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Imagine if this meant not being able to send or receive currency.

ceejayoz 7y ago
Not hard. My bank's had the occasional (twice in four years, IIRC) debit/credit swipe outage of a couple of hours. It happens.
anbop 7y ago
And? That’s why cash exists.
- the-dude 7y ago
  In NL cash transactions of 10k+ already needed to be reported to the authorities. But a new law will forbid any cash transactions higher than 3k.
  - dlphn___xyz 7y ago
    whats the reasoning behind the new law?
    - Spearchucker 7y ago
      The revenue service is unaware of cash payments/purchases made by private parties and so cannot tax such transactions. Unless those private parties volunteer the information.
    - i_cant_speel 7y ago
      It looks like an attempt to prevent money laundering https://nltimes.nl/2019/07/01/dutch-govt-ban-cash-payments-eu3000-fight-money-laundering https://nltimes.nl/2019/07/01/dutch-govt-ban-cash-payments-e...
  - urtrs 7y ago
    In Greece it is forbidden by law any cash transaction higher than 500 euros.
thrusong 7y ago
I would say cash is used much less often in Canada than it used to be and most people just tap or swipe their Interac debit cards. Outages happen from time to time, usually during the mad Christmas shopping season, but life goes on.
- jeromegv 7y ago
  Anecdata is always funny because I hardly know anyone that uses debit. Credit all the way.
  - Fogest 7y ago
    In Canada though? Because in Canada it is definitely rare to see cash now except in boomers. Even a lot of places don't accept cash like gyms for even purchases like drinks or towels.
    - karlding 7y ago
      If you frequent small (generally Asian) restaurants, it's quite common to see signs saying they only accept cash in Vancouver. Otherwise, if they take credit, they may attempt to incentivize paying with cash via discounts.
      - perardi 7y ago
        Same, here in Toronto. My favourite Asian fruit market only takes cash, and a lot of the corner stores have a minimum purchase for cards. But any business with any sort of margin (as in, I’m not buying grapes for 99¢/pound) takes contactless payments. My gym would look at me like I’m crazy if I tried to pay with cash, and Billy Bishop airport has been cash-free for years.
  - quibono 7y ago
    Why is that? What's some advantages of having a credit card versus a debit one?
draw_down 7y ago
Never been to a place where the "credit card machine is down"?
buboard 7y ago
Has there ever been a major bitcoin or ethereum, or stellar outage?
- ceejayoz 7y ago
  Facebook's more akin to an exchange for Libra, isn't it? There's 28 companies partnering up for the system.
  - buboard 7y ago
    They have one wallet. But there is no reason for a wallet to depend on facebook being online, and presumably there will be 100 points of failure for the ledger on launch
- BearsAreCool 7y ago
  This is basically the point of decentralized systems. Foor bitcoin to work it relies by protocol on whoever is online, so effectively everyone using it would have to go offline for it to fail. Additionally, bitcoin really doesn't get updates that would dramatically change how things function enough for their to be an error introduced that would take things down. In comparison, FB and friends rely on a handful of servers that typically can be taken out by one poorly planned software upgrade. This is a gross simplification, but the basic idea is that more servers and diversity of the servers (which you get from decentralised protocols) should lead to crashes not taking out the whole network.
- pigeons 7y ago
  https://medium.com/stellar-developers-blog/may-15th-network-halt-a7b933103984 https://medium.com/stellar-developers-blog/may-15th-network-...
- sekai 7y ago
  Nope, that's the beauty of decentralized network, it never goes offline while there at least some clients connected. You could disrupt the network with other ways though.
nemothekid 7y ago
You don't have to imagine - Wells Fargo was down for several hours earlier this year and no one could send or receive any money. People couldn't pay bills, transfer money and some couldn't even buy gas.
- londons_explore 7y ago
  > some couldn't even buy gas. How culture changes perspectives! Over here in Europe I was thinking "doesn't sound so bad". Then I realised over in the US, gas means petrol, and without petrol America doesn't work. I'll reply to any replies after I've taken the electric train home.
  - adventured 7y ago
    You're not being fair to Europe's very impressive contributions. After all, European companies lead the way in the production of rolling pollution machines, aka ICE vehicles. Besides, the US has cleaner air than most of Europe, thanks to the intense diesel particulate pollution across European cities. Who can forget the infamous Paris smog photos from a few years ago (which is still an ongoing problem)? Don't worry though, the US invented the modern electric car, twice, in the form of GM's EV1 and Tesla. We'll lead the European automakers out of the dark ages - underway right now as they all chase Tesla - and take care of the problem of the ICE automobile that Europe was heavily responsible for. In the process cities like Paris will be smog free again, finally.
    - tomglynch 7y ago
      I don't think he meant to offend you. Moving around in many if not most European cities without a car is a lot easier than to do so in the US. The US also has higher cars per capita: https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_by_vehicles_per_capita https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_by_vehicle...
      - deleted 7y ago
        [deleted]
narnianal 7y ago
I can answer that. For money! https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MiJPsOI61qE https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MiJPsOI61qE (quote from a tv show where the anti-hero destroys an intergalactic empire by setting the value of all money from 1 to 0; in the scene is the alien "white house" having a discussion what to do without money)
anon_z88 7y ago
LibraCoin reference? haha

Not hard. My bank's had the occasional (twice in four years, IIRC) debit/credit swipe outage of a couple of hours. It happens.

anbop 7y ago

And? That’s why cash exists.

the-dude 7y ago
In NL cash transactions of 10k+ already needed to be reported to the authorities. But a new law will forbid any cash transactions higher than 3k.
- dlphn___xyz 7y ago
  whats the reasoning behind the new law?
  - Spearchucker 7y ago
    The revenue service is unaware of cash payments/purchases made by private parties and so cannot tax such transactions. Unless those private parties volunteer the information.
  - i_cant_speel 7y ago
    It looks like an attempt to prevent money laundering https://nltimes.nl/2019/07/01/dutch-govt-ban-cash-payments-eu3000-fight-money-laundering https://nltimes.nl/2019/07/01/dutch-govt-ban-cash-payments-e...
- urtrs 7y ago
  In Greece it is forbidden by law any cash transaction higher than 500 euros.

thrusong 7y ago

I would say cash is used much less often in Canada than it used to be and most people just tap or swipe their Interac debit cards. Outages happen from time to time, usually during the mad Christmas shopping season, but life goes on.

jeromegv 7y ago
Anecdata is always funny because I hardly know anyone that uses debit. Credit all the way.
- Fogest 7y ago
  In Canada though? Because in Canada it is definitely rare to see cash now except in boomers. Even a lot of places don't accept cash like gyms for even purchases like drinks or towels.
  - karlding 7y ago
    If you frequent small (generally Asian) restaurants, it's quite common to see signs saying they only accept cash in Vancouver. Otherwise, if they take credit, they may attempt to incentivize paying with cash via discounts.
    - perardi 7y ago
      Same, here in Toronto. My favourite Asian fruit market only takes cash, and a lot of the corner stores have a minimum purchase for cards. But any business with any sort of margin (as in, I’m not buying grapes for 99¢/pound) takes contactless payments. My gym would look at me like I’m crazy if I tried to pay with cash, and Billy Bishop airport has been cash-free for years.
- quibono 7y ago
  Why is that? What's some advantages of having a credit card versus a debit one?

draw_down 7y ago

Never been to a place where the "credit card machine is down"?

buboard 7y ago

Has there ever been a major bitcoin or ethereum, or stellar outage?

ceejayoz 7y ago
Facebook's more akin to an exchange for Libra, isn't it? There's 28 companies partnering up for the system.
- buboard 7y ago
  They have one wallet. But there is no reason for a wallet to depend on facebook being online, and presumably there will be 100 points of failure for the ledger on launch
BearsAreCool 7y ago
This is basically the point of decentralized systems. Foor bitcoin to work it relies by protocol on whoever is online, so effectively everyone using it would have to go offline for it to fail. Additionally, bitcoin really doesn't get updates that would dramatically change how things function enough for their to be an error introduced that would take things down. In comparison, FB and friends rely on a handful of servers that typically can be taken out by one poorly planned software upgrade. This is a gross simplification, but the basic idea is that more servers and diversity of the servers (which you get from decentralised protocols) should lead to crashes not taking out the whole network.
pigeons 7y ago
https://medium.com/stellar-developers-blog/may-15th-network-halt-a7b933103984 https://medium.com/stellar-developers-blog/may-15th-network-...
sekai 7y ago
Nope, that's the beauty of decentralized network, it never goes offline while there at least some clients connected. You could disrupt the network with other ways though.

nemothekid 7y ago

You don't have to imagine - Wells Fargo was down for several hours earlier this year and no one could send or receive any money. People couldn't pay bills, transfer money and some couldn't even buy gas.

londons_explore 7y ago
> some couldn't even buy gas. How culture changes perspectives! Over here in Europe I was thinking "doesn't sound so bad". Then I realised over in the US, gas means petrol, and without petrol America doesn't work. I'll reply to any replies after I've taken the electric train home.
- adventured 7y ago
  You're not being fair to Europe's very impressive contributions. After all, European companies lead the way in the production of rolling pollution machines, aka ICE vehicles. Besides, the US has cleaner air than most of Europe, thanks to the intense diesel particulate pollution across European cities. Who can forget the infamous Paris smog photos from a few years ago (which is still an ongoing problem)? Don't worry though, the US invented the modern electric car, twice, in the form of GM's EV1 and Tesla. We'll lead the European automakers out of the dark ages - underway right now as they all chase Tesla - and take care of the problem of the ICE automobile that Europe was heavily responsible for. In the process cities like Paris will be smog free again, finally.
  - tomglynch 7y ago
    I don't think he meant to offend you. Moving around in many if not most European cities without a car is a lot easier than to do so in the US. The US also has higher cars per capita: https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_by_vehicles_per_capita https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_by_vehicle...
    - deleted 7y ago
      [deleted]

narnianal 7y ago

I can answer that. For money! https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MiJPsOI61qE https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MiJPsOI61qE (quote from a tv show where the anti-hero destroys an intergalactic empire by setting the value of all money from 1 to 0; in the scene is the alien "white house" having a discussion what to do without money)

anon_z88 7y ago

LibraCoin reference? haha