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I wonder how much money it costs Apple to handle subscription payments/cancellations for Netflix and other streaming services. I prefer to handle subscription

by skh 8y ago

I wonder how much money it costs Apple to handle subscription payments/cancellations for Netflix and other streaming services. I prefer to handle subscription through Apple because cancelling such services is never difficult. I don’t know how it is on other countries but cancelling services in the U.S. can be a hellish experience. Personally, I’d be willing to pay the “Apple Tax” on top of a subscription services’ cost for the peace of mind that comes from knowing that cancelling is easy. What a pain it will be when all the other subscription services stop paying the “Apple Tax”. I hope Apple comes up with a solution. Clearly their current cut is too much.

toufiqbarhamov 8y ago
For many things I’d agree, but to their credit Netflix has always made it trivially easy to cancel. They’re one of the few modern IT companies that seem to go out of the way to make joining and leaving fair and easily comprehensible. Now if they’d just make that autoplaying a goddamned option!
- MrMember 8y ago
  I was kind of surprised when I canceled my Netflix account. I had a laundry list of complaints I was going to put in the "why are you canceling" box but they never gave me one. Making it easy and painless to cancel is one of the few things they're still doing right.
  - kraftman 8y ago
    What were your reasons?
    - wernercd 8y ago
      To see what they'd ask?
    - bkraz 8y ago
      I also recently canceled and was surprised they didn't ask why. My reason was that the selection of content has changed dramatically. When I first signed up, I could choose a movie that I had in mind. Now, the selection of movies on Netflix streaming is extremely bleak. It's almost entirely TV shows, and about half of it is Netflix-produced. The quality of it is fine, I just don't want TV shows. I want access to the majority of movies ever produced, and would pay much more for such a service.
      - 83457 8y ago
        "I want access to the majority of movies ever produced" Appears that will never happen.
        toast0 8y ago
        This is really unfortunate; when Netflix launched streaming, they had a partnership with Start that had a lot of popular movies, but now you would need to mix and match two or three services to get similar coverage. I've been buying more and more discs lately, because I want to watch something today, and at any time in the future. I hope, one day, we get compulsory licensing for movies and TV shows, like is available for music -- then we can really watch whatever, as long as it has been digitized.
        Marsymars 8y ago
        Not never. In the long run, the majority of movies ever produced will be in the public domain.
    - MrMember 8y ago
      A lot of small issues that added up to an overall negative experience. The web UI redesign a few years ago that made it the same as the UI in Android, smart TVs, etc, but also slower and more difficult to use. Autoplaying something if you hover over it for more than a second (a cancerous UX design that has spread beyond Netflix now). UI inconsistencies like the "resume watching" row. 50% of the time it would be at the top where you would expect it, 25% of the time it would show up if you scrolled far enough, and 25% of the time it would never show up at all. I never understood that one, it was bizarre and unexpected behavior. Removing a lot of quality content and not replacing it equally high quality content. The overall decline in quality of Netflix's original series. There wasn't any one thing that made me decide to cancel, one day I realized I hadn't used it in several months and the UI made it a pain to use when I did, so I canceled.
  - zapzupnz 8y ago
    They didn't give you one? They gave me one, and I put in basically what you complained about.
  - dkersten 8y ago
    After I cancelled last time they offered me a free month, with no obligation of staying beyond the free month. They make it easy to leave and easy to come back.
- skh 8y ago
  Netflix has been very good about being easy to cancel. Few companies are as good as them but I can’t trust that Netflix will always be as good as they currently are.
  - UnpossibleJim 8y ago
    Which is funny, because getting ITunes off of my machines was like purging a virus. Once that is installed it is not just a "would you like to uninstall" dialogue.
- ocdtrekkie 8y ago
  Easy to cancel, but they won't stop begging me to come back.
  - toufiqbarhamov 8y ago
    Now that’s too true. Everyone seems to do that now! I bought a 3lb bag of Jelly Belly jelly beans to make some holiday vodka for a party, and they will not stop whining at me about points and buying more jelly beans. Thank Christ that I have an email I use just for online orders.
- tokyodude 8y ago
  I use this option often. I basically sign up about once every 4 months and cancel almost immediately. Something I want to try watching so I sign up. Then get annoyed at the autoplay which makes it nearly impossible for me to comfortably browse for other content I might be interested in so I give up and cancel.
- eisa01 8y ago
  Spotify is also super easy to cancel
todd3834 8y ago
I’m an Apple fan all around. (Even own a homepod). But I have to disagree with “cancelling is easy”. Cancelling a subscription on iOS is so hidden that I can’t say it’s easy. I hope they change this.
- skh 8y ago
  My experience is that it is easy once you find the right screen. A Google search always leads me to the right screen. Apple could be better at making the location more transparent but they couldn’t make the act of canceling, once you get to the right location, easier.
  - todd3834 8y ago
    Sure but the fact you have to google it every time is not exactly what I’d expect from Apple. I’m sure they will improve this. They must get a ton of support calls over this.
    - jclardy 8y ago
      As a dev who works on a fairly large app with an in-app subscription, we are the ones that get a ton of support requests, even having the unsubscribe link in our own settings. The problem is a huge percentage of users assume deleting the app will also stop their subscription, but it does not.
      - tokyodude 8y ago
        Sounds like something Apple should fix. They know you have a subscription for the App you're deleting. They should ask "You have a subscription for this app's services through Apple Pay. Do you want to unsubscribe?" They could even say something like "You have a subscription for this app's services through Apple Pay. Do you want to unsubscribe? Note that this app is still installed on your iPad" (assuming you deleted it from your iphone) As a tangent I notice that while Apple's hardware and OS are best in class their support infrastructure is arguably close to worst in class. Every time I have to deal with their support and order systems (apple.com) I run into issues that make it almost seem like they're still doing everything on paper and that none of their systems are connected.
pmart123 8y ago
A couple other advantages is it is likely more secure than having your credit card stored across many sites (although Stripe solves that too), and if your card expires, you only have to update one thing.
morpheuskafka 8y ago
And it makes iTunes gift cards really nice when they can be used to pay for anything under the sun, as long as it has an iOS app.
Laforet 8y ago
From what I heard from ios developers, the cost is a resounding "nothing"; any cancelled or fraudulent orders are simply taken out of Apple's monthly remittance to you. Details are usually wittheld for privacy reasons. It may be great for consumers but it's been a constant headache for devs and publishers since the beginning of the App Store because it's very hard to work out the source of any shrinkage. Netflix is probably better positioned to pursue these cases but for a lot of indie devs the cost of investigation far outweights any benefit so they have to accept it as a part of the business cost on top of the 30% already charged by AAPL.
- pfranz 8y ago
  While I sympathise with people trying to run a business, as a user I'm incredibly grateful not to be harassed by current and former services. I have a bunch of Netflix emails saying, "Please come back!" and "Try Netflix again for free!" as well as half a dozen that all say "Netflix tonight?" Too many bad actors ruin it for everyone and I don't think people fully appreciate what Apple does to protect their attention. I loathe the constant spam (from reputable merchants) and junk snail mail I get every day. Every few months I spend 20 min unsubscribing and refiltering email. Most people I know just let it clog up their mail app. I probably spend at least the same amount of time with junk mail. I realize it's difficult for an advertiser to reach me for actually useful things. But when I travel and see TV adverts, I'm glad I'm not constantly reminded that I should give luxury cars as Christmas gifts or how awesome shower gel is. I'm not interested in refinancing my mortgage every month or consolidation of debt I don't have. I don't care that my cellphone provider is broadcasting a NYE live show or the last car dealership I bought a car from wants me to switch insurance companies.
ehsankia 8y ago
Tell me about it. To cancel my NYT subscription, I had to swap my payment method to paypal, then literally block them from my Paypal. After which, they sent me no less than 10 emails, almost one per day for over a week.
zaidf 8y ago
I could not disagree more. It requires 5+ taps and just as many obscure screens to cancel a subscription to an iOS app. If Apple were really serious, they would have an app called Subscriptions.
- spullara 8y ago
  App Store -> Profile Pic -> Manage Subscriptions
  - trollied 8y ago
    Whilst true, it’s not intuitive to the majority of users.
celeritascelery 8y ago
I am in the same boat. For most things I will happily subscribe through iTunes and pay extra because I know that I can go to one place to manage all my subscriptions.

by skh 8y ago

toufiqbarhamov 8y ago

For many things I’d agree, but to their credit Netflix has always made it trivially easy to cancel. They’re one of the few modern IT companies that seem to go out of the way to make joining and leaving fair and easily comprehensible. Now if they’d just make that autoplaying a goddamned option!

MrMember 8y ago
I was kind of surprised when I canceled my Netflix account. I had a laundry list of complaints I was going to put in the "why are you canceling" box but they never gave me one. Making it easy and painless to cancel is one of the few things they're still doing right.
- kraftman 8y ago
  What were your reasons?
  - wernercd 8y ago
    To see what they'd ask?
  - bkraz 8y ago
    I also recently canceled and was surprised they didn't ask why. My reason was that the selection of content has changed dramatically. When I first signed up, I could choose a movie that I had in mind. Now, the selection of movies on Netflix streaming is extremely bleak. It's almost entirely TV shows, and about half of it is Netflix-produced. The quality of it is fine, I just don't want TV shows. I want access to the majority of movies ever produced, and would pay much more for such a service.
    - 83457 8y ago
      "I want access to the majority of movies ever produced" Appears that will never happen.
      - toast0 8y ago
        This is really unfortunate; when Netflix launched streaming, they had a partnership with Start that had a lot of popular movies, but now you would need to mix and match two or three services to get similar coverage. I've been buying more and more discs lately, because I want to watch something today, and at any time in the future. I hope, one day, we get compulsory licensing for movies and TV shows, like is available for music -- then we can really watch whatever, as long as it has been digitized.
      - Marsymars 8y ago
        Not never. In the long run, the majority of movies ever produced will be in the public domain.
  - MrMember 8y ago
    A lot of small issues that added up to an overall negative experience. The web UI redesign a few years ago that made it the same as the UI in Android, smart TVs, etc, but also slower and more difficult to use. Autoplaying something if you hover over it for more than a second (a cancerous UX design that has spread beyond Netflix now). UI inconsistencies like the "resume watching" row. 50% of the time it would be at the top where you would expect it, 25% of the time it would show up if you scrolled far enough, and 25% of the time it would never show up at all. I never understood that one, it was bizarre and unexpected behavior. Removing a lot of quality content and not replacing it equally high quality content. The overall decline in quality of Netflix's original series. There wasn't any one thing that made me decide to cancel, one day I realized I hadn't used it in several months and the UI made it a pain to use when I did, so I canceled.
- zapzupnz 8y ago
  They didn't give you one? They gave me one, and I put in basically what you complained about.
- dkersten 8y ago
  After I cancelled last time they offered me a free month, with no obligation of staying beyond the free month. They make it easy to leave and easy to come back.
skh 8y ago
Netflix has been very good about being easy to cancel. Few companies are as good as them but I can’t trust that Netflix will always be as good as they currently are.
- UnpossibleJim 8y ago
  Which is funny, because getting ITunes off of my machines was like purging a virus. Once that is installed it is not just a "would you like to uninstall" dialogue.
ocdtrekkie 8y ago
Easy to cancel, but they won't stop begging me to come back.
- toufiqbarhamov 8y ago
  Now that’s too true. Everyone seems to do that now! I bought a 3lb bag of Jelly Belly jelly beans to make some holiday vodka for a party, and they will not stop whining at me about points and buying more jelly beans. Thank Christ that I have an email I use just for online orders.
tokyodude 8y ago
I use this option often. I basically sign up about once every 4 months and cancel almost immediately. Something I want to try watching so I sign up. Then get annoyed at the autoplay which makes it nearly impossible for me to comfortably browse for other content I might be interested in so I give up and cancel.
eisa01 8y ago
Spotify is also super easy to cancel

todd3834 8y ago

I’m an Apple fan all around. (Even own a homepod). But I have to disagree with “cancelling is easy”. Cancelling a subscription on iOS is so hidden that I can’t say it’s easy. I hope they change this.

skh 8y ago
My experience is that it is easy once you find the right screen. A Google search always leads me to the right screen. Apple could be better at making the location more transparent but they couldn’t make the act of canceling, once you get to the right location, easier.
- todd3834 8y ago
  Sure but the fact you have to google it every time is not exactly what I’d expect from Apple. I’m sure they will improve this. They must get a ton of support calls over this.
  - jclardy 8y ago
    As a dev who works on a fairly large app with an in-app subscription, we are the ones that get a ton of support requests, even having the unsubscribe link in our own settings. The problem is a huge percentage of users assume deleting the app will also stop their subscription, but it does not.
    - tokyodude 8y ago
      Sounds like something Apple should fix. They know you have a subscription for the App you're deleting. They should ask "You have a subscription for this app's services through Apple Pay. Do you want to unsubscribe?" They could even say something like "You have a subscription for this app's services through Apple Pay. Do you want to unsubscribe? Note that this app is still installed on your iPad" (assuming you deleted it from your iphone) As a tangent I notice that while Apple's hardware and OS are best in class their support infrastructure is arguably close to worst in class. Every time I have to deal with their support and order systems (apple.com) I run into issues that make it almost seem like they're still doing everything on paper and that none of their systems are connected.

pmart123 8y ago

A couple other advantages is it is likely more secure than having your credit card stored across many sites (although Stripe solves that too), and if your card expires, you only have to update one thing.

morpheuskafka 8y ago

And it makes iTunes gift cards really nice when they can be used to pay for anything under the sun, as long as it has an iOS app.

Laforet 8y ago

From what I heard from ios developers, the cost is a resounding "nothing"; any cancelled or fraudulent orders are simply taken out of Apple's monthly remittance to you. Details are usually wittheld for privacy reasons. It may be great for consumers but it's been a constant headache for devs and publishers since the beginning of the App Store because it's very hard to work out the source of any shrinkage. Netflix is probably better positioned to pursue these cases but for a lot of indie devs the cost of investigation far outweights any benefit so they have to accept it as a part of the business cost on top of the 30% already charged by AAPL.

pfranz 8y ago
While I sympathise with people trying to run a business, as a user I'm incredibly grateful not to be harassed by current and former services. I have a bunch of Netflix emails saying, "Please come back!" and "Try Netflix again for free!" as well as half a dozen that all say "Netflix tonight?" Too many bad actors ruin it for everyone and I don't think people fully appreciate what Apple does to protect their attention. I loathe the constant spam (from reputable merchants) and junk snail mail I get every day. Every few months I spend 20 min unsubscribing and refiltering email. Most people I know just let it clog up their mail app. I probably spend at least the same amount of time with junk mail. I realize it's difficult for an advertiser to reach me for actually useful things. But when I travel and see TV adverts, I'm glad I'm not constantly reminded that I should give luxury cars as Christmas gifts or how awesome shower gel is. I'm not interested in refinancing my mortgage every month or consolidation of debt I don't have. I don't care that my cellphone provider is broadcasting a NYE live show or the last car dealership I bought a car from wants me to switch insurance companies.

ehsankia 8y ago

Tell me about it. To cancel my NYT subscription, I had to swap my payment method to paypal, then literally block them from my Paypal. After which, they sent me no less than 10 emails, almost one per day for over a week.

zaidf 8y ago

I could not disagree more. It requires 5+ taps and just as many obscure screens to cancel a subscription to an iOS app. If Apple were really serious, they would have an app called Subscriptions.

spullara 8y ago
App Store -> Profile Pic -> Manage Subscriptions
- trollied 8y ago
  Whilst true, it’s not intuitive to the majority of users.

celeritascelery 8y ago

I am in the same boat. For most things I will happily subscribe through iTunes and pay extra because I know that I can go to one place to manage all my subscriptions.