10 ms·

What I Learned Co-Founding Dribbble

308 points by doppp 7y ago

whywhywhywhy 7y ago
https://www.theverge.com/2019/6/26/18759672/dribbble-ceo-zack-onisko-timothy-reynolds-account-suspension https://www.theverge.com/2019/6/26/18759672/dribbble-ceo-zac... Not sure I'd consider any company good that bans (highly followed) users who disagree with the owners or criticize the site on other social networks.
- icxa 7y ago
  So you don't don't think any social network company is good, because they all do this to some extent, some more explicitly than others. On a different note, maybe I just see this differently. > “In this specific case, community flags triggered a temporary suspension." It seems like the comments this user was making did not resonate with users of the site. This is the reality of having a social site: you have to deal with people's actions, decisions, and opinions, however rational or irrational you view them to be. It's the same kind of thing that happens almost anywhere else in any other social situation.
  - mrcodedude 7y ago
    Or Dribbble is lying. ¯\_(ツ)_/¯
- VuongN 7y ago
  I read the article and full disclosure, I don't use Dribbble and am not a member. My thought is that temporarily suspending a user based on report from community members is reasonable. Dribbble looks like a very social/community-centric site, I'd imagine if a rogue member were to post inappropriate content, the community can come together and help moderate. This also mean that if community members feel personally offended and take it the other way, and ding someone like in this instance, the site steps in and make it right. Again, Dribbble unbanned him shortly after. I just feel like it's a non-issue-but that's just my opinion.
  - mrcodedude 7y ago
    That is very obviously not what happened. https://dribbble.com/turnislefthome https://dribbble.com/turnislefthome 50k followers, no new shots since February. This isn't a "rogue account" posting "inappropriate content." Don't you think it is suspect that his account (no activity in months) is "flagged" on the same day the CEO blocks him on Twitter for legitimate chirps?
    - jmull 7y ago
      The guy was ranting away on twitter about some recently announced changes, attacking the company and the CEO. It doesn't take a conspiracy for both the users to flag him and the CEO to block him in response. I don't know and I'm not going to try to guess, but I think the simplest answer is the most likely and the simplest answer is that the angry rant elicited strong reactions from multiple people.
      - huhtenberg 7y ago
        This "guy" has been an integral part of the Dribbble community for as long as I can remember, churning out and sharing absolutely incredible work. Just look at his portfolio. Front page material, literally created a new style trend with his desaturated low-poly mini scenes. Dribbble got from him being a member far more than he got from being on Dribbble. If there's someone who full on deserves the right to criticize the site, that'd be him. CEO picked a personal fight with one of most visible and respected members. He should've not. It was indeed _petty_.
        jmull 7y ago
        It's great he has been such a strong contributor to the community, but that doesn't mean people can't object to a twitter rant. > CEO picked a personal fight Did he though? That's not evident. Maybe you know differently? Honestly, I don't really care, but I see one guy ranting in public, throwing around angry insults and accusations without backup and I'm OK if people don't give him what he wants.
_rrnv 7y ago
This post will probably be undervalued and overlooked guessing by the slow pace of points and comments, but over the years I have read countless similar ones and to be honest this is the most substantial writeup I have ever encountered. Each point is exactly what matters. The tshirt idea is brilliant. Thanks!
- leetrout 7y ago
  It was a great read and certainly aligns with my take-aways from being at a startup from day 1 as well as joining other startups at early and late stages.
leetrout 7y ago
This is a great article and while my startup didn't make it past 5 members the advice in here is solid. On shirts (and swag): My startup had a mascot at the end and I wish we would have had it upfront and had stickers. It may seem trite but it's even documented in books like Managing the Unmanageable (or might have been Peopleware) that Apple made shirts for projects. When I worked at NatGeo we made internal swag for our project. For me personally, living in a world of intangible software, stickers and shirts give me something physical I can hold in my hand. Something I can wear or point to and relate to what I'm doing. On not knowing what you're doing: I think the best people I've worked with are very intelligent and curious and do great work for things they don't understand because they ask a ton of questions to learn it which helps lead to epiphanies. It doesn't always shake out that way but with a group of motivated individuals it is so rewarding. On everything being temporary: Leaving design / trends aside and looking at our code-- our engineering-- this is absolutely true. For any devops engineers out here reading this: repeatability helps a TON. It's so much easier to migrate from bash scripts to RPM/Deb and from RPM/Deb to Docker. Or from [Puppet|Chef|Ansible|Salt] to [New Flavor Of The Week]. Once it's codified in some way it's so easy to move it forward. Automation == repeatability == freedom. On people are everything: Please, please, please don't hire smart jerks. Great, you're smart, you can program in 10 languages and worked at a FANG. If the team doesn't want to sit next to you and work with you on a project I am hoping to shape my life, my future and my family's outcomes 8+ hours a day (even remote) it's going to spoil the whole bunch. I could go on and on for each section. I loved this article. Y'all will certainly find parts you disagree with but on the whole it is great and very applicable.
- janlaureys 7y ago
  Smart jerks are the worst. I work with a few of them and they can really be insufferable. They interrupt every conversation (IRL or through Rocketchat) because they know absolutely everything about the subject you happend to be talking about. I have started to use the AKSHUALLY meme image in retaliation from time to time. But what gets me the most is their self-importance. The bragging about the import people they have met, or the presentations they are asked to do. It gets really old really quick.
  - 7y ago
webdood90 7y ago
A refreshing read, honestly.
tmepskdj 7y ago
The best advice I ever read on founding your own company. Clear and concise without any fluff about big markets.
tiffanyh 7y ago
For those not aware, Dribbble was acquired by Metalab/Tiny back in 2017 (and is briefly referenced under #20) https://medium.com/@awilkinson/dribbble-2-0-c2cd1fa184c5#.8k5gezlet https://medium.com/@awilkinson/dribbble-2-0-c2cd1fa184c5#.8k...
dvtrn 7y ago
Dan and some of his early books and tutorials / opinions on web design I owe so much of my career to. It’s always a treat seeing him pop up here.
bredren 7y ago
I am not as convinced making a t-shirt for your startup as a first thing is a great idea. I think that can actually be an indicator of playing house. But you can do whatever you want.
- joegahona 7y ago
  I worked on a musical once where the book writer did photo shoots, logos, and T-shirts before the actual script, and it was a sign of bad things to come. So I agree with you and think this advice is mainly only a thing if you're on the level of Cederholm. As an aside, I like the idea of ending a response with "But you can do whatever you want." I'm going to end every work email today with that!
  - deleted 7y ago
    [deleted]
- dpeck 7y ago
  shirts can be printed on demand for less than $35 at MoQs of 1. Its not a large expense and it builds some camaraderie on a small and newly formed team. People like symbols and having artifacts from a specific time in their life. Get the tshirts/hoodies, but don't spend more than a couple hours picking a design.
- CalChris 7y ago
  T-shirts are cheap. Business cards are pointless. You want to talk about playing house (awesome phrase by the way) even thinking about cool digs. That’s playing house.
  - bredren 7y ago
    I’m not sure but I think I heard this phrase from Michael Seibel—Edit I think PG used this in an essay actually. edit: It is in this lecture: https://startupclass.samaltman.com/courses/lec03/ https://startupclass.samaltman.com/courses/lec03/ It is described as "...because while imitating all the outward forms of starting a startup, they have neglected the one thing that is actually essential, which is to make something people want."
VuongN 7y ago
Was reading article while listening to his banjo song: https://dancederholm.bandcamp.com/track/election-day https://dancederholm.bandcamp.com/track/election-day. Good article, fellow Masshol...yman!
bdotdub 7y ago
I really like Dan and have been following his stuff since the mid-2000s, but it's hard to apply this advice generally. #2 and #3 are only effective if you're Dan Cederholm. He already had a reputation which put him in a very luxurious position to essentially choose his first users and have them actually use it. The same goes for #3 – imagine if all of the "people you want on your platform" got tshirts and postcards from every startup that wanted them?
- GVIrish 7y ago
  Don't take it so literally. Can you find 100 people (or a few dozen) in your circles that could be first users of your product? Start with them. If you have trouble gaining traction with those folks, you may have trouble getting others to pay for your product. The caveat being that you have to make sure the people you're inviting fit somewhere in your customer profile. You can get discouraging feedback if your initial invitees don't fit your product.
fabiensanglard 7y ago
Great content. But why use ragged-right?
- sp332 7y ago
  Because justified leads to inconsistent word and letter spacing.
  - CharlesW 7y ago
    Fully-justified text is also generally harder to read for everyone, but for dyslexic folks especially. On the web, this is exacerbated by browsers' relatively poor support for fine, print-quality type layout.
    - omarchowdhury 7y ago
      Do you have any links that explore this?
      - mattkevan 7y ago
        Studies have found that justified text reduces reading speed by up to 11% as the eye has to do more work to find the next word as they’re irregularly spaced. I did a quick search and found a PDF [0] (page 8) referencing a study from 1986, but a lot of work has been done on typography and readability over the years. Actually, even though it’s pretty old, that document is full of solid design advice. [0] http://core.ecu.edu/engl/tpc/MennoMenno/ftp/williams%202000.pdf http://core.ecu.edu/engl/tpc/MennoMenno/ftp/williams%202000....
hurricanesugar 7y ago
One thing Dan didn't mention in the article is that he wrote 3 books about web design before Dribbble's launch: Web Design Solutions (2004), Bulletproof Web Design (2005) and Handcrafted CSS (2009). These books were unique among the first to hit a then-niche market: web designers who cared about quality. This was the perfect set-up to launching a platform for web designers who cared about quality and likely foundational to the early growth of Dribbble.
- rglover 7y ago
  That should speak highly, then, of putting in work beforehand to have an initial audience (and indirectly, prove your authority on the topic underlying your product).
  - hurricanesugar 7y ago
    Reminds me of Nathan Barry (nathanbarry.com) who did the same thing before he launched a successful product called ConvertKit.
- huhtenberg 7y ago
  Precisely. What launched Dribbble into a high orbit was a combination of three things. 1. It was really well executed. It didn't just look good, it has zero friction in use. The UX was flawless. You'd think "I wonder if I can do this", click where it would logically belong and, lo and behold, that thing was there and it worked exactly as you'd expect. It was, to use pg's qualifier, delightful. 2. It was seeded with top-tier designers from the start whom Dan was able to recruit because he was well-known in respective circles. If I were to try and reproduce this, it won't work no matter who good the site was, simply because I am nobody with no street rep. 3. Invitation-only system that was completely closed to the public in the beginning. All you'd see are "leaked" screenshots on sites like PatternTap from the member of the cool boys club, and they looked spectacular. So when they allowed public in, still with no way to post, the whole thing just took off - it already had the community that was massively appealing and it was flattering to become a part of it. Invites were golden, the hype was over the top. Regrettably, after it was sold to Tiny/Meta the quality of the site took a nose dive. They keep pushing out questionable "improvements" that clearly aim to improve their engagement stats rather than to be actually useful to the members. They reworked Pro accounts, bloating them with very niche and largely useless features and using that to raise the prices. What used to be an annual $20 no-brainer tip to Dan and Rich for their great job become an obnoxious $60/year subscription. They were getting an earful with every such improvement, so they now disable comments on every new announcement. I really wish Dan was back an the helm. He and Rich showed very unusual levels of restraint and common sense, and they did in fact listen to the people rather their analytics numbers. * A Dribbble member since 2010.
dewitt 7y ago
> "What I Learned Co-Founding Dribble" As a benefit to readers who aren't already familiar with Dribble, or with the author, perhaps he could add a quick introductory sentence to the article saying both who "I" refers to, and also what Dribble is. Interestingly, neither anywhere appears on the page anywhere, nor above the fold on the "About" page. PS: Seems like a good article and a very interesting author.
haolez 7y ago
The point about hiring good lawyers and accountants is important. I’ve been misguided in the past project by both lawyers and accountants that didn’t know my type of business very well, but acting like they did.
uptown 7y ago
Any other HN users also Dribble users? Here's mine: https://dribbble.com/davidmcooper https://dribbble.com/davidmcooper
- deleted 7y ago
  [deleted]
apl002 7y ago
I am curious, especially being a logo/branding expert, if Dan ever got push back on 3 b's in the name?
- mi100hael 7y ago
  Not Dan, but naming these days is hard. You basically have to invent a word to get a .com domain and good SEO. "Dribbble" is good because you can tell people "the name is 'dribble' with three b's" and people will immediately know how to spell it and their first instinct will be "dribbble.com" and if they search for it, it will be the top search result. Contrast that with a properly-spelled word like "Dribble." Their app will be nowhere near the top of any search result and people will go to dribble.com which is no-doubt already registered so they'll lose traffic because the domain will have to be something else unintuitive like dribble.io or dribbleapp.com.
  - apl002 7y ago
    " "Dribbble" is good because you can tell people "the name is 'dribble' with three b's" and people will immediately know how to spell it and their first instinct will be "dribbble.com" and if they search for it, it will be the top search result. " Totally agree with that. great point. I asked his question cause I am considering 3 letters in my startups name and I often use Dribbble as a reference that it can be done. I've done for the exact reason you mentioned. In 2019, getting a .com domain + instagram + twitter handles is really difficult.
dbmueller 7y ago
Regarding 'start up's: I have a project idea that i think is pretty good and think could actually be useful to people and fill a niche, but: * Nobody close to me I mentioned it to seems really interested. * I am not 100% sure it would actually work/be useful/generate revenue/... * I work full time and don't really want to invest my week-ends developing an idea I'm not sure will catch on. What's the best next step? How do I evaluate my idea's chances? How can I get feedback without risking it getting stolen (very little chance but it would sting)
- bredren 7y ago
  It sounds like you should not do it. Bootstrapping startups take commitment to use your free time. Raising money requires you show effort that would take up your free time. Worrying about having your idea stolen shows you haven’t spent much time learning about how this stuff works. Either dive in or go do something else.
  - dbmueller 7y ago
    But the thing is I like the idea and should like to see it executed (by me ideally)
    - GFischer 7y ago
      Set up a very short timeframe and goal - let´s say, I´m going to make a prototype (or code feature X) this weekend. Then show it here :) . The risk of it "getting stolen" exists, of course.. but if you don´t do it it´s exactly the same. If you aren´t convinced, you think someone else will have the time and commitment to do it? Unless they were already planning on it. My recommendation: go ahead and do it. Maybe you need some structured help, join a hackathon?
      - dbmueller 7y ago
        Fair points. I like the 'short timeframe/small goal' idea... might try that. Thanks for the tips!
mi100hael 7y ago
> "No thanks, I’m too busy." > I know. What a moron I was. I don't think that's moronic. No one should hold it against you if you have to say no to things because you already have a full plate. Saying "no" is healthy. People should do it (politely, of course) more often.
keithnz 7y ago
I "discovered" dribble a little while ago, but I've just realized I think I have been completely unaware of what it really is. I found and use it for helping select color combos. I basically go to https://dribbble.com/colors/E94F2E https://dribbble.com/colors/E94F2E with a color I'm pondering about, and just find pleasing combos, click through to their palette. Very cool. I was thinking it would be nice to have a vscode plugin color picker based on this. It's certainly help me make nicer looking things.
nojvek 7y ago
His piece about funding was very true. If you truly care about the community and slowly evolving things, VC may not be the right approach. VC money is about scaling fast and colonizing. It may not be for everyone and I'm guessing tons of great products got destroyed because they tried to grow too fast before getting a product market fit.
winter_blue 7y ago
Wow, this is a really great article. My favorite pieces of advice are the last four ones: > 17. Write, teach, and share what you’re learning I totally agree. Getting into blogging, and being a part of a blogging community can be a great way to connect with people in your field, and help others along the way. > 18. Don’t take funding Yes! > 19. Take care of yourself first This is too often under-emphasized. > 20. Knowing when to let go Something that we all probably struggle with.

308 points by doppp 7y ago

https://www.theverge.com/2019/6/26/18759672/dribbble-ceo-zack-onisko-timothy-reynolds-account-suspension https://www.theverge.com/2019/6/26/18759672/dribbble-ceo-zac... Not sure I'd consider any company good that bans (highly followed) users who disagree with the owners or criticize the site on other social networks.

icxa 7y ago
So you don't don't think any social network company is good, because they all do this to some extent, some more explicitly than others. On a different note, maybe I just see this differently. > “In this specific case, community flags triggered a temporary suspension." It seems like the comments this user was making did not resonate with users of the site. This is the reality of having a social site: you have to deal with people's actions, decisions, and opinions, however rational or irrational you view them to be. It's the same kind of thing that happens almost anywhere else in any other social situation.
- mrcodedude 7y ago
  Or Dribbble is lying. ¯\_(ツ)_/¯
VuongN 7y ago
I read the article and full disclosure, I don't use Dribbble and am not a member. My thought is that temporarily suspending a user based on report from community members is reasonable. Dribbble looks like a very social/community-centric site, I'd imagine if a rogue member were to post inappropriate content, the community can come together and help moderate. This also mean that if community members feel personally offended and take it the other way, and ding someone like in this instance, the site steps in and make it right. Again, Dribbble unbanned him shortly after. I just feel like it's a non-issue-but that's just my opinion.
- mrcodedude 7y ago
  That is very obviously not what happened. https://dribbble.com/turnislefthome https://dribbble.com/turnislefthome 50k followers, no new shots since February. This isn't a "rogue account" posting "inappropriate content." Don't you think it is suspect that his account (no activity in months) is "flagged" on the same day the CEO blocks him on Twitter for legitimate chirps?
  - jmull 7y ago
    The guy was ranting away on twitter about some recently announced changes, attacking the company and the CEO. It doesn't take a conspiracy for both the users to flag him and the CEO to block him in response. I don't know and I'm not going to try to guess, but I think the simplest answer is the most likely and the simplest answer is that the angry rant elicited strong reactions from multiple people.
    - huhtenberg 7y ago
      This "guy" has been an integral part of the Dribbble community for as long as I can remember, churning out and sharing absolutely incredible work. Just look at his portfolio. Front page material, literally created a new style trend with his desaturated low-poly mini scenes. Dribbble got from him being a member far more than he got from being on Dribbble. If there's someone who full on deserves the right to criticize the site, that'd be him. CEO picked a personal fight with one of most visible and respected members. He should've not. It was indeed _petty_.
      - jmull 7y ago
        It's great he has been such a strong contributor to the community, but that doesn't mean people can't object to a twitter rant. > CEO picked a personal fight Did he though? That's not evident. Maybe you know differently? Honestly, I don't really care, but I see one guy ranting in public, throwing around angry insults and accusations without backup and I'm OK if people don't give him what he wants.

_rrnv 7y ago

This post will probably be undervalued and overlooked guessing by the slow pace of points and comments, but over the years I have read countless similar ones and to be honest this is the most substantial writeup I have ever encountered. Each point is exactly what matters. The tshirt idea is brilliant. Thanks!

leetrout 7y ago
It was a great read and certainly aligns with my take-aways from being at a startup from day 1 as well as joining other startups at early and late stages.

leetrout 7y ago

This is a great article and while my startup didn't make it past 5 members the advice in here is solid. On shirts (and swag): My startup had a mascot at the end and I wish we would have had it upfront and had stickers. It may seem trite but it's even documented in books like Managing the Unmanageable (or might have been Peopleware) that Apple made shirts for projects. When I worked at NatGeo we made internal swag for our project. For me personally, living in a world of intangible software, stickers and shirts give me something physical I can hold in my hand. Something I can wear or point to and relate to what I'm doing. On not knowing what you're doing: I think the best people I've worked with are very intelligent and curious and do great work for things they don't understand because they ask a ton of questions to learn it which helps lead to epiphanies. It doesn't always shake out that way but with a group of motivated individuals it is so rewarding. On everything being temporary: Leaving design / trends aside and looking at our code-- our engineering-- this is absolutely true. For any devops engineers out here reading this: repeatability helps a TON. It's so much easier to migrate from bash scripts to RPM/Deb and from RPM/Deb to Docker. Or from [Puppet|Chef|Ansible|Salt] to [New Flavor Of The Week]. Once it's codified in some way it's so easy to move it forward. Automation == repeatability == freedom. On people are everything: Please, please, please don't hire smart jerks. Great, you're smart, you can program in 10 languages and worked at a FANG. If the team doesn't want to sit next to you and work with you on a project I am hoping to shape my life, my future and my family's outcomes 8+ hours a day (even remote) it's going to spoil the whole bunch. I could go on and on for each section. I loved this article. Y'all will certainly find parts you disagree with but on the whole it is great and very applicable.

janlaureys 7y ago
Smart jerks are the worst. I work with a few of them and they can really be insufferable. They interrupt every conversation (IRL or through Rocketchat) because they know absolutely everything about the subject you happend to be talking about. I have started to use the AKSHUALLY meme image in retaliation from time to time. But what gets me the most is their self-importance. The bragging about the import people they have met, or the presentations they are asked to do. It gets really old really quick.
- 7y ago

webdood90 7y ago

A refreshing read, honestly.

tmepskdj 7y ago

The best advice I ever read on founding your own company. Clear and concise without any fluff about big markets.

tiffanyh 7y ago

For those not aware, Dribbble was acquired by Metalab/Tiny back in 2017 (and is briefly referenced under #20) https://medium.com/@awilkinson/dribbble-2-0-c2cd1fa184c5#.8k5gezlet https://medium.com/@awilkinson/dribbble-2-0-c2cd1fa184c5#.8k...

dvtrn 7y ago

Dan and some of his early books and tutorials / opinions on web design I owe so much of my career to. It’s always a treat seeing him pop up here.

bredren 7y ago

I am not as convinced making a t-shirt for your startup as a first thing is a great idea. I think that can actually be an indicator of playing house. But you can do whatever you want.

joegahona 7y ago
I worked on a musical once where the book writer did photo shoots, logos, and T-shirts before the actual script, and it was a sign of bad things to come. So I agree with you and think this advice is mainly only a thing if you're on the level of Cederholm. As an aside, I like the idea of ending a response with "But you can do whatever you want." I'm going to end every work email today with that!
- deleted 7y ago
  [deleted]
dpeck 7y ago
shirts can be printed on demand for less than $35 at MoQs of 1. Its not a large expense and it builds some camaraderie on a small and newly formed team. People like symbols and having artifacts from a specific time in their life. Get the tshirts/hoodies, but don't spend more than a couple hours picking a design.
CalChris 7y ago
T-shirts are cheap. Business cards are pointless. You want to talk about playing house (awesome phrase by the way) even thinking about cool digs. That’s playing house.
- bredren 7y ago
  I’m not sure but I think I heard this phrase from Michael Seibel—Edit I think PG used this in an essay actually. edit: It is in this lecture: https://startupclass.samaltman.com/courses/lec03/ https://startupclass.samaltman.com/courses/lec03/ It is described as "...because while imitating all the outward forms of starting a startup, they have neglected the one thing that is actually essential, which is to make something people want."

VuongN 7y ago

Was reading article while listening to his banjo song: https://dancederholm.bandcamp.com/track/election-day https://dancederholm.bandcamp.com/track/election-day. Good article, fellow Masshol...yman!

bdotdub 7y ago

I really like Dan and have been following his stuff since the mid-2000s, but it's hard to apply this advice generally. #2 and #3 are only effective if you're Dan Cederholm. He already had a reputation which put him in a very luxurious position to essentially choose his first users and have them actually use it. The same goes for #3 – imagine if all of the "people you want on your platform" got tshirts and postcards from every startup that wanted them?

GVIrish 7y ago
Don't take it so literally. Can you find 100 people (or a few dozen) in your circles that could be first users of your product? Start with them. If you have trouble gaining traction with those folks, you may have trouble getting others to pay for your product. The caveat being that you have to make sure the people you're inviting fit somewhere in your customer profile. You can get discouraging feedback if your initial invitees don't fit your product.

fabiensanglard 7y ago

Great content. But why use ragged-right?

sp332 7y ago
Because justified leads to inconsistent word and letter spacing.
- CharlesW 7y ago
  Fully-justified text is also generally harder to read for everyone, but for dyslexic folks especially. On the web, this is exacerbated by browsers' relatively poor support for fine, print-quality type layout.
  - omarchowdhury 7y ago
    Do you have any links that explore this?
    - mattkevan 7y ago
      Studies have found that justified text reduces reading speed by up to 11% as the eye has to do more work to find the next word as they’re irregularly spaced. I did a quick search and found a PDF [0] (page 8) referencing a study from 1986, but a lot of work has been done on typography and readability over the years. Actually, even though it’s pretty old, that document is full of solid design advice. [0] http://core.ecu.edu/engl/tpc/MennoMenno/ftp/williams%202000.pdf http://core.ecu.edu/engl/tpc/MennoMenno/ftp/williams%202000....

hurricanesugar 7y ago

One thing Dan didn't mention in the article is that he wrote 3 books about web design before Dribbble's launch: Web Design Solutions (2004), Bulletproof Web Design (2005) and Handcrafted CSS (2009). These books were unique among the first to hit a then-niche market: web designers who cared about quality. This was the perfect set-up to launching a platform for web designers who cared about quality and likely foundational to the early growth of Dribbble.

rglover 7y ago
That should speak highly, then, of putting in work beforehand to have an initial audience (and indirectly, prove your authority on the topic underlying your product).
- hurricanesugar 7y ago
  Reminds me of Nathan Barry (nathanbarry.com) who did the same thing before he launched a successful product called ConvertKit.
huhtenberg 7y ago
Precisely. What launched Dribbble into a high orbit was a combination of three things. 1. It was really well executed. It didn't just look good, it has zero friction in use. The UX was flawless. You'd think "I wonder if I can do this", click where it would logically belong and, lo and behold, that thing was there and it worked exactly as you'd expect. It was, to use pg's qualifier, delightful. 2. It was seeded with top-tier designers from the start whom Dan was able to recruit because he was well-known in respective circles. If I were to try and reproduce this, it won't work no matter who good the site was, simply because I am nobody with no street rep. 3. Invitation-only system that was completely closed to the public in the beginning. All you'd see are "leaked" screenshots on sites like PatternTap from the member of the cool boys club, and they looked spectacular. So when they allowed public in, still with no way to post, the whole thing just took off - it already had the community that was massively appealing and it was flattering to become a part of it. Invites were golden, the hype was over the top. Regrettably, after it was sold to Tiny/Meta the quality of the site took a nose dive. They keep pushing out questionable "improvements" that clearly aim to improve their engagement stats rather than to be actually useful to the members. They reworked Pro accounts, bloating them with very niche and largely useless features and using that to raise the prices. What used to be an annual $20 no-brainer tip to Dan and Rich for their great job become an obnoxious $60/year subscription. They were getting an earful with every such improvement, so they now disable comments on every new announcement. I really wish Dan was back an the helm. He and Rich showed very unusual levels of restraint and common sense, and they did in fact listen to the people rather their analytics numbers. * A Dribbble member since 2010.

dewitt 7y ago

> "What I Learned Co-Founding Dribble" As a benefit to readers who aren't already familiar with Dribble, or with the author, perhaps he could add a quick introductory sentence to the article saying both who "I" refers to, and also what Dribble is. Interestingly, neither anywhere appears on the page anywhere, nor above the fold on the "About" page. PS: Seems like a good article and a very interesting author.

haolez 7y ago

The point about hiring good lawyers and accountants is important. I’ve been misguided in the past project by both lawyers and accountants that didn’t know my type of business very well, but acting like they did.

uptown 7y ago

Any other HN users also Dribble users? Here's mine: https://dribbble.com/davidmcooper https://dribbble.com/davidmcooper

deleted 7y ago
[deleted]

apl002 7y ago

I am curious, especially being a logo/branding expert, if Dan ever got push back on 3 b's in the name?

mi100hael 7y ago
Not Dan, but naming these days is hard. You basically have to invent a word to get a .com domain and good SEO. "Dribbble" is good because you can tell people "the name is 'dribble' with three b's" and people will immediately know how to spell it and their first instinct will be "dribbble.com" and if they search for it, it will be the top search result. Contrast that with a properly-spelled word like "Dribble." Their app will be nowhere near the top of any search result and people will go to dribble.com which is no-doubt already registered so they'll lose traffic because the domain will have to be something else unintuitive like dribble.io or dribbleapp.com.
- apl002 7y ago
  " "Dribbble" is good because you can tell people "the name is 'dribble' with three b's" and people will immediately know how to spell it and their first instinct will be "dribbble.com" and if they search for it, it will be the top search result. " Totally agree with that. great point. I asked his question cause I am considering 3 letters in my startups name and I often use Dribbble as a reference that it can be done. I've done for the exact reason you mentioned. In 2019, getting a .com domain + instagram + twitter handles is really difficult.

dbmueller 7y ago

Regarding 'start up's: I have a project idea that i think is pretty good and think could actually be useful to people and fill a niche, but: * Nobody close to me I mentioned it to seems really interested. * I am not 100% sure it would actually work/be useful/generate revenue/... * I work full time and don't really want to invest my week-ends developing an idea I'm not sure will catch on. What's the best next step? How do I evaluate my idea's chances? How can I get feedback without risking it getting stolen (very little chance but it would sting)

bredren 7y ago
It sounds like you should not do it. Bootstrapping startups take commitment to use your free time. Raising money requires you show effort that would take up your free time. Worrying about having your idea stolen shows you haven’t spent much time learning about how this stuff works. Either dive in or go do something else.
- dbmueller 7y ago
  But the thing is I like the idea and should like to see it executed (by me ideally)
  - GFischer 7y ago
    Set up a very short timeframe and goal - let´s say, I´m going to make a prototype (or code feature X) this weekend. Then show it here :) . The risk of it "getting stolen" exists, of course.. but if you don´t do it it´s exactly the same. If you aren´t convinced, you think someone else will have the time and commitment to do it? Unless they were already planning on it. My recommendation: go ahead and do it. Maybe you need some structured help, join a hackathon?
    - dbmueller 7y ago
      Fair points. I like the 'short timeframe/small goal' idea... might try that. Thanks for the tips!

mi100hael 7y ago

> "No thanks, I’m too busy." > I know. What a moron I was. I don't think that's moronic. No one should hold it against you if you have to say no to things because you already have a full plate. Saying "no" is healthy. People should do it (politely, of course) more often.

keithnz 7y ago

I "discovered" dribble a little while ago, but I've just realized I think I have been completely unaware of what it really is. I found and use it for helping select color combos. I basically go to https://dribbble.com/colors/E94F2E https://dribbble.com/colors/E94F2E with a color I'm pondering about, and just find pleasing combos, click through to their palette. Very cool. I was thinking it would be nice to have a vscode plugin color picker based on this. It's certainly help me make nicer looking things.

nojvek 7y ago

His piece about funding was very true. If you truly care about the community and slowly evolving things, VC may not be the right approach. VC money is about scaling fast and colonizing. It may not be for everyone and I'm guessing tons of great products got destroyed because they tried to grow too fast before getting a product market fit.

winter_blue 7y ago

Wow, this is a really great article. My favorite pieces of advice are the last four ones: > 17. Write, teach, and share what you’re learning I totally agree. Getting into blogging, and being a part of a blogging community can be a great way to connect with people in your field, and help others along the way. > 18. Don’t take funding Yes! > 19. Take care of yourself first This is too often under-emphasized. > 20. Knowing when to let go Something that we all probably struggle with.