22 ms·

I feel bad for those people who Paychecks got stolen, I wonder if they'll end up getting that back or did already since it mentioned "briefly pull"... People wh

by Keverw 7y ago

I feel bad for those people who Paychecks got stolen, I wonder if they'll end up getting that back or did already since it mentioned "briefly pull"... People who work paycheck to paycheck probably struggles the most and then overdraft fees, stress, couples often fight over money, etc... So pretty shameful if you are working hard, and stuff like this happens. You feel like you are doing everything right and things still go wrong. Even if they did put it back, still overdraft fees during that time if someone had a check cashed or automatic payment sent due to those funds being removed. I don't know why anyone would think they could get away with a fraud this large. I just think this stuff highlights how outdated the banking system is. I've always hated the idea of checks, I rather the money be gone right away then keeping track of it... Since checks still show on your balance even if not cashed yet. Then checks have your entire account number people could misuse. I have never wrote a check in my life though, but I know my family does for bills but I know more and more places have online bill pay... They trust mailing their entire account info than doing it online. However I feel both banking and the whole social security number thing needs to be rethought. it's insane you use the same number for everything and you pass it around to employers, contracting jobs freelancing or affiliate programs that pay commissions, credit cards, cable company, satellite tv, cell phone, doctors, dentists, etc. Well I know for doctors and stuff they say you can refuse to give it, but pretty sure they'll give you a hassle for exercising your rights. I know a while back there was some dentist storing patient information in a unsecured FTP account.

jhawk28 7y ago
the bank ended up taking the hit and is attempting to get the money back through litigation.
jamesb93 7y ago
It's pretty mental that the US still uses cheques for paying employees. I'm 26 and have never been given a cheque and all payments have been electronic.
- Keverw 7y ago
  Yeah, a lot of places offer direct deposit. Then some employers even offer like some type of prepaid debit cards with your pay loaded on it, I guess for the unbanked.
- slovenlyrobot 7y ago
  I'm 35 (I think!), the last time I received a cheque in the UK was 2001
  - Normal_gaussian 7y ago
    At 25 the only check I receive is worth £24.82 from the second settlement (money held "in case") of a will. I tried getting them to just BACS it like the first settlement... but they won't BACS less than £25 They also refuse cash and donation as a settlement, so in the spirit of the deceased I don't cash it, and a new one arrives every six months. I guess I'll find know the Solicitor has retired when the cheque stops coming...
  - walshemj 7y ago
    I get dividend cheques twice a year from some shares I hold and about four expenses cheques
  - Matthias247 7y ago
    Little bit older. Never in my whole life used a cheque in Germany. Then I moved to canada, and learned it's a common thing here. Salaries are by default paid with cheques, people pay their rent with them, etc. I was genuinely surprised when I opened a bank account and they wanted to give me cheques (and even charge for them!). I however got around using them - things can also be paid electronically by setting up direct deposit. It however always feels like the non-standard way.
- burnte 7y ago
  The vast majority of paychecks are electronic transfers. these weren't physical checks that were stolen, it was a diversion of digital transfers.
redm 7y ago
"Cachet ultimately decided to cancel all of those reversals and absorb that $26 million hit, which it is now trying to recover through the courts." So I don't think anyone is out, right?
- Keverw 7y ago
  Yeah, but wonder if people got any overdraft fees, etc during that time since the money was temporary missing because they expected it to be there for the checks or automatic payments. Usually $35 a pop, so could add up. So your money missing and overdraft fees sounds so devastating. I know a while back the local news was talking about this issue and interviewing workers, and some of them were unsure about their money. but sounds like they got it back at least. So sounds like now just a court battle, but at least the individual workers aren't involved in the nightmare directly it looks anymore. Sounds like it probably was days before putting it back, as they had to call and talk to someone - told them it was a mistake then later yet another disappeared... Then call again, etc... Even a Facebook group was started with many employees who all had the same issue. Here's the clip https://youtu.be/ELZaXpJiMFU https://youtu.be/ELZaXpJiMFU
  - eggpy 7y ago
    Those overdraft fees are absolutely reversible, it's just a pain to contact the bank to have them reversed.
    - Keverw 7y ago
      Yeah, it'd be nice since this became major news nationwide news for banks to forgive any overdraft fees. Probably a bank by bank thing, maybe even case by case thing.
    - anigbrowl 7y ago
      Just make it the company's responsibility to do that on behalf of the people it inconvenienced. Dumping the responsibility for those things on the injured party is fundamentally unethical.
techsupporter 7y ago
> I've always hated the idea of checks, I rather the money be gone right away then keeping track of it... Since checks still show on your balance even if not cashed yet. Then checks have your entire account number people could misuse. I have never wrote a check in my life though, but I know my family does for bills but I know more and more places have online bill pay... They trust mailing their entire account info than doing it online. Your reasoning isn't flawed but one big reason why I still write some checks is this: they're accepted as payment for free by the receiver where most electronic methods are charged. For example, my apartment's management company charges me $12.95 for a one-off direct debit payment, $6.95/payment for an automatic recurring debit payment, $32.50 for a payment made by debit card, or a whopping $109.55 for a payment made by credit card. (This means that the free--or at least "included in my rent"--payment option is for me to write a physical check and put it in the night drop box the day before rent is due and then their employees have to deal with the check, as opposed to the computers handling it all. Since the night drop is right there on my way out the door, the convenience factor is still high for me.) I don't like checks but I flatly refuse to pay money to pay a bill. If I owe you money, you will figure out how to accept it in a way that doesn't cost me more. What I owe is already figured into the balance; charging me more to hand you money is obnoxious. My apartment company isn't the only company like this so I still hand out about 20 checks per year. Fortunately, my credit union gives me one box of checks for free every year and I only use less than one book of them per year so there's no added cost there, too.
- iwasakabukiman 7y ago
  How much is your rent, if you don’t mind my asking? Those fees sound exorbitant. I used to do ACH transfers since those were free at the last place I rented. The management company only charged a $3 debit/credit card fee...
  - techsupporter 7y ago
    My rent is $2,385/month but they are flat fees charged by the electronic payments processor. (I've confirmed with a friend who lives in the same set of apartments but who has rent that is half of mine that the fees she sees online are identical down to the penny.)
hunter2_ 7y ago
> I know a while back there was some dentist storing patient information in a unsecured FTP account. There are thousands, if not millions, of people doing business like this. When I was shopping around for a home mortgage, a broker that I knew by personal family recommendation had me send tax returns to hername@isp and I, figuring that this stuff could land anywhere regardless of whether the broker operates so sadly, applied AES to the PDF and sent it on over, calling by phone to provide the password. I guarantee 99% of her clients don't bother. And I wouldn't be the least bit surprised to learn that she renamed the saved file on her computer to include the password.
- Drdrdrq 7y ago
  Probably doesn't matter now, but including #, %, < and similar characters in password helps with that. :)
wool_gather 7y ago
> Well I know for doctors and stuff they say you can refuse to give it You can refuse to give it to anyone who doesn't need it for tax purposes. Which is almost everyone. But, this is the stupid part, they can refuse to do business with you on that basis.
ajross 7y ago
> I feel bad for those people who Paychecks got stolen Per the article, Cachet Financial Services ended up holding the bag. They tried reversing a bunch of payroll account payments, but ultimately relented. Presumably some of that money will eventually be recovered. > I don't know why anyone would think they could get away with a fraud this large. Given the M.O., it's likely that this started small (as most fraud does). He cheated once with a float to cover a shortfall, then started making larger and larger bets. And eventually he lost a bet too large to cover, and had to try cheating in a different and more dangerous way with money in the payroll account, and got caught.

by Keverw 7y ago

jhawk28 7y ago

the bank ended up taking the hit and is attempting to get the money back through litigation.

jamesb93 7y ago

It's pretty mental that the US still uses cheques for paying employees. I'm 26 and have never been given a cheque and all payments have been electronic.

Keverw 7y ago
Yeah, a lot of places offer direct deposit. Then some employers even offer like some type of prepaid debit cards with your pay loaded on it, I guess for the unbanked.
slovenlyrobot 7y ago
I'm 35 (I think!), the last time I received a cheque in the UK was 2001
- Normal_gaussian 7y ago
  At 25 the only check I receive is worth £24.82 from the second settlement (money held "in case") of a will. I tried getting them to just BACS it like the first settlement... but they won't BACS less than £25 They also refuse cash and donation as a settlement, so in the spirit of the deceased I don't cash it, and a new one arrives every six months. I guess I'll find know the Solicitor has retired when the cheque stops coming...
- walshemj 7y ago
  I get dividend cheques twice a year from some shares I hold and about four expenses cheques
- Matthias247 7y ago
  Little bit older. Never in my whole life used a cheque in Germany. Then I moved to canada, and learned it's a common thing here. Salaries are by default paid with cheques, people pay their rent with them, etc. I was genuinely surprised when I opened a bank account and they wanted to give me cheques (and even charge for them!). I however got around using them - things can also be paid electronically by setting up direct deposit. It however always feels like the non-standard way.
burnte 7y ago
The vast majority of paychecks are electronic transfers. these weren't physical checks that were stolen, it was a diversion of digital transfers.

redm 7y ago

"Cachet ultimately decided to cancel all of those reversals and absorb that $26 million hit, which it is now trying to recover through the courts." So I don't think anyone is out, right?

Keverw 7y ago
Yeah, but wonder if people got any overdraft fees, etc during that time since the money was temporary missing because they expected it to be there for the checks or automatic payments. Usually $35 a pop, so could add up. So your money missing and overdraft fees sounds so devastating. I know a while back the local news was talking about this issue and interviewing workers, and some of them were unsure about their money. but sounds like they got it back at least. So sounds like now just a court battle, but at least the individual workers aren't involved in the nightmare directly it looks anymore. Sounds like it probably was days before putting it back, as they had to call and talk to someone - told them it was a mistake then later yet another disappeared... Then call again, etc... Even a Facebook group was started with many employees who all had the same issue. Here's the clip https://youtu.be/ELZaXpJiMFU https://youtu.be/ELZaXpJiMFU
- eggpy 7y ago
  Those overdraft fees are absolutely reversible, it's just a pain to contact the bank to have them reversed.
  - Keverw 7y ago
    Yeah, it'd be nice since this became major news nationwide news for banks to forgive any overdraft fees. Probably a bank by bank thing, maybe even case by case thing.
  - anigbrowl 7y ago
    Just make it the company's responsibility to do that on behalf of the people it inconvenienced. Dumping the responsibility for those things on the injured party is fundamentally unethical.

techsupporter 7y ago

> I've always hated the idea of checks, I rather the money be gone right away then keeping track of it... Since checks still show on your balance even if not cashed yet. Then checks have your entire account number people could misuse. I have never wrote a check in my life though, but I know my family does for bills but I know more and more places have online bill pay... They trust mailing their entire account info than doing it online. Your reasoning isn't flawed but one big reason why I still write some checks is this: they're accepted as payment for free by the receiver where most electronic methods are charged. For example, my apartment's management company charges me $12.95 for a one-off direct debit payment, $6.95/payment for an automatic recurring debit payment, $32.50 for a payment made by debit card, or a whopping $109.55 for a payment made by credit card. (This means that the free--or at least "included in my rent"--payment option is for me to write a physical check and put it in the night drop box the day before rent is due and then their employees have to deal with the check, as opposed to the computers handling it all. Since the night drop is right there on my way out the door, the convenience factor is still high for me.) I don't like checks but I flatly refuse to pay money to pay a bill. If I owe you money, you will figure out how to accept it in a way that doesn't cost me more. What I owe is already figured into the balance; charging me more to hand you money is obnoxious. My apartment company isn't the only company like this so I still hand out about 20 checks per year. Fortunately, my credit union gives me one box of checks for free every year and I only use less than one book of them per year so there's no added cost there, too.

iwasakabukiman 7y ago
How much is your rent, if you don’t mind my asking? Those fees sound exorbitant. I used to do ACH transfers since those were free at the last place I rented. The management company only charged a $3 debit/credit card fee...
- techsupporter 7y ago
  My rent is $2,385/month but they are flat fees charged by the electronic payments processor. (I've confirmed with a friend who lives in the same set of apartments but who has rent that is half of mine that the fees she sees online are identical down to the penny.)

hunter2_ 7y ago

> I know a while back there was some dentist storing patient information in a unsecured FTP account. There are thousands, if not millions, of people doing business like this. When I was shopping around for a home mortgage, a broker that I knew by personal family recommendation had me send tax returns to hername@isp and I, figuring that this stuff could land anywhere regardless of whether the broker operates so sadly, applied AES to the PDF and sent it on over, calling by phone to provide the password. I guarantee 99% of her clients don't bother. And I wouldn't be the least bit surprised to learn that she renamed the saved file on her computer to include the password.

Drdrdrq 7y ago
Probably doesn't matter now, but including #, %, < and similar characters in password helps with that. :)

wool_gather 7y ago

> Well I know for doctors and stuff they say you can refuse to give it You can refuse to give it to anyone who doesn't need it for tax purposes. Which is almost everyone. But, this is the stupid part, they can refuse to do business with you on that basis.

ajross 7y ago

> I feel bad for those people who Paychecks got stolen Per the article, Cachet Financial Services ended up holding the bag. They tried reversing a bunch of payroll account payments, but ultimately relented. Presumably some of that money will eventually be recovered. > I don't know why anyone would think they could get away with a fraud this large. Given the M.O., it's likely that this started small (as most fraud does). He cheated once with a float to cover a shortfall, then started making larger and larger bets. And eventually he lost a bet too large to cover, and had to try cheating in a different and more dangerous way with money in the payroll account, and got caught.