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Plant trees while you search the web
- dominikmauritz 7y agoI switched to Ecosia about a month ago. IMHO search result quality is at about 90 % to 95 % compared to Google. I believe Ecosia is using Bing in the background. They are planting trees and claim to respect my privacy. Overall I'm happy with Ecosia and started recommending it to friends. PS. I'm German and do searches in German and English.
- jk2faster 7y agoI used ecosia for a period of few months, and stopped when I read this their privacy policy(https://info.ecosia.org/privacy#privacy-policy-section-7 https://info.ecosia.org/privacy#privacy-policy-section-7): > For example, when you do a search on Ecosia we forward the following information to our partner, Bing: IP address, user agent string, search term, and some settings like your country and language setting. So when a search is done, our IP address is send to Bing. I really love the idea of planting trees from profit, and have nothing against ecosia. Just commented to inform readers. <edit> Before getting downvoted into oblivion, I would like to make it clear that I'm not saying ecosia is unethical or that everyone should stop using it because of this. For some it matters, for some it doesn't and ecosia seems a great choice for those whom this doesn't matter. I'm just posting it so that those who do care(about their IP being send to Bing) can be aware(since I wasn't for a few months). </edit>
- _ph_ 7y agoHow is this different to using Bing as a search engine directly?
- hanniabu 7y agoThere isn't other than the planet benefits
- jk2faster 7y agoIt is not. I've been using DuckDuckGo before switching to them, for me privacy is a big deal. When I first saw ecosia, I thought it was similar to DDG in terms of privacy(Probably because they had pro-privacy phrases). I know it's not a problem for most, especially if they are using search engines like Bing or Google. And I believe it's better to use ecosia than using say, Bing or Google.
- dominikmauritz 7y agoWhich search engine are you using now instead of Ecosia? I'm much more comfortable to give some information to Microsoft then giving more information to Google so they can add it to my profile they already have.
- jk2faster 7y agoI use DuckDuckGo and StartPage. StartPage uses Google's result without sharing user IP(https://support.startpage.com/index.php?/Knowledgebase/Article/View/159/22/do-you-share-my-ip-address-with-google https://support.startpage.com/index.php?/Knowledgebase/Artic...). I think ecosia can do something similar to that and I would be extremely glad to switch.
- okmokmz 7y agoI'm a strong advocate for digital privacy and opposed to the majority of data collection that occurs, but this comment is FUD. None of the info that you listed would be private if you used Bing normally, so if you're worried about them having that info you'd need to stop using search engines all together >So when a search is done, our IP address is send to Bing. Explain why you believe that's a negative? If you use Bing normally they would know your IP as well >user agent string Again, using bing normally will allow them to see this information >search term Obviously required to be sent to bing >some settings like your country and language setting Again, this is information that would be available to Bing if you use their service normally
- hoschicz 7y agoDuckDuckGo also uses Bing and they don't send the IP AFAIK
- stffndtz 7y agoAFAIK that is impossible
- jk2faster 7y agoStartPage does it with Google and is explained here: https://support.startpage.com/index.php?/Knowledgebase/Article/View/159/22/do-you-share-my-ip-address-with-google https://support.startpage.com/index.php?/Knowledgebase/Artic... So it is probably possible.
- danskeren 7y agoDefinitely not impossible. Microsoft offers a pay-as-you-go Bing Search API (https://azure.microsoft.com/en-us/pricing/details/cognitive-services/search-api/ https://azure.microsoft.com/en-us/pricing/details/cognitive-...). I can only assume ecosia share this data with Microsoft because doing so has allowed them to land a more lucrative deal.
- thekyle 7y ago
- nvrspyx 7y ago> We don’t create personal profiles of you based on your search history. We actually anonymize all searches within one week. > Many web services collect user data in order to sell it without asking your permission. We don’t sell your data or your searches to advertising companies. > We protect your searches from potential eavesdroppers with a securely encrypted connection. This way we make sure that nobody between you and us can see your searches. If they’re just handing everything off to Bing wholesale, are these quotes either misleading or straight up lies? The first one I’m confused about with the “anonymize all searches within one week”. I don’t know what that means. The second seems like Bing could still do those things. And the last one would be a lie considering Bing can see it. https://info.ecosia.org/privacy https://info.ecosia.org/privacy
- Colex 7y ago> And the last one would be a lie considering Bing can see it. How would that be a lie. They protect from eavesdroppers, as in someone intercepting the connection and trying to extract data being transmitted within a system. Bing is part of the whole system, not a third party trying to eavesdrop. Finally, they say they don't allow anyone between you and them - which is different from allowing between them and a third party, but I'm sure they would use an encrypted connection even when communicating with Bing.
- nvrspyx 7y agoThat’s true. I guess I jumped the gun on that one. However, “nobody between you and us” still feels disingenuous because you have to dig quite a bit to find out that they use Bing on the backend and then leave concluding that “us” also includes Microsoft as the responsibility of the user. The average user isn’t going to make that connection because they’re not likely to be reading through the privacy policy or digging through the FAQ to discover they use Bing. I think their page touting “privacy” should clearly indicate that they use Bing and that your privacy is ultimately beholden to Microsoft, not Ecosia, especially since Ecosia is happy to send unique identifiers to Bing for personalized search results as default. It feels like a deftly move to offload their own responsibility to then be able to tout privacy as a selling point because they themselves don’t do anything with your information, Microsoft does.
- Gys 7y agoTheir value proposition is planting trees and not privacy. They get a cut of the Bing ad revenues and a cut of that is invested in trees. Its a simple model. I learned about it 1-2 years ago and was expecting more of these ‘feel good’ labelled search engines.
- thekyle 7y agoIf anyone is wondering why they send Bing the IP address, it's most likely because the Bing API uses the searchers IP address if you want location specific search results like weather, local restaurants, etc. > Results are customized to the location or market of the user. The location or market can be determined implicitly (via IP address) or configured explicitly. https://azure.microsoft.com/en-us/services/cognitive-services/bing-web-search-api/ https://azure.microsoft.com/en-us/services/cognitive-service...
- RenRav 7y ago7 million active users, 70 million trees... only 10 trees have been planted per user? I like the idea but I wonder on average just how many searches it takes for one tree to be planted.
- dominikmauritz 7y agoThey say on average you need 45 searches to plant a tree.
- amelius 7y agoIs anyone verifying these claims?
- jordigh 7y agoI would like to know that too, because currently all sources on the Ecosia Wikipedia page are either self-published or primary, so the article reads like an ad. If this really is working and we can all truly combat deforestation and global warming by watching Ecosia's ads, I'd like to know. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ecosia https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ecosia
- concert-gilled 7y agoDo users know where these tree they have planted are?
- ForHackernews 7y ago...how much profit do you think a search engine makes per user?
- RenRav 7y agoWay more than what Ecosia's managed so far. Others here have said they only earn from clicks though. Because they aren't selling user data on the side and they are a business with their own expenses, maybe this amount is as optimized as possible.
- bluGill 7y ago
- WA 7y agoIf you don't click on ads, or have an Adblocker installed, you generate no money for Ecosia. Thus, no trees get planted. I think it's important to point this out, because in their marketing, they make it sound as if searching alone is enough. There's also this little counter in the upper right corner. 45 searches (on average) are required to plant a tree. Of course, only if you click on an ad. You could even argue that you cause more environmental damage, because Ecosia is then just an unnecessary wrapper around Bing consuming energy (although it's probably not much). Edit: Added second paragraph Edit2: Source is their FAQ: https://ecosia.zendesk.com/hc/en-us/articles/206019452-How-does-Ecosia-make-money- https://ecosia.zendesk.com/hc/en-us/articles/206019452-How-d...
- Hoasi 7y ago> I think it's important to point this out, because in their marketing, they make it sound as if searching alone is enough. Thank you for pointing that out. There is no point using it for search if you are using ad-blocking software.
- PavlovsCat 7y agoHmm? It's trivial to configure site-specific exceptions for any decent ad-blocker, no?
- Forbo 7y ago> There is no point using it for search if you are using ad-blocking software. I'd disagree. The network effect can help. Acquaintances tend to be interested whenever they see me using any search engine that isn't Google.
- jammygit 7y agoApparently the search queries are sent to bing, including ip addresses and the like. If it was more anonymized I would use it in a heartbeat
- SuoDuanDao 7y agoWhat if I repeatedly click on ads by advertisers I dislike?
- chaosfox 7y agoecosia financial reports: https://blog.ecosia.org/ecosia-financial-reports-tree-planting-receipts/ https://blog.ecosia.org/ecosia-financial-reports-tree-planti...
- fourier_mode 7y agoFor 170k euors spent in salaries they are able to hire 39 people. Seems quite less from the US standard.
- war1025 7y agoThat value is per month, which would be roughly 2 million euros / year. An average of 50k euro / (person * year), seems pretty reasonable.
- rushi_agrawal 7y agoI remember there was a link on HN which had a list of sites similar to this which are greener in general (i.e. which plant trees, or which use only green energy like solar, etc). I've been searching for it but couldn't find it. If someone has it, can they post it ? Thanks!
- stffndtz 7y agoCould it be https://ethical.net/resources/ https://ethical.net/resources/?
- rushi_agrawal 7y agoThanks! Yes, this is what I was looking for.
- kawera 7y agoPrevious discussion with interesting comments: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=19324766 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=19324766
- jordigh 7y agoThis really feels like greenwashing to me. The purpose of ads is (1) to make you buy something you didn't need before the ad made you aware of it, or (2) to make you choose the advertised brand amongst competing brands when you buy a product comparable to the advertised one. Runaway consumption is what has gotten us into this ecological mess in the first place. Watching ads to replant trees just sounds very strange.
- mistrial9 7y agowhere is the market to implement otherwise ? people talked about "needing a micropayments model on the Internet" almost twenty years ago.. and continually since then
- pier25 7y ago> Runaway consumption is what has gotten us into this ecological mess in the first place. In part. If instead of almost 8 billion humans there were 4 billions we wouldn't be in this mess either.
- bad-joke 7y ago> If instead of almost 8 billion humans there were 4 billions we wouldn't be in this mess either. I'm not sure your logic follows. The US outputs roughly 13% of global CO2 emissions despite having 4% of the world population. If the ratio of population to CO2 output was scaled in this case, 7.5 billion US citizens would output 118,000 Mt of CO2 per year. Halving that (to less than 4 billion humans) would be 59,000 Mt of CO2 per year, and the current global output is 37,000 Mt per year.
- void_nill 7y agoI just tried to use the search engine without Javascript and that's a really bad result. [1] [1] https://imgur.com/a/ybtiAkk https://imgur.com/a/ybtiAkk
- Hamuko 7y agoI'd rather just send $5 somewhere. If they earn a few cents per ad clicked, I'd have to click like 250 different ads in order to get to that $5.
- cwkoss 7y agoAdvertising spending is inversely correlated with product quality.
- elektor 7y agohttps://blog.ecosia.org/content/images/2019/06/Financial-Report-May19_english@2x.png https://blog.ecosia.org/content/images/2019/06/Financial-Rep... From their infographic, you can see that Ecosia donates 51.6% of its income to planting trees, the rest going to employee incomes, reserves, and "spreading the word". You can save yourself the extra step and simply donate to the foundations that Ecosia donates money to: edenprojects.org hommesetterro.com greenbeltmovement.org itpa.org.br
- k_sze 7y agoThere was a recent article about planting the wrong kind of trees in Ireland [1]. What do we know about Ecosia’s tree-planting partners? It would be great to have more oversight over the tree-planting, maybe even let users have “voting” power (decide which tree-planting partner to benefit from the proceedings of your search results, kinda like how Humble Bundle let’s you choose which charity to give to). [1] https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=20380793 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=20380793
- gay-Bullshit 7y agoWow. Pretending that ads make a difference. I think we all know the truth. Even if you look at ads. Even if you click on ads. Looking at bullshit (or pretending to) with no intent to commit and buy isn't valuable. Imagine an auto dealership with continuous foot traffic and no sales. At some point, the truth becomes obvious. It's like a corner gas station at an intersection with a long, slow traffic light. First they post a sign that says "no through traffic" because people route around the red light. At some point they start calling the cops, and a patrol car starts writing tickets for bypassing the intersection via private property. Everyone loves to pretend that ads are valuable but they aren't.
- CTOSian 7y agofor sure you plant too, money on ecosia managers' pockets. "Adblock till the sun burns out"