13 ms·

RxBar co-founder Peter Rahal on life after becoming a millionaire

264 points by neha_t 7y ago

qes 7y ago
Oh boo hoo. Multiple-hundred millionaire is lonely and doesn't know how to define himself. Cry me a river.
- dang 7y ago
  Ok, but please don't post unsubstantive comments here; especially not ragey ones or shallow dismissals. That only poisons the thread and makes this place even worse. https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html
alexandernst 7y ago
You write post on medium.
compiler-guy 7y ago
Actually getting the money itself in reality did happen overnight, but the setup took him years and thousands of hours of work and much blood sweat and tears. This isn't so much about what happens when you become rich quickly, as "What happens when you achieve your goal?"
- mfoy_ 7y ago
  Well, yes and no, the article does grapple with the issues of becoming rich. So... both things can be true.
  - mfoy_ 7y ago
    For whoever down-voted this: Finding a spouse is not specifically challenging due to having achieved your goals... it is, however, coloured by money. "Is she only dating me for my wealth?" is not something that occurs to someone who does not have wealth but has achieved their goals.
- ryanmarsh 7y ago
  It's like the reverse of the Hemingway quote: "How did you go bankrupt?" "Two ways. Gradually, then suddenly."
- jeron 7y ago
  apparently to this guy, it means once you achieve your goal you manually carry groceries, start intermittent fasting, and switching between first class and coach
- MrMember 7y ago
  Based on the title I was expecting something akin to winning the lottery. Working 15 hour days for years to build a successful company from the ground up and selling it isn't what I think of when I think "overnight millionaire."
- _bxg1 7y ago
  What I'm discovering in my own life is that goals are inherently unsatisfying. What's satisfying is living well, not in terms of a goalpost you've passed but in terms of an undulating way of existing in the world. Goals serve a purpose (heh), but they will never bring you happiness.
- tempsy 7y ago
  I mean, going from 0 to $600M in a couple years may as well be overnight.
ocfnash 7y ago
According to Chekhov: "One is shy of asking men under sentence what they have been sentenced for; and in the same way it is awkward to ask very rich people what they want so much money for, why they make such a poor use of their wealth, why they don't give it up, even when they see in it their unhappiness"
- iandanforth 7y ago
  This. The trivial answer to 'reintroducing struggle' isn't even discussed.
  - x0ner 7y ago
    “That’s one of the problems he seems to be grappling with: more money, generally, means less struggle, and if it’s struggle that made him, how does he find that going forward?”
    - klipt 7y ago
      Money only removes some struggles. As Steve Jobs found, even ridiculous money won't prevent you from struggling if you have terminal cancer.
      - gdix 7y ago
        Solution for Peter Rahal: get cancer.
        klipt 7y ago
        Maybe then he'd plow his money into something useful like cancer research. Of course, even better if he puts his money to a good cause without getting cancer.
        pembrook 7y ago
        By simply reinvesting his money into the economy via stocks and bonds he is contributing the making the world a better place. Market economics has been lifting the world's humans out of poverty at an alarmingly fast rate since 2000. You'll never hear about this in the news of course.
danielovichdk 7y ago
These types of young people have no class, no style and no real dreams to follow - other than making money. Because someone makes money does not make then interesting to read about. This is a perfect example
- mogadsheu 7y ago
  The guy built a brand around a growing lifestyle and changed the way products are communicated. His impact on packaging is present all over the place if you look. He’s just looking for his next calling. I thought it was interesting read, but it’s a story without a resolution yet.
- iamthirsty 7y ago
  You say that they have no class, no style, and no dreams, however you don't really have much to go off to make such definite generalized statements about a whole class of people. Seems more like you created an emotional image about a group you don't like and this is the conclusion that would produce.
  - mike00632 7y ago
    He has eating utensils made of gold.
    - solotronics 7y ago
      I mean... there is a chance he got them ironically.
      - matthewsmith_io 7y ago
        (◔_◔)
      - OrangeMango 7y ago
        > I mean... there is a chance he got them ironically. Sure, I see where you're going with that. Miami, a fully-furnished house that is expensive for the sake of being expensive, filled with items that can be converted to clean, legal cash with minimum overhead once the home is purchased. The irony is that a home intended for money laundering was bought by a guy that got boatloads of clean cash dumped on his head, wondering what to do with it all.
ericmcer 7y ago
It is interesting that creating a healthy bar with 'No B.S.' seemed to be motivated entirely by money, no idealism, no concern for public health, etc. He was totally willing to sell to a massive corporation that will almost certainly dilute his product to save cash and his main concern around that seemed to be 'but what will I do now?'. Maybe his life doesn't seem empty now that he has money, maybe it has always been empty.
- sudhirj 7y ago
  That seems like a partial mis-characterization - he did insist that the buyer keep the company as an independent unit and retain all the employees, which is about as much as you can do when you’re selling. And he was likely tired and burning out as well - better to sell than run it to the ground or wait till someone else kills you off. That said, he does seem to have been hustling from a young age, so why not? Could have just as easily been a new department store chain or movie theatre chain that he started instead, and we wouldn’t think he had “no idealism, no concern for public health”. Why the negativity for a food company?
  - agota 7y ago
    >Why the negativity for a food company? Presumably because a food company has direct effect on the health of a person consuming the product.
    - sudhirj 7y ago
      But all points seem to indicate that the food was good and clean, and he went through great trouble to keep it that way. But why is someone making food more obligated to continue doing so than someone making non-food?
- p_roz 7y ago
  His selfish motives resulted in a new product that many people seem to like. I think it’s amazing that we have a system that can harness his ambition, benefitting both him and the consumers of his product.
tekkk 7y ago
I did not expect to read the whole thing through but I guess I just did. It's fascinating the inner struggle of someone so successful yet who still feels the need to find something bigger to accomplish, a higher mountain to climb. I feel for him, since life is not easy for most of us and he purposefully tries to make it harder for him. But I also think, that the meaning he so desperately wants can come from other things than just building bigger companies with bigger stakes. There's always a bigger stage play, a bigger house to build or company to create. For me art is quite enjoyable, as there are no specific limits to your proficiency or rules to play by (well there are some very good guidelines). It just is what it is to amuse you, make the time go a little faster and perhaps amuse other people too. Or friends, children and family in general, relationships that aren't bound by status or money but by mutual enjoyment of each other's company. Maybe what Peter needs to do is just go away for a while and travel the world, and find out what it actually means to be human in broader sense. Just put everything on hold and go somewhere, with a fake name if you must and just hang out with random people and experience their reality for a while. It isn't the end-goal to have "made something" but the trip to get there, even if it sounds like a cliche. I'm sure he could too find something satisfying that isn't just building companies. Or maybe I'm wrong, as I've never met the guy and don't know him personally. And building a more meaningful and successful company must sound like fun too. It's just that is not all that there is.
- codesushi42 7y ago
  That is what makes ambitious people successful. They always want more and never stop wanting more. Those who are content with settling don't have the drive to make it.
  - Retric 7y ago
    I think HK Rowling is a solid counter to that argument. Success is far more about leverage than drive. Drive is still extremely useful, just not the root cause for success.
    - ska 7y ago
      Two points perhaps worth considering: 1) Defining "success" as "made a ton of money" is reductive and probably not very useful 2) Many (most?) successful people are ambitious, but lots of ambitious people do not succeed, at least by their own standards
bryanmgreen 7y ago
Seems like this individual is in need of a re-branding as much as the re-branding that turned RX Bar from a soulless company into a raging success. (Shoutout to The McQuades and Scott & Victor for their incredible brand and package design work. http://www.themcquades.com/rx-bar http://www.themcquades.com/rx-bar)
- programbreeding 7y ago
  I was looking at that packaging last week at the store and was impressed by it. Although I became fixated on them putting "No B.S." rather than "0 B.S." It seemed more natural to me to say 0 considering the rest of the design. It made me wonder if that's something that they tested and there's a consumer-related reason they went with "No," or if there was a product-labeling regulation that prevented it. And then I realized I was spending too much time staring at an endcap in the grocery store and I needed to move on.
  - bryanmgreen 7y ago
    Based on my experience as a designer, I would say that idea was to separate "BS" from the ingredients and make the phrase more impactful. "No B.S" also works as a tagline in a way that "0 B.S." doesn't
  - Konnstann 7y ago
    That was exactly my thought after reading the article. I'm always wondering whether subtle differences in how I would have done something are meaningless, or due to my lack of understanding of whatever it is I'm looking at (in this case advertising).
  - pbhjpbhj 7y ago
    "what's OBS?" {moves gaze to next product}
celticmusic 7y ago
This marketing team needs to step up their game, I only had to scroll for 30 seconds to get past the header. Best practice says if I'm not scrolling for a minimum of 3 minutes, I'm going to leave their site too soon.
- nknealk 7y ago
  I double plus appreciated the giant footer telling me to sign in with facebook or google. Even though the header also has a signin link.
refurb 7y ago
Interesting read. Not that it matters, but I hate the consistency of those bars. It’s like eating a bunch of taffy. I always wonder if I’m missing fillings after.
- jeron 7y ago
  thoughts on it vs clif bar?
  - refurb 7y ago
    I prefer Cliff bar overall, but the Rx bar isn’t bad at all. Seems healthier (more protein than Cliff), but the texture is hard to get used to.
  - maximente 7y ago
    i think cliff bars have way more ingredients (not necessarily bad ones) and more sugar. i think rxbar appeals to the "food as fuel" crowd. there is a continuum there from those who don't want to think about healthy stuff, just get quality calories in (think soylent and/or more healthier home stuff, "rations" types who cook 15 meals at once, etc.) to those who want to signal that they are willing to eat gross stuff to look good or hit fitness goals, and lots in between. cliff bars i think are more acceptable taste but don't really have a niche - too much sugar to eat if you want low % body fat, too many carbs generally, but decent to throw in a bag if you don't want to eat some uber-processed alternative like whatever cereal bars normally have
justboxing 7y ago
The story holds it's own, and doesn't really need the "Overnight Millionaire" click bait. Also, > He and a buddy from elementary school started RxBar in 2012... By the time RxBar became a business with revenues north of $100 million, with virtually no outside investment, Rahal was grinding at it from 7 a.m. to 10 p.m daily. This is anything but "overnight". Reminds me of the "overnight success" quotes in many forms, but recently from Shopify founder. > It took about 10 years' time for Shopify to be an overnight success. - Tobias Lutke
- tempsy 7y ago
  He went from nothing to $600M in 5 years. It isn't "technically" overnight but 5 years is not that long. And the 7-10 grind was probably only true of year 0-1. RxBar got a lot of traction well before they were sold, and so to believe he was grinding for the entire 5 years in the same way he was in the basement when they first started is a bit naive. Worse than "overnight millionaire" porn is "hustle" porn. The truth is for businesses that are fortunate to find product market fit the market carries you more than anything you've personally done.
  - soneca 7y ago
    > "RxBar got a lot of traction well before they were sold, and so to believe he was grinding for the entire 5 years in the same way he was in the basement when they first started is a bit naive" I would have the opposite perception. That it is naive of your part assuming that once a business gets good traction that its founders start working less hours.
    - tempsy 7y ago
      If they kept working the same hours as when they just start up then it's because they want to and not because they need to. Your sales figures once you achieve product market fit is not a function of how many hours you can work in a day.
      - pathseeker 7y ago
theNJR 7y ago
As the former CMO of Quest Nutrition, which just sold for $1b, I have many thoughts. I'll have to come back to this.
- mogadsheu 7y ago
  Would love to hear them, I cofounded a children’s nutrition company here in the Bay!
jedberg 7y ago
This is the embodiment of "money doesn't buy happiness". If your only life goal is the acquisition of money, then you get stuck once you achieve your goal.
motohagiography 7y ago
Just means you are responsible for deploying more liquid capital into productive assets. Have fun finding those. If you are creative and a builder, the people who made you what you are were the ones who told you "no," and now there are a lot fewer of those once they think you have money. Barring a few quality of life things and some freedom, the rest is just symbols and artifacts. That bit about finding a woman who will love him for who he is inside and not for his money is silly. In case he hasn't noticed, who he is inside is also now richer than croesus as well. Very simply, the money event was a huge recent peak experience that totally re-based his identity, and until he either recognizes it again as external, or accumulates newer more intense experiences to offset it, he's going to struggle with accepting it and finding a personal equilibrium again. If he wants a partner to validate that he is more than his money, he's starting from a dangerously flawed premise. If he takes responsibility for himself and his identity and doesn't outsource his self worth to a partner/family, he'll be fine. Otherwise, he should just put up a dating profile that says, "millionaire seeks emotional hostage for codependent death spiral." I'm a fan of Epictetus on that one, who essentially rephrases it so that things are not yours, they are things you relate to. e.g. the family I have, support, love etc, instead of "my family." It's not "my money," because it's not essential to who he is, it's "the money I have." I'd say if he's looking for someone to complete and validate his essential idea of himself "without the money," he doesn't have a sufficiently complete sense of self yet to share. He'll probably be cooler after 40. Anyway, good luck to anyone who ends up in this situation. It's rare and a huge distraction from more basic human needs that might have still needed work before the event. I like to think I would make a very good rich person, but mostly because it sounds like an interesting job.
- dangus 7y ago
  I think the whole thing boils down to the idea that, someone who manages to make this much money on pure ambition, hard work, and yes, a decent amount of luck and being in the right place in the right time - well, they’re not likely to be able to enjoy this amount of wealth. They ground it out in a way that I can’t even imagine having the energy to do. I’m a relatively lazy 9-5er who basically refuses to work past 5:01 PM unless there’s a pants on fire emergency. If I had 600 million dollars, that’s it. I’d never work again. It’s really that simple. I would sleep just fine knowing that I have already completed my life’s task of providing for myself and my family. I’d be basically doing what the old dude on the Netflix original “Samurai Gourmet” is doing. Walking around finding the next place to eat lunch and solving minor conflicts in between food porn segments. Or just taking up whatever hobby I want, traveling the world like MySpace Tom.
maliker 7y ago
You put it in an index fund and get back to work?
refurb 7y ago
Interesting story. He really did become a millionaire overnight, it was a lump sum payout with no obligation to work for the acquiring company. Different than other founders where you get stock in the acquiring company and you’re locked up for 2 years. You get to watch your potential payout oscillate in value all the while working for a big Corp.
- giarc 7y ago
  In most of the stories I've read where the founder is required to stay on, they typically have very little duties or responsibilities. Often it seems like the "show up at 11 and leave by 2" type situations.
  - refurb 7y ago
    Agreed, but even with the minimal responsibilities, it’s a burden to founders because they can’t do anything else (non-competes).
    - poseidonist 7y ago
      Boo hoo. The people who got them to the point of selling still have to show up and actually do real work.
    - deleted 7y ago
      [deleted]
steve_adams_86 7y ago
I wonder if he struggles with these underlying things not because of the money but because of his own grappling with his success and identity. The money makes these things louder because he 'made it' yet nothing is better. I grew up on the 'stupid list' too (I was the only kid who made it on there one year), and like him, I suffer from ADHD. Growing up as the idiot does serious damage, and it drives you to succeed like no other sometimes. The trouble is you can convince others that you're capable, you can be admired for how far you've ascended from the stupid list, but at the end of the day you're still wired to feel like nothing is ever enough. You're still the kid on the list. No girlfriend or boyfriend fixes that. No amount of money fixes that. I hope that's not the case - I hope he finds something to do that brings him a lot of joy. Apart from the money though, all of this seems fairly relatable to me. I don't think external validation is the answer to these kinds of feelings.
- christiansakai 7y ago
  This hits too close too home :(
dvt 7y ago
I don't like articles like this for two reasons: (1) they trivialize actually building a company, growing it, and selling it, and (2), they provide comfort for those that don't have the drive/luck/privilege of getting there by arguing that "hey, money doesn't make you happy!" First of all, as others mention in the thread, this is hardly an example of an "overnight success" -- there are no such examples, barring a few extreme outliers. Not only do the great majority of startups fail, the great majority of successes grind for years and years before seeing the light at the end of the tunnel. It's not like some dream-land utopia. If you're like me (and I think most HN'ers are), you continue building stuff in spite of the overwhelming odds. That's the real lesson here. Trying, failing, trying, failing, and doing this over and over, even though expecting a different outcome is technically insanity. Secondly, the adage of "money doesn't bring happiness" is obvious to anyone that's not young or incredibly naive. We get it -- money is not the end-all of life (duh). But at the same time, can we not kid ourselves? Money makes life much easier than the alternative. Anyone that grew up poor and achieved some modicum of success (I grew up in essential poverty in a third world country; now I make a "modest" six figure salary and live in Los Angeles) realizes this. I'm reminded of a (2008 crash) documentary I saw years ago where a banker says: "I grew up poor, and now I'm rich; trust me, I'd rather be rich."
- tachyonbeam 7y ago
  Agreed. I also grew up poor and now live comfortably. Having my own place with no roommates (or mentally ill family members screaming at me) brings me a lot of peace. Being able to just uber somewhere when I have an appointment but feel too tired to take public transit for 45 minutes makes my life easier. There are a lot of problems in life that you can make disappear (or simplify a lot) by throwing a little money at them. You can remove a lot of stress factors. Money gives you more freedom to choose what you want your life to be like. The flipside is that I know very well that, if I'm in an anxious mindset, my brain will find things to worry and be unhappy about. I know being a multi-millionaire wouldn't bring me bliss, but... Being able to work on my own projects, as much as I want, whenever I want. That would be fucking awesome.
  - hef19898 7y ago
igammarays 7y ago
"It is a truth universally acknowledged, that a single man in possession of a good fortune, must be in want of a wife."
lacker 7y ago
In tech it's pretty rare to become a millionare overnight. You can go overnight between each of these phases: Phase 1: You are making very little money. You are excited when there is free pizza at an event, because you got a free dinner. Phase 2: You are making a decent salary, enough to survive quite comfortably, even in a pretty expensive location. In tech, often this salary is enough to make you a millionaire if you just invest it conservatively and wait a decade. Phase 3: You are still making that decent salary, but now you are also a millionaire on paper. Your stock is worth millions of dollars, but that isn't directly relevant to your daily life. Phase 4: You have millions of dollars in liquid assets. I have worked with a number of people who have gone through each of these phase changes. In my experience, going from phase 1 to 2 is by far the biggest change. After that, things just don't change immediately. You might move to a nicer place to live, or have enough money to become an investor or leave the conventional career track, but those things happen slowly.
- fuddle 7y ago
  Very well put.
sharadov 7y ago
A poor little rich boy is all I can say! If he is feeling so unchallenged and wants "skin in the game" then give away all your money and start again. But he won't, no one can, once you've got a taste for the good life.. Btw, the RX bar tastes awful.
- Invictus0 7y ago
  My theory is that the people buying the energy bars prefer that they taste like shit to make themselves feel more hardcore about whatever dieting philosophy du jour they abide by.
  - misiti3780 7y ago
    they are a good snack right before you lift weights ... they do taste like shit but who cares
    - solotronics 7y ago
      Business idea: rX bar that doesnt taste like shit.
      - umeshunni 7y ago
        Most of those involve adding copious amounts of sugar to make the bars taste bearable. This, of course, has other health negatives. I've seen protein bars with 50+ grams of sugar in them!
        urban_strike 7y ago
        I mean, RxBars are full of dates, which are basically pure sugar.
      - mywittyname 7y ago
        Cut out three of the ingredients from each bar. 4 Cashews, No BS 1 Egg, No BS 2 Dates, No BS
throw03172019 7y ago
How common are acquisitions without any earn out periods?
indigodaddy 7y ago
General question, not a business person: Where does existing cash in the bank go upon an acquisition? To the seller, buyer, or something that is generally negotiated?
- refurb 7y ago
  Existing cash goes to the buyer, but it’s fully accounted for, so the seller gets it in the end. I.e. company is worth $600M including $50M cash on hand. Seller gets $600M.
  - ralmeida 7y ago
    Yes - another way to look at it is that liquid cash in company's bank accounts is an asset of the company and the company valuation "includes" it.
    - indigodaddy 7y ago
      Thanks, guys, appreciate the explanations!
DubiousPusher 7y ago
If this article was trying to depict this man as thuroughl vain and void of humanity it could not have done a better job. He moved to Miami Beach to avoid paying taxes? This hundreds of millionaire couldn't just move to a place he liked because he was worried about his marginal tax rate? He bought a house that's empty and has accoutrements for a lifestyle he doesn't have or plan to have. This is a person buying something that looks like what other rich people by because it's what he's supposed to do. He's succeed and now is not just overwhelmed by the opportunities he can tackle but is paralyzed by a lack of struggle. I see these articles over and over again about entrepreneurs and what they show me is that many are not successful because they are imaginative people full of passion and ideas. Rather they are like robots who can see and optimize some little piece of the economy. And by and large they never tire of working at their own little corner. They are different from normal people not in their vision but because they do not tire of bulldoging one very tiny little thing. I know that's not all entrepreneurs but there are so many profiles like this and they do not make me empathize with these people. They send a shiver down my spine.
- agota 7y ago
  I think you do have a point about him trying to buy what you are "supposed" to buy once you are wealthy. However, I think that your robot criticism of entrepreneurs is unfair. Street sweepers, cashiers at a grocery store, McDonald's employees are doing work that is way more repetitive than what an average entrepreneur does, yet you wouldn't call them robot-like, would you?
  - DubiousPusher 7y ago
    When I say robotic I'm not referring to the reptitiveness of the work. I'm talking about the singularity of focus and mind founders often posses for things that are utterly mundane. Making an energy bar is surely exciting at first. Creating recipes, working out deals to sell them, building a brand. But at a certain point your energy bar is about as good as any other. And it tastes as good as any other. And your branding is as good as any other. And the only thing that really differentiates you is how well you can wedge your prybar into the market. That work is really mundane but there is a type of person that thrives doing that. I've known a few people in this situation and many of them are like this guy. When the struggle is over, the mission is achieved and they just kind of shut down. They've spent so much time obsessing over how to sell a freaking energy bar that they've never developed themselves or their passion.
notadoc 7y ago
> Before the Kellogg deal was finalized and he was about to suddenly become very rich, Rahal got worried. “Can I seriously find someone who’s going to love me without the money?” This seems like an easy thought exercise to work through. If you're rich enough to worry about being loved for your money, then you're probably rich enough to have a second modest existence to date from (modest apartment, car, etc). So, don't show any sign of wealth to people you date, until after you're already in love. If they love you for you, they'll love you regardless of your circumstance, no?
- InterimNew 7y ago
  You'd also have to go by a pseudonym or a perspective partner might google you and ruin the whole charade. At that point your behavior is fairly duplicitous, which is hardly a solid foundation for one of the most meaningful relationships of your life.
- agota 7y ago
  I don't know if I'd be impressed if a guy did this. In theory, this sounds like a fairytale, an ordinary guy turns out to be a multi-millionaire. In practice, this means that he lied to my face the entire time, presumably got his family and friends to lie to me as well, because apparently the entire time we were dating he thought that I might be a gold digger? Creating an entire separate identity because of your gold digger paranoia doesn't seem like a healthy behavior.
  - monort 7y ago
    Do you ask all your dates for net worth? I never had this question asked, so I can imagine doing this without lying.
    - agota 7y ago
      Okay, so, realistically, if the guy in the article wants a woman to be in the dark as to what his net worth is, he'd need to: 1. Use a fake name. 2. Create a fake story as to what he's been up to for the last five years professionally. 3. Get an ordinary apartment, car, clothes, etc. all for the purpose of appearing to have regular income. 4. Get his friends to support his fake name, fake life, fake career story, etc. 5. Get his family to support his fake name, fake life, fake career story, etc. You don't think all that counts as lying?
Peter_Smith 7y ago
paywall
zackmorris 7y ago
Anyone out there achieve fsck you money? I have been between gigs this summer and brainstorming inventions. I seem to come up with one or two a week, but have only written down the most viable ones, so have maybe 20 or so that could provide FU money to someone, if a way could be found to manufacture them. To be completely honest, this is why I find stories like this a bit disheartening. I'm happy for anyone that wins a large amount of money in the internet lottery, but I worry that countless other people will never have a chance to make it because they're too busy making rent each month. If I had anything above the amount of money it would take to retire (roughly $2-5 million), the rest would go to grants and setting up inventor think tanks. I know that number varies, and mine might even be low (I live in the northwest), but surely everyone has considered a number of their own. If you made it and are interested in funding inventors, open source projects, things of that nature, it would be great to hear your thoughts on being a benefactor for people who maybe aren't great at business but whose ideas could potentially change the world. Even anonymous replies would be a great resource for how to think about connecting philanthropists with makers.
poseidonist 7y ago
If he's miserable he can always give it away. Oh no? Won't do that. Then shut up you incredibly entitled whiny jerk.
- dang 7y ago
  We've banned this account for breaking the site guidelines. Would you please not create accounts to do that with? https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html

264 points by neha_t 7y ago

qes 7y ago

Oh boo hoo. Multiple-hundred millionaire is lonely and doesn't know how to define himself. Cry me a river.

dang 7y ago
Ok, but please don't post unsubstantive comments here; especially not ragey ones or shallow dismissals. That only poisons the thread and makes this place even worse. https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html

alexandernst 7y ago

You write post on medium.

compiler-guy 7y ago

Actually getting the money itself in reality did happen overnight, but the setup took him years and thousands of hours of work and much blood sweat and tears. This isn't so much about what happens when you become rich quickly, as "What happens when you achieve your goal?"

mfoy_ 7y ago
Well, yes and no, the article does grapple with the issues of becoming rich. So... both things can be true.
- mfoy_ 7y ago
  For whoever down-voted this: Finding a spouse is not specifically challenging due to having achieved your goals... it is, however, coloured by money. "Is she only dating me for my wealth?" is not something that occurs to someone who does not have wealth but has achieved their goals.
ryanmarsh 7y ago
It's like the reverse of the Hemingway quote: "How did you go bankrupt?" "Two ways. Gradually, then suddenly."
jeron 7y ago
apparently to this guy, it means once you achieve your goal you manually carry groceries, start intermittent fasting, and switching between first class and coach
MrMember 7y ago
Based on the title I was expecting something akin to winning the lottery. Working 15 hour days for years to build a successful company from the ground up and selling it isn't what I think of when I think "overnight millionaire."
_bxg1 7y ago
What I'm discovering in my own life is that goals are inherently unsatisfying. What's satisfying is living well, not in terms of a goalpost you've passed but in terms of an undulating way of existing in the world. Goals serve a purpose (heh), but they will never bring you happiness.
tempsy 7y ago
I mean, going from 0 to $600M in a couple years may as well be overnight.

ocfnash 7y ago

According to Chekhov: "One is shy of asking men under sentence what they have been sentenced for; and in the same way it is awkward to ask very rich people what they want so much money for, why they make such a poor use of their wealth, why they don't give it up, even when they see in it their unhappiness"

iandanforth 7y ago
This. The trivial answer to 'reintroducing struggle' isn't even discussed.
- x0ner 7y ago
  “That’s one of the problems he seems to be grappling with: more money, generally, means less struggle, and if it’s struggle that made him, how does he find that going forward?”
  - klipt 7y ago
    Money only removes some struggles. As Steve Jobs found, even ridiculous money won't prevent you from struggling if you have terminal cancer.
    - gdix 7y ago
      Solution for Peter Rahal: get cancer.
      - klipt 7y ago
        Maybe then he'd plow his money into something useful like cancer research. Of course, even better if he puts his money to a good cause without getting cancer.
        pembrook 7y ago
        By simply reinvesting his money into the economy via stocks and bonds he is contributing the making the world a better place. Market economics has been lifting the world's humans out of poverty at an alarmingly fast rate since 2000. You'll never hear about this in the news of course.

danielovichdk 7y ago

These types of young people have no class, no style and no real dreams to follow - other than making money. Because someone makes money does not make then interesting to read about. This is a perfect example

mogadsheu 7y ago
The guy built a brand around a growing lifestyle and changed the way products are communicated. His impact on packaging is present all over the place if you look. He’s just looking for his next calling. I thought it was interesting read, but it’s a story without a resolution yet.
iamthirsty 7y ago
You say that they have no class, no style, and no dreams, however you don't really have much to go off to make such definite generalized statements about a whole class of people. Seems more like you created an emotional image about a group you don't like and this is the conclusion that would produce.
- mike00632 7y ago
  He has eating utensils made of gold.
  - solotronics 7y ago
    I mean... there is a chance he got them ironically.
    - matthewsmith_io 7y ago
      (◔_◔)
    - OrangeMango 7y ago
      > I mean... there is a chance he got them ironically. Sure, I see where you're going with that. Miami, a fully-furnished house that is expensive for the sake of being expensive, filled with items that can be converted to clean, legal cash with minimum overhead once the home is purchased. The irony is that a home intended for money laundering was bought by a guy that got boatloads of clean cash dumped on his head, wondering what to do with it all.

ericmcer 7y ago

It is interesting that creating a healthy bar with 'No B.S.' seemed to be motivated entirely by money, no idealism, no concern for public health, etc. He was totally willing to sell to a massive corporation that will almost certainly dilute his product to save cash and his main concern around that seemed to be 'but what will I do now?'. Maybe his life doesn't seem empty now that he has money, maybe it has always been empty.

sudhirj 7y ago
That seems like a partial mis-characterization - he did insist that the buyer keep the company as an independent unit and retain all the employees, which is about as much as you can do when you’re selling. And he was likely tired and burning out as well - better to sell than run it to the ground or wait till someone else kills you off. That said, he does seem to have been hustling from a young age, so why not? Could have just as easily been a new department store chain or movie theatre chain that he started instead, and we wouldn’t think he had “no idealism, no concern for public health”. Why the negativity for a food company?
- agota 7y ago
  >Why the negativity for a food company? Presumably because a food company has direct effect on the health of a person consuming the product.
  - sudhirj 7y ago
    But all points seem to indicate that the food was good and clean, and he went through great trouble to keep it that way. But why is someone making food more obligated to continue doing so than someone making non-food?
p_roz 7y ago
His selfish motives resulted in a new product that many people seem to like. I think it’s amazing that we have a system that can harness his ambition, benefitting both him and the consumers of his product.

tekkk 7y ago

I did not expect to read the whole thing through but I guess I just did. It's fascinating the inner struggle of someone so successful yet who still feels the need to find something bigger to accomplish, a higher mountain to climb. I feel for him, since life is not easy for most of us and he purposefully tries to make it harder for him. But I also think, that the meaning he so desperately wants can come from other things than just building bigger companies with bigger stakes. There's always a bigger stage play, a bigger house to build or company to create. For me art is quite enjoyable, as there are no specific limits to your proficiency or rules to play by (well there are some very good guidelines). It just is what it is to amuse you, make the time go a little faster and perhaps amuse other people too. Or friends, children and family in general, relationships that aren't bound by status or money but by mutual enjoyment of each other's company. Maybe what Peter needs to do is just go away for a while and travel the world, and find out what it actually means to be human in broader sense. Just put everything on hold and go somewhere, with a fake name if you must and just hang out with random people and experience their reality for a while. It isn't the end-goal to have "made something" but the trip to get there, even if it sounds like a cliche. I'm sure he could too find something satisfying that isn't just building companies. Or maybe I'm wrong, as I've never met the guy and don't know him personally. And building a more meaningful and successful company must sound like fun too. It's just that is not all that there is.

codesushi42 7y ago
That is what makes ambitious people successful. They always want more and never stop wanting more. Those who are content with settling don't have the drive to make it.
- Retric 7y ago
  I think HK Rowling is a solid counter to that argument. Success is far more about leverage than drive. Drive is still extremely useful, just not the root cause for success.
  - ska 7y ago
    Two points perhaps worth considering: 1) Defining "success" as "made a ton of money" is reductive and probably not very useful 2) Many (most?) successful people are ambitious, but lots of ambitious people do not succeed, at least by their own standards

bryanmgreen 7y ago

Seems like this individual is in need of a re-branding as much as the re-branding that turned RX Bar from a soulless company into a raging success. (Shoutout to The McQuades and Scott & Victor for their incredible brand and package design work. http://www.themcquades.com/rx-bar http://www.themcquades.com/rx-bar)

programbreeding 7y ago
I was looking at that packaging last week at the store and was impressed by it. Although I became fixated on them putting "No B.S." rather than "0 B.S." It seemed more natural to me to say 0 considering the rest of the design. It made me wonder if that's something that they tested and there's a consumer-related reason they went with "No," or if there was a product-labeling regulation that prevented it. And then I realized I was spending too much time staring at an endcap in the grocery store and I needed to move on.
- bryanmgreen 7y ago
  Based on my experience as a designer, I would say that idea was to separate "BS" from the ingredients and make the phrase more impactful. "No B.S" also works as a tagline in a way that "0 B.S." doesn't
- Konnstann 7y ago
  That was exactly my thought after reading the article. I'm always wondering whether subtle differences in how I would have done something are meaningless, or due to my lack of understanding of whatever it is I'm looking at (in this case advertising).
- pbhjpbhj 7y ago
  "what's OBS?" {moves gaze to next product}

celticmusic 7y ago

This marketing team needs to step up their game, I only had to scroll for 30 seconds to get past the header. Best practice says if I'm not scrolling for a minimum of 3 minutes, I'm going to leave their site too soon.

nknealk 7y ago
I double plus appreciated the giant footer telling me to sign in with facebook or google. Even though the header also has a signin link.

refurb 7y ago

Interesting read. Not that it matters, but I hate the consistency of those bars. It’s like eating a bunch of taffy. I always wonder if I’m missing fillings after.

jeron 7y ago
thoughts on it vs clif bar?
- refurb 7y ago
  I prefer Cliff bar overall, but the Rx bar isn’t bad at all. Seems healthier (more protein than Cliff), but the texture is hard to get used to.
- maximente 7y ago
  i think cliff bars have way more ingredients (not necessarily bad ones) and more sugar. i think rxbar appeals to the "food as fuel" crowd. there is a continuum there from those who don't want to think about healthy stuff, just get quality calories in (think soylent and/or more healthier home stuff, "rations" types who cook 15 meals at once, etc.) to those who want to signal that they are willing to eat gross stuff to look good or hit fitness goals, and lots in between. cliff bars i think are more acceptable taste but don't really have a niche - too much sugar to eat if you want low % body fat, too many carbs generally, but decent to throw in a bag if you don't want to eat some uber-processed alternative like whatever cereal bars normally have

justboxing 7y ago

The story holds it's own, and doesn't really need the "Overnight Millionaire" click bait. Also, > He and a buddy from elementary school started RxBar in 2012... By the time RxBar became a business with revenues north of $100 million, with virtually no outside investment, Rahal was grinding at it from 7 a.m. to 10 p.m daily. This is anything but "overnight". Reminds me of the "overnight success" quotes in many forms, but recently from Shopify founder. > It took about 10 years' time for Shopify to be an overnight success. - Tobias Lutke

tempsy 7y ago
He went from nothing to $600M in 5 years. It isn't "technically" overnight but 5 years is not that long. And the 7-10 grind was probably only true of year 0-1. RxBar got a lot of traction well before they were sold, and so to believe he was grinding for the entire 5 years in the same way he was in the basement when they first started is a bit naive. Worse than "overnight millionaire" porn is "hustle" porn. The truth is for businesses that are fortunate to find product market fit the market carries you more than anything you've personally done.
- soneca 7y ago
  > "RxBar got a lot of traction well before they were sold, and so to believe he was grinding for the entire 5 years in the same way he was in the basement when they first started is a bit naive" I would have the opposite perception. That it is naive of your part assuming that once a business gets good traction that its founders start working less hours.
  - tempsy 7y ago
    If they kept working the same hours as when they just start up then it's because they want to and not because they need to. Your sales figures once you achieve product market fit is not a function of how many hours you can work in a day.
    - pathseeker 7y ago

theNJR 7y ago

As the former CMO of Quest Nutrition, which just sold for $1b, I have many thoughts. I'll have to come back to this.

mogadsheu 7y ago
Would love to hear them, I cofounded a children’s nutrition company here in the Bay!

jedberg 7y ago

This is the embodiment of "money doesn't buy happiness". If your only life goal is the acquisition of money, then you get stuck once you achieve your goal.

motohagiography 7y ago

Just means you are responsible for deploying more liquid capital into productive assets. Have fun finding those. If you are creative and a builder, the people who made you what you are were the ones who told you "no," and now there are a lot fewer of those once they think you have money. Barring a few quality of life things and some freedom, the rest is just symbols and artifacts. That bit about finding a woman who will love him for who he is inside and not for his money is silly. In case he hasn't noticed, who he is inside is also now richer than croesus as well. Very simply, the money event was a huge recent peak experience that totally re-based his identity, and until he either recognizes it again as external, or accumulates newer more intense experiences to offset it, he's going to struggle with accepting it and finding a personal equilibrium again. If he wants a partner to validate that he is more than his money, he's starting from a dangerously flawed premise. If he takes responsibility for himself and his identity and doesn't outsource his self worth to a partner/family, he'll be fine. Otherwise, he should just put up a dating profile that says, "millionaire seeks emotional hostage for codependent death spiral." I'm a fan of Epictetus on that one, who essentially rephrases it so that things are not yours, they are things you relate to. e.g. the family I have, support, love etc, instead of "my family." It's not "my money," because it's not essential to who he is, it's "the money I have." I'd say if he's looking for someone to complete and validate his essential idea of himself "without the money," he doesn't have a sufficiently complete sense of self yet to share. He'll probably be cooler after 40. Anyway, good luck to anyone who ends up in this situation. It's rare and a huge distraction from more basic human needs that might have still needed work before the event. I like to think I would make a very good rich person, but mostly because it sounds like an interesting job.

dangus 7y ago
I think the whole thing boils down to the idea that, someone who manages to make this much money on pure ambition, hard work, and yes, a decent amount of luck and being in the right place in the right time - well, they’re not likely to be able to enjoy this amount of wealth. They ground it out in a way that I can’t even imagine having the energy to do. I’m a relatively lazy 9-5er who basically refuses to work past 5:01 PM unless there’s a pants on fire emergency. If I had 600 million dollars, that’s it. I’d never work again. It’s really that simple. I would sleep just fine knowing that I have already completed my life’s task of providing for myself and my family. I’d be basically doing what the old dude on the Netflix original “Samurai Gourmet” is doing. Walking around finding the next place to eat lunch and solving minor conflicts in between food porn segments. Or just taking up whatever hobby I want, traveling the world like MySpace Tom.

maliker 7y ago

You put it in an index fund and get back to work?

refurb 7y ago

Interesting story. He really did become a millionaire overnight, it was a lump sum payout with no obligation to work for the acquiring company. Different than other founders where you get stock in the acquiring company and you’re locked up for 2 years. You get to watch your potential payout oscillate in value all the while working for a big Corp.

giarc 7y ago
In most of the stories I've read where the founder is required to stay on, they typically have very little duties or responsibilities. Often it seems like the "show up at 11 and leave by 2" type situations.
- refurb 7y ago
  Agreed, but even with the minimal responsibilities, it’s a burden to founders because they can’t do anything else (non-competes).
  - poseidonist 7y ago
    Boo hoo. The people who got them to the point of selling still have to show up and actually do real work.
  - deleted 7y ago
    [deleted]

steve_adams_86 7y ago

I wonder if he struggles with these underlying things not because of the money but because of his own grappling with his success and identity. The money makes these things louder because he 'made it' yet nothing is better. I grew up on the 'stupid list' too (I was the only kid who made it on there one year), and like him, I suffer from ADHD. Growing up as the idiot does serious damage, and it drives you to succeed like no other sometimes. The trouble is you can convince others that you're capable, you can be admired for how far you've ascended from the stupid list, but at the end of the day you're still wired to feel like nothing is ever enough. You're still the kid on the list. No girlfriend or boyfriend fixes that. No amount of money fixes that. I hope that's not the case - I hope he finds something to do that brings him a lot of joy. Apart from the money though, all of this seems fairly relatable to me. I don't think external validation is the answer to these kinds of feelings.

christiansakai 7y ago
This hits too close too home :(

dvt 7y ago

I don't like articles like this for two reasons: (1) they trivialize actually building a company, growing it, and selling it, and (2), they provide comfort for those that don't have the drive/luck/privilege of getting there by arguing that "hey, money doesn't make you happy!" First of all, as others mention in the thread, this is hardly an example of an "overnight success" -- there are no such examples, barring a few extreme outliers. Not only do the great majority of startups fail, the great majority of successes grind for years and years before seeing the light at the end of the tunnel. It's not like some dream-land utopia. If you're like me (and I think most HN'ers are), you continue building stuff in spite of the overwhelming odds. That's the real lesson here. Trying, failing, trying, failing, and doing this over and over, even though expecting a different outcome is technically insanity. Secondly, the adage of "money doesn't bring happiness" is obvious to anyone that's not young or incredibly naive. We get it -- money is not the end-all of life (duh). But at the same time, can we not kid ourselves? Money makes life much easier than the alternative. Anyone that grew up poor and achieved some modicum of success (I grew up in essential poverty in a third world country; now I make a "modest" six figure salary and live in Los Angeles) realizes this. I'm reminded of a (2008 crash) documentary I saw years ago where a banker says: "I grew up poor, and now I'm rich; trust me, I'd rather be rich."

tachyonbeam 7y ago
Agreed. I also grew up poor and now live comfortably. Having my own place with no roommates (or mentally ill family members screaming at me) brings me a lot of peace. Being able to just uber somewhere when I have an appointment but feel too tired to take public transit for 45 minutes makes my life easier. There are a lot of problems in life that you can make disappear (or simplify a lot) by throwing a little money at them. You can remove a lot of stress factors. Money gives you more freedom to choose what you want your life to be like. The flipside is that I know very well that, if I'm in an anxious mindset, my brain will find things to worry and be unhappy about. I know being a multi-millionaire wouldn't bring me bliss, but... Being able to work on my own projects, as much as I want, whenever I want. That would be fucking awesome.
- hef19898 7y ago

igammarays 7y ago

"It is a truth universally acknowledged, that a single man in possession of a good fortune, must be in want of a wife."

lacker 7y ago

In tech it's pretty rare to become a millionare overnight. You can go overnight between each of these phases: Phase 1: You are making very little money. You are excited when there is free pizza at an event, because you got a free dinner. Phase 2: You are making a decent salary, enough to survive quite comfortably, even in a pretty expensive location. In tech, often this salary is enough to make you a millionaire if you just invest it conservatively and wait a decade. Phase 3: You are still making that decent salary, but now you are also a millionaire on paper. Your stock is worth millions of dollars, but that isn't directly relevant to your daily life. Phase 4: You have millions of dollars in liquid assets. I have worked with a number of people who have gone through each of these phase changes. In my experience, going from phase 1 to 2 is by far the biggest change. After that, things just don't change immediately. You might move to a nicer place to live, or have enough money to become an investor or leave the conventional career track, but those things happen slowly.

fuddle 7y ago
Very well put.

sharadov 7y ago

A poor little rich boy is all I can say! If he is feeling so unchallenged and wants "skin in the game" then give away all your money and start again. But he won't, no one can, once you've got a taste for the good life.. Btw, the RX bar tastes awful.

Invictus0 7y ago
My theory is that the people buying the energy bars prefer that they taste like shit to make themselves feel more hardcore about whatever dieting philosophy du jour they abide by.
- misiti3780 7y ago
  they are a good snack right before you lift weights ... they do taste like shit but who cares
  - solotronics 7y ago
    Business idea: rX bar that doesnt taste like shit.
    - umeshunni 7y ago
      Most of those involve adding copious amounts of sugar to make the bars taste bearable. This, of course, has other health negatives. I've seen protein bars with 50+ grams of sugar in them!
      - urban_strike 7y ago
        I mean, RxBars are full of dates, which are basically pure sugar.
    - mywittyname 7y ago
      Cut out three of the ingredients from each bar. 4 Cashews, No BS 1 Egg, No BS 2 Dates, No BS

throw03172019 7y ago

How common are acquisitions without any earn out periods?

indigodaddy 7y ago

General question, not a business person: Where does existing cash in the bank go upon an acquisition? To the seller, buyer, or something that is generally negotiated?

refurb 7y ago
Existing cash goes to the buyer, but it’s fully accounted for, so the seller gets it in the end. I.e. company is worth $600M including $50M cash on hand. Seller gets $600M.
- ralmeida 7y ago
  Yes - another way to look at it is that liquid cash in company's bank accounts is an asset of the company and the company valuation "includes" it.
  - indigodaddy 7y ago
    Thanks, guys, appreciate the explanations!

DubiousPusher 7y ago

If this article was trying to depict this man as thuroughl vain and void of humanity it could not have done a better job. He moved to Miami Beach to avoid paying taxes? This hundreds of millionaire couldn't just move to a place he liked because he was worried about his marginal tax rate? He bought a house that's empty and has accoutrements for a lifestyle he doesn't have or plan to have. This is a person buying something that looks like what other rich people by because it's what he's supposed to do. He's succeed and now is not just overwhelmed by the opportunities he can tackle but is paralyzed by a lack of struggle. I see these articles over and over again about entrepreneurs and what they show me is that many are not successful because they are imaginative people full of passion and ideas. Rather they are like robots who can see and optimize some little piece of the economy. And by and large they never tire of working at their own little corner. They are different from normal people not in their vision but because they do not tire of bulldoging one very tiny little thing. I know that's not all entrepreneurs but there are so many profiles like this and they do not make me empathize with these people. They send a shiver down my spine.

agota 7y ago
I think you do have a point about him trying to buy what you are "supposed" to buy once you are wealthy. However, I think that your robot criticism of entrepreneurs is unfair. Street sweepers, cashiers at a grocery store, McDonald's employees are doing work that is way more repetitive than what an average entrepreneur does, yet you wouldn't call them robot-like, would you?
- DubiousPusher 7y ago
  When I say robotic I'm not referring to the reptitiveness of the work. I'm talking about the singularity of focus and mind founders often posses for things that are utterly mundane. Making an energy bar is surely exciting at first. Creating recipes, working out deals to sell them, building a brand. But at a certain point your energy bar is about as good as any other. And it tastes as good as any other. And your branding is as good as any other. And the only thing that really differentiates you is how well you can wedge your prybar into the market. That work is really mundane but there is a type of person that thrives doing that. I've known a few people in this situation and many of them are like this guy. When the struggle is over, the mission is achieved and they just kind of shut down. They've spent so much time obsessing over how to sell a freaking energy bar that they've never developed themselves or their passion.

notadoc 7y ago

> Before the Kellogg deal was finalized and he was about to suddenly become very rich, Rahal got worried. “Can I seriously find someone who’s going to love me without the money?” This seems like an easy thought exercise to work through. If you're rich enough to worry about being loved for your money, then you're probably rich enough to have a second modest existence to date from (modest apartment, car, etc). So, don't show any sign of wealth to people you date, until after you're already in love. If they love you for you, they'll love you regardless of your circumstance, no?

InterimNew 7y ago
You'd also have to go by a pseudonym or a perspective partner might google you and ruin the whole charade. At that point your behavior is fairly duplicitous, which is hardly a solid foundation for one of the most meaningful relationships of your life.
agota 7y ago
I don't know if I'd be impressed if a guy did this. In theory, this sounds like a fairytale, an ordinary guy turns out to be a multi-millionaire. In practice, this means that he lied to my face the entire time, presumably got his family and friends to lie to me as well, because apparently the entire time we were dating he thought that I might be a gold digger? Creating an entire separate identity because of your gold digger paranoia doesn't seem like a healthy behavior.
- monort 7y ago
  Do you ask all your dates for net worth? I never had this question asked, so I can imagine doing this without lying.
  - agota 7y ago
    Okay, so, realistically, if the guy in the article wants a woman to be in the dark as to what his net worth is, he'd need to: 1. Use a fake name. 2. Create a fake story as to what he's been up to for the last five years professionally. 3. Get an ordinary apartment, car, clothes, etc. all for the purpose of appearing to have regular income. 4. Get his friends to support his fake name, fake life, fake career story, etc. 5. Get his family to support his fake name, fake life, fake career story, etc. You don't think all that counts as lying?

Peter_Smith 7y ago

paywall

zackmorris 7y ago

Anyone out there achieve fsck you money? I have been between gigs this summer and brainstorming inventions. I seem to come up with one or two a week, but have only written down the most viable ones, so have maybe 20 or so that could provide FU money to someone, if a way could be found to manufacture them. To be completely honest, this is why I find stories like this a bit disheartening. I'm happy for anyone that wins a large amount of money in the internet lottery, but I worry that countless other people will never have a chance to make it because they're too busy making rent each month. If I had anything above the amount of money it would take to retire (roughly $2-5 million), the rest would go to grants and setting up inventor think tanks. I know that number varies, and mine might even be low (I live in the northwest), but surely everyone has considered a number of their own. If you made it and are interested in funding inventors, open source projects, things of that nature, it would be great to hear your thoughts on being a benefactor for people who maybe aren't great at business but whose ideas could potentially change the world. Even anonymous replies would be a great resource for how to think about connecting philanthropists with makers.

poseidonist 7y ago

If he's miserable he can always give it away. Oh no? Won't do that. Then shut up you incredibly entitled whiny jerk.

dang 7y ago
We've banned this account for breaking the site guidelines. Would you please not create accounts to do that with? https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html