6 ms·

The obvious follow up question, then, is: why does Japan use 2-prong outlets even today? Are Japanese people dying from electrical shock at a much higher rate

by ken 7y ago

The obvious follow up question, then, is: why does Japan use 2-prong outlets even today? Are Japanese people dying from electrical shock at a much higher rate than the rest of the world? Is Japan full of only Perfect Electricians? Or is this not actually the significant problem that this myth (in the etiological sense, not the fictional sense) would lead us to believe? The only 2-prong device I own is a (Japanese-made, of course) rice cooker. You'd think that if any device warranted 3-prong safety, it'd be a metal container which combines water and mains electricity.

deleted 7y ago
[deleted]
throw0101a 7y ago
> The obvious follow up question, then, is: why does Japan use 2-prong outlets even today? Because JP is behind the times: > Japan also uses a grounded plug similar to the North American NEMA 5-15.[49] However, it is less common than its NEMA 1-15 equivalent. Since 2005, new Japanese homes are required to have class I grounded sockets for connecting domestic appliances. This rule does not apply for sockets not intended to be used for domestic appliances, but it is strongly advised to have class I sockets throughout the home.[52] * https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/AC_power_plugs_and_sockets#JIS_C_8303,_Class_I_earthed https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/AC_power_plugs_and_sockets#JIS... So as things are re-built, you'll see more. In the same way the old 'best practices' in automobiles didn't mandate ABS or air bags, some country's electrical best practices aren't written to the state of the art. Everyone is probably looking at IEC 60364 for overall guidelines: * https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/IEC_60364 https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/IEC_60364 See: * https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Act_on_Product_Safety_of_Electrical_Appliances_and_Materials https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Act_on_Product_Safety_of_Elect...
- ralfd 7y ago
  What about the Europlug?
  - sitharus 7y ago
    The Europlug is only supposed to be used on double-insulated appliances - those with an insulating outer shell enclosing all live components. Appliances like that do not require a protective earth as a human is not able to contact the live circuitry under normal circumstances. Same reason as light bulbs are not earthed.
- astrodust 7y ago
  Japan also has two completely different power grids, one at 50Hz, one at 60Hz, because reasons. https://www7.tepco.co.jp/about/facilities/substations-e.html https://www7.tepco.co.jp/about/facilities/substations-e.html There's a lot of "seemed like a good idea at the time" decisions baked into Japan's electrical system.
GuB-42 7y ago
- Japan runs at 100V, the lowest and therefore safest voltage in the world. At least when it comes to electrocution. I suppose that it is also the reason why in Europe, where the standard voltage goes up to 240V, electrical safety is much more strict. - As it is already mentioned, Japan is backwards in several domains and that may just be one of these. That's despite their technological advance in others. - I have a feeling that there are more "perfect electricians" in Japan than anywhere else, because of their culture. - Some 2-prong devices are perfectly safe because they are double insulated. This is also called Class II and the symbol for it is a square inside another square.
- refurb 7y ago
  Japan runs at 100V, the lowest and therefore safest voltage in the world. That's not really how electricity works is it? My understanding is that with the resistance of the human body, once you exceed a certain voltage AC (much lower than 100 V), yes, current increases, but you're going to be severely electrocuted regardless.
  - scotty79 7y ago
    Voltage does matter. If you have thick skin or touch cable through something (like layer of paint) it might be enough to save you if the voltage is 100V but not if it's 240V.
    - Balgair 7y ago
      ElectroBoom has a great video on how the interplay between current and voltage works with lethality in the human body. As he shows, even 150A in your mouth can be safe: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XDf2nhfxVzg https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XDf2nhfxVzg To be totally clear here: DO NOT ATTEMPT AT HOME.
      - tehwalrus 7y ago
        Similarly, lowest voltage ever to kill someone was 48V.
29athrowaway 7y ago
Many japanese house units are built to be used for 30 years. Then they are demolished.
- Scoundreller 7y ago
  Houses, yes, but what about the apartment blocks and offices?
- ci5er 7y ago
  How does this work? Most of the places I lived in in the 1980s and 1990s are still standing (incl. houses, small apartment complexes (say 60 units total on 3 stories) and high-density apartment towers) I was mostly in Tokyo NW, Saitama and Nagoya (and a little bit in a more Osaka-ey direction from time-to-time).

by ken 7y ago

deleted 7y ago

[deleted]

throw0101a 7y ago

> The obvious follow up question, then, is: why does Japan use 2-prong outlets even today? Because JP is behind the times: > Japan also uses a grounded plug similar to the North American NEMA 5-15.[49] However, it is less common than its NEMA 1-15 equivalent. Since 2005, new Japanese homes are required to have class I grounded sockets for connecting domestic appliances. This rule does not apply for sockets not intended to be used for domestic appliances, but it is strongly advised to have class I sockets throughout the home.[52] * https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/AC_power_plugs_and_sockets#JIS_C_8303,_Class_I_earthed https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/AC_power_plugs_and_sockets#JIS... So as things are re-built, you'll see more. In the same way the old 'best practices' in automobiles didn't mandate ABS or air bags, some country's electrical best practices aren't written to the state of the art. Everyone is probably looking at IEC 60364 for overall guidelines: * https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/IEC_60364 https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/IEC_60364 See: * https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Act_on_Product_Safety_of_Electrical_Appliances_and_Materials https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Act_on_Product_Safety_of_Elect...

ralfd 7y ago
What about the Europlug?
- sitharus 7y ago
  The Europlug is only supposed to be used on double-insulated appliances - those with an insulating outer shell enclosing all live components. Appliances like that do not require a protective earth as a human is not able to contact the live circuitry under normal circumstances. Same reason as light bulbs are not earthed.
astrodust 7y ago
Japan also has two completely different power grids, one at 50Hz, one at 60Hz, because reasons. https://www7.tepco.co.jp/about/facilities/substations-e.html https://www7.tepco.co.jp/about/facilities/substations-e.html There's a lot of "seemed like a good idea at the time" decisions baked into Japan's electrical system.

GuB-42 7y ago

- Japan runs at 100V, the lowest and therefore safest voltage in the world. At least when it comes to electrocution. I suppose that it is also the reason why in Europe, where the standard voltage goes up to 240V, electrical safety is much more strict. - As it is already mentioned, Japan is backwards in several domains and that may just be one of these. That's despite their technological advance in others. - I have a feeling that there are more "perfect electricians" in Japan than anywhere else, because of their culture. - Some 2-prong devices are perfectly safe because they are double insulated. This is also called Class II and the symbol for it is a square inside another square.

refurb 7y ago
Japan runs at 100V, the lowest and therefore safest voltage in the world. That's not really how electricity works is it? My understanding is that with the resistance of the human body, once you exceed a certain voltage AC (much lower than 100 V), yes, current increases, but you're going to be severely electrocuted regardless.
- scotty79 7y ago
  Voltage does matter. If you have thick skin or touch cable through something (like layer of paint) it might be enough to save you if the voltage is 100V but not if it's 240V.
  - Balgair 7y ago
    ElectroBoom has a great video on how the interplay between current and voltage works with lethality in the human body. As he shows, even 150A in your mouth can be safe: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XDf2nhfxVzg https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XDf2nhfxVzg To be totally clear here: DO NOT ATTEMPT AT HOME.
    - tehwalrus 7y ago
      Similarly, lowest voltage ever to kill someone was 48V.

29athrowaway 7y ago

Many japanese house units are built to be used for 30 years. Then they are demolished.

Scoundreller 7y ago
Houses, yes, but what about the apartment blocks and offices?
ci5er 7y ago
How does this work? Most of the places I lived in in the 1980s and 1990s are still standing (incl. houses, small apartment complexes (say 60 units total on 3 stories) and high-density apartment towers) I was mostly in Tokyo NW, Saitama and Nagoya (and a little bit in a more Osaka-ey direction from time-to-time).