10 ms·

Why Airplane Boarding Got So Ridiculous

76 points by prostoalex 7y ago

finnthehuman 7y ago
This author is just now figuring out that checking bags is over-demonized and that cloth duffles are dope? This is some real rookie shit. So much so that I suspect flight tech has passed me by and the people at the front are sharing outdated metagame strategy with the masses.
- siberianbear 7y ago
  I don't even get why everyone has these roller carry-ons. I have a soft-sided backpack designed specifically for air travel. It always fits in the bin and it's way faster to carry than something that rolls on the ground with wheels. And ditching all the hard sides and wheels makes everything weigh less.
  - BerislavLopac 7y ago
    Do you have any links to check those out? Thanks!
    - siberianbear 7y ago
      I have the "Sky Train" bag from Red Oxx and I love it. It's a bit expensive, but it's very well made. I've abused mine a lot over a ten-year period and nothing has broken. The shape and size makes it perfect for overhead bins. https://www.redoxx.com/sky-train/91019/product https://www.redoxx.com/sky-train/91019/product
  - leetcrew 7y ago
    do you also bring a "personal item"? for me the backpack is my personal item, so my carry on needs to be something convenient to carry while already wearing a backpack.
    - siberianbear 7y ago
      I have a laptop bag, but I usually don't bring it and just put my laptop in my backpack.
    - alistairSH 7y ago
      I've taken to traveling with this[1] bag from Osprey. I typically put my cameras and tablet in a separate small backpack, though for shorter trips all my stuff will fit in the Osprey (just in case I get really unlucky with overhead - I will not gate-check my electronics). For longer walks, I strap the small backpack to the Osprey. For short walks, I wear the Osprey normally and sling the other bag over a single shoulder. 1 - https://www.osprey.com/us/en/product/farpoint-40-FARPNT40_526.html https://www.osprey.com/us/en/product/farpoint-40-FARPNT40_52...
      - phendrenad2 7y ago
        Small/medium, or medium/large?
        alistairSH 7y ago
        My wife has the SM and I have the ML. Mine is slightly taller overall, but unless you set them side-by-side and have them packed full, you'd be hard-pressed to tell the difference. In theory, if mine is fully packed, it might not fit in a smaller overhead, but I've never actually had that happen - even full, they have enough "give" to jam into the bin. Also, as mentioned elsewhere, the backpack is much more likely to be allowed onto a flight that is doing the "mandatory" gate check thing that is common on smaller regional jets/turbo-props. Edit - FWIW, my last trip to Scotland, I had 2x shoes (running, hiking), clothing for 4 full days, 1x running clothes, a Patagonia Nanapuff jacket, baseball cap, belt, rain coat and rain pants, and toiletries. All fit with ease. In the second pack (an REI UL pack), I had 2x camera bodies, 3x lenses, iPad Mini, chargers/cables and spare batteries for all, binoculars, sunglasses, headphones, and passports/travel documents. Not sure I could have crammed it all into the Osprey - probably if I cut back to a single camera/lens and went to 3 days clothes (doing laundry either way, so 4 was overkill).
      - 7y ago
  - crispyambulance 7y ago
    > why everyone has these roller carry-ons[?] Because backpacks duffel-bags easily get heavy and uncomfortable. They're especially miserable in hot weather. Also all the straps, do-daads, pockets and zippers get annoying. The optimal thing is a hardshell roll-on with 4 wheels that stands up by itself. A smallish one is very good for overhead, but if you have to check it, no problem.
    - alistairSH 7y ago
      Bags designed specifically for carry-on use[1] don't have most of those problems. Comfortable shoulder and hip straps. Straps that zip away when needed. Removable cross-body (duffle style) strap. No bulky external pockets to snag on things. And unlike some of the larger "carry-on" rollers, it fits in the overhead on all airplanes, even the smaller turbo-props. 1 - https://www.osprey.com/us/en/product/farpoint-40-FARPNT40_526.html https://www.osprey.com/us/en/product/farpoint-40-FARPNT40_52...
    - Tyr42 7y ago
      Also, hard shell bags are less likely to pick up bed bugs than soft cloth bags.
  - finnthehuman 7y ago
    >I don't even get why everyone has these roller carry-ons. They over-pack, can’t carry that weight, and don’t have a checked luggage strategy. Sometimes you just can’t check or slim down, but a lot of people don’t really try.
  - wmil 7y ago
    One big reason is that they are clearly labeled as being legal carry on size. No one wants to pack a duffel then pull out a tape measure.
  - Terretta 7y ago
    Because roller carry ons don’t make your shoulder tired, especially when waiting in the lines. And my roller is probably smaller than most people’s backpack. This Tumi Voyageur 4 wheeled carry-on bag fits even in the regional jump jet bins, and under the seat of full size planes: 16” x 14” x 7.5” = https://www.tumi.com/p/osona-compact-carry-on-01100001077/ https://www.tumi.com/p/osona-compact-carry-on-01100001077/ I often business travel 6 full business days with this bag, including a sport coat, dress shirts, etc., in fact I’m heading to CNCF with it right now. (Have leisure traveled 3 weeks with it.) It is the smallest sensible 4-wheel roller I’ve found, but I’m always on the lookout for others. This bag though, I’ve never once been asked to check. Tumi also has slightly larger options, but they won’t fit under the seat or in the regional jet bins: 16” x 16” x 8.5” = https://www.amazon.com/TUMI-Carry-Wheeled-Briefcase-Computer/dp/B07MQTNPSL/ https://www.amazon.com/TUMI-Carry-Wheeled-Briefcase-Computer... 15” x 17” x 8” = https://www.tumi.com/p/compact-4-wheeled-brief-01171781041/ https://www.tumi.com/p/compact-4-wheeled-brief-01171781041/ Your airmiles may vary...
- cryoshon 7y ago
  i am praying the duffel secret doesn't get out, because it'll lead to a crackdown. my "carry on" sized duffel is verifiably 3-5 inches larger than the maximum allowed dimensions, but i bring it on without a problem every time. i can't stand the idea of dragging some big and clunky thing -- which will surely break at the wheels eventually -- when i can just sling my bag and go.
  - cr1895 7y ago
    If you haven't stuffed the bag so it's exceeding the dimensions, why on earth wouldn't it be allowed? It's not a check of the potential size, it's a check of how much space is it actually taking up.
    - michaelt 7y ago
      Because you're flying on an airline like Ryanair that uses extortionate extra fees as a profit centre, and you fear they'll charge you such a fee.
  - nlawalker 7y ago
    I travel with a rectangular soft-walled carry-on backpack that's built to the maximum allowed dimensions. More than once, I've been near the end of the boarding line, where they stop people from getting on the plane with their full-sized carry-ons because there's not enough room (which happens more and more frequently now). Every time, the backpack goes right through.
    - namdnay 7y ago
      My secret is a soft roller to IATA size, but with a zip system that lets you expand the interior by 1-2 inches. If I'm flying for leisure in economy and they're checking luggage in bins, I'll pull out some clothes and wear them to pass the gate, then stop just after and cram them back in. Silly, but that's the game :(
    - FireBeyond 7y ago
      I occasionally travel with a Pelican Air 1535, which is carry-on compatible, with my camera gear (about $5-15,000 depending on what I'm doing). I've heard of people suggesting one of two methods of handling forced check-ins: 1) I use an app called MyGearVault that shows the value of the kit (also offers insurance). Checked bags are only insured to a maximum of 3,500. You can extend this to 5,000 for $50, but no more. "I do not want to check my bag because it is not covered by your insurance". 2) carry $50/$100 - if asked to check your bag, look behind you. "Hey, is someone willing to check their bag in place of me, here's some incentive". I've never personally tried other method, but I've heard people claim success with either.
jacques_chester 7y ago
The causality is backwards. Larger hardcase roll-ons followed from checked luggage being a paid extra, not the other way around. The first time I flew in the US I thought there was something wrong with my flight. It took 45 minutes to board and leave! But then it happened again. And again. And again. And slowly it dawned on me that this is just what folks here consider normal. Now we've gone from "you pay extra so you can board last" to "you pay extra so you can board first". It's nuts.
- namdnay 7y ago
  Well, the actual game is "you pay a bit extra to board first" or "you pay a lot extra to board last". If you're in business or first (on a plane big enough to have properly separated cabins of course), the big advantage of the upper cabin classes is that you have your own luggage bin
  - nlawalker 7y ago
    > "you pay a lot extra to board last" In my experience, the first- and business- class folks always take advantage of their ability to board first, because sitting in first class on the tarmac is more comfortable than sitting in the airport terminal.
    - gumby 7y ago
      Nah, go straight from the lounge to the aircraft, waiting until they come get you. Some lounges let you board directly, but even when you can’t you can get up your leisure and cut the queue. If you have to wait in the regular terminal I agree: board first
    - namdnay 7y ago
      I think it depends on the layout of the terminal. If the lounge is not too far from the gate, it's more comfortable to just roll up last minute
    - CaptainZapp 7y ago
      Doesn't much matter on intra European flights. There is usually no first and the difference between business and cattle class is a guaranteed free middle seat and better catering served on real glassware. Seats are (except for slightly more legroom, which, alas, is the case until the exit rows) exactly the same.
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Yizahi 7y ago
Author is implying that he only fears whatever time he needs to wait for checked bag. I find it ridiculous - air travel is already an all day long enterprise even on short flights - get to the airport, then minimum 2 hours for all checks, then flight itself, then check on arrival (up to 1 hour), then baggage if any and then get out of the airport. Baggage wait time is usually a rounding error in all this. What is really important is that people usually carry fragile and expensive things in hand luggage and is forced to check it in there is a high probility of it breaking or theft. This is a real reason for fighting for overhead space. Also losing all your luggage (checked in and forced checked in) or even delaying it by few days is significantly more painful if only one item was lost/delayed, especially if it was a trip from home to another place (not reverse).
- JOnAgain 7y ago
  >> minimum 2 hours for all checks You don’t fly much.
- namdnay 7y ago
  And if you're travelling into a country with painful immigration processes (e.g. USA), the time spent waiting for your baggage can be the difference between a 15mn cue at immigration and a 2h cue at customs EDIT: the big queue is at customs not immigration
  - dagw 7y ago
    At every airport I've flown into in the US baggage claim is after immigration.
    - namdnay 7y ago
      You're right, I was conflating immigration and customs
  - muro 7y ago
    I think you get your baggage after immigration.
  - 7y ago
joezydeco 7y ago
So the author argues that baggage handling is more efficient and trackable than before, but baggage fees are "a disincentive to check luggage"? I accept that baggage fees are designed to mask a lower advertised fare and/or extract more pax revenue. And I don't understand the mad rush to skip baggage claim and get out of the airport 15 minutes quicker. Baggage tracking and recovery is indeed a lot quicker and I've never had a problem. And the lines at car rental desks and taxi pickups didn't magically get shorter in my recent observations. In fact they're longer. I suppose that makes me an outlier, but the ~$25 is worth taking all the stress out of queueing at the gate and trying to get on as quickly as possible. Your time/value equation might be different.
- wgerard 7y ago
  > I suppose that makes me an outlier, but the ~$25 is worth taking all the stress out of queueing at the gate and trying to get on as quickly as possible. Your time/value equation might be different. I think the math just starts changing when you're not traveling by yourself. If it's even a small family of 3, traveling with checked luggage is suddenly $150 roundtrip. Sure, largely insignificant compared to the cost of the tickets themselves, but still enough to make you think twice about it.
  - joezydeco 7y ago
    I've been flying my family overseas from the time my children were infants, and you're right that the fees are insignificant when you're paying the current rates to fly 4 people during high travel season. But I'll just add another casual observation that people travel with way too much shit. For a family of 4 we've never needed more than 2 suitcases, and maybe only one is packed to the max. If I had 200 pounds of luggage (+ carryons) for 4 people staying 2 weeks in Europe I'd probably be reconsidering a few things.
    - wgerard 7y ago
      > But I'll just add another casual observation that people travel with way too much shit. One thing I started doing after trips is doing a "post-mortem" of sorts, basically: 1) How much did I use this item I packed? 2) Would it have changed my trip significantly without this item? If the answer is "rarely" and "not really", I don't pack it next time.
wgerard 7y ago
Another interesting wrench I've noticed: People who've lost their checked bags at some point. I know a few people who had their checked luggage lost by the airline, and the aftermath was so painful that they basically refuse to check luggage ever again. I am curious whether the boarding process has gotten significantly longer over time, and whether that costs airlines more money than they receive in baggage fees. I'm sure the answer is "not by a longshot", but still curious nonetheless.
- forgottenpass 7y ago
  >the aftermath was so painful that they basically refuse to check luggage ever again. I know this is why people don't check luggage, but knowing the possibility exists makes it possible to plan around. I don't often fly with more than a backpack, but when I do I always check. Nothing I don't mind losing forever, nothing that can't be temporarily replaced. If bag gets delayed only have the airline deliver somewhere staffed to receive a package (like an office/hotel) and with plenty of time for the delivery to be made, or get it from the baggage office on the way out.
  - wgerard 7y ago
    You can plan around it, but that doesn't make it any less stressful necessarily during an activity that's already of varying degrees of stressful (traveling). If I lose all my clothes in my luggage that isn't really a huge deal (I can buy new clothes), but it certainly puts a major damper on the trip.
snug 7y ago
CGP Grey did a video about this https://youtu.be/oAHbLRjF0vo https://youtu.be/oAHbLRjF0vo
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musicale 7y ago
Southwest seems to board fairly quickly with unassigned seating. But my favorite experience has been when they occasionally open both the front and rear doors for fast exiting.
dhimes 7y ago
My gripe is that there ought to be an assigned overhead compartment for every individual seat. I get really annoyed when there's not enough room for my carry-on and it becomes my problem. It should be the airline's problem.
- hjk05 7y ago
  As a European all the complaints In this thread sound completely foreign. Whenever I fly, the stewards just help those who can’t find space at their seat with their bags. It’s never an issue.
bensonn 7y ago
The airlines chose to turn a simple logistical procedure into a silly game of caste and cash. Passengers chose to play the game and try to win, beating their fellow passengers. Moving 100 people 100 feet takes 45 minutes and 5 crew members to organize. Instead of everybody working together to make it smooth, passengers compete against each other and the airlines. Passengers try and get the largest bag possible on the plane free of charge. They try to get on before other passengers so they can take up lots of overhead space and normally try to put their bags in bins closer to the front than their seats. Later passengers who sit up front then have to put their bags closer the the back of the plane and then fight to get back there when it is time to get off. They shove, squeeze and smash bags into the already filled bins rougher than any bag handler could dream of in a desperate attempt to avoid checking. The designers and players of the game all seem to work very hard in making the simple task of getting on a plane very difficult, slow and unpleasant. The whole game is so bizarrely penalizing that passengers actually want to be first to get onto a cramped plane and sit down, where they will be cramped and sitting hours on end. While flight is a modern miracle, flying is like the Jerry Springer show- it is humans at their worst and is depressing to watch. Why don't they just put seat numbers and dividers on the bins? Your luggage fits in your bin or it gets checked at $25. Travelling for one week or less and all my luggage (clean underwear and toothbrush) fits into a small backpack that I still can't find room for when I board late. Being tall means under the seat does't work well since my feet are there. Anything less than ten hours drive is a road trip for me.
- sauwan 7y ago
  I just got back from an American Airlines (I typically fly Delta, and haven't ever experienced anything quite like this) flight just like this. I was boarding group 5 of 8. 1-4 are the special premium "play the game" passes. I had PAID EXTRA to sit in row 7 near the front of the plane, because I had an extremely short layover and knew I wouldn't have any time to waste. But when I got on the plane, the overhead bins all the way back to row 21 were full. So I had to go to the back of the plane, and then fight my way back through the crowds to the front of the plane. And then when the flight landed, me and about 5 other passengers spent the next 15 minutes slowly working our way backwards, seat by seat to try to get to our bags as people got off the plane. Luckily I'm a runner and was able to catch my flight, but I'm going to be avoiding flying American unless I absolutely can't avoid it. It was stupidity.
solatic 7y ago
If the airlines were smart, they'd consider doing away with the overhead bins altogether. Those bins create a tragedy of the commons. Bring a small backpack to be put under your seat that can carry your passport, laptop, headphones, a book to read, etc., or nothing at all. Check the rest. If the airlines do away with the overhead bins, then the first checked bag should be free. If it takes too long to get the bags on a carousel one-by-one, consider taking a leaf from the shipping industry and figure out some kind of containerization system for passenger aircraft whereby suitcases are loaded into containers before the aircraft gets to the gate, and the containers are unloaded at the destination. Caveat: I'm not a business traveler. But, if you travel for business so often that you have status, then your checked bags are priority-marked and they're the first ones on the carousel anyway. As a guy who most often travels internationally and thus gets a free checked bag, even without status I never seem to need to wait more than 5-10 minutes for my bag, even on international flights where most travelers are checking bags.
- lsllc 7y ago
  Since they started charging for checked bags, now everyone tries to carry on as much as they can which results in slow boarding and getting off. They should be charging for overhead bin use and make checked bags be free (along with small bags under the seat in front of you). This way most people would go back to checking bags and only the business people or people willing to pay would carry-on. With planes being so overbooked these days I often carry my bag through security (which slows that down!) but then gate check it for free (so the airline is now losing the revenue).
  - dpark 7y ago
    > They should be charging for overhead bin use Several airlines (and some of the lowest cost tickets for bigger airlines) do charge for this. But of course they don't make checked bags free.
  - solatic 7y ago
    The compromise position is probably to only have overhead bin space in premium cabins, then the price of overhead bin space is folded into the premium ticket. Good point that carry-on bags probably also slows down security, and the amount that it slows security down is probably not negligible. Without carry-on suitcases, you could probably completely do away with the X-ray machines (hand-check people's purses and backpacks), which are (anecdotally) probably the biggest bottleneck at airport security.
mmphosis 7y ago
* Captive market of people sitting in the airplane shopping mall for hours. * Extra charges for everything. Compare airplane boarding with simply boarding a train in Switzerland / Europe: You get on the train. If you miss the train, you get on the next one. Air travel was like this a long time ago, and still is for short-haul flights, and short-haul fleets are going all electric. I think fast electric rail is here [in Europe and China/Japan/Korea] and is the future. Hopefully flying will be reduced, but for now, airplane boarding is ridiculous.
- sokoloff 7y ago
  > short-haul fleets are going all electric. There is literally not a single passenger service nor airline sized electric airplane in the world. “are going” is significantly premature at a minimum.
  - mmphosis 7y ago
    I am talking about short-haul flights where boarding is almost as easy as getting on the train. https://arstechnica.com/tech-policy/2018/10/scotlands-orkney-islands-may-see-electric-plane-service-by-2021/ https://arstechnica.com/tech-policy/2018/10/scotlands-orkney... https://www.harbourair.com/harbour-air-and-magnix-partner-to-build-worlds-first-all-electric-airline/ https://www.harbourair.com/harbour-air-and-magnix-partner-to... http://www.bbc.com/future/story/20180814-norways-plan-for-a-fleet-of-electric-planes http://www.bbc.com/future/story/20180814-norways-plan-for-a-...
    - sokoloff 7y ago
      In round numbers, how many of those ultra-short-haul passenger flights are flying electric today? I think the answer is a perfectly round number.
exabrial 7y ago
Still waiting for an airline to go 100% overhead bin free; something I think Southwest should try on an experimental route. Backing this up with free bags and adding an SLA for bag-to-claim (10m, depending on the airport) to give people predictability.
guiltygods 7y ago
This is why the assumption that market forces and competition will be favorable to consumers is a sham. There is no counter to shameless greed which is now directly impacting consumers who are actually paying more than earlier but on a piecemeal basis.

76 points by prostoalex 7y ago

This author is just now figuring out that checking bags is over-demonized and that cloth duffles are dope? This is some real rookie shit. So much so that I suspect flight tech has passed me by and the people at the front are sharing outdated metagame strategy with the masses.

siberianbear 7y ago
I don't even get why everyone has these roller carry-ons. I have a soft-sided backpack designed specifically for air travel. It always fits in the bin and it's way faster to carry than something that rolls on the ground with wheels. And ditching all the hard sides and wheels makes everything weigh less.
- BerislavLopac 7y ago
  Do you have any links to check those out? Thanks!
  - siberianbear 7y ago
    I have the "Sky Train" bag from Red Oxx and I love it. It's a bit expensive, but it's very well made. I've abused mine a lot over a ten-year period and nothing has broken. The shape and size makes it perfect for overhead bins. https://www.redoxx.com/sky-train/91019/product https://www.redoxx.com/sky-train/91019/product
- leetcrew 7y ago
  do you also bring a "personal item"? for me the backpack is my personal item, so my carry on needs to be something convenient to carry while already wearing a backpack.
  - siberianbear 7y ago
    I have a laptop bag, but I usually don't bring it and just put my laptop in my backpack.
  - alistairSH 7y ago
    I've taken to traveling with this[1] bag from Osprey. I typically put my cameras and tablet in a separate small backpack, though for shorter trips all my stuff will fit in the Osprey (just in case I get really unlucky with overhead - I will not gate-check my electronics). For longer walks, I strap the small backpack to the Osprey. For short walks, I wear the Osprey normally and sling the other bag over a single shoulder. 1 - https://www.osprey.com/us/en/product/farpoint-40-FARPNT40_526.html https://www.osprey.com/us/en/product/farpoint-40-FARPNT40_52...
    - phendrenad2 7y ago
      Small/medium, or medium/large?
      - alistairSH 7y ago
        My wife has the SM and I have the ML. Mine is slightly taller overall, but unless you set them side-by-side and have them packed full, you'd be hard-pressed to tell the difference. In theory, if mine is fully packed, it might not fit in a smaller overhead, but I've never actually had that happen - even full, they have enough "give" to jam into the bin. Also, as mentioned elsewhere, the backpack is much more likely to be allowed onto a flight that is doing the "mandatory" gate check thing that is common on smaller regional jets/turbo-props. Edit - FWIW, my last trip to Scotland, I had 2x shoes (running, hiking), clothing for 4 full days, 1x running clothes, a Patagonia Nanapuff jacket, baseball cap, belt, rain coat and rain pants, and toiletries. All fit with ease. In the second pack (an REI UL pack), I had 2x camera bodies, 3x lenses, iPad Mini, chargers/cables and spare batteries for all, binoculars, sunglasses, headphones, and passports/travel documents. Not sure I could have crammed it all into the Osprey - probably if I cut back to a single camera/lens and went to 3 days clothes (doing laundry either way, so 4 was overkill).
    - 7y ago
- crispyambulance 7y ago
  > why everyone has these roller carry-ons[?] Because backpacks duffel-bags easily get heavy and uncomfortable. They're especially miserable in hot weather. Also all the straps, do-daads, pockets and zippers get annoying. The optimal thing is a hardshell roll-on with 4 wheels that stands up by itself. A smallish one is very good for overhead, but if you have to check it, no problem.
  - alistairSH 7y ago
    Bags designed specifically for carry-on use[1] don't have most of those problems. Comfortable shoulder and hip straps. Straps that zip away when needed. Removable cross-body (duffle style) strap. No bulky external pockets to snag on things. And unlike some of the larger "carry-on" rollers, it fits in the overhead on all airplanes, even the smaller turbo-props. 1 - https://www.osprey.com/us/en/product/farpoint-40-FARPNT40_526.html https://www.osprey.com/us/en/product/farpoint-40-FARPNT40_52...
  - Tyr42 7y ago
    Also, hard shell bags are less likely to pick up bed bugs than soft cloth bags.
- finnthehuman 7y ago
  >I don't even get why everyone has these roller carry-ons. They over-pack, can’t carry that weight, and don’t have a checked luggage strategy. Sometimes you just can’t check or slim down, but a lot of people don’t really try.
- wmil 7y ago
  One big reason is that they are clearly labeled as being legal carry on size. No one wants to pack a duffel then pull out a tape measure.
- Terretta 7y ago
  Because roller carry ons don’t make your shoulder tired, especially when waiting in the lines. And my roller is probably smaller than most people’s backpack. This Tumi Voyageur 4 wheeled carry-on bag fits even in the regional jump jet bins, and under the seat of full size planes: 16” x 14” x 7.5” = https://www.tumi.com/p/osona-compact-carry-on-01100001077/ https://www.tumi.com/p/osona-compact-carry-on-01100001077/ I often business travel 6 full business days with this bag, including a sport coat, dress shirts, etc., in fact I’m heading to CNCF with it right now. (Have leisure traveled 3 weeks with it.) It is the smallest sensible 4-wheel roller I’ve found, but I’m always on the lookout for others. This bag though, I’ve never once been asked to check. Tumi also has slightly larger options, but they won’t fit under the seat or in the regional jet bins: 16” x 16” x 8.5” = https://www.amazon.com/TUMI-Carry-Wheeled-Briefcase-Computer/dp/B07MQTNPSL/ https://www.amazon.com/TUMI-Carry-Wheeled-Briefcase-Computer... 15” x 17” x 8” = https://www.tumi.com/p/compact-4-wheeled-brief-01171781041/ https://www.tumi.com/p/compact-4-wheeled-brief-01171781041/ Your airmiles may vary...
cryoshon 7y ago
i am praying the duffel secret doesn't get out, because it'll lead to a crackdown. my "carry on" sized duffel is verifiably 3-5 inches larger than the maximum allowed dimensions, but i bring it on without a problem every time. i can't stand the idea of dragging some big and clunky thing -- which will surely break at the wheels eventually -- when i can just sling my bag and go.
- cr1895 7y ago
  If you haven't stuffed the bag so it's exceeding the dimensions, why on earth wouldn't it be allowed? It's not a check of the potential size, it's a check of how much space is it actually taking up.
  - michaelt 7y ago
    Because you're flying on an airline like Ryanair that uses extortionate extra fees as a profit centre, and you fear they'll charge you such a fee.
- nlawalker 7y ago
  I travel with a rectangular soft-walled carry-on backpack that's built to the maximum allowed dimensions. More than once, I've been near the end of the boarding line, where they stop people from getting on the plane with their full-sized carry-ons because there's not enough room (which happens more and more frequently now). Every time, the backpack goes right through.
  - namdnay 7y ago
    My secret is a soft roller to IATA size, but with a zip system that lets you expand the interior by 1-2 inches. If I'm flying for leisure in economy and they're checking luggage in bins, I'll pull out some clothes and wear them to pass the gate, then stop just after and cram them back in. Silly, but that's the game :(
  - FireBeyond 7y ago
    I occasionally travel with a Pelican Air 1535, which is carry-on compatible, with my camera gear (about $5-15,000 depending on what I'm doing). I've heard of people suggesting one of two methods of handling forced check-ins: 1) I use an app called MyGearVault that shows the value of the kit (also offers insurance). Checked bags are only insured to a maximum of 3,500. You can extend this to 5,000 for $50, but no more. "I do not want to check my bag because it is not covered by your insurance". 2) carry $50/$100 - if asked to check your bag, look behind you. "Hey, is someone willing to check their bag in place of me, here's some incentive". I've never personally tried other method, but I've heard people claim success with either.

jacques_chester 7y ago

The causality is backwards. Larger hardcase roll-ons followed from checked luggage being a paid extra, not the other way around. The first time I flew in the US I thought there was something wrong with my flight. It took 45 minutes to board and leave! But then it happened again. And again. And again. And slowly it dawned on me that this is just what folks here consider normal. Now we've gone from "you pay extra so you can board last" to "you pay extra so you can board first". It's nuts.

namdnay 7y ago
Well, the actual game is "you pay a bit extra to board first" or "you pay a lot extra to board last". If you're in business or first (on a plane big enough to have properly separated cabins of course), the big advantage of the upper cabin classes is that you have your own luggage bin
- nlawalker 7y ago
  > "you pay a lot extra to board last" In my experience, the first- and business- class folks always take advantage of their ability to board first, because sitting in first class on the tarmac is more comfortable than sitting in the airport terminal.
  - gumby 7y ago
    Nah, go straight from the lounge to the aircraft, waiting until they come get you. Some lounges let you board directly, but even when you can’t you can get up your leisure and cut the queue. If you have to wait in the regular terminal I agree: board first
  - namdnay 7y ago
    I think it depends on the layout of the terminal. If the lounge is not too far from the gate, it's more comfortable to just roll up last minute
  - CaptainZapp 7y ago
    Doesn't much matter on intra European flights. There is usually no first and the difference between business and cattle class is a guaranteed free middle seat and better catering served on real glassware. Seats are (except for slightly more legroom, which, alas, is the case until the exit rows) exactly the same.

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Yizahi 7y ago

Author is implying that he only fears whatever time he needs to wait for checked bag. I find it ridiculous - air travel is already an all day long enterprise even on short flights - get to the airport, then minimum 2 hours for all checks, then flight itself, then check on arrival (up to 1 hour), then baggage if any and then get out of the airport. Baggage wait time is usually a rounding error in all this. What is really important is that people usually carry fragile and expensive things in hand luggage and is forced to check it in there is a high probility of it breaking or theft. This is a real reason for fighting for overhead space. Also losing all your luggage (checked in and forced checked in) or even delaying it by few days is significantly more painful if only one item was lost/delayed, especially if it was a trip from home to another place (not reverse).

JOnAgain 7y ago
>> minimum 2 hours for all checks You don’t fly much.
namdnay 7y ago
And if you're travelling into a country with painful immigration processes (e.g. USA), the time spent waiting for your baggage can be the difference between a 15mn cue at immigration and a 2h cue at customs EDIT: the big queue is at customs not immigration
- dagw 7y ago
  At every airport I've flown into in the US baggage claim is after immigration.
  - namdnay 7y ago
    You're right, I was conflating immigration and customs
- muro 7y ago
  I think you get your baggage after immigration.
- 7y ago

joezydeco 7y ago

So the author argues that baggage handling is more efficient and trackable than before, but baggage fees are "a disincentive to check luggage"? I accept that baggage fees are designed to mask a lower advertised fare and/or extract more pax revenue. And I don't understand the mad rush to skip baggage claim and get out of the airport 15 minutes quicker. Baggage tracking and recovery is indeed a lot quicker and I've never had a problem. And the lines at car rental desks and taxi pickups didn't magically get shorter in my recent observations. In fact they're longer. I suppose that makes me an outlier, but the ~$25 is worth taking all the stress out of queueing at the gate and trying to get on as quickly as possible. Your time/value equation might be different.

wgerard 7y ago
> I suppose that makes me an outlier, but the ~$25 is worth taking all the stress out of queueing at the gate and trying to get on as quickly as possible. Your time/value equation might be different. I think the math just starts changing when you're not traveling by yourself. If it's even a small family of 3, traveling with checked luggage is suddenly $150 roundtrip. Sure, largely insignificant compared to the cost of the tickets themselves, but still enough to make you think twice about it.
- joezydeco 7y ago
  I've been flying my family overseas from the time my children were infants, and you're right that the fees are insignificant when you're paying the current rates to fly 4 people during high travel season. But I'll just add another casual observation that people travel with way too much shit. For a family of 4 we've never needed more than 2 suitcases, and maybe only one is packed to the max. If I had 200 pounds of luggage (+ carryons) for 4 people staying 2 weeks in Europe I'd probably be reconsidering a few things.
  - wgerard 7y ago
    > But I'll just add another casual observation that people travel with way too much shit. One thing I started doing after trips is doing a "post-mortem" of sorts, basically: 1) How much did I use this item I packed? 2) Would it have changed my trip significantly without this item? If the answer is "rarely" and "not really", I don't pack it next time.

wgerard 7y ago

Another interesting wrench I've noticed: People who've lost their checked bags at some point. I know a few people who had their checked luggage lost by the airline, and the aftermath was so painful that they basically refuse to check luggage ever again. I am curious whether the boarding process has gotten significantly longer over time, and whether that costs airlines more money than they receive in baggage fees. I'm sure the answer is "not by a longshot", but still curious nonetheless.

forgottenpass 7y ago
>the aftermath was so painful that they basically refuse to check luggage ever again. I know this is why people don't check luggage, but knowing the possibility exists makes it possible to plan around. I don't often fly with more than a backpack, but when I do I always check. Nothing I don't mind losing forever, nothing that can't be temporarily replaced. If bag gets delayed only have the airline deliver somewhere staffed to receive a package (like an office/hotel) and with plenty of time for the delivery to be made, or get it from the baggage office on the way out.
- wgerard 7y ago
  You can plan around it, but that doesn't make it any less stressful necessarily during an activity that's already of varying degrees of stressful (traveling). If I lose all my clothes in my luggage that isn't really a huge deal (I can buy new clothes), but it certainly puts a major damper on the trip.

snug 7y ago

CGP Grey did a video about this https://youtu.be/oAHbLRjF0vo https://youtu.be/oAHbLRjF0vo

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musicale 7y ago

Southwest seems to board fairly quickly with unassigned seating. But my favorite experience has been when they occasionally open both the front and rear doors for fast exiting.

dhimes 7y ago

My gripe is that there ought to be an assigned overhead compartment for every individual seat. I get really annoyed when there's not enough room for my carry-on and it becomes my problem. It should be the airline's problem.

hjk05 7y ago
As a European all the complaints In this thread sound completely foreign. Whenever I fly, the stewards just help those who can’t find space at their seat with their bags. It’s never an issue.

bensonn 7y ago

The airlines chose to turn a simple logistical procedure into a silly game of caste and cash. Passengers chose to play the game and try to win, beating their fellow passengers. Moving 100 people 100 feet takes 45 minutes and 5 crew members to organize. Instead of everybody working together to make it smooth, passengers compete against each other and the airlines. Passengers try and get the largest bag possible on the plane free of charge. They try to get on before other passengers so they can take up lots of overhead space and normally try to put their bags in bins closer to the front than their seats. Later passengers who sit up front then have to put their bags closer the the back of the plane and then fight to get back there when it is time to get off. They shove, squeeze and smash bags into the already filled bins rougher than any bag handler could dream of in a desperate attempt to avoid checking. The designers and players of the game all seem to work very hard in making the simple task of getting on a plane very difficult, slow and unpleasant. The whole game is so bizarrely penalizing that passengers actually want to be first to get onto a cramped plane and sit down, where they will be cramped and sitting hours on end. While flight is a modern miracle, flying is like the Jerry Springer show- it is humans at their worst and is depressing to watch. Why don't they just put seat numbers and dividers on the bins? Your luggage fits in your bin or it gets checked at $25. Travelling for one week or less and all my luggage (clean underwear and toothbrush) fits into a small backpack that I still can't find room for when I board late. Being tall means under the seat does't work well since my feet are there. Anything less than ten hours drive is a road trip for me.

sauwan 7y ago
I just got back from an American Airlines (I typically fly Delta, and haven't ever experienced anything quite like this) flight just like this. I was boarding group 5 of 8. 1-4 are the special premium "play the game" passes. I had PAID EXTRA to sit in row 7 near the front of the plane, because I had an extremely short layover and knew I wouldn't have any time to waste. But when I got on the plane, the overhead bins all the way back to row 21 were full. So I had to go to the back of the plane, and then fight my way back through the crowds to the front of the plane. And then when the flight landed, me and about 5 other passengers spent the next 15 minutes slowly working our way backwards, seat by seat to try to get to our bags as people got off the plane. Luckily I'm a runner and was able to catch my flight, but I'm going to be avoiding flying American unless I absolutely can't avoid it. It was stupidity.

solatic 7y ago

If the airlines were smart, they'd consider doing away with the overhead bins altogether. Those bins create a tragedy of the commons. Bring a small backpack to be put under your seat that can carry your passport, laptop, headphones, a book to read, etc., or nothing at all. Check the rest. If the airlines do away with the overhead bins, then the first checked bag should be free. If it takes too long to get the bags on a carousel one-by-one, consider taking a leaf from the shipping industry and figure out some kind of containerization system for passenger aircraft whereby suitcases are loaded into containers before the aircraft gets to the gate, and the containers are unloaded at the destination. Caveat: I'm not a business traveler. But, if you travel for business so often that you have status, then your checked bags are priority-marked and they're the first ones on the carousel anyway. As a guy who most often travels internationally and thus gets a free checked bag, even without status I never seem to need to wait more than 5-10 minutes for my bag, even on international flights where most travelers are checking bags.

lsllc 7y ago
Since they started charging for checked bags, now everyone tries to carry on as much as they can which results in slow boarding and getting off. They should be charging for overhead bin use and make checked bags be free (along with small bags under the seat in front of you). This way most people would go back to checking bags and only the business people or people willing to pay would carry-on. With planes being so overbooked these days I often carry my bag through security (which slows that down!) but then gate check it for free (so the airline is now losing the revenue).
- dpark 7y ago
  > They should be charging for overhead bin use Several airlines (and some of the lowest cost tickets for bigger airlines) do charge for this. But of course they don't make checked bags free.
- solatic 7y ago
  The compromise position is probably to only have overhead bin space in premium cabins, then the price of overhead bin space is folded into the premium ticket. Good point that carry-on bags probably also slows down security, and the amount that it slows security down is probably not negligible. Without carry-on suitcases, you could probably completely do away with the X-ray machines (hand-check people's purses and backpacks), which are (anecdotally) probably the biggest bottleneck at airport security.

mmphosis 7y ago

* Captive market of people sitting in the airplane shopping mall for hours. * Extra charges for everything. Compare airplane boarding with simply boarding a train in Switzerland / Europe: You get on the train. If you miss the train, you get on the next one. Air travel was like this a long time ago, and still is for short-haul flights, and short-haul fleets are going all electric. I think fast electric rail is here [in Europe and China/Japan/Korea] and is the future. Hopefully flying will be reduced, but for now, airplane boarding is ridiculous.

sokoloff 7y ago
> short-haul fleets are going all electric. There is literally not a single passenger service nor airline sized electric airplane in the world. “are going” is significantly premature at a minimum.
- mmphosis 7y ago
  I am talking about short-haul flights where boarding is almost as easy as getting on the train. https://arstechnica.com/tech-policy/2018/10/scotlands-orkney-islands-may-see-electric-plane-service-by-2021/ https://arstechnica.com/tech-policy/2018/10/scotlands-orkney... https://www.harbourair.com/harbour-air-and-magnix-partner-to-build-worlds-first-all-electric-airline/ https://www.harbourair.com/harbour-air-and-magnix-partner-to... http://www.bbc.com/future/story/20180814-norways-plan-for-a-fleet-of-electric-planes http://www.bbc.com/future/story/20180814-norways-plan-for-a-...
  - sokoloff 7y ago
    In round numbers, how many of those ultra-short-haul passenger flights are flying electric today? I think the answer is a perfectly round number.

exabrial 7y ago

Still waiting for an airline to go 100% overhead bin free; something I think Southwest should try on an experimental route. Backing this up with free bags and adding an SLA for bag-to-claim (10m, depending on the airport) to give people predictability.

guiltygods 7y ago

This is why the assumption that market forces and competition will be favorable to consumers is a sham. There is no counter to shameless greed which is now directly impacting consumers who are actually paying more than earlier but on a piecemeal basis.