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What good will a superior understanding of gene editing be if we cease being a civilized society where scientific research can be nurtured in the first place? E

What good will a superior understanding of gene editing be if we cease being a civilized society where scientific research can be nurtured in the first place? Ethics are not optional to science, they are integral to the social foundation upon which science rests.

Fishysoup 7y ago
I get the feeling OP is saying this sarcastically, as a way to criticize China.
shrimp_emoji 7y ago
Ethics (e.g., scruples against fabricating research for personal gain) are actually what keeps Western science a cut above Eastern science. Obviously, though, ethics aren't a binary concept; you can value eugenics at the expense of suffering and be committed to the quality of your research. And good science knows no politics. People do, though, and they're the scientists.
- hatracksat 7y ago
  Reproducibility and a lack of corruption are what elevates western science. Ethics are a handicap with good intentions, that's fine but it needs to be acknowledged because a proton doesn't care that it's in a bomb and a cell doesn't care about medical board reviews. China is working to reduce corruption enough to compete in terms of learning outcomes and eventually they'll likely succeed because they've demonstrated a willingness to escalate tactics until the desired outcome is achieved. Whether it's two decades from now or four, eventually the difference will be that they have a backlog of 'evil' experimental data plus the West's (because western academics favor easy sharing over most things). The social implications we normally talk about creating backlash aren't a reliable safeguard here because the mainland Chinese are, at large, content with their country and the progress it's making. The Chinese mainstream isn't Hong Kong or Taiwan, it's the mainlanders who have very different values than many westerners and who aren't likely to care if the result is better medicines or being the first to have access to novel gene edited medicines.
amelius 7y ago
Yes, standing on the shoulders of giants is ok ... but behave while doing so.
manicdee 7y ago
Would you agree that China sees eye to eye with the West regarding other ethical concerns such as copyright, patents, organ transplants, or genocide?

Fishysoup 7y ago

I get the feeling OP is saying this sarcastically, as a way to criticize China.

shrimp_emoji 7y ago

Ethics (e.g., scruples against fabricating research for personal gain) are actually what keeps Western science a cut above Eastern science. Obviously, though, ethics aren't a binary concept; you can value eugenics at the expense of suffering and be committed to the quality of your research. And good science knows no politics. People do, though, and they're the scientists.

hatracksat 7y ago
Reproducibility and a lack of corruption are what elevates western science. Ethics are a handicap with good intentions, that's fine but it needs to be acknowledged because a proton doesn't care that it's in a bomb and a cell doesn't care about medical board reviews. China is working to reduce corruption enough to compete in terms of learning outcomes and eventually they'll likely succeed because they've demonstrated a willingness to escalate tactics until the desired outcome is achieved. Whether it's two decades from now or four, eventually the difference will be that they have a backlog of 'evil' experimental data plus the West's (because western academics favor easy sharing over most things). The social implications we normally talk about creating backlash aren't a reliable safeguard here because the mainland Chinese are, at large, content with their country and the progress it's making. The Chinese mainstream isn't Hong Kong or Taiwan, it's the mainlanders who have very different values than many westerners and who aren't likely to care if the result is better medicines or being the first to have access to novel gene edited medicines.

amelius 7y ago

Yes, standing on the shoulders of giants is ok ... but behave while doing so.

manicdee 7y ago

Would you agree that China sees eye to eye with the West regarding other ethical concerns such as copyright, patents, organ transplants, or genocide?