7 ms·

US visa laws are barbaric. Giving only 60 days to find a new job when one has been laid off without prior notice. How is that supposed to be fair? H1B visa have

US visa laws are barbaric. Giving only 60 days to find a new job when one has been laid off without prior notice. How is that supposed to be fair? H1B visa have the effect of creating indentured slaves by placing all of the power on the employers and prevent employees from having any negotiation power since they are always under the threat of losing their visa... While the US is still seen in a way as a dreamland to live and work in by people in poorer areas, it seems to me anecdotally that more and more people in developed countries no longer have any interest in moving there due to the many issues surrounding visas, work conditions, living conditions, fun things like CBP and overzealous immigration officers, etc... This is not a good thing for a country that has long been successful in attracting the best and the brightest.

vr46 7y ago
On another perspective, perhaps it will be good for India to have an influx of skilled and experienced people back. The West has long poached talent from everywhere else.
- atemerev 7y ago
  Not “poached”, they were moving voluntarily, because of much better conditions and attitudes. So no, it won’t be good for anybody. They were not needed at home, and they are not needed now.
  - simonh 7y ago
    When discussing recruitment, poaching implies enticement rather than coercion.
    - deleted 7y ago
      [deleted]
  - mapcars 7y ago
    What makes you think they were not needed at home?
    - atemerev 7y ago
      People who are needed are not inclined to emigrate — they have a lot of respect at least, and monetary compensation at best. There are also ethical reasons — perhaps I am needed back in my country to help with their Internet censorship efforts and large-scale deception infrastructure, but I am not particularly inclined to go.
csunbird 7y ago
I'm one of the software engineers that decided I will not work in US at all in any possible future. Medical system, visa procedures and visa problems were major deciding factors on my decision to move and work in Europe instead.
- saiya-jin 7y ago
  Add high criminality and overall police state. Definitely a place of much less true freedom compared to any western europe (unless you define freedom as hoarding tons of guns for when 'they' come). Directly contributing to mass murder of some poor guys defending their home country from foreign invasion for power and greed half around the globe with your taxes. Much more free time to have a life. And so on and on and on. We as software devs can literally spin a globe, close eyes and point randomly and simply move there. Some places are harder than others, but its still a breeze compared to many other professions if you have some good experience. Why would anyone go to US these days baffles me. The real quality of life is much harder to get there.
  - torgian 7y ago
    Hell. I left the US and got a job as a remote developer for a company in Japan (and since have started my own business). I make less than I would in the States but I’m happier overall.
  - raxxorrax 7y ago
    Bad argument, since 'they' as in the state came pretty often in Europe. I don't give anything on patriotism, but I admire the US for their freedom and I understand the need to have it for the society they are. Yeah, the security paranoia of the US in the last 20 years is abhorrent, dangerous, costly, infantile and probably against their own values, no further explanation needed. But I don't think there are better countries concerning civil rights. No European state comes close. Not Sweden, not Norway, Switzerland maybe for some people... I live in Europe and regularly think about working in the US. Wouldn't want to go to Silicon Valley though.
    - 7y ago
neya 7y ago
The US laws are better than most countries. In Singapore (for example), you have just 30 days to pack your stuff and get out of the country, for instance. And that's hardly enough if you've lived there for years and usually you've accumulated a lot of stuff. It's not even enough time to sell all your stuff. Usually people just give them away for free when they leave the country. I know people who got 49" TVs for a ridiculous $100 from people leaving the country. At least 60 days is not so bad. Can it be better? Yes, sure. But not bad at all.
- SauciestGNU 7y ago
  Singapore is hardly a good counterexample, considering the authoritarian nature of the place. "Disneyland with the death penalty" is a very low standard for freedom and human rights.
  - neya 7y ago
    > Disneyland with the death penalty Haha, that's a unique description and also a good point.
    - justin66 7y ago
      https://www.wired.com/1993/04/gibson-2/ https://www.wired.com/1993/04/gibson-2/
- Aeolun 7y ago
  Better than most countries, yes. Better than most of the western world? Not by far.
  - sweeeety 7y ago
    I found the USA visa system much more sensible (yet outdated) than most of European countries I lived in (no European citizen here). USA, with exception of China and India, have a quite clear and manageable path for citizenship. Denmark for example is constantly changing its rules because of "cultural" reasons.
lalos 7y ago
If the job role really is in high demand and there is low supply (which are the reqs to get the permit in the first place), it should be 'easy' to get another one. Not arguing it is correct but that might be the reasoning behind it.

vr46 7y ago

On another perspective, perhaps it will be good for India to have an influx of skilled and experienced people back. The West has long poached talent from everywhere else.

atemerev 7y ago
Not “poached”, they were moving voluntarily, because of much better conditions and attitudes. So no, it won’t be good for anybody. They were not needed at home, and they are not needed now.
- simonh 7y ago
  When discussing recruitment, poaching implies enticement rather than coercion.
  - deleted 7y ago
    [deleted]
- mapcars 7y ago
  What makes you think they were not needed at home?
  - atemerev 7y ago
    People who are needed are not inclined to emigrate — they have a lot of respect at least, and monetary compensation at best. There are also ethical reasons — perhaps I am needed back in my country to help with their Internet censorship efforts and large-scale deception infrastructure, but I am not particularly inclined to go.

csunbird 7y ago

I'm one of the software engineers that decided I will not work in US at all in any possible future. Medical system, visa procedures and visa problems were major deciding factors on my decision to move and work in Europe instead.

saiya-jin 7y ago
Add high criminality and overall police state. Definitely a place of much less true freedom compared to any western europe (unless you define freedom as hoarding tons of guns for when 'they' come). Directly contributing to mass murder of some poor guys defending their home country from foreign invasion for power and greed half around the globe with your taxes. Much more free time to have a life. And so on and on and on. We as software devs can literally spin a globe, close eyes and point randomly and simply move there. Some places are harder than others, but its still a breeze compared to many other professions if you have some good experience. Why would anyone go to US these days baffles me. The real quality of life is much harder to get there.
- torgian 7y ago
  Hell. I left the US and got a job as a remote developer for a company in Japan (and since have started my own business). I make less than I would in the States but I’m happier overall.
- raxxorrax 7y ago
  Bad argument, since 'they' as in the state came pretty often in Europe. I don't give anything on patriotism, but I admire the US for their freedom and I understand the need to have it for the society they are. Yeah, the security paranoia of the US in the last 20 years is abhorrent, dangerous, costly, infantile and probably against their own values, no further explanation needed. But I don't think there are better countries concerning civil rights. No European state comes close. Not Sweden, not Norway, Switzerland maybe for some people... I live in Europe and regularly think about working in the US. Wouldn't want to go to Silicon Valley though.
  - 7y ago

neya 7y ago

The US laws are better than most countries. In Singapore (for example), you have just 30 days to pack your stuff and get out of the country, for instance. And that's hardly enough if you've lived there for years and usually you've accumulated a lot of stuff. It's not even enough time to sell all your stuff. Usually people just give them away for free when they leave the country. I know people who got 49" TVs for a ridiculous $100 from people leaving the country. At least 60 days is not so bad. Can it be better? Yes, sure. But not bad at all.

SauciestGNU 7y ago
Singapore is hardly a good counterexample, considering the authoritarian nature of the place. "Disneyland with the death penalty" is a very low standard for freedom and human rights.
- neya 7y ago
  > Disneyland with the death penalty Haha, that's a unique description and also a good point.
  - justin66 7y ago
    https://www.wired.com/1993/04/gibson-2/ https://www.wired.com/1993/04/gibson-2/
Aeolun 7y ago
Better than most countries, yes. Better than most of the western world? Not by far.
- sweeeety 7y ago
  I found the USA visa system much more sensible (yet outdated) than most of European countries I lived in (no European citizen here). USA, with exception of China and India, have a quite clear and manageable path for citizenship. Denmark for example is constantly changing its rules because of "cultural" reasons.

lalos 7y ago

If the job role really is in high demand and there is low supply (which are the reqs to get the permit in the first place), it should be 'easy' to get another one. Not arguing it is correct but that might be the reasoning behind it.