11 ms·

Librem 5 App Design Tutorial

125 points by kgwxd 8y ago

hcal 8y ago
"Design" was in the title but I was hoping for a development tutorial. I know its just gtk, but I'm hoping someone with the project can put together a very simple python or js tutorial for making simple apps.
- craftyguy 8y ago
  This is a start, though it's not complete: https://developer.puri.sm/Librem5/Apps/Gnome.html https://developer.puri.sm/Librem5/Apps/Gnome.html
- swiley 8y ago
  TCL/TK will probably work since it's running wayland.
ocdtrekkie 8y ago
As soon as I get some sort of confirmation on if I will be able to get one of these running on Verizon, I would like to dive in and build some stuff. But right now I still don't even know if this phone will work for me.
- fghtr 8y ago
  https://puri.sm/faq/supported-networks/ https://puri.sm/faq/supported-networks/
awinter-py 8y ago
I want a linux phone so bad I can taste it The only reason I'm on android is because of f-droid -- the android experience still degrades every few months (we can process all your SMS through our website! slower animations!). So tired of carrying G's hot garbage around in my pocket.
- Funes- 8y ago
  You can use LineageOS[0] for the time being. [0]: https://lineageos.org/ https://lineageos.org/.
  - thallian 8y ago
    lineageos + microg + playmaker for the stuff I still want from the playstore makes it almost usable for me. But I am with op for being able to taste my desire :)
- elorant 8y ago
  So why not an iPhone? I'm not trolling, I try to understand why so many IT guys choose Android when it's obvious that Google sucks as much data as they can out of the platform.
  - smacktoward 8y ago
    The original appeal is best summarized in this 2010 tweet by Andy Rubin: https://twitter.com/arubin/status/27808662429 https://twitter.com/arubin/status/27808662429 i.e. Android is completely open; if Google were to try to put something nefarious in it, anyone who'd checked out the Android source would be able to see that nefarious thing and remove it; if Google kept putting it back in, nerds would be able to fork Android to take it away from Google. This has become much less true over the years than it used to be, of course, as much of what makes Android Android has migrated out of the core OS into less open intermediate layers like apps and services. This transition helps Google push updates out to users more quickly, since cell network operators proved to be pretty slow about pushing out updates to Android proper, but from Google's perspective it also has the side benefit of making "open Android" (e.g. AOSP) pretty incomplete unless you pair it with Google's proprietary services.
    - ocdtrekkie 8y ago
      It has been a very long time since doing this produced a usable operating system. Relevant thread: https://twitter.com/CopperheadOS/status/772592323112869888 https://twitter.com/CopperheadOS/status/772592323112869888
bhauer 8y ago
I am looking forward to the Librem 5. I am concerned about the philosophy of "avoiding preferences" since deep control and customization of phone and application behavior is one of the draws of something like the Librem 5. I would be comfortable with that philosophy as long as it's coupled with something along the lines of the Windows Registry, where it is common to find many preferences and configuration options that were simply not exposed in an application's user interface. But reducing the ability of users to adapt software to their needs without some countermeasure is chilling my interest a bit.
- ocdtrekkie 8y ago
  I do feel like there's a certain risk to pushing that point, given that most of the people who want to jump on something like a Linux phone are probably nerds who want to dive deep into pools of settings. But I also think they've got to be careful to avoid having apps that literally require you go in and manage a conf file on a phone. I am generally pretty fond of having a lot of settings, but I think you have to sort out why you have them. Is it for personal preference (dark mode/light mode) or is it something you should be able to detect and automate and not ask for?
  - swiley 8y ago
    >But I also think they've got to be careful to avoid having apps that literally require you go in and manage a conf file on a phone. Then they should go get an iphone! 100% of the appeal for this phone is that you'll be able to run GNU/X11 on it. (there's privacy stuff too but that's a result of the openness) I already have conf files for most of the apps and use them on handhelds too.
    - ocdtrekkie 8y ago
      This is a bad opinion. :) We do not want people using iPhones if better options become available. For open to succeed, open has to still be appealing to the masses. The more people who embrace a true Linux platform, the more options you will have to buy phones running true Linux platforms. Aka, it is in your best interest to recognize you are an extremely uncommon user and that you benefit if more common users can use the product. Even as a fairly technical user who likes to have a lot of settings and options, I do not ever want to have to pop open a text editor on my phone to fix an app. I'm fine with it being possible to do so, but I had better never have to do it. Arguably, since the hardware should support you running whatever flavor of hackery you want, you should support the phone having apps designed with the average user in mind, knowing full well you are capable of customizing it to your liking anyways.
darrmit 8y ago
I really love the idea of a Linux phone but my big concern is that of stability. I spent many years running Android/F-Droid trying to find a balance between usability/stability and privacy and ultimately just ended up on iOS. I depend on my phone for critical things: GPS, photo taking/backup, etc. so the margin for experimentation (and error) is pretty thin.
vgoh1 8y ago
I really want Librem to succeed. I am willing to pay quite a bit more, for a less capable device, if it respects me as a user. So much performance that we have these days is just fluff, anyway. I really hope that they bake enough into the price to be sustainable on low volume. I don't see this phone being anything more than niche in the near and intermediate future, and if priced right, maybe it can survive on that.
- deleted 8y ago
  [deleted]
Ericson2314 8y ago
I will contribute to NixOS on the Librem 5 once it is out. Highly recommend it as the interface bandwidth of phones vs laptops means dealing with shitty state would be even more annoying.
ncmncm 8y ago
There does not seem to be anything here specific to the Librem 5 (or any other number) or even to phones. It mentions Gnome in passing, but that mainly runs on other things that bring much larger pools of potential users. Maybe it should suggest developing for the desktop and tablet first, and then adapting the successful project to the phone afterward. Or, just adapting an existing project.

125 points by kgwxd 8y ago

hcal 8y ago

"Design" was in the title but I was hoping for a development tutorial. I know its just gtk, but I'm hoping someone with the project can put together a very simple python or js tutorial for making simple apps.

craftyguy 8y ago
This is a start, though it's not complete: https://developer.puri.sm/Librem5/Apps/Gnome.html https://developer.puri.sm/Librem5/Apps/Gnome.html
swiley 8y ago
TCL/TK will probably work since it's running wayland.

ocdtrekkie 8y ago

As soon as I get some sort of confirmation on if I will be able to get one of these running on Verizon, I would like to dive in and build some stuff. But right now I still don't even know if this phone will work for me.

fghtr 8y ago
https://puri.sm/faq/supported-networks/ https://puri.sm/faq/supported-networks/

awinter-py 8y ago

I want a linux phone so bad I can taste it The only reason I'm on android is because of f-droid -- the android experience still degrades every few months (we can process all your SMS through our website! slower animations!). So tired of carrying G's hot garbage around in my pocket.

Funes- 8y ago
You can use LineageOS[0] for the time being. [0]: https://lineageos.org/ https://lineageos.org/.
- thallian 8y ago
  lineageos + microg + playmaker for the stuff I still want from the playstore makes it almost usable for me. But I am with op for being able to taste my desire :)
elorant 8y ago
So why not an iPhone? I'm not trolling, I try to understand why so many IT guys choose Android when it's obvious that Google sucks as much data as they can out of the platform.
- smacktoward 8y ago
  The original appeal is best summarized in this 2010 tweet by Andy Rubin: https://twitter.com/arubin/status/27808662429 https://twitter.com/arubin/status/27808662429 i.e. Android is completely open; if Google were to try to put something nefarious in it, anyone who'd checked out the Android source would be able to see that nefarious thing and remove it; if Google kept putting it back in, nerds would be able to fork Android to take it away from Google. This has become much less true over the years than it used to be, of course, as much of what makes Android Android has migrated out of the core OS into less open intermediate layers like apps and services. This transition helps Google push updates out to users more quickly, since cell network operators proved to be pretty slow about pushing out updates to Android proper, but from Google's perspective it also has the side benefit of making "open Android" (e.g. AOSP) pretty incomplete unless you pair it with Google's proprietary services.
  - ocdtrekkie 8y ago
    It has been a very long time since doing this produced a usable operating system. Relevant thread: https://twitter.com/CopperheadOS/status/772592323112869888 https://twitter.com/CopperheadOS/status/772592323112869888

bhauer 8y ago

I am looking forward to the Librem 5. I am concerned about the philosophy of "avoiding preferences" since deep control and customization of phone and application behavior is one of the draws of something like the Librem 5. I would be comfortable with that philosophy as long as it's coupled with something along the lines of the Windows Registry, where it is common to find many preferences and configuration options that were simply not exposed in an application's user interface. But reducing the ability of users to adapt software to their needs without some countermeasure is chilling my interest a bit.

ocdtrekkie 8y ago
I do feel like there's a certain risk to pushing that point, given that most of the people who want to jump on something like a Linux phone are probably nerds who want to dive deep into pools of settings. But I also think they've got to be careful to avoid having apps that literally require you go in and manage a conf file on a phone. I am generally pretty fond of having a lot of settings, but I think you have to sort out why you have them. Is it for personal preference (dark mode/light mode) or is it something you should be able to detect and automate and not ask for?
- swiley 8y ago
  >But I also think they've got to be careful to avoid having apps that literally require you go in and manage a conf file on a phone. Then they should go get an iphone! 100% of the appeal for this phone is that you'll be able to run GNU/X11 on it. (there's privacy stuff too but that's a result of the openness) I already have conf files for most of the apps and use them on handhelds too.
  - ocdtrekkie 8y ago
    This is a bad opinion. :) We do not want people using iPhones if better options become available. For open to succeed, open has to still be appealing to the masses. The more people who embrace a true Linux platform, the more options you will have to buy phones running true Linux platforms. Aka, it is in your best interest to recognize you are an extremely uncommon user and that you benefit if more common users can use the product. Even as a fairly technical user who likes to have a lot of settings and options, I do not ever want to have to pop open a text editor on my phone to fix an app. I'm fine with it being possible to do so, but I had better never have to do it. Arguably, since the hardware should support you running whatever flavor of hackery you want, you should support the phone having apps designed with the average user in mind, knowing full well you are capable of customizing it to your liking anyways.

darrmit 8y ago

I really love the idea of a Linux phone but my big concern is that of stability. I spent many years running Android/F-Droid trying to find a balance between usability/stability and privacy and ultimately just ended up on iOS. I depend on my phone for critical things: GPS, photo taking/backup, etc. so the margin for experimentation (and error) is pretty thin.

vgoh1 8y ago

I really want Librem to succeed. I am willing to pay quite a bit more, for a less capable device, if it respects me as a user. So much performance that we have these days is just fluff, anyway. I really hope that they bake enough into the price to be sustainable on low volume. I don't see this phone being anything more than niche in the near and intermediate future, and if priced right, maybe it can survive on that.

deleted 8y ago
[deleted]

Ericson2314 8y ago

I will contribute to NixOS on the Librem 5 once it is out. Highly recommend it as the interface bandwidth of phones vs laptops means dealing with shitty state would be even more annoying.

ncmncm 8y ago

There does not seem to be anything here specific to the Librem 5 (or any other number) or even to phones. It mentions Gnome in passing, but that mainly runs on other things that bring much larger pools of potential users. Maybe it should suggest developing for the desktop and tablet first, and then adapting the successful project to the phone afterward. Or, just adapting an existing project.