::create("div", L"Hello world"); root.append(div); div.attach_event_handler(my_controller); Or do you mean something else?
        api 7y ago
        Whoa... I didn't know it let you do that! In that case that's quite interesting. It opens the potential for using the web renderer but not having to code everything in JS.
        c-smile 7y ago
        "It opens the potential..." Applications that use Sciter for their UI are native applications. Like Norton AntiVirus for example. Or any other app of these vendors: https://sciter.com/#customers https://sciter.com/#customers
    - c-smile 7y ago
      Sciter's author here. a) Is anyone brave here to finance transition of Sciter to OpenSource? Please contact me if yes. b) Sciter's script is a JavaScript++: It uses JS syntax and runtime like `arr.concat(a,b)`. Grammar and syntax was extended to better support UI cases. Like `const width = 12px;` is valid construct as Sciter has Length data type. React and JSX are implemented natively. function render() { return <p>{this.greeting}</p>; } is a valid construct as JSX (SSX in Sciter) is a part of script grammar : https://sciter.com/developers/sciter-docs/reactor-and-ssx/ https://sciter.com/developers/sciter-docs/reactor-and-ssx/
      - untog 7y ago
        Don’t get me wrong, I agree with you that it’s an amazing scripting language. But I think one of the reasons Electron has been so popular is that web devs can take all the skills they already have, including JS, and make a native app. Learning a new language is a barrier to adoption, to hiring developers in the future, blah blah. But I want to give you credit for an absolutely phenomenal project! If I had the cash lying around to finance it as an open source concern I would, but alas.
rezmason 7y ago
I assume you're quoting the "Why Neutralinojs is better" page: https://github.com/neutralinojs/evaluation/blob/master/README.md#why-neutralinojs-is-better--proof https://github.com/neutralinojs/evaluation/blob/master/READM... This page was last updated 2/28/2019. Last month, Microsoft Edge was rereleased as a Chromium based browser. Presumably this would change the Windows frontend for Neutralino to Chromium, but I'm only speculating. Edit: It appears that a Chromium system-provided web view for Windows is still in developer preview: https://docs.microsoft.com/en-us/microsoft-edge/hosting/webview2 https://docs.microsoft.com/en-us/microsoft-edge/hosting/webv...

It uses whatever the system webview is. So on Windows that is IE, on Mac it’s WKWebView, not sure about Linux. It’s a trade off: it’s much more lightweight but loses cross platform consistency. For some that might be absolutely fine, for others it may not.

pjmlp 7y ago
Just like the Web stack. If that isn't desired, then doing native apps is the way.
vorpalhex 7y ago
I wish we had a step inbetween. Something more than "just a webview" but something less than, well, all of electron. Give me like a really cut down browser that's consistent across platforms and embed it.
- untog 7y ago
  It's a shame Sciter hasn't seen more adoption: https://sciter.com/ https://sciter.com/ But a) it's a commercial product and b) uses it's own scripting language instead of JavaScript. But from some initial noodling around with it the browser engine is very capable and the footprint small.
  - api 7y ago
    The weird language is the big turn-off for me, not the license. This is also a turn-off for Flutter and Lazarus. WHY do these projects insist on doing this? What is it about UI that leads people to think this is a good idea? Do not make me learn yet another language just to use your UI library. It's not that FreePascal or Dart are bad languages. It's that they're another language to consume yet more precious attention and head space, and there's nothing compelling enough about them vs. C++, Rust, Go, Python, JS/TypeScript, etc. to make it worthwhile.
    - vips7L 7y ago
      I've been looking at Dart lately and it seems like a pretty awesome language. A weird mashup of Java + JavaScript, but I agree its something else that has to be learned. I think flutter would probably have better adoption if they chose something more mainstream.
    - c-smile 7y ago
      You can use Sciter in C++, Rust, Go, Python, Delphi, C# and D projects : https://github.com/sciter-sdk https://github.com/sciter-sdk
      - api 7y ago
        You can't write your GUI in those languages.
        c-smile 7y ago
        > You can't write your GUI in those languages. What do you mean by "write GUI"? If to declare DOM structure then HTML is for that. If to initialize DOM structure from code at runtime then this (C++ here): use namespace sciter; element root = window.get_root(); element div = element::create("div", L"Hello world"); root.append(div); div.attach_event_handler(my_controller); Or do you mean something else?
        api 7y ago
        Whoa... I didn't know it let you do that! In that case that's quite interesting. It opens the potential for using the web renderer but not having to code everything in JS.
        c-smile 7y ago
        "It opens the potential..." Applications that use Sciter for their UI are native applications. Like Norton AntiVirus for example. Or any other app of these vendors: https://sciter.com/#customers https://sciter.com/#customers
  - c-smile 7y ago
    Sciter's author here. a) Is anyone brave here to finance transition of Sciter to OpenSource? Please contact me if yes. b) Sciter's script is a JavaScript++: It uses JS syntax and runtime like `arr.concat(a,b)`. Grammar and syntax was extended to better support UI cases. Like `const width = 12px;` is valid construct as Sciter has Length data type. React and JSX are implemented natively. function render() { return <p>{this.greeting}</p>; } is a valid construct as JSX (SSX in Sciter) is a part of script grammar : https://sciter.com/developers/sciter-docs/reactor-and-ssx/ https://sciter.com/developers/sciter-docs/reactor-and-ssx/
    - untog 7y ago
      Don’t get me wrong, I agree with you that it’s an amazing scripting language. But I think one of the reasons Electron has been so popular is that web devs can take all the skills they already have, including JS, and make a native app. Learning a new language is a barrier to adoption, to hiring developers in the future, blah blah. But I want to give you credit for an absolutely phenomenal project! If I had the cash lying around to finance it as an open source concern I would, but alas.

rezmason 7y ago

I assume you're quoting the "Why Neutralinojs is better" page: https://github.com/neutralinojs/evaluation/blob/master/README.md#why-neutralinojs-is-better--proof https://github.com/neutralinojs/evaluation/blob/master/READM... This page was last updated 2/28/2019. Last month, Microsoft Edge was rereleased as a Chromium based browser. Presumably this would change the Windows frontend for Neutralino to Chromium, but I'm only speculating. Edit: It appears that a Chromium system-provided web view for Windows is still in developer preview: https://docs.microsoft.com/en-us/microsoft-edge/hosting/webview2 https://docs.microsoft.com/en-us/microsoft-edge/hosting/webv...