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Raising the American Weakling (2017)
- h2odragon 7y agoI wonder how hard it would be to track the phrase "easy open packaging" and similar through advertising. I wonder how many people alive today have never swung a hammer to real purpose, and if the same could have been said of their parents.
- ravenstine 7y agoAt my last job, there were people who were shocked that I replaced the latches on my cabinets myself and fixed the toilet without calling a plumber. A lot of people probably wouldn't know where to begin without an expert.
- master-litty 7y agoWell, it's also a renter's problem. I don't possess these skills because I'm not allowed to practice or exercise them. Broken cabinet? Gotta call the landlord; If I tried fixing it myself I'd technically be breaking my lease.
- inflatableDodo 7y agoI think I have technically broken my lease on that score in every single place I have ever rented.
- chmod775 7y agoThis is only an issue if your apartment comes fully furnished. I know americans renting stuff in Germany have been surprised they're supposed to bring everything including their own kitchen. So there's up and downsides to both approaches (fixing your own stuff vs. having to bring it in the first place.). For things you don't own (broken window, toilet, etc.), not fixing them yourself may be important though because your landlord is supposed to foot the bill.
- vangelis 7y agoBringing your own cabinets sounds wild.
- quintushoratius 7y agoUS-based individual checking in: I've never rented a furnished apartment. My father is a landlord and, to my knowledge, has never rented out a furnished apartment. In my experience GP's comment stands: if you start fixing shit that isn't yours, you're in violation of most residential leases.
- ryandrake 7y agoWhen I tell people in the office I fix my own cars, built a shed in my backyard, replaced the pumps in my hot tub, and do all my home remodeling, they look at me as if i have horns growing out of my head. My old man slaughtered his own hogs for food and built his own house, and his father helped build the Empire State Building. How are we losing practical manual labor skills generation by generation? I’ve vowed that my daughter will learn how to use every tool in my garage, effectively and safely.
- zoeysaurusrex 7y agoReally?? Because when my coworkers and I meet someone like this we are all amazed and respectful. No offense, but I have a hard time believing that people become the worst versions of themselves because of your private behavior. Sorry to be so curt, but I’m tired of this sort of circle jerking going on in HN as of late. what you say may be true, but this sort of commentary is rampant lately.
- ryandrake 7y agoNobody turns into “the worst versions of themselves” but a common attitude is: why would you do these things when there are other kinds of people who do it for you as their job? And: you must have a lot more free time than I! No insults or derision, just surprise. It’s definitely different than 20 years ago. Back then everyone I hung out with used to tinker and had a closet full of tools you could borrow. Now it seems nobody’s into it. They even have a special “makers” label for people who like to build things as a hobby.
- ravenstine 7y agoThat's the same reaction I get most of the time, especially when they're closer to my age. Every once in a while they'll respond in appreciation, but the knee jerk reaction for a lot of people is to cock an eyebrow. I guess that's what happens when we code up these apps that allow people to just order whatever they want through their phones and never have to do anything themselves.
- AngryData 7y ago
- vangelis 7y agoI'd love to do the latter, but it's not my house.
- blunte 7y ago"Clamshell" plastic packaging is evil and deadly, even when my physical fitness is high. I shudder to think how I will open that stuff when I'm old and decrepit.
- Something1234 7y agoThe Leatherman wingman had the perfect tool to get the clamshell packaging open. It was almost like a can opener exacto knife hybrid. Cut through it like a hot knife through butter.
- XorNot 7y agoI need a new Leatherman and didn't realize I need this exact feature till now - thank you!
- inflatableDodo 7y agoI tend to use a breadknife.
- michaelt 7y agoSometimes clamshell packaging is used to make high-value-density, easily shopliftable items like microsd cards and fancy razors too big to fit into people's pockets. Being impossible to remove by hand is a feature as far as these manufacturers are concerned!
- aaronbrethorst 7y agoOn the flip side of the “easy open packaging” coin, I’ve seen scissors broken by plastic blister packages.
- vangelis 7y agoI don't know about the Silicon Valley bubble, but those skills are certainly alive and well in the real America.
- ulisesrmzroche 7y agoYeah, lol, I’m like procrastinating on all the stuff people are flexing on here. Let’s not make it seem like mowing a lawn or doing some minor handiwork around the house is more than a little kids job.
- blunte 7y agoLack of grip strength would certainly be an indication of corresponding lack of overall body strength. While it is possible to develop strength in isolated muscle groups with specific exercises, it is not easy to develop full system strength without involving the hands in gripping form. If overall physical strength has some relationship to health and longevity (which I believe is generally accepted to be some indication of), then lack of grip strength would be a simple measure of fitness. I don't think it's a huge mystery why wealthier groups are physically weaker (and less healthy, and more overweight). There is less need or requirement to do manual labor compared to people in developing countries. Jobs tend to be more white collar than blue collar. Kids tend to have more indoor entertainment options (electronics, computers, toys). Science fiction has often portrayed advanced civilizations as soft, physically weak beings (gelatin creatures in glass tubes and such) that use their mental gifts more than their physical ones. However, humans will probably not reach a point of not needing their bodies in order to maintain health and long life. So we really should all be regularly active. Besides, there's ample evidence that good physical fitness also benefits the mind as well as the mood.
- nradov 7y agoIn the US, low income people are more likely to be obese. https://www.stateofobesity.org/socioeconomics-obesity/ https://www.stateofobesity.org/socioeconomics-obesity/
- blunte 7y agoI was more referring to developing countries - people farming and building with non powered tools, walking and carrying stuff, playing soccer (and other forms of entertainment that don’t require electricity).
- PakG1 7y agoI somehow believe that our need for physical sex will not allow us to become gelatin in tubes. Even the world of Alita seems a bit farfetched. But who knows?
- 7y ago
- RyJones 7y agoAs I’ve grown older, I’ve lost a ton of grip strength. I blame arthritis; perhaps it’s decay of society, instead?
- blunte 7y agoI'm certainly no doctor, but I think arthritis is a kind of inflammation; and medicine is starting to realize that a lot of human health issues are inflammation-based. The source of inflammation isn't always clear, but I suspect it has to do with chemicals in our environment and our food. Low or zero THC hemp oil has been demonstrated to reduce inflammation, and some old folks have reported remarkable reductions of arthritis while using hemp oil. If you can reduce your pain to the point of being able to do physical exercises that are full body, you should give it a try. Squats, dead lift, and bench press are very beneficial when done correctly, and they will improve your grip strength as a side benefit (can't move the weights around if you can't hold on to them!)
- greesil 7y agoThere's a high correlation between age and the proclamations of the decay of society, so maybe you're on to something here.
- RyJones 7y agoI would rather blame my failings on others; sure. As long as it keeps introspection at bay, I’m for it.
- deleted 7y ago[deleted]
- joe_the_user 7y agoI would recommend the writings of FM Alexander[1] for an analysis of the degeneration of human muscle utilization with the advance of civilization. "Lack of exercise" is insufficient as an explanation. A slightly better way to put it is that rational processes have substituted for instinctive balance processes. But overall, the whole process must be, uh, grasped. [1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/F._Matthias_Alexander https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/F._Matthias_Alexander
- acconrad 7y agoDeadlifts work 70% of the muscles in your body, including your forearms and gripping muscles. Your best bang-for-the-buck to help your strength and get in some exercise is to pick heavy stuff off of the ground a few times.
- cheerlessbog 7y agoNow distinct muscles then squats do?
- acconrad 7y agoThe total muscle mass of involvement with deadlifts is higher than squats because of the lever used by your arms (whereas you support the bar with your back in the squat, the same muscles that keep the bar close to you when deadlifting). Rather than someone interpret this as "do deadlifts over squats" I'd say "do both because they're both great for your body if executed with proper form and weight."
- marble-drink 7y agoDeadlifts are great. But people need to know what "heavy" really means. For a deadlift that means at least two times your bodyweight. Many people in the gym just don't try hard enough.
- ubercow13 7y agoI honestly think it doesn't really matter. I get many pains that are fixed by deadlifting and it doesn't have to be an even vaguely heavy weight to do it, eg 1x bodyweight. I can lift 2x +, but it doesn't feel necessary to keep fit.
- glangdale 7y ago"Heavy" means hard-for-the-person (i.e. 3-5 rep maxes). If you found 2x bodyweight a good starting weight, then congrats, but that's not a realistic standard to enforce almost everyone. I've pulled 235kg at 100kg raw (no straps or belt), which is advanced-beginner or pissweak-intermediate, but training to get there involved starting with about 140kg, not 200kg. Heavy lifting and trying hard is important, like you say, but it's a relative thing to experience, genetics, age, etc. I've seen grannies pull 1.1x bodyweight and I'd say they were lifting "heavy".
- enraged_camel 7y ago“A weak man is not as happy as that same man would be if he were strong. This reality is offensive to some people who would like the intellectual or spiritual to take precedence. It is instructive to see what happens to these very people as their squat strength goes up.” ― Mark Rippetoe, Starting Strength
- dade_ 7y agoUpper body strength is in decline period and it is major indicator for life expectancy and health. Fortunately rock / gym climbing is rapidly gaining in popularity. Sport climbing will be part of the 2020 olympics. I love it and look forward to going with a buddy of mine each weekend. Also have grip exercisers in my carry on because I travel so much.
- BubRoss 7y agoCorrelation is not causation.
- TulliusCicero 7y agoSports are great, but you're never gonna get most people exercising that way. Most people will consistently exercise, over the long term, only if it's a necessity: like for their job, or for transportation. It really has to be built into one's daily routine. The Netherlands is a great example here, they have very high rates of active transportation (walking/biking) for the developed world.
- kd5bjo 7y agoSocial clubs of various forms have been a part of society for a long time. You could get a long way if sports clubs were a welcoming place to go hang out and socialize instead of just rentable facilities where you have to book a time and provide your own opponents.
- nradov 7y agoMany gyms have open times when any member can show up and join a pick up game of basketball / tennis / racquetball.
- harimau777 7y agoIt seems to me that in order to be successful exercise cannot be something that one adopts to meet a specific goal (i.e. look better, fit into a piece of clothing, address a health concern). Instead people need to adopt a way of life that includes exercise. That's why I think the "cult" aspects of CrossFit are a lot of what makes it so successful. Other examples are people that adopt yoga or martial arts as a way of life rather than just an activity.
- User23 7y agoProximate cause, but probably not the ultimate one: https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/17895324 https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/17895324
- thom 7y agoOne could while away many hours - muscles atrophying the entire time - analysing people’s need to pop up in the comments here with some variation on “not MY grip strength”.
- alexandercrohde 7y agoThis type of comment has gotten so bad in some topics lately that I just skim through topics to find ones that don't start with "I"
- malkia 7y agoI have a dynanometer, and I get it to show Error with my right hand. Left hand is about 85kg. I can squeeze (on good day) #3 Iron Mind (right hand), and #2.5 (left hand). Been gripping (but mostly that) for the last 3-4 years, though lots lots of muscle while diagnosed with diabetes II, almost year+half ago, and started low-carbo/keto diet (now I'm from 11 -> 5.6 without medication). Don't feel super-strong, can do few pull ups, few dips, dozen of push ups and I'm more than 40. Also hate running, hate it since the army... Point is, I'm skeptical of grip training ~ health. Or maybe if you've over-trained for that aspect, it may be lying...
- dean177 7y agoGrip strength is an indicator for overall fitness since it will improve from a range of activities, weightlifting being an obvious one but even something like cycling will have an improved grip compared to someone who doesn’t do anything. Improving your grip strength specifically won’t really improve your performance or overall fitness though (unless you are into rock climbing!)
- malkia 7y agoI'm seriously thinking of starting with deadlifting, but need to find someone to do it, show me proper. Right next to a 24th fitness, where I work, just need to set my mind for it.
- nradov 7y agoMost gyms have certified personal trainers available to hire. Pay an expert to give you a few lessons on proper form. That will help you avoid injury. Deadlifts are great, but mix in some other types of resistance training to maintain balance.
- glangdale 7y agoThe article itself stated that specifically training your grip strength won't magically give you better health outcomes - like you surmised, over-training that aspect breaks this metric. I think the causality runs the other way - untrained grip strength is a great indicator of a lot of useful things. Probably a good mix of neural and tendon and muscular stuff, not just a "let's go test a bunch of random people's flat bench press score and find out who's been hanging out in the gym a lot". Never tried the Iron Mind numbered grippers, but I have an Ivanko Super Gripper. I use it cautiously as years of Judo and BJJ have given me "high mileage hands".
- TomMckenny 7y agoI'm not sure it's a factor but the was a fad in the '80s or so for using what are now called Hand Grippers. I don't know how wide spread that fad was but if that was when the norms were established, it might bare considering.
- alexandercrohde 7y agoHow as nobody here connected the possibility that this is caused-by our reduced average testosterone levels [1]? If nobody else is gonna suggest its possibly environmental chemicals then I guess I get to be that guy. [1] https://academic.oup.com/jcem/article/92/1/196/2598434 https://academic.oup.com/jcem/article/92/1/196/2598434
- ken 7y agoWould that explain why women are suffering decreased grip strength, too?
- rks404 7y agonot just weaker, maybe a bit slower than our ancestors as well https://mindhacks.com/2018/04/03/did-the-victorians-have-faster-reactions/ https://mindhacks.com/2018/04/03/did-the-victorians-have-fas...