5 ms·

How can people in Europe and US help?

by adamnemecek 7y ago

option 7y ago
letting you elected representatives know that you care is the easiest thing we can do.
- adamnemecek 7y ago
  Something more direct.
  - adammunich 7y ago
    Stop buying imported goods?
    - dqonvzpa 7y ago
      Stop 'United States–Hong Kong Policy Act' will definitely hurt the HK gov and CCP.
    - H8crilA 7y ago
      Don't, freezing the global trade is dangerous. It was one of the causes of the German debt crisis and the rise of Hitler. Trade tools are incredibly effective in foreign policy and therefore seem very appealing to people in power but also too often ended up badly for the world when deployed. Know the history.
  - chillacy 7y ago
    Pick a spot on the spectrum between "plane ticket, wear black, brave tear gas and beatings" and "thoughts and prayers"
anigbrowl 7y ago
Amplify HK voices and focus on the issues they are unhappy about rather than the polities involved, which easily degenerates into nationalistic tribalism. Being supportive of protesters' demand for civil rights, self-determination, and rejection of authoritarian policing doesn't necessarily mean being against Chinese people; resist attempts by people to reshape the discussion on such terms. I suggest not working through conventional political channels involving state actors, where the marginal utility of your participation is negligible and you are empowering state institutions which ultimately disempowers individuals and communities. Study up on direct action techniques; if you're in the right area, protest things like companies who supply riot equipment to police; disrupt, get attention, and use that as a platform to express solidarity with HK. Direct action is effective, politically empowering, and equips you to fight against political repression yourself if there is any risk that you could find yourself or your community subject to it in the future.
__m 7y ago
By staying out of it. Hongkong belongs to China just as Catalonia belongs to Spain, or California to the US. Imagine China interfering with that.
- inflatableDodo 7y ago
  Is easy to imagine. People go all over the place and people love interfering. History would be dramatically different otherwise. And probably a lot shorter.
- qub1t 7y ago
  Just because Hong Kong “belongs” to China doesn’t mean the west should ignore the wishes of what seems like the majority of the population that lives there. Especially when they’re protesting against an anti-democratic authoritarian government, and all they’re asking for is a reduction of police brutality and the right to a democratically elected government.
  - verttii 7y ago
    Though what could we do about it?
    - kevin_b_er 7y ago
      Shine light on the brutality and inhumanity of the Communist Party of China to the rest of the world. The CPC tries to keep secret its cruelty, tries to keep secret its concentration camps, tries to silents their people's discussion about the true nature of the CPC, and tries to keep secret its leader's lust to be a new Mao. Sunshine on the CPC's true nature is the best disinfectant.
      - verttii 7y ago
        Not sure what all that sunshine has done so far about those concentration camps in Xinjiang and possibly elsewhere too. I'd say just about nothing. The communist party seems rather immune to criticism. Franky, HK's struggle looks hopeless to me.
jrjdjdhhedh 7y ago
They could have not made China the leading power in Asia 30 years ago.
nitrobeast 7y ago
By being more concerned about police brutality in US, which will give totalitarian states less excuse to behave similarly.
- i_am_nomad 7y ago
  I have yet to hear the Chinese government explain their actions in Hong Kong with regards to American police procedure.
  - Simon_says 7y ago
    The wumao bring it up periodically. Whataboutism is like their favorite pastime.
akvadrako 7y ago
Stay out of it; this is an internal Chinese issue. Imagine if China started trying to help Antifa or alt-right protestors shut down an airport in the US. That kind of interference could lead to war.
- MisterTea 7y ago
  > That kind of interference could lead to war. Or a crappy election cycle.
- Junk_Collector 7y ago
  They do; I thought that this was common knowledge. A quick example from a few years ago http://content.time.com/time/magazine/article/0,9171,135999,00.html http://content.time.com/time/magazine/article/0,9171,135999,... See also last election.
ackbar03 7y ago
The entire thing about protestors walking around with us and UK flags is a farce, its messed up and I will never be able to take the protestors seriously if that's what they do. Hong Kong was handed over to the British over the opium war. This was a war where the Chinese people tried to stop the British from selling poison to their population. The loss of Hong Kong was a humiliation, a shame to everyone Chinese. Yet these people wave the British flag during their protest? They'd rather be someone's dog again? I'm sorry but I look down at them, if they don't like Hong Kong then please get out of here
verttii 7y ago
To be honest there's really not much anyone is willing to do for HK. Particularly the European nations are doing everything to avoid provoking China anyhow. Look at how almost no one is willing to even acknowledge Taiwan's independence in fear of Chinese reaction. Unfortunately, HK's case is much more hopeless than Taiwan's.
vkou 7y ago
We can stop repressing domestic protestors, so that we won't be the pot calling the kettle black. Or, if we aren't interested in doing that, contemplate this may be none of our business, just like police brutality at home is none of China's business. Or, consider it a third way - we as a society are incapable, or unwilling in reigning in police brutality against domestic protestors. What makes you think we are at all capable of bringing such a change to another country, when we can't even do it to our own?
logfromblammo 7y ago
Accept more asylum and immigration petitions from Hong Kong residents that want to get out. Help them bring their money with them. Publish and broadcast Cantonese-language information encouraging skilled and educated people to leave Hong Kong. Hong Kong is China. No one disputes it. These protests cannot be seen as anything other than a rearguard action to cover the retreat of those who don't want to be ruled by Beijing. So give them a place to go other than Vancouver. If it had the political will, and were less racist, the US could absorb 750k people to Houston, New Orleans, Mobile, and Tampa, which represents 10% of Hong Kong, and 10% the metro populations of those cities. The coast of the US facing the Gulf of Mexico is superficially similar to the Chinese coast facing the South China Sea, and there must be at least some businesses that could be transplanted without too many operational changes.
- magduf 7y ago
  The US can't easily absorb so many people unless they're dirt poor and willing to live 20 to an apartment. That many middle-class people will make the traffic situation far worse, because the US absolutely refuses to build more densely and build more public transit to make cities walkable. It's not a good place to live at all.

How can people in Europe and US help?

option 7y ago

letting you elected representatives know that you care is the easiest thing we can do.

adamnemecek 7y ago
Something more direct.
- adammunich 7y ago
  Stop buying imported goods?
  - dqonvzpa 7y ago
    Stop 'United States–Hong Kong Policy Act' will definitely hurt the HK gov and CCP.
  - H8crilA 7y ago
    Don't, freezing the global trade is dangerous. It was one of the causes of the German debt crisis and the rise of Hitler. Trade tools are incredibly effective in foreign policy and therefore seem very appealing to people in power but also too often ended up badly for the world when deployed. Know the history.
- chillacy 7y ago
  Pick a spot on the spectrum between "plane ticket, wear black, brave tear gas and beatings" and "thoughts and prayers"

anigbrowl 7y ago

Amplify HK voices and focus on the issues they are unhappy about rather than the polities involved, which easily degenerates into nationalistic tribalism. Being supportive of protesters' demand for civil rights, self-determination, and rejection of authoritarian policing doesn't necessarily mean being against Chinese people; resist attempts by people to reshape the discussion on such terms. I suggest not working through conventional political channels involving state actors, where the marginal utility of your participation is negligible and you are empowering state institutions which ultimately disempowers individuals and communities. Study up on direct action techniques; if you're in the right area, protest things like companies who supply riot equipment to police; disrupt, get attention, and use that as a platform to express solidarity with HK. Direct action is effective, politically empowering, and equips you to fight against political repression yourself if there is any risk that you could find yourself or your community subject to it in the future.

__m 7y ago

By staying out of it. Hongkong belongs to China just as Catalonia belongs to Spain, or California to the US. Imagine China interfering with that.

inflatableDodo 7y ago
Is easy to imagine. People go all over the place and people love interfering. History would be dramatically different otherwise. And probably a lot shorter.
qub1t 7y ago
Just because Hong Kong “belongs” to China doesn’t mean the west should ignore the wishes of what seems like the majority of the population that lives there. Especially when they’re protesting against an anti-democratic authoritarian government, and all they’re asking for is a reduction of police brutality and the right to a democratically elected government.
- verttii 7y ago
  Though what could we do about it?
  - kevin_b_er 7y ago
    Shine light on the brutality and inhumanity of the Communist Party of China to the rest of the world. The CPC tries to keep secret its cruelty, tries to keep secret its concentration camps, tries to silents their people's discussion about the true nature of the CPC, and tries to keep secret its leader's lust to be a new Mao. Sunshine on the CPC's true nature is the best disinfectant.
    - verttii 7y ago
      Not sure what all that sunshine has done so far about those concentration camps in Xinjiang and possibly elsewhere too. I'd say just about nothing. The communist party seems rather immune to criticism. Franky, HK's struggle looks hopeless to me.

jrjdjdhhedh 7y ago

They could have not made China the leading power in Asia 30 years ago.

nitrobeast 7y ago

By being more concerned about police brutality in US, which will give totalitarian states less excuse to behave similarly.

i_am_nomad 7y ago
I have yet to hear the Chinese government explain their actions in Hong Kong with regards to American police procedure.
- Simon_says 7y ago
  The wumao bring it up periodically. Whataboutism is like their favorite pastime.

akvadrako 7y ago

Stay out of it; this is an internal Chinese issue. Imagine if China started trying to help Antifa or alt-right protestors shut down an airport in the US. That kind of interference could lead to war.

MisterTea 7y ago
> That kind of interference could lead to war. Or a crappy election cycle.
Junk_Collector 7y ago
They do; I thought that this was common knowledge. A quick example from a few years ago http://content.time.com/time/magazine/article/0,9171,135999,00.html http://content.time.com/time/magazine/article/0,9171,135999,... See also last election.

ackbar03 7y ago

The entire thing about protestors walking around with us and UK flags is a farce, its messed up and I will never be able to take the protestors seriously if that's what they do. Hong Kong was handed over to the British over the opium war. This was a war where the Chinese people tried to stop the British from selling poison to their population. The loss of Hong Kong was a humiliation, a shame to everyone Chinese. Yet these people wave the British flag during their protest? They'd rather be someone's dog again? I'm sorry but I look down at them, if they don't like Hong Kong then please get out of here

verttii 7y ago

To be honest there's really not much anyone is willing to do for HK. Particularly the European nations are doing everything to avoid provoking China anyhow. Look at how almost no one is willing to even acknowledge Taiwan's independence in fear of Chinese reaction. Unfortunately, HK's case is much more hopeless than Taiwan's.

vkou 7y ago

We can stop repressing domestic protestors, so that we won't be the pot calling the kettle black. Or, if we aren't interested in doing that, contemplate this may be none of our business, just like police brutality at home is none of China's business. Or, consider it a third way - we as a society are incapable, or unwilling in reigning in police brutality against domestic protestors. What makes you think we are at all capable of bringing such a change to another country, when we can't even do it to our own?

logfromblammo 7y ago

Accept more asylum and immigration petitions from Hong Kong residents that want to get out. Help them bring their money with them. Publish and broadcast Cantonese-language information encouraging skilled and educated people to leave Hong Kong. Hong Kong is China. No one disputes it. These protests cannot be seen as anything other than a rearguard action to cover the retreat of those who don't want to be ruled by Beijing. So give them a place to go other than Vancouver. If it had the political will, and were less racist, the US could absorb 750k people to Houston, New Orleans, Mobile, and Tampa, which represents 10% of Hong Kong, and 10% the metro populations of those cities. The coast of the US facing the Gulf of Mexico is superficially similar to the Chinese coast facing the South China Sea, and there must be at least some businesses that could be transplanted without too many operational changes.

magduf 7y ago
The US can't easily absorb so many people unless they're dirt poor and willing to live 20 to an apartment. That many middle-class people will make the traffic situation far worse, because the US absolutely refuses to build more densely and build more public transit to make cities walkable. It's not a good place to live at all.