7 ms·

Heat Wave Results in Highest U.S. Electricity Demand Since 2017

100 points by infodocket 7y ago

alexilliamson 7y ago
Since 2017? It's only 2019. Am I missing something?
- mempko 7y ago
  It's getting much hotter every year and the likely hood of breaking a record increases. So don't be surprised to see the same story in 2020.
  - shados 7y ago
    Fine, so is it highest demand since "ever" with 2017 being the last record, or is it just that 2016 had even higher?
    - AnimalMuppet 7y ago
      No, this is the highest demand since 2017, with 2017 being slightly higher. Which is pretty lame. I'm with alexilliamson. So it's the highest in the last two years? Color me unimpressed. I guess it's just the consequences of recency bias running amuck. "2017? That was so five-minutes-ago."
  - recursive 7y ago
    Huh? This story is about the highest electricity usage in 2 years. If it's getting hotter every year, we'd be seeing a new record.
    - tjbiddle 7y ago
      OP should've said the running average is getting hotter every year. Next year may end up colder, but the average temperature of 2020-2024 will very likely be hotter than 2015-2019.
- repiret 7y ago
  Amusingly the headline could also be written “2018 and 2019 electricity demand lower than 2017”
  - AnimalMuppet 7y ago
    The absolute peak demand in 2019 was slightly lower than the absolute peak demand in 2017. That's a bit different.
  - nostromo 7y ago
    That's a boring headline. Also a boring headline: "US oil use peaked fourteen years ago, in 2005." And yet, it's also true. https://ycharts.com/indicators/us_oil_consumption https://ycharts.com/indicators/us_oil_consumption So is, "US per capita energy use has been falling since 2007." https://www.bloomberg.com/opinion/articles/2018-03-01/americans-electricity-use-just-keeps-falling https://www.bloomberg.com/opinion/articles/2018-03-01/americ... In order to get clicks, you have to frame everything in alarmist terms.
    - craftinator 7y ago
      A .gov site is packing headlines to get more clicks? Why do you think that is?
      - brink 7y ago
        1 click = 1 tax
        polynomial 7y ago
        1 doge = 1 doge
      - adventured 7y ago
        Because at the bottom it says this: "Principal contributor: Mark Morey" If you're going to write something, it's nice to have it read by an audience. In the grand scheme of anything alarmist (especially these days), this headline is fairly benign. Still, I'm sure the author likes to have their contributed content read, paid attention to, like any normal person would. So you come up with a headline that differentiates, stands out in some manner, even if it's reaching a bit.
- hanoz 7y ago
  > Am I missing something? You may be. Firstly the interval size. Highest year since two years ago is unimpressive, highest day since two years ago is more (still not very) impressive. Secondly this is coming from "Today in Energy" which appears to be a journal of the minutiae of energy production and consumption. I don't think the target audience is meant to be alarmed, just mildly interested.
- jbeales 7y ago
  There was a big heatwave in 2017. I can't find documentation, but "highest since 2017" might actually mean "Second-Highest Ever"
irrational 7y ago
During the recent (ongoing?) European heat wave I read that AC is uncommon in Europe. I wonder if it will become more common now that heat waves are becoming more common?
- Zenst 7y ago
  I tend to see more and more air-con hoses popping out of windows open enough to accomodate them whilst out and about during summers in the UK. Units get cheaper, demand increases. So I'd say yes. For me, a two litter bottle of water, frozen and stood in a bowl in my bedroom with the window and door closed. Does wonders as draws out the water with condensation upon the bottle - lowering the humidity. Also cools the air. Though I'm sure I'll get some form of aircon in the next few years.
  - dictum 7y ago
    > For me, a teo liter bottle of water, frozen and stood in a bowl Well, now I know another person on HN who's done that.
    - Hextinium 7y ago
      I don't have a vent fan in my bathroom so I put a 2 litter aluminum bottle on top of an aluminum plate in my sink, does wonders vs nothing at all.
- nstom 7y ago
  I read that AC installation companies have been getting a lot of business in the past few weeks, and anecdotally I've heard from local businesses looking to install it as well. So I'd say yes, it'll definitely become more common.
- nine_k 7y ago
  I suspect that many European buildings have good passive thermal insulation, because of colder and longer winters than in most of the US. This must help get by with fewer active cooling devices. Also, European side-opening windows make it much harder to install an AC unit than American slide-up windows; in many cases your only option is a split system.
chiph 7y ago
ERCOT (Electric Reliability Council of Texas), which operates the third grid in the US, has a page with realtime load data: http://www.ercot.com/content/cdr/html/real_time_system_conditions.html http://www.ercot.com/content/cdr/html/real_time_system_condi...
hmd_imputer 7y ago
Why is this even news? What is next? The temperature is highest since the last week?
pier25 7y ago
AC is a positive feedback. The warmer the planet, the more AC is used, the more electricity is generated, the more GHG are emitted. Repeat. Of course this cycle could be broken with renewables, but the vast majority of the world's electricity comes from fossil fuels.
- heymijo 7y ago
  Very true and let me add a note. "Positive feedback" in everyday terms seems like a good thing. In systems speak: > A positive feedback loop speeds up a process. [0] So in this context, that is highly undesirable. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Twelve_leverage_points https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Twelve_leverage_points
frankbreetz 7y ago
It seems like energy demand created by heatwaves should be low hanging fruit for compensating with solar power. It seems the sun is usually shining during a heatwave. Am I oversimplifying or missing something here?

100 points by infodocket 7y ago

alexilliamson 7y ago

Since 2017? It's only 2019. Am I missing something?

mempko 7y ago
It's getting much hotter every year and the likely hood of breaking a record increases. So don't be surprised to see the same story in 2020.
- shados 7y ago
  Fine, so is it highest demand since "ever" with 2017 being the last record, or is it just that 2016 had even higher?
  - AnimalMuppet 7y ago
    No, this is the highest demand since 2017, with 2017 being slightly higher. Which is pretty lame. I'm with alexilliamson. So it's the highest in the last two years? Color me unimpressed. I guess it's just the consequences of recency bias running amuck. "2017? That was so five-minutes-ago."
- recursive 7y ago
  Huh? This story is about the highest electricity usage in 2 years. If it's getting hotter every year, we'd be seeing a new record.
  - tjbiddle 7y ago
    OP should've said the running average is getting hotter every year. Next year may end up colder, but the average temperature of 2020-2024 will very likely be hotter than 2015-2019.
repiret 7y ago
Amusingly the headline could also be written “2018 and 2019 electricity demand lower than 2017”
- AnimalMuppet 7y ago
  The absolute peak demand in 2019 was slightly lower than the absolute peak demand in 2017. That's a bit different.
- nostromo 7y ago
  That's a boring headline. Also a boring headline: "US oil use peaked fourteen years ago, in 2005." And yet, it's also true. https://ycharts.com/indicators/us_oil_consumption https://ycharts.com/indicators/us_oil_consumption So is, "US per capita energy use has been falling since 2007." https://www.bloomberg.com/opinion/articles/2018-03-01/americans-electricity-use-just-keeps-falling https://www.bloomberg.com/opinion/articles/2018-03-01/americ... In order to get clicks, you have to frame everything in alarmist terms.
  - craftinator 7y ago
    A .gov site is packing headlines to get more clicks? Why do you think that is?
    - brink 7y ago
      1 click = 1 tax
      - polynomial 7y ago
        1 doge = 1 doge
    - adventured 7y ago
      Because at the bottom it says this: "Principal contributor: Mark Morey" If you're going to write something, it's nice to have it read by an audience. In the grand scheme of anything alarmist (especially these days), this headline is fairly benign. Still, I'm sure the author likes to have their contributed content read, paid attention to, like any normal person would. So you come up with a headline that differentiates, stands out in some manner, even if it's reaching a bit.
hanoz 7y ago
> Am I missing something? You may be. Firstly the interval size. Highest year since two years ago is unimpressive, highest day since two years ago is more (still not very) impressive. Secondly this is coming from "Today in Energy" which appears to be a journal of the minutiae of energy production and consumption. I don't think the target audience is meant to be alarmed, just mildly interested.
jbeales 7y ago
There was a big heatwave in 2017. I can't find documentation, but "highest since 2017" might actually mean "Second-Highest Ever"

irrational 7y ago

During the recent (ongoing?) European heat wave I read that AC is uncommon in Europe. I wonder if it will become more common now that heat waves are becoming more common?

Zenst 7y ago
I tend to see more and more air-con hoses popping out of windows open enough to accomodate them whilst out and about during summers in the UK. Units get cheaper, demand increases. So I'd say yes. For me, a two litter bottle of water, frozen and stood in a bowl in my bedroom with the window and door closed. Does wonders as draws out the water with condensation upon the bottle - lowering the humidity. Also cools the air. Though I'm sure I'll get some form of aircon in the next few years.
- dictum 7y ago
  > For me, a teo liter bottle of water, frozen and stood in a bowl Well, now I know another person on HN who's done that.
  - Hextinium 7y ago
    I don't have a vent fan in my bathroom so I put a 2 litter aluminum bottle on top of an aluminum plate in my sink, does wonders vs nothing at all.
nstom 7y ago
I read that AC installation companies have been getting a lot of business in the past few weeks, and anecdotally I've heard from local businesses looking to install it as well. So I'd say yes, it'll definitely become more common.
nine_k 7y ago
I suspect that many European buildings have good passive thermal insulation, because of colder and longer winters than in most of the US. This must help get by with fewer active cooling devices. Also, European side-opening windows make it much harder to install an AC unit than American slide-up windows; in many cases your only option is a split system.

chiph 7y ago

ERCOT (Electric Reliability Council of Texas), which operates the third grid in the US, has a page with realtime load data: http://www.ercot.com/content/cdr/html/real_time_system_conditions.html http://www.ercot.com/content/cdr/html/real_time_system_condi...

hmd_imputer 7y ago

Why is this even news? What is next? The temperature is highest since the last week?

pier25 7y ago

AC is a positive feedback. The warmer the planet, the more AC is used, the more electricity is generated, the more GHG are emitted. Repeat. Of course this cycle could be broken with renewables, but the vast majority of the world's electricity comes from fossil fuels.

heymijo 7y ago
Very true and let me add a note. "Positive feedback" in everyday terms seems like a good thing. In systems speak: > A positive feedback loop speeds up a process. [0] So in this context, that is highly undesirable. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Twelve_leverage_points https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Twelve_leverage_points

frankbreetz 7y ago

It seems like energy demand created by heatwaves should be low hanging fruit for compensating with solar power. It seems the sun is usually shining during a heatwave. Am I oversimplifying or missing something here?