8 ms·

Any indication whether this make it into Ubuntu 20.04?

by Scramblejams 7y ago

edoceo 7y ago
It's gonna be 5.4
pkaye 7y ago
They are staying with 5.4 but will back port WireGuard.
- axaxs 7y ago
  Yikes, that feels like a mistake. 5.4 has awful issues with intel integrated graphics crashing.
  - thayne 7y ago
    The timing is a little unfortunate. 5.6 will be too late to make it in for 20.04, but 5.5 isn't an LTS kernel and 20.04 is an LTS distribution, so I understand not wanting to use 5.5.
    - SlowRobotAhead 7y ago
      The issue of a rigid release schedule! April means April whether you miss out on something or not.
      - m-p-3 7y ago
        You still end up having to make compromises no matter what.
        thegeekpirate 7y ago
        One method allows for you to determine which compromises are acceptable, while the other does not.
        Dylan16807 7y ago
        Not really. Let's consider an alternate flexible version that stretches up to 2-3 months outside of emergencies. Versus a non-flexible version that stretches 0 months outside of emergencies. If you compare the flexible version targeted at June, and the non-flexible version targeted at August, you'll find that they're making almost the exact same compromises. Nothing ever stops you from using an earlier version if it's more stable. So both schedules get to chose from multiple versions. Maybe flexible chooses from 6 month old to 3 months in the future code, via delaying. But non-flexible can choose from 9 month old to 0 month old code. It works out the same, and the only difference is how you label it.
    - derefr 7y ago
      I'm kind of curious why Canonical don't simultaneously release a non-LTS release at the same time as the LTS release, to continue the flow of non-LTS releases. It seems like it'd make gearing up for the "LTS + 6mo" non-LTS release easier. Plus, then there'd be a clear non-LTS release to attribute any backported update packages to (that show up before they cut the "LTS + 6mo" non-LTS release.)
      - pkaye 7y ago
        They do keep latest kernel PPAs for those who want to experiment. https://kernel.ubuntu.com/~kernel-ppa/mainline/v5.5/ https://kernel.ubuntu.com/~kernel-ppa/mainline/v5.5/
      - slgeorge 7y ago
        When I was involved we did LTS, and then half the distro team was focused on the LTS .1 release which happens 3 months later. The reality of software is that no amount of internal testing is the same as the amount of bug reports you get after the release. And, for an LTS as it's going to be around for a long time getting fixes in is more important - with a standard release you can choose to leave some that you'll resolve in the next six month release. The reality of doing LTS, plus LTS .1 mean that the next standard release didn't get as much attention. So in reality the first six month release was often very rough, with a lot of new things in it that would be straightened out over the course of the entire cycle. As someone mentions later in the thread Canonical started doing HWE releases, which means you can run a later kernel on the LTS. So I'm running 18.04.4 (I think) which has a HWE kernel that is newer than the one that originally shipped - not just security fixes but newer hardware compatibility.
      - shrimp_emoji 7y ago
        ITT: why Manjaro's nerfed rolling is best model while point releases are a server meme.
  - CarelessExpert 7y ago
    Eh, just as Canonical will backport Wireguard, I'd expect them to backport stabilization fixes to address issues like that.
  - ralala 7y ago
    Have the issues been fixed in 5.5 or 5.6?
    - axaxs 7y ago
      Yes, it was fixed in 5.5. There's a few corners of the internet explaining the issue...this one is good enough https://bbs.archlinux.org/viewtopic.php?id=250765 https://bbs.archlinux.org/viewtopic.php?id=250765 . I have a newish all intel setup, and 5.4 crashes to the point of insanity. I gave up and installed 5.5 and it went away. It's a serious issue for an LTS release.
  - tracker1 7y ago
    First time I put Ubuntu on a laptop (2004 or so), there was an intel graphics regression so bad, I put windows back on it... This past October was the first time, in a very long time, Linux went on as my main OS. And running a new x570 board with an rx 5700xt has been painful until much later, when support got dramatically better. Still have an issue with when I come back from the blank screen and login, the login screen won't go away... all the top/side bar shows, but it covers apps... I wind up ctrl+alt=f3 to login to a terminal and reboot. Should really figure out the commands to kill and restart gnome, but it's really been a pain. not sure if KDE might be better.
    - namibj 7y ago
      (sudo) pkill Xorg should likely do the trick, but check e.g. htop (hit F5 to get a tree view) for the name of the root process of the graphics session.
      - tracker1 7y ago
        switched over to KDE after writing that... will see if it's still an issue in a day or two.
- thayne 7y ago
  Really? Do you have a source for that? (I'm not doubting you, I just haven't heard anything about that, and would be very happy if this is true).
  - haunter 7y ago
    https://lists.ubuntu.com/archives/kernel-team/2020-February/107227.html https://lists.ubuntu.com/archives/kernel-team/2020-February/...
    - thayne 7y ago
      Sorry, I meant the part about backporting wireguard. I did find a phoronix article on it: https://www.phoronix.com/scan.php?page=news_item&px=Ubuntu-20.04-Adds-WireGuard https://www.phoronix.com/scan.php?page=news_item&px=Ubuntu-2...
  - pkaye 7y ago
    https://www.phoronix.com/scan.php?page=news_item&px=Ubuntu-20.04-Adds-WireGuard https://www.phoronix.com/scan.php?page=news_item&px=Ubuntu-2... is one source but I remember seeing it elsewhere.
thayne 7y ago
After ubuntu 20.10 is released 20.04 will probably get a later version of the kernel in the linux-hwe package
gchamonlive 7y ago
any reason for choosing ubuntu over arch for personal computers? Or any rolling release distro for that matter
- mehrdadn 7y ago
  Python packages don't install on /usr/local on Arch which makes it easy to wreck your installation, many projects and scripts out there only support Ubuntu and not Arch, etc. And I say this as an Arch fan who would rather avoid Ubuntu...
  - rmdashrfstar 7y ago
    virtualenv?
    - mehrdadn 7y ago
      Before I try to respond, you have to ask yourself: what do you imagine is the reason why Ubuntu folks have gone out of their way to patch Python for /usr/local? Surely it's not out of ignorance for virtualenv?
  - gchamonlive 7y ago
    interesting, I never looked where the python aur packages were installed
    - mehrdadn 7y ago
      This isn't AUR-specific, it's an issue that comes up with sudo pip install.
      - gchamonlive 7y ago
        pip with sudo is always discouraged. Did you encounter use cases that absolutely requires you to install packages with `sudo pip`?
Zardoz84 7y ago
Nothing forbides you of installing 5.6 on Ubuntu 20.04 or other older version.

Any indication whether this make it into Ubuntu 20.04?

edoceo 7y ago

It's gonna be 5.4

pkaye 7y ago

They are staying with 5.4 but will back port WireGuard.

axaxs 7y ago
Yikes, that feels like a mistake. 5.4 has awful issues with intel integrated graphics crashing.
- thayne 7y ago
  The timing is a little unfortunate. 5.6 will be too late to make it in for 20.04, but 5.5 isn't an LTS kernel and 20.04 is an LTS distribution, so I understand not wanting to use 5.5.
  - SlowRobotAhead 7y ago
    The issue of a rigid release schedule! April means April whether you miss out on something or not.
    - m-p-3 7y ago
      You still end up having to make compromises no matter what.
      - thegeekpirate 7y ago
        One method allows for you to determine which compromises are acceptable, while the other does not.
        Dylan16807 7y ago
        Not really. Let's consider an alternate flexible version that stretches up to 2-3 months outside of emergencies. Versus a non-flexible version that stretches 0 months outside of emergencies. If you compare the flexible version targeted at June, and the non-flexible version targeted at August, you'll find that they're making almost the exact same compromises. Nothing ever stops you from using an earlier version if it's more stable. So both schedules get to chose from multiple versions. Maybe flexible chooses from 6 month old to 3 months in the future code, via delaying. But non-flexible can choose from 9 month old to 0 month old code. It works out the same, and the only difference is how you label it.
  - derefr 7y ago
    I'm kind of curious why Canonical don't simultaneously release a non-LTS release at the same time as the LTS release, to continue the flow of non-LTS releases. It seems like it'd make gearing up for the "LTS + 6mo" non-LTS release easier. Plus, then there'd be a clear non-LTS release to attribute any backported update packages to (that show up before they cut the "LTS + 6mo" non-LTS release.)
    - pkaye 7y ago
      They do keep latest kernel PPAs for those who want to experiment. https://kernel.ubuntu.com/~kernel-ppa/mainline/v5.5/ https://kernel.ubuntu.com/~kernel-ppa/mainline/v5.5/
    - slgeorge 7y ago
      When I was involved we did LTS, and then half the distro team was focused on the LTS .1 release which happens 3 months later. The reality of software is that no amount of internal testing is the same as the amount of bug reports you get after the release. And, for an LTS as it's going to be around for a long time getting fixes in is more important - with a standard release you can choose to leave some that you'll resolve in the next six month release. The reality of doing LTS, plus LTS .1 mean that the next standard release didn't get as much attention. So in reality the first six month release was often very rough, with a lot of new things in it that would be straightened out over the course of the entire cycle. As someone mentions later in the thread Canonical started doing HWE releases, which means you can run a later kernel on the LTS. So I'm running 18.04.4 (I think) which has a HWE kernel that is newer than the one that originally shipped - not just security fixes but newer hardware compatibility.
    - shrimp_emoji 7y ago
      ITT: why Manjaro's nerfed rolling is best model while point releases are a server meme.
- CarelessExpert 7y ago
  Eh, just as Canonical will backport Wireguard, I'd expect them to backport stabilization fixes to address issues like that.
- ralala 7y ago
  Have the issues been fixed in 5.5 or 5.6?
  - axaxs 7y ago
    Yes, it was fixed in 5.5. There's a few corners of the internet explaining the issue...this one is good enough https://bbs.archlinux.org/viewtopic.php?id=250765 https://bbs.archlinux.org/viewtopic.php?id=250765 . I have a newish all intel setup, and 5.4 crashes to the point of insanity. I gave up and installed 5.5 and it went away. It's a serious issue for an LTS release.
- tracker1 7y ago
  First time I put Ubuntu on a laptop (2004 or so), there was an intel graphics regression so bad, I put windows back on it... This past October was the first time, in a very long time, Linux went on as my main OS. And running a new x570 board with an rx 5700xt has been painful until much later, when support got dramatically better. Still have an issue with when I come back from the blank screen and login, the login screen won't go away... all the top/side bar shows, but it covers apps... I wind up ctrl+alt=f3 to login to a terminal and reboot. Should really figure out the commands to kill and restart gnome, but it's really been a pain. not sure if KDE might be better.
  - namibj 7y ago
    (sudo) pkill Xorg should likely do the trick, but check e.g. htop (hit F5 to get a tree view) for the name of the root process of the graphics session.
    - tracker1 7y ago
      switched over to KDE after writing that... will see if it's still an issue in a day or two.
thayne 7y ago
Really? Do you have a source for that? (I'm not doubting you, I just haven't heard anything about that, and would be very happy if this is true).
- haunter 7y ago
  https://lists.ubuntu.com/archives/kernel-team/2020-February/107227.html https://lists.ubuntu.com/archives/kernel-team/2020-February/...
  - thayne 7y ago
    Sorry, I meant the part about backporting wireguard. I did find a phoronix article on it: https://www.phoronix.com/scan.php?page=news_item&px=Ubuntu-20.04-Adds-WireGuard https://www.phoronix.com/scan.php?page=news_item&px=Ubuntu-2...
- pkaye 7y ago
  https://www.phoronix.com/scan.php?page=news_item&px=Ubuntu-20.04-Adds-WireGuard https://www.phoronix.com/scan.php?page=news_item&px=Ubuntu-2... is one source but I remember seeing it elsewhere.

thayne 7y ago

After ubuntu 20.10 is released 20.04 will probably get a later version of the kernel in the linux-hwe package

gchamonlive 7y ago

any reason for choosing ubuntu over arch for personal computers? Or any rolling release distro for that matter

mehrdadn 7y ago
Python packages don't install on /usr/local on Arch which makes it easy to wreck your installation, many projects and scripts out there only support Ubuntu and not Arch, etc. And I say this as an Arch fan who would rather avoid Ubuntu...
- rmdashrfstar 7y ago
  virtualenv?
  - mehrdadn 7y ago
    Before I try to respond, you have to ask yourself: what do you imagine is the reason why Ubuntu folks have gone out of their way to patch Python for /usr/local? Surely it's not out of ignorance for virtualenv?
- gchamonlive 7y ago
  interesting, I never looked where the python aur packages were installed
  - mehrdadn 7y ago
    This isn't AUR-specific, it's an issue that comes up with sudo pip install.
    - gchamonlive 7y ago
      pip with sudo is always discouraged. Did you encounter use cases that absolutely requires you to install packages with `sudo pip`?

Zardoz84 7y ago

Nothing forbides you of installing 5.6 on Ubuntu 20.04 or other older version.