4 ms·

They desperately need to port messages/facetime to windows and android. They could very easily charge a flat yearly fee with the promise of secure messaging.

by tw04 8y ago

They desperately need to port messages/facetime to windows and android. They could very easily charge a flat yearly fee with the promise of secure messaging. They're going to miss the boat just like blackberry before them if they don't move sooner rather than later. EVENTUALLY Google will stop dropping the ball, and then it will be too late.

Skunkleton 8y ago
Apple has and advantage in that you cannot set default messaging app on iOS. For me at least, that is the only thing that keeps me on Messages/Maps/Mail.
ancorevard 8y ago
At this point Android is such a privacy hell hole that creating a secure messaging app will be doomed to fail. It matter little if the app and its protocols are secure if the device is rooted or otherwise exploited and typed conversations can be siphoned which would expose both the sender and the receiver. The receiver might be an iOS device, causing the communication security/privacy integrity of an iOS user to be at the mercy of any Android device.
- walterbell 8y ago
  iOS messaging apps need an option to warn the sender (or block delivery) when the receiver has non-iOS devices, e.g. in a specific group context with sensitive data.
  - CarriersSuck 8y ago
    This would have to be the case. You can't trust an Android device to not have anything between the keyboard app and the messaging app.
- on_and_off 8y ago
  how is that different than exploiting security flaws in iOS ?
  - scarface74 8y ago
    There is a difference between a security flaw and insecure by design as with Android. One simple example is how third party keyboards work on both platforms. First the user has to install the keyboard, then explicitly go to settings to use it and even then it doesn’t have network access by default. The user has to go back into settings to give it network access and iOS gives you a big scary warning. Even then, iOS will switch back to the standard keyboard when you type into a password field.
    - on_and_off 8y ago
      You could just as easily argue that iOS is by nature insecure since absolutely exterior audits are impossible.
      - scarface74 8y ago
        It isn’t “impossible.” People have been analyzing assembly language programs and hacking them since the dawn of personal computers. How do you think Google has been able to find exploits in iOS? I have no idea why people think that assembly language is the language of wizards. Between the binary blob drivers that the OEMs don’t even have access to and Google Play Services, Android is equally hard to audit.
        on_and_off 8y ago
        false equivalence
edmundsauto 8y ago
What makes you think that Google is the big competitor to Messages in the US, rather than FB Messenger? I know more (non-tech audience) people who use FB Messenger than any of the google products. Does Google default to Hangouts messages when using an android phone, if the recipient also has an Android (vs. straight MMS)? Personally, I use Apple's Messages, but that's because it's installed by default and integrated with SMS. It's basically just enhanced MMS, so a really really easy transition.
- wvenable 8y ago
  > Does Google default to Hangouts messages when using an android phone, if the recipient also has an Android (vs. straight MMS)? No. Google does not integrate their messaging solution with SMS. The real reason behind that is that Google doesn't want to piss off the carriers who still see messaging (iMessage excluded) as a source of revenue.
  - anchpop 8y ago
    This is the reasoning for RCS, unfortunately. They could have implemented it everywhere a long time ago but wait for carrier support
  - nicoburns 8y ago
    In which countries is messaging still a revenue source? In the UK you usually get unlimited SMS mesages on even the cheapest plans... (and everyone is using whatsapp or facebook messenger anyway, which is probably why)
  - edmundsauto 8y ago
    Interesting. What is it about Google's position that makes them not want to piss off the carriers? Apple seems to take consumer friendly, anti-carrier positions -- no-lock SIM, iMessages the default. What do you think makes Google different? Is it because they partner more closely on handsets?
  - tw04 8y ago
    You realize hangouts supported SMS previously and they removed the functionality to try to get people to use Allo, right?

by tw04 8y ago

Skunkleton 8y ago

Apple has and advantage in that you cannot set default messaging app on iOS. For me at least, that is the only thing that keeps me on Messages/Maps/Mail.

ancorevard 8y ago

At this point Android is such a privacy hell hole that creating a secure messaging app will be doomed to fail. It matter little if the app and its protocols are secure if the device is rooted or otherwise exploited and typed conversations can be siphoned which would expose both the sender and the receiver. The receiver might be an iOS device, causing the communication security/privacy integrity of an iOS user to be at the mercy of any Android device.

walterbell 8y ago
iOS messaging apps need an option to warn the sender (or block delivery) when the receiver has non-iOS devices, e.g. in a specific group context with sensitive data.
- CarriersSuck 8y ago
  This would have to be the case. You can't trust an Android device to not have anything between the keyboard app and the messaging app.
on_and_off 8y ago
how is that different than exploiting security flaws in iOS ?
- scarface74 8y ago
  There is a difference between a security flaw and insecure by design as with Android. One simple example is how third party keyboards work on both platforms. First the user has to install the keyboard, then explicitly go to settings to use it and even then it doesn’t have network access by default. The user has to go back into settings to give it network access and iOS gives you a big scary warning. Even then, iOS will switch back to the standard keyboard when you type into a password field.
  - on_and_off 8y ago
    You could just as easily argue that iOS is by nature insecure since absolutely exterior audits are impossible.
    - scarface74 8y ago
      It isn’t “impossible.” People have been analyzing assembly language programs and hacking them since the dawn of personal computers. How do you think Google has been able to find exploits in iOS? I have no idea why people think that assembly language is the language of wizards. Between the binary blob drivers that the OEMs don’t even have access to and Google Play Services, Android is equally hard to audit.
      - on_and_off 8y ago
        false equivalence

edmundsauto 8y ago

What makes you think that Google is the big competitor to Messages in the US, rather than FB Messenger? I know more (non-tech audience) people who use FB Messenger than any of the google products. Does Google default to Hangouts messages when using an android phone, if the recipient also has an Android (vs. straight MMS)? Personally, I use Apple's Messages, but that's because it's installed by default and integrated with SMS. It's basically just enhanced MMS, so a really really easy transition.

wvenable 8y ago
> Does Google default to Hangouts messages when using an android phone, if the recipient also has an Android (vs. straight MMS)? No. Google does not integrate their messaging solution with SMS. The real reason behind that is that Google doesn't want to piss off the carriers who still see messaging (iMessage excluded) as a source of revenue.
- anchpop 8y ago
  This is the reasoning for RCS, unfortunately. They could have implemented it everywhere a long time ago but wait for carrier support
- nicoburns 8y ago
  In which countries is messaging still a revenue source? In the UK you usually get unlimited SMS mesages on even the cheapest plans... (and everyone is using whatsapp or facebook messenger anyway, which is probably why)
- edmundsauto 8y ago
  Interesting. What is it about Google's position that makes them not want to piss off the carriers? Apple seems to take consumer friendly, anti-carrier positions -- no-lock SIM, iMessages the default. What do you think makes Google different? Is it because they partner more closely on handsets?
- tw04 8y ago
  You realize hangouts supported SMS previously and they removed the functionality to try to get people to use Allo, right?