24 ms·

FCC threatens carriers with 'regulatory intervention' over robocalls

382 points by jmsflknr 8y ago

markovbot 8y ago
So the article doesn't seem to mention any of the ongoing efforts to stop or reduce caller ID spoofing, such as SHAKEN/STIR. I'm not clear if that will do anything, and it's certainly far too little too late, but the industry is doing something. On that note, does anyone know how SHAKEN/STIR is supposed to work? I understand that it basically sets up a PKI with JWTs in SIP headers, but from what I can tell there needs to be some sort of trusted CA which creates and signs these things, but I can't tell who that CA is or if there even is an agreed upon central CA. I'd also be interested in any corrections/expansion on any of the things I said above, I really don't know much about it and would like to. edit: after making this comment I did a bit more research, and it looks like[0] there will be per-country CAs that can issue certificates to owners of phone numbers within that country. I'm specifically curious about which CAs will be trusted in the United States. [0]: https://tools.ietf.org/id/draft-burger-stir-iana-cert-00.html https://tools.ietf.org/id/draft-burger-stir-iana-cert-00.htm...
- thwythwy 8y ago
  Quick correction, I don't think "doing something" (italics omitted) is the legal standard for regulatory intervention
  - markovbot 8y ago
    Right, I didn't mean to imply that this action by the FCC was in any way wrong. The fact that caller ID is completely unauthenticated in 2019 is horrifying, and regulation is long over due.
- deleted 8y ago
  [deleted]
- toast0 8y ago
  Authority for the North American Numbering plan currently falls to the FCC, after the breakup of AT&T; they contract out administration, Ericsson got a 5 year contract in 2017, previously it was administered by Neustar (and Lockheed Martin, before Neustar was spun out). I'd imagine Ericsson would spin up a new CA instance just for this. As the administratior, they keep the records of who phone numbers are assigned to, and where they've been ported. My understanding is once a +1 area code is allocated to a country, that country's telecoms regulator manages further allocations (or contracts it out).
  - markovbot 8y ago
    Cool, thanks for the info. Any idea what the timeline on creating that CA is?
    - toast0 8y ago
      No idea. I wasn't aware of this proposal (STIR), I just am aware of a lot of number allocation stuff. Does STIR have any support from telecoms companies and/or ITU? Or is it IANA only? I see Neustar has a page that seems related: https://www.home.neustar/atis-testbed/index.php https://www.home.neustar/atis-testbed/index.php ?
      - markovbot 8y ago
        From what I can tell, the telcos are implementing it, or at least say they are: * "Caller Verified is T-Mobile’s implementation of the STIR and SHAKEN standards" [0] * "Verizon reiterates both our commitment to deploying the STIR/SHAKEN call authentication technology" [1] * "Sprint supports efforts to build the SHAKEN/STIR call authentication system" [2] * AT&T doesn't seem to mention STIR or SHAKEN by name on their robocall page [3] but the FCC sent them a letter thanking them for their "commitment to implement a robust call authentication framework in 2019" [4] * "Comcast is proud to be at the forefront of efforts to address the scourge of illegal spoofed robocalls in this country, including the development of the end-to-end call authentication protocol known as SHAKEN and STIR" [5] etc [0]: https://www.t-mobile.com/news/caller-verified-note9 https://www.t-mobile.com/news/caller-verified-note9 [1]: https://ecfsapi.fcc.gov/file/1119062987519/2018%2011%2019%20Verizon%20Call%20Authentication%20Framework%20WC%20Docket%20No.%2017-97.pdf https://ecfsapi.fcc.gov/file/1119062987519/2018%2011%2019%20... [2]: https://ecfsapi.fcc.gov/file/1091391175368/Sprint%20Call%20Authentication%20Comments.pdf https://ecfsapi.fcc.gov/file/1091391175368/Sprint%20Call%20A... [3]: https://about.att.com/sites/cyberaware/ae/robocall https://about.att.com/sites/cyberaware/ae/robocall [4]: https://docs.fcc.gov/public/attachments/DOC-354933A2.pdf https://docs.fcc.gov/public/attachments/DOC-354933A2.pdf [5]: https://ecfsapi.fcc.gov/file/111974588343/Comcast%20Resp%20to%20Chmn%20Pai%20re%20SHAKEN%20STIR%20(11-19-18).pdf https://ecfsapi.fcc.gov/file/111974588343/Comcast%20Resp%20t...
- rhizome 8y ago
  That's a nice effort, but I think the phone company should be required to itemize each call's billing information by default. Perhaps the billing number (the number obscured by spoofing) on every bill, with the rest available by request or on the website (to save paper). But all in all, the problem is that the phone company will refuse to help unless required by law. They make good money from shitty robocallers.
- jzl 8y ago
  More info on SHAKEN/STIR: https://transnexus.com/whitepapers/understanding-stir-shaken/ https://transnexus.com/whitepapers/understanding-stir-shaken... http://nymag.com/intelligencer/2018/05/how-to-stop-spam-robocalls-with-stir-shaken.html http://nymag.com/intelligencer/2018/05/how-to-stop-spam-robo...
wil421 8y ago
Robocalls are terrible and a valid reason to have regulations. We should sign up every Senator and Congressman’s cellphone to N number of scammy sites. See how fast the issue is solved. SS7 issue be damned, AT&T and Verizon will solve it if you force their hands.
- AceJohnny2 8y ago
  Good luck finding a congressperson's personal cell phone.
  - jasonjayr 8y ago
    What would it cost to Wardial a whole area code with TextToSpeech + SpeechToText on twilio?
    - dba7dba 8y ago
      Reminds me of the time, well a long time ago, when I worked at a tech startup during the early 2000 bubble. Talent war was intense. We had recruiters cold calling people's desk to try to lure people away. At that office, like every desk (many unoccupied) had a normal phone, with an extension #. In one instance, a recruiter called and it was answered and he/she was told not interested. After that call, every phone on each of the row of desks started ringing one at a time. After about 3 - 5 such ringings, someone picked up and told them to knock it off.
      - AceJohnny2 8y ago
        I've been cold-called at my desk by a recruiter twice in the past couple years. For one thing, I have no idea how they got my desk number (they knew my name), as that's supposed to be internal-only information, so that was an unpleasant surprise. For another thing, I'm of that population that strongly prefers text-mode communication over phone calls. So making an cold call to my work was a great way to get a "fuck off" and blacklist that recruiter. I wonder from what business culture they come from, and what their success rate with that method are, to make that approach seem viable.
newprint 8y ago
Good + heavy $$$ punishments. My father had heart attack few weeks ago and my brother refused to pickup a call, because he was thinking that it was a robocall. It was a call from hospital in VA, they a left voicemail.
- AimForTheBushes 8y ago
  At this point, if it's a phone number not in my contacts I'm letting it go to voicemail. The problem is that I'm getting desensitized to voicemails. After hearing "...Blue cross, Aetna, blah blah" health insurance spam voicemails 5x a day I guess anyone would just start deleting them without checking. It's infuriating. Also, hope your father is doing alright!
  - dba7dba 8y ago
    I also stopped really checking voicemails... I stopped checking voicemails, as only people who call and leave voicemail are not the people who I communicate everyday. People in my life know to text/chat/email if they need to get through to me right away. And I do the same. I never leave voicemail in people's inboxes...
    - AimForTheBushes 8y ago
      Exactly. I got 7 spam calls today. Each one left a voicemail. I can't keep up with that.
  - loeg 8y ago
    I also let non-contacts go to voicemail, but my experience is different — I find that almost no unsolicited calls leave voicemails. Also, I use the Google Voice transcription, which is at least good enough to let me know if it's interesting or spam. Sometimes even good enough I don't need to listen to the recording.
    - nikanj 8y ago
      If they had to press a key, they'd not leave any, ever. As of right now, the voicemails are the robospiel with the first 30 seconds cut off. They start the tape the moment your voicemail picks up, and by the time it gets to the beep, their message is already half through.
deleted 8y ago
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WD-42 8y ago
Funny, Pai "celebrated" repealing Obama era anti robocall laws back in March. Maybe it took him a year of robo calls on his own phone to change his mind. https://www.cnet.com/news/courts-nixes-fcc-rules-targeting-robocalls/ https://www.cnet.com/news/courts-nixes-fcc-rules-targeting-r... This guy is anti consumer. Don't let him fool you.
- kevin_b_er 8y ago
  Most likely they affected him personally.
- tmaly 8y ago
  Too bad the public could not help direct this policy rather than have it fall to one person's biases
  - kevin_b_er 8y ago
    Not quite. It falls to the biases of the party that controls the FCC.
    - tmaly 8y ago
      but with the internet and all the modern technology, should such an important decision be centralized like this at all?
- ams6110 8y ago
  The earlier regulations were too broad and in theory could subject callers to a fine if they called or texted anyone else without prior consent. What he is asking for now is that caller IDs be verified. I don't know how realistic that is given the way they are implimented (trivially spoofable) but that's a narrower demand.
  - JohnFen 8y ago
    So he's only addressing spoofed caller ID, and not doing a thing about the ungodly number of spam calls? Sounds to me like his priorities are exactly backwards.
RandomInteger4 8y ago
I've stopped answering my phone completely unless the number is in my contacts. If I plan to communicate with anyone (recruiters, etc.) I make it explicit that I won't answer their call unless they give me the number they'll be calling from ahead of time, and then I tell them I'll place them in my contacts with that number. My hope is that this is training these individuals to be more aware of the issue, assuming they've forgotten about it due to being desensitized or using some paid caller ID spam service that not everyone has access to for lack of funds. I've also long turned off my voice mail; it's just a waste of time.
- wetpaws 8y ago
  I stopped using phone completely, period, even for known numbers. It's in permanent silence, no vibration, no checking mode. It took some time for friends to learn they have to use Skype or whatsapp to contact me, but after that I don't have to worry about spam and midnight calls anymore.
  - ghaff 8y ago
    So, you're basically not reachable in an emergency unless someone knows the special code to get hold of you? To say nothing of local service people etc. who you might have to deal with. I don't like junk calls either but cutting myself off from normal communication channels doesn't seem as if it would be very practical.
    - wetpaws 8y ago
      People can use texts for emergency messages. If they want to voice call, this usually mean situation is not so urgent in a first place.
      - UncleEntity 8y ago
        I think I'd take issue with a text "Umm, yeah, your mom died so call me". And, yes, I do in fact use punctuation on text messages...
MiddleEndian 8y ago
Just give consumers the ability to see the actual number or VOIP address that's calling them instead of "Caller ID", even if the number is blocked. Then consumers can accurately create an adblock-like list of spam numbers, block calls from outside their country, etc.
- reustle 8y ago
  The problem I notice is that I'm getting calls from my local area code (low population area). Chances are those numbers are registered, used, and released. Poor dev or person in the near future will find themselves on a blacklist.
  - MiddleEndian 8y ago
    Those numbers are just the caller id rather than the true origin of the caller. Anybody can claim anything as their caller id. The phone companies know the true origin (usually outside the US) but they do not pass that information forward.
RcouF1uZ4gsC 8y ago
Robocalls aren't the worst part of caller id spoofing. Robocalls are basically annoyances. However, there are real scams such as the IRS scam https://www.irs.gov/newsroom/irs-urges-public-to-stay-alert-for-scam-phone-calls https://www.irs.gov/newsroom/irs-urges-public-to-stay-alert-... where people are getting called with numbers that appear to be from the government, and are losing millions of dollars. We really need a solution to prevent number spoofing.
- Buttons840 8y ago
  I'm one who has used number spoofing for good. I create a system to call patients and remind them of medical appointments many years ago, and we would spoof the Caller ID number so that it showed the call coming from the appointment desk of the relevant Doctor's office, even though all the calls were actually originated from a central location. The company had ownership of all phone numbers we displayed, and it was beneficial to users who could call back and reach an appointment desk with the power to help them.
  - ghaff 8y ago
    Yeah, that's one of the issues. There are actually quite a few legit reasons to spoof Caller ID. So "ban spoofing, period" is pretty much a non-starter.
    - yjftsjthsd-h 8y ago
      Just do it like SPF does for email; the legitimate owner of a number may delegate its use to anyone they choose.
AnimalMuppet 8y ago
What needs to happen is jail time for systematic violation of the "do not call" list. Anything less is bandaids.
- Someone1234 8y ago
  Most of them aren't in the US, so it isn't clear how that would work.
  - AnimalMuppet 8y ago
    That part would work out by making it impossible to have an international call spoof US caller ID.
- deathanatos 8y ago
  I agree completely, though I wonder why do-not-call even needs to be a thing here. These spammers are calling repeatedly for the sole purpose of committing fraud¹. Fraud, normally, is illegal. Why do phones need special legislation here? ¹The factory warranty on my vehicle is going to expire? I don't have a vehicle with an expiring warranty. "This is your final notice" how I wish those words would be true. Or my "medical-grade knee brace" that I supposedly wear. Or the interest rate I could get on the CC I don't have.
  - AnimalMuppet 8y ago
    Why do we need do-not-call? Because even if it isn't fraud, I still don't want them to call me. [Edit: And I think it is in fact working, in that the non-fraud people don't call me much anymore. So the ones who do call are the ones willing to break the do-not-call law, which means they're probably also willing to break other laws, like the ones against fraud.]
gist 8y ago
The vast majority of robo calls are done for someone either in the US (a company) to make money or uses the US banks to collect money in some way. What they may want to consider is a team of people to actually take the calls and trace them back to the source. Or at least the people that are making money in some way. And don't say or react 'oh that wouldn't work'. Of course it would work if done correctly. No point in selling health insurance by way of a third party making calls or on your own if it will get you in hot water. From what I can tell nobody is making robo calls to simply be annoying. It's quite different than a DOS attack done for fun or many other 'crimes' if you want to call it that. Not that they shouldn't approach this in the way they are. But to simply make as if there is no way to get the perps is a bit ridiculous. Someone is in the end selling something or collecting some name or something like that. I am reminded of what I thought back when graffiti was a bigger deal than it is now. Why not simply set honey pots that you know are going to get tagged? Or monitor various locations likely to get graffiti. Now this doesn't mean that offshore people with scams won't get involved. That could happen. But as a start might make sense to at least gut the people in the US that are benefiting from this (in addition not instead of other 'remedies' by the carriers).
davesque 8y ago
Thank god. It's getting ridiculous. I get 3 or 4 of these every day now. That's something like 90% of the calls I get.
pkaye 8y ago
Particularly sucks for me because I'm on a kidney transplant list so may get a call any time of a potential match and they didn't specific which number will call me. So basically I end up answering all these unknown number robocalls in case I miss one of these matches.
- penagwin 8y ago
  I'm so sorry, but that's seriously the ultimate tease. Every phone call is a "MAYBE ITS MY NEW KIDNEY?!" and instead you're greated with "Your cars EXTENDED WARRANTY is about to expire, please press 1 now to speak to a representative about your cars EXTENDED WARRANTY"
  - pkaye 8y ago
    To be honest, I still have a couple years wait on the kidney but there is a non-zero change of a perfect match that gets to the head of the line. And I certainly don't want to miss that. I do have a trick in dealing with the calls though. I answer the line but say nothing. Humans will always say something if there is silence for a while. Robocalls will just hang up. And I notice if they hangup, the chance of future calls are lower.
    - fromthestart 8y ago
      I read somewhere that the purpose of some subset of robocalls is to simply listen for an answer to determine whether a human operator has been found.
      - UncleEntity 8y ago
        I'm fairly convinced of that, a couple times I "press one to speak with a sales representative" and it immediately hung up on me. Or "press three to be removed from the call list" and the volume of spam calls drastically increases. I actually just finished a couple weeks of zero spam calls and it was wonderful...if not a bit on the lonely side
the_watcher 8y ago
Putting aside any discussion of Pai's motivations and political considerations, is there a reason that carriers wouldn't want to eliminate these robocalls? Are the spoofers paying the carriers? It seems like any carrier that figured out how to effectively eliminate (or even reduce) them would have a massive competitive advantage until the others caught up, right?
- asdff 8y ago
  That would require cost sunk into innovative engineering, while the business model of telecoms is stasis at best and anticonsumer practices at worse.
- monocasa 8y ago
  Carriers do still pay n cents a minute for calling->receiving carriers, so the receiving carrier has a financial incentive to keep the robocalls coming.
commandlinefan 8y ago
Robocalls have made my telephone so useless as a telephone that I'm beginning to wonder if I even need a telephone number at all, just as I started wondering if I actually needed a house phone or cable.
- deleted 8y ago
  [deleted]
- porphyrogene 8y ago
  In the US, house phones and cable are for being advertised to, cell phones and streaming are for contact and content respectively. That has been the case for at least a decade. I can receive calls from numbers that are not in my contacts but the notification is silent. Now if only I were allowed to dispose of my mailbox I could have a home free of advertising. Yesterday I received an infuriating catalog from Restoration Hardware that weighed a pound and a half, all because I bought one awful product that fell apart in a few months and had to be recycled. It amazes me that we subsidize such obnoxious ads being delivered to every resident.
  - JohnFen 8y ago
    > cell phones and streaming are for contact and content respectively. That has been the case for at least a decade. That decade-long social norm is dead. Now all phones are for being advertised to.
    - porphyrogene 8y ago
      That is true, at least in my experience. At least modern phones are smart enough to know how to shut up.
  - lh7777 8y ago
    I've had reasonable success cutting back on useless catalogs with catalogchoice.org. There are a few very persistent clothing companies that I'll have to call to see if I can get them to finally stop sending catalogs every few weeks, but for the most part, Catalog Choice is pretty quick and effective. Too bad there's no way to opt out of all bulk mail, though.
bradleyjg 8y ago
I understood the problem to be, at least in no small part, regulatory to begin with. To what extent are carriers permitted to deliberately not complete a call originating outside their own network (what about from a foreign network)?
newnewpdro 8y ago
I've noticed that my prepay burner phones, some of which I've kept in service for years, never receive robocalls. It's definitely not a blind system of calling all numbers, you can have a robocall-free existence. I've simply never supplied the numbers for those phones to any personal information selling (or leaking) services/businesses, and that seems to effectively keep them off the call lists.
eruci 8y ago
It is out of control. A robot selling health insurance keeps calling at all hours, although I live in Canada where I enjoy universal health care.
Waterluvian 8y ago
Are robcalls something that ALL Americans deal with daily, or is it just really bad for some people?
- Twirrim 8y ago
  It happens on a very large scale. https://www.washingtonpost.com/technology/2019/01/29/report-americans-got-billion-robocalls-last-year-up-percent/?utm_term=.5685ef5f6d42 https://www.washingtonpost.com/technology/2019/01/29/report-... In 2018 Americans got 26.3 billion robocalls, up 46% from 2017. With an estimated population of 328,863,150 in 2018, that's 79 per person, so more than once a week on average, and of course a whole bunch of that population doesn't have a phone (e.g. most kids)
- ravenstine 8y ago
  I get several of them every day and I know other people who do, too. I just disable phone calls most of the time because T-Mobile doesn't care at all to address the issue, no matter how many times I've reported it. Their answer is for me to install a 3rd party app that doesn't actually block the calls but hangs up on them.
  - toomuchtodo 8y ago
    T-Mobile has put much effort into not only identifying scam calls but also the ability to block them. No app required, no extra charge. https://support.t-mobile.com/docs/DOC-38784 https://support.t-mobile.com/docs/DOC-38784
    - ikeboy 8y ago
      I've gotten plenty of legitimate calls marked as spam caller, which means T-Mobile can't be trusted here.
      - toomuchtodo 8y ago
        I haven’t gotten any spam calls after enabling it on my phone number that I’ve had with TMO for 20+ years, nor have any legit calls been marked as spam. I suppose everyone’s milegage may vary.
ArtDev 8y ago
I almost exclusively use my Google Voice number and its remarkable how good it is at filtering spam-calls. I want to tell everyone to get Google Voice.. but given their history of killing successful projects. Well, its only a matter of time. Dear Google: here take my money! Keep Google Voice!
- rincebrain 8y ago
  Nearly 100% of the spam calls I get on my cell phone in the past few years are to the actual cell phone number (which I've never given anyone), not the GV number. :( Sadly, I'm not aware of a good way to filter these out.
  - Sylamore 8y ago
    It's a bit of work, but what I've done in the past is to set the default ringtone to a silent ring tone (or the mosquito one if you're old enough and want to annoying your kids), then for each of your contacts set a custom ringtone. Doesn't scale well if you've got a lot of contacts to deal with.
RickJWagner 8y ago
Yyyyyyyyesssssssss! It's about time.
Animats 8y ago
The FCC previously proposed giving carriers "freedom to block".[1] That didn't fly. Insisting on tighter standards for caller ID is reasonable enough. [1] https://www.washingtonpost.com/technology/2018/11/20/fcc-has-new-plan-combat-unwanted-robocalls-spammy-texts/?utm_term=.bfa8093ddfc0 https://www.washingtonpost.com/technology/2018/11/20/fcc-has...
fernly 8y ago
While I was reading the last paragraph of this story, my phone rang, showing a number in a nearby town. And of course, as I confidently expected, it was "Hi there! This is Stan, from your local air duct cleaning service!" Nice to get that evening call from Stan, or James, or Dave, wanting to clean my ducts. Every fucking evening. Yes, FCC. Do it do it do it!
nullc 8y ago
Under the theory that the economics of scam-spam calls only work out if good victims self select by not hanging up I have long considered it a civic duty to waste the scammers time. In the past, I managed to keep a scammer on the phone for an hour or more simply by leaving it on speaker phone and making various "oh really, interesting tell me more" sounds while half paying attention. On more than a few occasions I eventually caused the scammer to either crack up laughing-- after I got tired of stringing them along and hit them with a devastating pun-- or freak out screaming at me. But in the last two years I've _never_ been able to bait one out long enough for them to have scammed me if I had been an eligible mark and not for the lack of trying. The majority of the scam calls just end up hanging up before I ever get to a human, the majority of those that do make it to a human hang up as soon as they hear my voice. The majority of those that don't immediately hand up, do after a couple back and forth interactions. "You've been selected to get $1000 back from the IRS for being a great taxpayer!" "Oh man, thats great!" <click> "You've been selected to get $1000 back from the IRS for being a great taxpayer!" "Really? How did that happen?" <click> "You've been selected to get $1000 back from the IRS for being a great taxpayer!" "Whos this again?" <click> I'm wondering if they're now doing some kind of demographic profiling using my voice-- e.g. I don't sound enough like an aged or mentally impaired pensioner, or perhaps even have some kind of machine-learning time waster voice identification. ... or maybe there is some kind of meta-scam where someone is charging another scammer to handle these calls but aren't actually doing the work. Regardless, I'd like to encourage all of you to do your civic duty and waste a scammers time. It can be done with very little effort on your part and it almost certainly protects real potential victims (even with my frequent hangups, my actions are almost certainly extending protection via false positives, if nothing else). I have confirmed that these actions have not increased or decreased the rate of scam calls I get relative to my SO who doesn't engage in this practice (because she simply does not answer unrecognized numbers at all).
- blakejustblake 8y ago
  I would not suggest people try to waste scammers time, or do anything but hang up on them. A lot of calls that just hang up on you are putting out the feelers for phone numbers that have humans answering on the other line so that they know that's a viable target for attempting to scam. Showing any sign that your phone number belongs to an actual human just ups the chances that you're going to get an increased amount of phone spam, regardless of if you got the chance to waste someone's time or not. Also, people should be wary of saying anything at all the these suspicious phone calls, some of them try to get recordings of you saying some key words to make it easier to steal your identity. For instance, if someone asks if you are who you are by name and you say yes, then they've got decent confirmation that they've got a recording of a particular person saying "yes" which can be used against you in stealing your identity or credit card fraud.
_bxg1 8y ago
I like how Pai is championing this issue only because it's the most uncontroversial action he can possibly take. So that he can say "Look! I'm doing something! I'm totally not giving the telecom companies a free pass!"
jacobsenscott 8y ago
I'm sure Pai "threatening regulatory intervention" has them quaking in their boots. They just toss him a few benjamins and the he shuts tf up.
org3432 8y ago
Still no word on when they'll crack down on USPS junk mail too, I miss important letter because my mailbox is piled up with spam. And people to have to buy bigger PO Boxes just to support their racket.
- adrr 8y ago
  USPS would go bankrupt if it wasn't for junk mail. It is pretty much the only mail I get since I opted out of physical billing statements.
  - AnIdiotOnTheNet 8y ago
    Possibly, but they also do quite a lot of business in package delivery, which is something customers actually still want.
- will_pseudonym 8y ago
  Kramer agrees. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sMqt1uAxibw https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sMqt1uAxibw
  - argd678 8y ago
    I looked to see how I can cancel my mail too, they don’t let you.
- nikanj 8y ago
  At least the junk in my mailbox doesn't yank me out of a good programming flow.
bad_charlotte 8y ago
Hopefully this regulation will really make illegal telemarketers stop calling us with those spam calls.I also read an article that might be useful for someone who has similar robocalls problems at https://www.whycall.me/news/consumer-wins-massive-229500-robocall-lawsuit-against-time-warner-cable/ https://www.whycall.me/news/consumer-wins-massive-229500-rob....
newshorts 8y ago
Good. Robot calls have rendered my phone a “voicemail only” machine. I never answer my phone, please text or leave voicemail.
auiya 8y ago
If the FCC were interested in the least this would have been done years ago.
heyjudy 8y ago
NoMoRobo is free for landline VOIP in the US (maybe Canada too). Works like a charm in 98% of the time. For cell phones, you'll usually have to pay for such an app that can intercept calls and check RBLs of naughty numbers.
- nikanj 8y ago
  Checking for naughty numbers is completely useless, when the incoming caller ID is spoofed every time.
lsllc 8y ago
I get about 5 junk calls a day, at least 2 usually in Chinese. Does anyone know what the ones in Chinese are about? These days I just don't answer unless it's someone in my contacts, if it's anything important they'll leave a message. Wonder if it's possible to have a plan with NO voice on it!
solotronics 8y ago
I have a phone number from a city I used to live in 10 years ago. I don't keep up with anyone from that city so if I get a call from that area code its most likely a spam call.

382 points by jmsflknr 8y ago

So the article doesn't seem to mention any of the ongoing efforts to stop or reduce caller ID spoofing, such as SHAKEN/STIR. I'm not clear if that will do anything, and it's certainly far too little too late, but the industry is doing something. On that note, does anyone know how SHAKEN/STIR is supposed to work? I understand that it basically sets up a PKI with JWTs in SIP headers, but from what I can tell there needs to be some sort of trusted CA which creates and signs these things, but I can't tell who that CA is or if there even is an agreed upon central CA. I'd also be interested in any corrections/expansion on any of the things I said above, I really don't know much about it and would like to. edit: after making this comment I did a bit more research, and it looks like[0] there will be per-country CAs that can issue certificates to owners of phone numbers within that country. I'm specifically curious about which CAs will be trusted in the United States. [0]: https://tools.ietf.org/id/draft-burger-stir-iana-cert-00.html https://tools.ietf.org/id/draft-burger-stir-iana-cert-00.htm...

thwythwy 8y ago
Quick correction, I don't think "doing something" (italics omitted) is the legal standard for regulatory intervention
- markovbot 8y ago
  Right, I didn't mean to imply that this action by the FCC was in any way wrong. The fact that caller ID is completely unauthenticated in 2019 is horrifying, and regulation is long over due.
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toast0 8y ago
Authority for the North American Numbering plan currently falls to the FCC, after the breakup of AT&T; they contract out administration, Ericsson got a 5 year contract in 2017, previously it was administered by Neustar (and Lockheed Martin, before Neustar was spun out). I'd imagine Ericsson would spin up a new CA instance just for this. As the administratior, they keep the records of who phone numbers are assigned to, and where they've been ported. My understanding is once a +1 area code is allocated to a country, that country's telecoms regulator manages further allocations (or contracts it out).
- markovbot 8y ago
  Cool, thanks for the info. Any idea what the timeline on creating that CA is?
  - toast0 8y ago
    No idea. I wasn't aware of this proposal (STIR), I just am aware of a lot of number allocation stuff. Does STIR have any support from telecoms companies and/or ITU? Or is it IANA only? I see Neustar has a page that seems related: https://www.home.neustar/atis-testbed/index.php https://www.home.neustar/atis-testbed/index.php ?
    - markovbot 8y ago
      From what I can tell, the telcos are implementing it, or at least say they are: * "Caller Verified is T-Mobile’s implementation of the STIR and SHAKEN standards" [0] * "Verizon reiterates both our commitment to deploying the STIR/SHAKEN call authentication technology" [1] * "Sprint supports efforts to build the SHAKEN/STIR call authentication system" [2] * AT&T doesn't seem to mention STIR or SHAKEN by name on their robocall page [3] but the FCC sent them a letter thanking them for their "commitment to implement a robust call authentication framework in 2019" [4] * "Comcast is proud to be at the forefront of efforts to address the scourge of illegal spoofed robocalls in this country, including the development of the end-to-end call authentication protocol known as SHAKEN and STIR" [5] etc [0]: https://www.t-mobile.com/news/caller-verified-note9 https://www.t-mobile.com/news/caller-verified-note9 [1]: https://ecfsapi.fcc.gov/file/1119062987519/2018%2011%2019%20Verizon%20Call%20Authentication%20Framework%20WC%20Docket%20No.%2017-97.pdf https://ecfsapi.fcc.gov/file/1119062987519/2018%2011%2019%20... [2]: https://ecfsapi.fcc.gov/file/1091391175368/Sprint%20Call%20Authentication%20Comments.pdf https://ecfsapi.fcc.gov/file/1091391175368/Sprint%20Call%20A... [3]: https://about.att.com/sites/cyberaware/ae/robocall https://about.att.com/sites/cyberaware/ae/robocall [4]: https://docs.fcc.gov/public/attachments/DOC-354933A2.pdf https://docs.fcc.gov/public/attachments/DOC-354933A2.pdf [5]: https://ecfsapi.fcc.gov/file/111974588343/Comcast%20Resp%20to%20Chmn%20Pai%20re%20SHAKEN%20STIR%20(11-19-18).pdf https://ecfsapi.fcc.gov/file/111974588343/Comcast%20Resp%20t...
rhizome 8y ago
That's a nice effort, but I think the phone company should be required to itemize each call's billing information by default. Perhaps the billing number (the number obscured by spoofing) on every bill, with the rest available by request or on the website (to save paper). But all in all, the problem is that the phone company will refuse to help unless required by law. They make good money from shitty robocallers.
jzl 8y ago
More info on SHAKEN/STIR: https://transnexus.com/whitepapers/understanding-stir-shaken/ https://transnexus.com/whitepapers/understanding-stir-shaken... http://nymag.com/intelligencer/2018/05/how-to-stop-spam-robocalls-with-stir-shaken.html http://nymag.com/intelligencer/2018/05/how-to-stop-spam-robo...

wil421 8y ago

Robocalls are terrible and a valid reason to have regulations. We should sign up every Senator and Congressman’s cellphone to N number of scammy sites. See how fast the issue is solved. SS7 issue be damned, AT&T and Verizon will solve it if you force their hands.

AceJohnny2 8y ago
Good luck finding a congressperson's personal cell phone.
- jasonjayr 8y ago
  What would it cost to Wardial a whole area code with TextToSpeech + SpeechToText on twilio?
  - dba7dba 8y ago
    Reminds me of the time, well a long time ago, when I worked at a tech startup during the early 2000 bubble. Talent war was intense. We had recruiters cold calling people's desk to try to lure people away. At that office, like every desk (many unoccupied) had a normal phone, with an extension #. In one instance, a recruiter called and it was answered and he/she was told not interested. After that call, every phone on each of the row of desks started ringing one at a time. After about 3 - 5 such ringings, someone picked up and told them to knock it off.
    - AceJohnny2 8y ago
      I've been cold-called at my desk by a recruiter twice in the past couple years. For one thing, I have no idea how they got my desk number (they knew my name), as that's supposed to be internal-only information, so that was an unpleasant surprise. For another thing, I'm of that population that strongly prefers text-mode communication over phone calls. So making an cold call to my work was a great way to get a "fuck off" and blacklist that recruiter. I wonder from what business culture they come from, and what their success rate with that method are, to make that approach seem viable.

newprint 8y ago

Good + heavy $$$ punishments. My father had heart attack few weeks ago and my brother refused to pickup a call, because he was thinking that it was a robocall. It was a call from hospital in VA, they a left voicemail.

AimForTheBushes 8y ago
At this point, if it's a phone number not in my contacts I'm letting it go to voicemail. The problem is that I'm getting desensitized to voicemails. After hearing "...Blue cross, Aetna, blah blah" health insurance spam voicemails 5x a day I guess anyone would just start deleting them without checking. It's infuriating. Also, hope your father is doing alright!
- dba7dba 8y ago
  I also stopped really checking voicemails... I stopped checking voicemails, as only people who call and leave voicemail are not the people who I communicate everyday. People in my life know to text/chat/email if they need to get through to me right away. And I do the same. I never leave voicemail in people's inboxes...
  - AimForTheBushes 8y ago
    Exactly. I got 7 spam calls today. Each one left a voicemail. I can't keep up with that.
- loeg 8y ago
  I also let non-contacts go to voicemail, but my experience is different — I find that almost no unsolicited calls leave voicemails. Also, I use the Google Voice transcription, which is at least good enough to let me know if it's interesting or spam. Sometimes even good enough I don't need to listen to the recording.
  - nikanj 8y ago
    If they had to press a key, they'd not leave any, ever. As of right now, the voicemails are the robospiel with the first 30 seconds cut off. They start the tape the moment your voicemail picks up, and by the time it gets to the beep, their message is already half through.

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WD-42 8y ago

Funny, Pai "celebrated" repealing Obama era anti robocall laws back in March. Maybe it took him a year of robo calls on his own phone to change his mind. https://www.cnet.com/news/courts-nixes-fcc-rules-targeting-robocalls/ https://www.cnet.com/news/courts-nixes-fcc-rules-targeting-r... This guy is anti consumer. Don't let him fool you.

kevin_b_er 8y ago
Most likely they affected him personally.
tmaly 8y ago
Too bad the public could not help direct this policy rather than have it fall to one person's biases
- kevin_b_er 8y ago
  Not quite. It falls to the biases of the party that controls the FCC.
  - tmaly 8y ago
    but with the internet and all the modern technology, should such an important decision be centralized like this at all?
ams6110 8y ago
The earlier regulations were too broad and in theory could subject callers to a fine if they called or texted anyone else without prior consent. What he is asking for now is that caller IDs be verified. I don't know how realistic that is given the way they are implimented (trivially spoofable) but that's a narrower demand.
- JohnFen 8y ago
  So he's only addressing spoofed caller ID, and not doing a thing about the ungodly number of spam calls? Sounds to me like his priorities are exactly backwards.

RandomInteger4 8y ago

I've stopped answering my phone completely unless the number is in my contacts. If I plan to communicate with anyone (recruiters, etc.) I make it explicit that I won't answer their call unless they give me the number they'll be calling from ahead of time, and then I tell them I'll place them in my contacts with that number. My hope is that this is training these individuals to be more aware of the issue, assuming they've forgotten about it due to being desensitized or using some paid caller ID spam service that not everyone has access to for lack of funds. I've also long turned off my voice mail; it's just a waste of time.

wetpaws 8y ago
I stopped using phone completely, period, even for known numbers. It's in permanent silence, no vibration, no checking mode. It took some time for friends to learn they have to use Skype or whatsapp to contact me, but after that I don't have to worry about spam and midnight calls anymore.
- ghaff 8y ago
  So, you're basically not reachable in an emergency unless someone knows the special code to get hold of you? To say nothing of local service people etc. who you might have to deal with. I don't like junk calls either but cutting myself off from normal communication channels doesn't seem as if it would be very practical.
  - wetpaws 8y ago
    People can use texts for emergency messages. If they want to voice call, this usually mean situation is not so urgent in a first place.
    - UncleEntity 8y ago
      I think I'd take issue with a text "Umm, yeah, your mom died so call me". And, yes, I do in fact use punctuation on text messages...

MiddleEndian 8y ago

Just give consumers the ability to see the actual number or VOIP address that's calling them instead of "Caller ID", even if the number is blocked. Then consumers can accurately create an adblock-like list of spam numbers, block calls from outside their country, etc.

reustle 8y ago
The problem I notice is that I'm getting calls from my local area code (low population area). Chances are those numbers are registered, used, and released. Poor dev or person in the near future will find themselves on a blacklist.
- MiddleEndian 8y ago
  Those numbers are just the caller id rather than the true origin of the caller. Anybody can claim anything as their caller id. The phone companies know the true origin (usually outside the US) but they do not pass that information forward.

RcouF1uZ4gsC 8y ago

Robocalls aren't the worst part of caller id spoofing. Robocalls are basically annoyances. However, there are real scams such as the IRS scam https://www.irs.gov/newsroom/irs-urges-public-to-stay-alert-for-scam-phone-calls https://www.irs.gov/newsroom/irs-urges-public-to-stay-alert-... where people are getting called with numbers that appear to be from the government, and are losing millions of dollars. We really need a solution to prevent number spoofing.

Buttons840 8y ago
I'm one who has used number spoofing for good. I create a system to call patients and remind them of medical appointments many years ago, and we would spoof the Caller ID number so that it showed the call coming from the appointment desk of the relevant Doctor's office, even though all the calls were actually originated from a central location. The company had ownership of all phone numbers we displayed, and it was beneficial to users who could call back and reach an appointment desk with the power to help them.
- ghaff 8y ago
  Yeah, that's one of the issues. There are actually quite a few legit reasons to spoof Caller ID. So "ban spoofing, period" is pretty much a non-starter.
  - yjftsjthsd-h 8y ago
    Just do it like SPF does for email; the legitimate owner of a number may delegate its use to anyone they choose.

AnimalMuppet 8y ago

What needs to happen is jail time for systematic violation of the "do not call" list. Anything less is bandaids.

Someone1234 8y ago
Most of them aren't in the US, so it isn't clear how that would work.
- AnimalMuppet 8y ago
  That part would work out by making it impossible to have an international call spoof US caller ID.
deathanatos 8y ago
I agree completely, though I wonder why do-not-call even needs to be a thing here. These spammers are calling repeatedly for the sole purpose of committing fraud¹. Fraud, normally, is illegal. Why do phones need special legislation here? ¹The factory warranty on my vehicle is going to expire? I don't have a vehicle with an expiring warranty. "This is your final notice" how I wish those words would be true. Or my "medical-grade knee brace" that I supposedly wear. Or the interest rate I could get on the CC I don't have.
- AnimalMuppet 8y ago
  Why do we need do-not-call? Because even if it isn't fraud, I still don't want them to call me. [Edit: And I think it is in fact working, in that the non-fraud people don't call me much anymore. So the ones who do call are the ones willing to break the do-not-call law, which means they're probably also willing to break other laws, like the ones against fraud.]

gist 8y ago

The vast majority of robo calls are done for someone either in the US (a company) to make money or uses the US banks to collect money in some way. What they may want to consider is a team of people to actually take the calls and trace them back to the source. Or at least the people that are making money in some way. And don't say or react 'oh that wouldn't work'. Of course it would work if done correctly. No point in selling health insurance by way of a third party making calls or on your own if it will get you in hot water. From what I can tell nobody is making robo calls to simply be annoying. It's quite different than a DOS attack done for fun or many other 'crimes' if you want to call it that. Not that they shouldn't approach this in the way they are. But to simply make as if there is no way to get the perps is a bit ridiculous. Someone is in the end selling something or collecting some name or something like that. I am reminded of what I thought back when graffiti was a bigger deal than it is now. Why not simply set honey pots that you know are going to get tagged? Or monitor various locations likely to get graffiti. Now this doesn't mean that offshore people with scams won't get involved. That could happen. But as a start might make sense to at least gut the people in the US that are benefiting from this (in addition not instead of other 'remedies' by the carriers).

davesque 8y ago

Thank god. It's getting ridiculous. I get 3 or 4 of these every day now. That's something like 90% of the calls I get.

pkaye 8y ago

Particularly sucks for me because I'm on a kidney transplant list so may get a call any time of a potential match and they didn't specific which number will call me. So basically I end up answering all these unknown number robocalls in case I miss one of these matches.

penagwin 8y ago
I'm so sorry, but that's seriously the ultimate tease. Every phone call is a "MAYBE ITS MY NEW KIDNEY?!" and instead you're greated with "Your cars EXTENDED WARRANTY is about to expire, please press 1 now to speak to a representative about your cars EXTENDED WARRANTY"
- pkaye 8y ago
  To be honest, I still have a couple years wait on the kidney but there is a non-zero change of a perfect match that gets to the head of the line. And I certainly don't want to miss that. I do have a trick in dealing with the calls though. I answer the line but say nothing. Humans will always say something if there is silence for a while. Robocalls will just hang up. And I notice if they hangup, the chance of future calls are lower.
  - fromthestart 8y ago
    I read somewhere that the purpose of some subset of robocalls is to simply listen for an answer to determine whether a human operator has been found.
    - UncleEntity 8y ago
      I'm fairly convinced of that, a couple times I "press one to speak with a sales representative" and it immediately hung up on me. Or "press three to be removed from the call list" and the volume of spam calls drastically increases. I actually just finished a couple weeks of zero spam calls and it was wonderful...if not a bit on the lonely side

the_watcher 8y ago

Putting aside any discussion of Pai's motivations and political considerations, is there a reason that carriers wouldn't want to eliminate these robocalls? Are the spoofers paying the carriers? It seems like any carrier that figured out how to effectively eliminate (or even reduce) them would have a massive competitive advantage until the others caught up, right?

asdff 8y ago
That would require cost sunk into innovative engineering, while the business model of telecoms is stasis at best and anticonsumer practices at worse.
monocasa 8y ago
Carriers do still pay n cents a minute for calling->receiving carriers, so the receiving carrier has a financial incentive to keep the robocalls coming.

commandlinefan 8y ago

Robocalls have made my telephone so useless as a telephone that I'm beginning to wonder if I even need a telephone number at all, just as I started wondering if I actually needed a house phone or cable.

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porphyrogene 8y ago
In the US, house phones and cable are for being advertised to, cell phones and streaming are for contact and content respectively. That has been the case for at least a decade. I can receive calls from numbers that are not in my contacts but the notification is silent. Now if only I were allowed to dispose of my mailbox I could have a home free of advertising. Yesterday I received an infuriating catalog from Restoration Hardware that weighed a pound and a half, all because I bought one awful product that fell apart in a few months and had to be recycled. It amazes me that we subsidize such obnoxious ads being delivered to every resident.
- JohnFen 8y ago
  > cell phones and streaming are for contact and content respectively. That has been the case for at least a decade. That decade-long social norm is dead. Now all phones are for being advertised to.
  - porphyrogene 8y ago
    That is true, at least in my experience. At least modern phones are smart enough to know how to shut up.
- lh7777 8y ago
  I've had reasonable success cutting back on useless catalogs with catalogchoice.org. There are a few very persistent clothing companies that I'll have to call to see if I can get them to finally stop sending catalogs every few weeks, but for the most part, Catalog Choice is pretty quick and effective. Too bad there's no way to opt out of all bulk mail, though.

bradleyjg 8y ago

I understood the problem to be, at least in no small part, regulatory to begin with. To what extent are carriers permitted to deliberately not complete a call originating outside their own network (what about from a foreign network)?

newnewpdro 8y ago

I've noticed that my prepay burner phones, some of which I've kept in service for years, never receive robocalls. It's definitely not a blind system of calling all numbers, you can have a robocall-free existence. I've simply never supplied the numbers for those phones to any personal information selling (or leaking) services/businesses, and that seems to effectively keep them off the call lists.

eruci 8y ago

It is out of control. A robot selling health insurance keeps calling at all hours, although I live in Canada where I enjoy universal health care.

Waterluvian 8y ago

Are robcalls something that ALL Americans deal with daily, or is it just really bad for some people?

Twirrim 8y ago
It happens on a very large scale. https://www.washingtonpost.com/technology/2019/01/29/report-americans-got-billion-robocalls-last-year-up-percent/?utm_term=.5685ef5f6d42 https://www.washingtonpost.com/technology/2019/01/29/report-... In 2018 Americans got 26.3 billion robocalls, up 46% from 2017. With an estimated population of 328,863,150 in 2018, that's 79 per person, so more than once a week on average, and of course a whole bunch of that population doesn't have a phone (e.g. most kids)
ravenstine 8y ago
I get several of them every day and I know other people who do, too. I just disable phone calls most of the time because T-Mobile doesn't care at all to address the issue, no matter how many times I've reported it. Their answer is for me to install a 3rd party app that doesn't actually block the calls but hangs up on them.
- toomuchtodo 8y ago
  T-Mobile has put much effort into not only identifying scam calls but also the ability to block them. No app required, no extra charge. https://support.t-mobile.com/docs/DOC-38784 https://support.t-mobile.com/docs/DOC-38784
  - ikeboy 8y ago
    I've gotten plenty of legitimate calls marked as spam caller, which means T-Mobile can't be trusted here.
    - toomuchtodo 8y ago
      I haven’t gotten any spam calls after enabling it on my phone number that I’ve had with TMO for 20+ years, nor have any legit calls been marked as spam. I suppose everyone’s milegage may vary.

ArtDev 8y ago

I almost exclusively use my Google Voice number and its remarkable how good it is at filtering spam-calls. I want to tell everyone to get Google Voice.. but given their history of killing successful projects. Well, its only a matter of time. Dear Google: here take my money! Keep Google Voice!

rincebrain 8y ago
Nearly 100% of the spam calls I get on my cell phone in the past few years are to the actual cell phone number (which I've never given anyone), not the GV number. :( Sadly, I'm not aware of a good way to filter these out.
- Sylamore 8y ago
  It's a bit of work, but what I've done in the past is to set the default ringtone to a silent ring tone (or the mosquito one if you're old enough and want to annoying your kids), then for each of your contacts set a custom ringtone. Doesn't scale well if you've got a lot of contacts to deal with.

RickJWagner 8y ago

Yyyyyyyyesssssssss! It's about time.

Animats 8y ago

The FCC previously proposed giving carriers "freedom to block".[1] That didn't fly. Insisting on tighter standards for caller ID is reasonable enough. [1] https://www.washingtonpost.com/technology/2018/11/20/fcc-has-new-plan-combat-unwanted-robocalls-spammy-texts/?utm_term=.bfa8093ddfc0 https://www.washingtonpost.com/technology/2018/11/20/fcc-has...

fernly 8y ago

While I was reading the last paragraph of this story, my phone rang, showing a number in a nearby town. And of course, as I confidently expected, it was "Hi there! This is Stan, from your local air duct cleaning service!" Nice to get that evening call from Stan, or James, or Dave, wanting to clean my ducts. Every fucking evening. Yes, FCC. Do it do it do it!

nullc 8y ago

Under the theory that the economics of scam-spam calls only work out if good victims self select by not hanging up I have long considered it a civic duty to waste the scammers time. In the past, I managed to keep a scammer on the phone for an hour or more simply by leaving it on speaker phone and making various "oh really, interesting tell me more" sounds while half paying attention. On more than a few occasions I eventually caused the scammer to either crack up laughing-- after I got tired of stringing them along and hit them with a devastating pun-- or freak out screaming at me. But in the last two years I've _never_ been able to bait one out long enough for them to have scammed me if I had been an eligible mark and not for the lack of trying. The majority of the scam calls just end up hanging up before I ever get to a human, the majority of those that do make it to a human hang up as soon as they hear my voice. The majority of those that don't immediately hand up, do after a couple back and forth interactions. "You've been selected to get $1000 back from the IRS for being a great taxpayer!" "Oh man, thats great!" <click> "You've been selected to get $1000 back from the IRS for being a great taxpayer!" "Really? How did that happen?" <click> "You've been selected to get $1000 back from the IRS for being a great taxpayer!" "Whos this again?" <click> I'm wondering if they're now doing some kind of demographic profiling using my voice-- e.g. I don't sound enough like an aged or mentally impaired pensioner, or perhaps even have some kind of machine-learning time waster voice identification. ... or maybe there is some kind of meta-scam where someone is charging another scammer to handle these calls but aren't actually doing the work. Regardless, I'd like to encourage all of you to do your civic duty and waste a scammers time. It can be done with very little effort on your part and it almost certainly protects real potential victims (even with my frequent hangups, my actions are almost certainly extending protection via false positives, if nothing else). I have confirmed that these actions have not increased or decreased the rate of scam calls I get relative to my SO who doesn't engage in this practice (because she simply does not answer unrecognized numbers at all).

blakejustblake 8y ago
I would not suggest people try to waste scammers time, or do anything but hang up on them. A lot of calls that just hang up on you are putting out the feelers for phone numbers that have humans answering on the other line so that they know that's a viable target for attempting to scam. Showing any sign that your phone number belongs to an actual human just ups the chances that you're going to get an increased amount of phone spam, regardless of if you got the chance to waste someone's time or not. Also, people should be wary of saying anything at all the these suspicious phone calls, some of them try to get recordings of you saying some key words to make it easier to steal your identity. For instance, if someone asks if you are who you are by name and you say yes, then they've got decent confirmation that they've got a recording of a particular person saying "yes" which can be used against you in stealing your identity or credit card fraud.

_bxg1 8y ago

I like how Pai is championing this issue only because it's the most uncontroversial action he can possibly take. So that he can say "Look! I'm doing something! I'm totally not giving the telecom companies a free pass!"

jacobsenscott 8y ago

I'm sure Pai "threatening regulatory intervention" has them quaking in their boots. They just toss him a few benjamins and the he shuts tf up.

org3432 8y ago

Still no word on when they'll crack down on USPS junk mail too, I miss important letter because my mailbox is piled up with spam. And people to have to buy bigger PO Boxes just to support their racket.

adrr 8y ago
USPS would go bankrupt if it wasn't for junk mail. It is pretty much the only mail I get since I opted out of physical billing statements.
- AnIdiotOnTheNet 8y ago
  Possibly, but they also do quite a lot of business in package delivery, which is something customers actually still want.
will_pseudonym 8y ago
Kramer agrees. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sMqt1uAxibw https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sMqt1uAxibw
- argd678 8y ago
  I looked to see how I can cancel my mail too, they don’t let you.
nikanj 8y ago
At least the junk in my mailbox doesn't yank me out of a good programming flow.

bad_charlotte 8y ago

Hopefully this regulation will really make illegal telemarketers stop calling us with those spam calls.I also read an article that might be useful for someone who has similar robocalls problems at https://www.whycall.me/news/consumer-wins-massive-229500-robocall-lawsuit-against-time-warner-cable/ https://www.whycall.me/news/consumer-wins-massive-229500-rob....

newshorts 8y ago

Good. Robot calls have rendered my phone a “voicemail only” machine. I never answer my phone, please text or leave voicemail.

auiya 8y ago

If the FCC were interested in the least this would have been done years ago.

heyjudy 8y ago

NoMoRobo is free for landline VOIP in the US (maybe Canada too). Works like a charm in 98% of the time. For cell phones, you'll usually have to pay for such an app that can intercept calls and check RBLs of naughty numbers.

nikanj 8y ago
Checking for naughty numbers is completely useless, when the incoming caller ID is spoofed every time.

lsllc 8y ago

I get about 5 junk calls a day, at least 2 usually in Chinese. Does anyone know what the ones in Chinese are about? These days I just don't answer unless it's someone in my contacts, if it's anything important they'll leave a message. Wonder if it's possible to have a plan with NO voice on it!

solotronics 8y ago

I have a phone number from a city I used to live in 10 years ago. I don't keep up with anyone from that city so if I get a call from that area code its most likely a spam call.