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I knew it was bad, but I had not realized that the CTE numbers were so high from the article "...read the work of the Boston University C.T.E. center, which fou
by michaelbuckbee 8y ago
I knew it was bad, but I had not realized that the CTE numbers were so high from the article "...read the work of the Boston University C.T.E. center, which found evidence of degenerative brain disease in 99 percent of brains obtained from deceased N.F.L. players and 91 percent of college football players and 21 percent of those who played high school football."
From BU's site, here was the methodology: "For the study, the researchers began with the donated brains of 202 football players. Pathologists, knowing nothing of a patient’s history or symptoms, examined each brain for evidence of CTE. At the same time, clinicians—blinded to each brain’s pathology—used medical records and interviews with family members to collect detailed information about each patient’s medical history and symptoms. The group met for regular consensus meetings, where the pathologists and the clinicians presented their findings. They limited the study to football players, providing a somewhat homogeneous sample."
Stated another way (based on the study) 9 out of 10 college football players are going to leave with CTE.
- slg 8y agoI don't want to diminish the seriousness of CTE, but there is a huge selection bias there since the brains had to be donated to the study in the first place. Fully healthy people are probably much less likely to make the decision to donate their brain on death. Most of the people who are making the choice to donate are probably doing so because they experienced CTE symptoms during their life.
- ericras 8y agoThe University of Nebraska's Center for Brain, Biology and Behavior (which is housed inside the stadium) is trying to overcome the selection bias of these studies by doing a baseline scan of all football players: https://www.starherald.com/sports/big_red_wrap/football/at-nu-football-team-and-researchers-have-teamed-up-to/article_186a10ab-226f-599f-99f8-cb0e1f6855d9.html https://www.starherald.com/sports/big_red_wrap/football/at-n...
- brightball 8y agoExactly. The brains were actually donated due to suspicion of CTE and one of them was a punter who died in a motor cross accident. The game is only getting safer right now. IMO there’s no reason to play tackle football before the middle school level but after that I have zero issue. I played offensive and defensive line in high school and have been following these studies closely; there’s a ton of scare mongering and data slanting happening to create the headlines and very little coverage being given to rule changes to make the game safer.
- lotsofpulp 8y agoIt's clear that there is significant brain damage risk to participating in activities that knock your brain around. Why anyone would let their children or themselves box, MMA, hit soccer balls with their head, or play American football is beyond me.
- cljs-js-eval 8y agoThere are worse things in life than brain damage risk, and I'm thankful that others aren't allowed to choose for me how I approach those risks.
- Scoundreller 8y agoBut will you even get to approach the risk in the first place? Every venue will require its leagues/teams playing on it to get insurance. And if nobody will underwrite that insurance, or the price is sky-high, then the sport practically won’t exist at the recreational or professional level. Doubly so if governments start refusing to subsidize the construction of their rec/professional playing areas.
- bdamm 8y agoIt's OK by me that things you can't get insurance for die off. Nobody knows risk like insurance companies.
- lotsofpulp 8y agoWhat can be worse than damaging your brain? It’s literally what makes you, you.
- sgt101 8y agoThere are many things, for example, becoming morbidly obese and dying of a heart attack in your 20's, getting convicted of a violent crime and being sentenced to life imprisonment, getting killed in a war, getting killed in a car wreck. Humans are not rational brains riding round in a sort of meat carriage, we are animals and our whole body (and social setting) adds up to who we are. Physical conflict is part of human life - specifically a proportion of young men are predisposed to physical rivalry. Taking options to express this away does not remove the predisposition, it merely shifts it to other outlets which may be much less constrained and much less positive.
- scott_s 8y agoAs I explained elsewhere, that's not a valid conclusion to draw, since the families of all of the players donated their players brain because the family suspected their player had CTE. But it's still a horrifying stat, and the conclusion one should draw is that playing American football means you are at significant risk for developing CTE. Enough that it has changed how I view the sport.
- jrandm 8y agoThe paper disagrees with your restatement: > caution must be used in interpreting the high frequency of CTE in this sample, > and estimates of prevalence cannot be concluded or implied from this sample https://jamanetwork.com/journals/jama/fullarticle/2645104 https://jamanetwork.com/journals/jama/fullarticle/2645104 Last paragraph before the Conclusion header.
- michaelbuckbee 8y agoThanks for pointing this out, I wasn't trying to mislead so much as understand this better and didn't realize the provenance of the brains in this study.