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This might be simply Russian state propaganda working, but wouldn't the diversification of the world's currencies be a good thing? Remember how everyone were af

This might be simply Russian state propaganda working, but wouldn't the diversification of the world's currencies be a good thing? Remember how everyone were afraid of the collapse of the US Dollar back in 2008, and then the similar predictions about the Euro? (And we're hearing a lot about the Great Britain's Pound these days.)

thefounder 8y ago
It would not be good for the US but may be that good for other countries. U.S would loose some of its financial control(i.e sanctions, monitoring individuals etc). Anyway NOPEC will not happen as long as oil maintains is importance to the world economy. I doubt US is going to invade SA anytime soon.
- deleted 8y ago
  [deleted]
Theodores 8y ago
> wouldn't the diversification of the world's currencies be a good thing? It is not that simple. If an economy has a surplus, e.g. China, where does that surplus go? This is why we have a default world currency whether that be silver, gold or petro dollars. When you work through it a bit more the more you realise a basket of currencies won't work, unless every currency is essentially the same. Capital is like water, it flows. I would like to see discussion on how we can move on from the currencies we have to a measure of energy. Everything can be measured in energy terms, why not cut out the abstractions?
- ainar-g 8y ago
  I used to play with an idea of a science fiction novel, where the united Earth's currency is essentially kcal/kJ. The problem is that if you have a flammable and radioactive material, do you count the energy you get from it by burning it, or the energy from throwing it into a nuclear fission reactor, or the energy of throwing it into a black hole in a particular angle[1]? [1]: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ulCdoCfw-bY https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ulCdoCfw-bY
- Mvandenbergh 8y ago
  Since the prices of our main global energy source, oil and gas, are set in dollars, that energy unit is basically the dollar.
- ilaksh 8y ago
  I think for it to be fixed to any real thing (rather than imaginary points that people just keep arbitrarily adding to their databases) then you need a comprehensive way to globally measure that thing. My theory is that decentralized platforms may eventually provide a way for that to be feasible, but with current paradigms it is not.
- maxwell 8y ago
  Cue Bitcoin maximalists explaining that it's effectively a "measure of energy."
AndyMcConachie 8y ago
At some point a 13 year old kid in America is going to blame "the Russians" for why he didn't do his chores. It's amazing how much stuff they get blamed for these days. I mean, what are you actually suggesting? That they've infiltrated Bloomberg? That they're controlling the Saudis? I'm frankly just tired of all the evidence-free fearmongering about "The Russians", and at this point I just want to say, provide evidence or STFU.
- zimablue 8y ago
  It's not disputed that they have a large, well funded state propaganda machine and interfered (through internet propaganda) in the last US elections, the dispute was over whether they directly colluded or just assisted at a distance. The idea that they would push a narrative that get picked up and provide behind the scenes support to geopolitics in their favor isn't some wild hypothesis, it's obviously true whatever your political partisanship. US do the same, obviously.
- ainar-g 8y ago
  Um, no. I am Russian, and I live in Russia. Whether I like it or not, I hear the state propaganda every day. I probably should have mentioned that. Putin and his, erm, colleagues constantly use “multi-polar world” and “prevention of (implied US-American) hegemony” as a reason for their actions. This includes the desire to make Russian Rouble one of the world's currencies. If anyone, I am extremely tired of US-Americans blaming their poor policies on “The Russians”, but in this case, the possibility of US Dollar losing some of its value does indeed align with the Kremlin's wants.
  - ilaksh 8y ago
    One theory might be that it could be good for Russia for a certain period of time, up until Russia's currency was so successful that it did indeed threaten the US hegemony. But having the world order tilted back that way could cause tremendous economic problems for the United States as well as putting pressure on the US-centric military apparatus to maintain its hegemony. It could even lead to a war between major powers. Its almost like the bully being afraid to take his foot off of his victim's neck because he might get up and then he has to actually fight him. I think the reason other countries may not be anxious to push things is because a global war is probably going to be much worse for them than just having a weaker currency and less resources etc. The other aspect is that it seems like history very commonly ends up in a situation like this with hegemonic powers (otherwise known as Empires). So for now people some people may hate the United States, but sooner or later people will be resenting the Chinese or the artificial superintelligence that starts controlling everything. Personally the current paradigm benefits me so I hope it will continue for awhile, and that we can arrive at the next one without too many people dying. It would be nice to imagine an equitable world, but that doesn't seem feasible given the preponderance of propaganda despite democratized instantaneous mass communications.

thefounder 8y ago

It would not be good for the US but may be that good for other countries. U.S would loose some of its financial control(i.e sanctions, monitoring individuals etc). Anyway NOPEC will not happen as long as oil maintains is importance to the world economy. I doubt US is going to invade SA anytime soon.

deleted 8y ago
[deleted]

Theodores 8y ago

> wouldn't the diversification of the world's currencies be a good thing? It is not that simple. If an economy has a surplus, e.g. China, where does that surplus go? This is why we have a default world currency whether that be silver, gold or petro dollars. When you work through it a bit more the more you realise a basket of currencies won't work, unless every currency is essentially the same. Capital is like water, it flows. I would like to see discussion on how we can move on from the currencies we have to a measure of energy. Everything can be measured in energy terms, why not cut out the abstractions?

ainar-g 8y ago
I used to play with an idea of a science fiction novel, where the united Earth's currency is essentially kcal/kJ. The problem is that if you have a flammable and radioactive material, do you count the energy you get from it by burning it, or the energy from throwing it into a nuclear fission reactor, or the energy of throwing it into a black hole in a particular angle[1]? [1]: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ulCdoCfw-bY https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ulCdoCfw-bY
Mvandenbergh 8y ago
Since the prices of our main global energy source, oil and gas, are set in dollars, that energy unit is basically the dollar.
ilaksh 8y ago
I think for it to be fixed to any real thing (rather than imaginary points that people just keep arbitrarily adding to their databases) then you need a comprehensive way to globally measure that thing. My theory is that decentralized platforms may eventually provide a way for that to be feasible, but with current paradigms it is not.
maxwell 8y ago
Cue Bitcoin maximalists explaining that it's effectively a "measure of energy."

AndyMcConachie 8y ago

At some point a 13 year old kid in America is going to blame "the Russians" for why he didn't do his chores. It's amazing how much stuff they get blamed for these days. I mean, what are you actually suggesting? That they've infiltrated Bloomberg? That they're controlling the Saudis? I'm frankly just tired of all the evidence-free fearmongering about "The Russians", and at this point I just want to say, provide evidence or STFU.

zimablue 8y ago
It's not disputed that they have a large, well funded state propaganda machine and interfered (through internet propaganda) in the last US elections, the dispute was over whether they directly colluded or just assisted at a distance. The idea that they would push a narrative that get picked up and provide behind the scenes support to geopolitics in their favor isn't some wild hypothesis, it's obviously true whatever your political partisanship. US do the same, obviously.
ainar-g 8y ago
Um, no. I am Russian, and I live in Russia. Whether I like it or not, I hear the state propaganda every day. I probably should have mentioned that. Putin and his, erm, colleagues constantly use “multi-polar world” and “prevention of (implied US-American) hegemony” as a reason for their actions. This includes the desire to make Russian Rouble one of the world's currencies. If anyone, I am extremely tired of US-Americans blaming their poor policies on “The Russians”, but in this case, the possibility of US Dollar losing some of its value does indeed align with the Kremlin's wants.
- ilaksh 8y ago
  One theory might be that it could be good for Russia for a certain period of time, up until Russia's currency was so successful that it did indeed threaten the US hegemony. But having the world order tilted back that way could cause tremendous economic problems for the United States as well as putting pressure on the US-centric military apparatus to maintain its hegemony. It could even lead to a war between major powers. Its almost like the bully being afraid to take his foot off of his victim's neck because he might get up and then he has to actually fight him. I think the reason other countries may not be anxious to push things is because a global war is probably going to be much worse for them than just having a weaker currency and less resources etc. The other aspect is that it seems like history very commonly ends up in a situation like this with hegemonic powers (otherwise known as Empires). So for now people some people may hate the United States, but sooner or later people will be resenting the Chinese or the artificial superintelligence that starts controlling everything. Personally the current paradigm benefits me so I hope it will continue for awhile, and that we can arrive at the next one without too many people dying. It would be nice to imagine an equitable world, but that doesn't seem feasible given the preponderance of propaganda despite democratized instantaneous mass communications.