7 ms·

Last year I wanted to buy Thinking in Bets (great book, btw). I was feeling impatient, so I looked it up on Barnes and Noble's website, and saw that a store whe

Last year I wanted to buy Thinking in Bets (great book, btw). I was feeling impatient, so I looked it up on Barnes and Noble's website, and saw that a store where I was had it in stock. I went in to purchase it, and the price in store was a couple bucks higher than the listed price online. I asked the clerk about it, and he kind of shrugged and said he couldn't do anything about it. I walked out without the book and ordered it from Amazon on my phone in the parking lot. I still can't fathom the decision-making that led to that pricing strategy.

Scoundreller 7y ago
People are usually prepared to pay a bit more to get something right away vs. in a few days. It works out great (usually) for the impatient, but terribly for the patient that are aware of their options.
- ummonk 7y ago
  The problem is that as a lazy person, waiting a day or two for something to be delivered straight to my doorstep is less effort than having to go to a store to pick something up.
- munmaek 7y ago
  Why does this work out terribly for the patient? It's not like you're going to die if you don't get the book you want in 2 days, or even 3-7 business days. (Not that I buy physical books anymore typically, but it applies to other items) People have just grown very impatient over time. I found myself getting annoyed that I wasn't receiving some items in 1 day (in Korea), until I reflected on what I actually was getting annoyed over. Personally I find myself buying things on amazon or gmarket simply to avoid having to drive to the store.
abdullahkhalids 7y ago
What's confusing? Shipping a book from a warehouse is cheaper and maintaining a website is cheaper than setting up and selling from a physical store. If I order a book online, I don't want to subsidize the walk in customers.
- nraynaud 7y ago
  the value of the book doesn't change depending on its distribution channel
  - jpollock 7y ago
    Of course the value of a book changes based on the distribution channel. Immediacy has value, so if you need something _now_ you will be willing to pay for that. Also, you have to pay in time and money to go to the store, so you _may_ be willing to pay more to have the book delivered. In both situations, the way the book gets to you changes the price you're willing to pay.
    - autoexec 7y ago
      The value of "shipping fees" changes depending on speed, but those are always separate from the cost of the actual item being purchased.
  - abdullahkhalids 7y ago
    Absolutely does. The experience of going to a bookstore, browsing through the shelves, perhaps reading a few pages while sitting on a comfortable couches, perhaps talking to a knowledgeable salesperson about books (or life or anything), definitely has value. And I believe that value is greater than the convenience of ordering books online and then having to wait a 1-14 days for the book to deliver.
    - Mediterraneo10 7y ago
      > perhaps talking to a knowledgeable salesperson about books You aren’t likely to talk to a knowledgeable salesperson at a chain bookseller, as generally they are not big book fans. They just needed a job, and these chains will hire just about anyone who can competently work their POS systems. I can understand certain independent bookshops having great additional value to customers because their proprietors and the other clerks were voracious readers. However, for Borders/Barnes & Noble/Waldenbooks, and various other US chains, their staff has been generally unable to talk in any depth on books since at least the 1990s when I first visited them.
Rebelgecko 7y ago
Maybe you ended up ordering on Amazon on principle, but FWIW you can order from B&N online and do in-store pickup
IAmGraydon 7y ago
I can’t fathom the decision-making that led to spending the time to go down to the store for some instant gratification and then leaving over a $2 difference.
- darkpuma 7y ago
  Presumably it was the principle of the matter. Bait and switch generally being seen in a negative light...
- Glyptodon 7y ago
  Because you don't want to reward bald-faced manipulation. It's not about saving two dollars.
  - megaremote 7y ago
    What do you call the manipulation that amazon does then?
    - prepend 7y ago
      Reliability and sound logic are big for me. Amazon is more consistent in that that are always squeezing. I don’t like a company that sometimes squeezes and sometimes caresses.
  - munmaek 7y ago
    So instead you reward amazon treating its employees terribly.
    - kortilla 7y ago
      No, the reward is for the convenience.
      - mrits 7y ago
        They are both really convenient though.
barking 7y ago
Going off topic. I looked up that book on Amazon and one critical review said it was the same thing repeated over and over and he could sum up the book's advice in one paragraph: Make a decision as if you are betting all of your money on your choice. Don't take shortcuts based on your inborn biases and seek contrarian opinions and experienced counsel. Don't blame bad luck on bad outcomes; figure out how you could have made a better informed decision. Oh, and surprise, surprise, join groups with participants who have had similar experiences and expertise who can critique your choices and illuminate your blindspots. There you go. Was he wrong?
- ellius 7y ago
  Yes and no. You could summarize 'The Wealth of Nations' the same way and it would also sound pretty basic and not worth the 800+ page read. I agree in general that 'Thinking in Bets' is conceptually thin, in the sense that there's a high text-to-ideas ratio, but there's some value in reading all of that. Duke does a good job of describing her own thoughts and experiences, in a way that makes you want to actually apply those ideas in your own life (rather than just read about them). A better book on the topic is 'Fooled by Randomness.' It's much more conceptually dense and covers a lot of the same ideas.
  - barking 7y ago
    That makes sense alright. The fooled by randomness does sound more interesting.
rhizome 7y ago
From the parking lot? In your car? With which you spent $2 in gas to travel there and back?
- uponcoffee 7y ago
  This boils down to voting with your dollars, the root comment didn't like B&N's business practice and gave their business to someone else.
lostcolony 7y ago
I had the exact same thing with a D&D book. I don't remember which (it was 5th ed, so fairly recent), but online it was equal to the Amazon price. In person it was like $10-20 more, and yeah, wouldn't price match. Taught me to never look at B&N for a book I wanted again. I only ever go in there now when I happen to pass one with time to kill and just want to browse.
dragonwriter 7y ago
> Last year I wanted to buy Thinking in Bets (great book, btw). I was feeling impatient, so I looked it up on Barnes and Noble's website, and saw that a store where I was had it in stock. > I went in to purchase it, and the price in store was a couple bucks higher than the listed price online. If you looked at in on the web and saw that it was in stock, it also had a “buy online and pick up at X store” button on the results page online, which is both more convenient and avoids the problem you relate (they've had that feature for years, and I just tested and it's still there now.) The in store price is probably higher because people coming in, going through the stacks and de-merchandising books, asking questions, etc., cost more to service, and would be even more unsustainably unprofitable if online prices, which are for sales that don't have those costs associated were charged (meanwhile, online sales would be uncompetitive if in-store prices were charged.)
mieseratte 7y ago
Are you sure the one online was the same imprint and trim size as the one in-store? Publishers often have multiple different imprints and trim sizes as a means of price discrimination, as well as for stylistic reasons. Just the other week I went into Barnes & Noble to purchase a book and they had two different trim sizes of the same exact book right next to each other. Both paperback but one was large-and-thin while the other was small-and-thick. The former was about $4 more than the latter.
- ngngngng 7y ago
  Barnes & Noble online is run as a completely different business than the brick and mortar stores. The prices are not posted to match on any items. Brick & Mortar stores will not honor any online posted prices because of this strategy.
jschwartzi 7y ago
It actually costs them a ton of money to physically label the prices on each book. B&N adds their own sticker over the top of the MSRP when they receive the book. Changing the sticker every time the online price is changed would cost them a small fortune. If you're ever wondering why the online price differs from the in-store price by a significant amount, usually it's not because the retailer is trying to gouge you. It's because they would have to pay to have the shelves re-tagged. Retailers don't use the regular store associates to re-tag shelves. Instead they usually have roving teams of contractors who go around retagging everything on the store shelves periodically. The only way to really eliminate this is using electronic shelf labels, and that's quite impossible in a bookstore. Much of their inventory is thinner than the tags themselves.
- ineedasername 7y ago
  Books all have barcode with entries in their POS linked database, why not just have the current price linked to it? When I used to work for BN during my college days, that's how it worked. When a book was on sale, there was no need to re-tag the books, it was just a database update.
- SOLAR_FIELDS 7y ago
  Half price books has solved this in a rather ingenious way: they just sell the book for half of what the MSRP is on the cover. No need to tag anything, decent markup, and the price data is already there/doesn’t need to be created. It’s little efficiencies like this that make HPB one of the most successful brick and mortar bookstores out there.
  - omnimus 7y ago
    Selling books for half does not sound lik "decent" markup lol.
    - SOLAR_FIELDS 7y ago
      Considering they buy the books from people for something like 10% of the MSRP, it is definitely a decent markup for them.
deleted 7y ago
[deleted]
omnimus 7y ago
This is norm in europe with most online stores (especially smaller ones) that have physical store. It makes sese to me since i dont have to pay for shipping.
mastratton3 7y ago
I mean $2 seems fair for them to hold it in inventory and take the risk.

Scoundreller 7y ago

People are usually prepared to pay a bit more to get something right away vs. in a few days. It works out great (usually) for the impatient, but terribly for the patient that are aware of their options.

ummonk 7y ago
The problem is that as a lazy person, waiting a day or two for something to be delivered straight to my doorstep is less effort than having to go to a store to pick something up.
munmaek 7y ago
Why does this work out terribly for the patient? It's not like you're going to die if you don't get the book you want in 2 days, or even 3-7 business days. (Not that I buy physical books anymore typically, but it applies to other items) People have just grown very impatient over time. I found myself getting annoyed that I wasn't receiving some items in 1 day (in Korea), until I reflected on what I actually was getting annoyed over. Personally I find myself buying things on amazon or gmarket simply to avoid having to drive to the store.

abdullahkhalids 7y ago

What's confusing? Shipping a book from a warehouse is cheaper and maintaining a website is cheaper than setting up and selling from a physical store. If I order a book online, I don't want to subsidize the walk in customers.

nraynaud 7y ago
the value of the book doesn't change depending on its distribution channel
- jpollock 7y ago
  Of course the value of a book changes based on the distribution channel. Immediacy has value, so if you need something _now_ you will be willing to pay for that. Also, you have to pay in time and money to go to the store, so you _may_ be willing to pay more to have the book delivered. In both situations, the way the book gets to you changes the price you're willing to pay.
  - autoexec 7y ago
    The value of "shipping fees" changes depending on speed, but those are always separate from the cost of the actual item being purchased.
- abdullahkhalids 7y ago
  Absolutely does. The experience of going to a bookstore, browsing through the shelves, perhaps reading a few pages while sitting on a comfortable couches, perhaps talking to a knowledgeable salesperson about books (or life or anything), definitely has value. And I believe that value is greater than the convenience of ordering books online and then having to wait a 1-14 days for the book to deliver.
  - Mediterraneo10 7y ago
    > perhaps talking to a knowledgeable salesperson about books You aren’t likely to talk to a knowledgeable salesperson at a chain bookseller, as generally they are not big book fans. They just needed a job, and these chains will hire just about anyone who can competently work their POS systems. I can understand certain independent bookshops having great additional value to customers because their proprietors and the other clerks were voracious readers. However, for Borders/Barnes & Noble/Waldenbooks, and various other US chains, their staff has been generally unable to talk in any depth on books since at least the 1990s when I first visited them.

Rebelgecko 7y ago

Maybe you ended up ordering on Amazon on principle, but FWIW you can order from B&N online and do in-store pickup

IAmGraydon 7y ago

I can’t fathom the decision-making that led to spending the time to go down to the store for some instant gratification and then leaving over a $2 difference.

darkpuma 7y ago
Presumably it was the principle of the matter. Bait and switch generally being seen in a negative light...
Glyptodon 7y ago
Because you don't want to reward bald-faced manipulation. It's not about saving two dollars.
- megaremote 7y ago
  What do you call the manipulation that amazon does then?
  - prepend 7y ago
    Reliability and sound logic are big for me. Amazon is more consistent in that that are always squeezing. I don’t like a company that sometimes squeezes and sometimes caresses.
- munmaek 7y ago
  So instead you reward amazon treating its employees terribly.
  - kortilla 7y ago
    No, the reward is for the convenience.
    - mrits 7y ago
      They are both really convenient though.

barking 7y ago

Going off topic. I looked up that book on Amazon and one critical review said it was the same thing repeated over and over and he could sum up the book's advice in one paragraph: Make a decision as if you are betting all of your money on your choice. Don't take shortcuts based on your inborn biases and seek contrarian opinions and experienced counsel. Don't blame bad luck on bad outcomes; figure out how you could have made a better informed decision. Oh, and surprise, surprise, join groups with participants who have had similar experiences and expertise who can critique your choices and illuminate your blindspots. There you go. Was he wrong?

ellius 7y ago
Yes and no. You could summarize 'The Wealth of Nations' the same way and it would also sound pretty basic and not worth the 800+ page read. I agree in general that 'Thinking in Bets' is conceptually thin, in the sense that there's a high text-to-ideas ratio, but there's some value in reading all of that. Duke does a good job of describing her own thoughts and experiences, in a way that makes you want to actually apply those ideas in your own life (rather than just read about them). A better book on the topic is 'Fooled by Randomness.' It's much more conceptually dense and covers a lot of the same ideas.
- barking 7y ago
  That makes sense alright. The fooled by randomness does sound more interesting.

rhizome 7y ago

From the parking lot? In your car? With which you spent $2 in gas to travel there and back?

uponcoffee 7y ago
This boils down to voting with your dollars, the root comment didn't like B&N's business practice and gave their business to someone else.

lostcolony 7y ago

I had the exact same thing with a D&D book. I don't remember which (it was 5th ed, so fairly recent), but online it was equal to the Amazon price. In person it was like $10-20 more, and yeah, wouldn't price match. Taught me to never look at B&N for a book I wanted again. I only ever go in there now when I happen to pass one with time to kill and just want to browse.

dragonwriter 7y ago

> Last year I wanted to buy Thinking in Bets (great book, btw). I was feeling impatient, so I looked it up on Barnes and Noble's website, and saw that a store where I was had it in stock. > I went in to purchase it, and the price in store was a couple bucks higher than the listed price online. If you looked at in on the web and saw that it was in stock, it also had a “buy online and pick up at X store” button on the results page online, which is both more convenient and avoids the problem you relate (they've had that feature for years, and I just tested and it's still there now.) The in store price is probably higher because people coming in, going through the stacks and de-merchandising books, asking questions, etc., cost more to service, and would be even more unsustainably unprofitable if online prices, which are for sales that don't have those costs associated were charged (meanwhile, online sales would be uncompetitive if in-store prices were charged.)

mieseratte 7y ago

Are you sure the one online was the same imprint and trim size as the one in-store? Publishers often have multiple different imprints and trim sizes as a means of price discrimination, as well as for stylistic reasons. Just the other week I went into Barnes & Noble to purchase a book and they had two different trim sizes of the same exact book right next to each other. Both paperback but one was large-and-thin while the other was small-and-thick. The former was about $4 more than the latter.

ngngngng 7y ago
Barnes & Noble online is run as a completely different business than the brick and mortar stores. The prices are not posted to match on any items. Brick & Mortar stores will not honor any online posted prices because of this strategy.

jschwartzi 7y ago

It actually costs them a ton of money to physically label the prices on each book. B&N adds their own sticker over the top of the MSRP when they receive the book. Changing the sticker every time the online price is changed would cost them a small fortune. If you're ever wondering why the online price differs from the in-store price by a significant amount, usually it's not because the retailer is trying to gouge you. It's because they would have to pay to have the shelves re-tagged. Retailers don't use the regular store associates to re-tag shelves. Instead they usually have roving teams of contractors who go around retagging everything on the store shelves periodically. The only way to really eliminate this is using electronic shelf labels, and that's quite impossible in a bookstore. Much of their inventory is thinner than the tags themselves.

ineedasername 7y ago
Books all have barcode with entries in their POS linked database, why not just have the current price linked to it? When I used to work for BN during my college days, that's how it worked. When a book was on sale, there was no need to re-tag the books, it was just a database update.
SOLAR_FIELDS 7y ago
Half price books has solved this in a rather ingenious way: they just sell the book for half of what the MSRP is on the cover. No need to tag anything, decent markup, and the price data is already there/doesn’t need to be created. It’s little efficiencies like this that make HPB one of the most successful brick and mortar bookstores out there.
- omnimus 7y ago
  Selling books for half does not sound lik "decent" markup lol.
  - SOLAR_FIELDS 7y ago
    Considering they buy the books from people for something like 10% of the MSRP, it is definitely a decent markup for them.

deleted 7y ago

[deleted]

omnimus 7y ago

This is norm in europe with most online stores (especially smaller ones) that have physical store. It makes sese to me since i dont have to pay for shipping.

mastratton3 7y ago

I mean $2 seems fair for them to hold it in inventory and take the risk.