17 ms·

Limiting Social Media Decreases Loneliness and Depression

327 points by T-A 8y ago

kobiguru 8y ago
I agree with the conclusions. I got rid of all social media except for Reddit ( for ML related discussions) and Hacker News. I always calmer since. It amazing how fast my mind felt better from the negativity.
- Kiro 8y ago
  Hacker News and Reddit are the worst though.
  - stareatgoats 8y ago
    Reddit can be, but HN is IMO the best social media site there is in the IT space, because of the clear guidelines, active moderation and well thought out mechanics which for example enables both flame-war suppression and anonymity, no small feat.
    - Kiro 8y ago
      Two problems I see with HN: 1. It's the most addictive social media I know. 2. Due to the "downvote if you disagree" policy you get downvoted for simple opinions and that makes you really depressed when you happen to have opinions about stuff that's not in line with the general HN crowd.
      - mav3rick 8y ago
        You shouldn't take the internet so seriously. Don't let any rando hurt your self esteem. If someone says you're wrong try to find out if there is some truth in their argument. Best case you grow , worst case life remains the same.
      - petra 8y ago
        I agree HN is very addictive, maybe the most of all social media. but why ?
        eeZah7Ux 8y ago
        Because it focuses on topics rather than facebook nonversations
    - clarry 8y ago
      IMO the guidelines, moderation and mechanics all work way better on lobste.rs than here. Here the hivemind effect is pretty damn strong too, so it's going to be frustrating to try have a fruitful discussion if your opinion doesn't align with the group. Here there are enough toxic people that discussions often turn into tiresome, flamey back-and-forth between a handful of people. And here there are too many people with opinions but no expertise. So the signal to noise ratio gets really bad and you can't assume the people reading your comments can understand subtler points; if you do, it's quite inevitable that a bunch of people with opinions but no expertise will pile up on the comment and it feels like flamebait. When I post here, I kinda have to indulge in a ton of self-censorship. Most of the time I end up not posting the comment I wrote because it feels like it won't be a worthwhile discussion. Or it'll be just another comment buried among a few hundred others; just noise, not discussion. It's not satisfying.
      - bengale 8y ago
        Why do you think it’s different there. Also, how do you go about getting an account over there?
        clarry 8y ago
        It helps that the community is smaller and we've had the occasional meta thread discussing rules & phenomenons, with moderators and active posters alike present. We also have a somewhat tight knit community of active participants & mods on IRC. I think this makes the whole thing more human. There are other factors, for example downvoting because you disagree isn't seen as a valid reason for downvotes on Lobsters. In fact, when you downvote, you must specify a reason (there's a list of choices). Of course people can abuse the system, but I think it sort of encourages people to go down the right path. The invite system probably helps keep worst of the worst out. Tags help people ignore the topics they find frustrating. Speaking of tags, all stories must be tagged and if you can't find an appropriate tag, the story most likely doesn't belong. We've been trying to focus on purely technical content (and by that I mean really technical and not non-technical stories that are somehow related to technology) with some art, while avoiding politics, inactionable news, opinion pieces and the like. To be fair, as the community has grown larger, it seems like we've been slipping more and more from this ideal and opinion pieces about "practices" (that's a tag) and "culture" (yeah...) have gotten annoyingly common. We can still filter out those tags. As for getting an account... I think there's something written about that on the site.
  - icelancer 8y ago
    For that to be true you have to have one hell of a selective group of people you follow on Facebook and Twitter. Hacker News is without question the best "social media" site I read and has mostly maintained its quality over the years I've been here. Reddit, however, is godawful.
    - SlowRobotAhead 8y ago
      Yea? Have a pro-gun discussion on HackerNews and tell me how it’s so much better than Reddit. HN has its own problems. For one, there is a growing discontent for different opinions (downvote happy), and two, there is one “channel”, so it’s mob rule for opinion.
      - JoeAltmaier 8y ago
        Downvoting is simple disagreement (by policy) not some attempt to quash discussion. I know folks guard their karma jealously, which leads to resentment about downvoting. Add to that the 'greyed out' feature on downvoted comments which does look like censorship. But as an automatic mechanism for self-moderation it works ok, not perfect. Just look at the stuff at the bottom of a long discussion to see the quashed stuff, and tell me it doesn't belong there.
        SlowRobotAhead 8y ago
        Except that downvotes do exactly that. A couple and you’re marked as downvoted by fading, a few more and your comment is collapsed. “By policy” or not. It’s treated as a “make the bad man who said the mean things go away so he won’t fool or sway other people”. Just like Reddit.
        FiveSquared 8y ago
        Well, America has xtreme gun conrol laws, so the rest of the wolrd thinks you aree extreme, which elads to downvotes. BTW, mass shooting are EVERY WEEK IN THE USA. Swisterland has guns and yet they have feweer. Its the culture and lack of traiining.
  - b3b0p 8y ago
    I feel it greatly depends on what subreddits you follow. I find that limiting it to only a few (at a time) and those aren't toxic (socially, work related, or effect you emotionally) aren't bad and actually are about one of the only places to stay up to date and learn.
rwnspace 8y ago
I've deleted all my social media accounts besides Reddit and HN. The only thing that's stopping me from visiting these two is addiction. I don't read the news, mostly, why bother? It does much more harm than good. You don't need 1000 hrs of newsreading to vote effectively. My next step is to make a personal website with some contact details and a scraper script for the links in the HN top 30-40 that I can run as a cronjob. While cutting social media is not a panacea, I have found a significant improvement in the amount of free time I have, and I don't compulsively think about what other people are doing. It's a good exercise to assume that engagement in social media is work and multiply how many hours you've sunk into it by your usual hourly wage...
- icelancer 8y ago
  > I don't read the news, mostly, why bother? It does much more harm than good. It's weird that this is a minority opinion (I happen to agree with you). Some 20 years ago we lacked the ability to consume even 10% of the news we are exposed to today if we just open Twitter, and democracy wasn't collapsing. (some argue we are in a worse spot today, though I disagree - strife does not equal inequality) The cable news cycle combined with social media with the majority of people thinking that their opinion is worth something has led to some interesting results. I expect the next generation of people in the United States to mostly get over this bug in the system via selective apathy.
  - rcMgD2BwE72F 8y ago
    > with the majority of people thinking that their opinion is worth something has led to some interesting results What do you mean?
    - Zelphyr 8y ago
      Everybody is shouting at each other about how right they are and not listening to what others are saying to try to understand their point of view. The net result being giant echo chambers clashing against one another and the media using that for fun and profit.
  - 8y ago
KozmoNau7 8y ago
Luckily I never got into Instagram or Twitter, but I was big into both Reddit and Facebook for a long time. I cut off Reddit completely after a run-in with yet another subreddit wannabe dictator mod. It just wasn't worth the drama, not to mention the crappy usability of the site, especially on mobile. For Facebook, I can't cut it off completely, it is unfortunately indispensable for arranging events and interacting with my group of friends/acquaintances. I mostly interact in a couple of concert/festival-related groups, and run one of them myself. That said, I have cut off all games and apps, and I mute all the stupid meme pages that people like to share from. New ones do pop up once in a while, and obviously those get muted too. The result is that my Facebook experience is 90% chatting with like-minded people about music. I use a Chromium plugin to delete all of posts and likes that are more than ~6 months old, because nobody should care about old FB posts. I also keep my FB account for Messenger, as it has become the de facto standard instant messaging service here in Denmark. For discussion on other subjects, I'm a long-time member of an old-school forum that charges $10 for an account. That seems to weed out most of the low-content trolls and idiots, and aside from a few deliberately stupid subforums, the discussions are relatively intelligent and entertaining.
- selimthegrim 8y ago
  If this is the forum I suspect (goon?), I’m certainly pleasantly surprised it is no longer known as a source of trolls.
  - KozmoNau7 8y ago
    Yeah, the days of troll raids are long gone, thankfully.
szilardboy 8y ago
The abstract mentions limiting social media use to about 30 minutes a day. Why not eliminate it completely? I'd imagine the gains from maintaining relationships can be found elsewhere (e.g. phone calls or real life meetups).
- KozmoNau7 8y ago
  For all its faults, Facebook is very useful for arranging events and makes it easy for people to RSVP and provide/ask for more information in the event posting itself. It also provides a low barrier of entry and low complexity way of creating groups for discussion and sharing between friends. This is extremely helpful for people who aren't super tech-savvy. Yes, you can do this stuff elsewhere, manually keeping email and phone chains going, but FB does put all of this stuff in one place and makes it relatively easy to use. That is not the problem with FB. The problem is all of the other junk they keep pushing, all the ads and games and gamification.
User23 8y ago
Sartre was right
- baumgarn 8y ago
  can you add some context?
  - neals 8y ago
    () => "Sartre was right";
  - User23 8y ago
    “Hell is other people” evidently applies to social media.
  - 0xcde4c3db 8y ago
    One of Sartre's most (in)famous quotations is usually translated as "Hell is other people". In context, he was apparently getting at something closer to: Hell is the inevitability of seeing yourself through the eyes of others, as an object rather than a subject.
skilled 8y ago
I have a Twitter account that I don't post on, but use it to follow a few people whose content I enjoy and so it gives me a nice 'latest feed' I can check once a day. My Reddit use is in a similar place, but I do see myself using it more often whenever I want to burn some time. And HN for the latest news in Tech and other interesting (not watered down) topics. Deleted my Facebook account simply because FB as a platform sucks. I could log back on in 5 years and my feed would still look the same. Never used Instagram before. If you want to socialize on the web, then IMO, it's better to work on something you like -- project, website, etc, -- and build a community around that. I'll occasionally check Quora since sometimes people ask you to answer questions, but that's about it.
FahadUddin92 8y ago
So let me explain it. I started being active on the internet after learning no one would be friends with me (I was in class 6 back then). I would spend time figuring out things, talking to people and then social media evolved. I am still pretty active on social media but the main reason people are active on social media is they don't have people around them that listen to them.
- hippich 8y ago
  That what many miss about social networks (and long-distance communication overall, i.e. IRC, ICQ, etc) - it is not always about looking at other people fancy moments (which is probably some type of social networks promote today) but it is to have a connection with people, which otherwise you would not get locally.
jelly_dev 8y ago
About half way through my college education I decided I would only use Facebook for messages and otherwise eliminated all social media from my life aside from Reddit and Hacker news. Since then I found my outlook on life has improved dramatically and recommend most people do that. The problem with social media is you only see the interesting parts of people's lives, so you're forced into a loop of thinking your life is pointless and boring, while for the most part everyone's life is pretty boring aside from some brief moments
- deleted 8y ago
  [deleted]
- kopo 8y ago
  HN and Reddit arent that different from other social media sites. All of them in my mind are "All You Can Eat" info buffet tables. This is just the current approach we have of dealing with a new world overloaded by info. It will change as we learn more and more about how it effects people. In the real world nobody healthy visits an "All You Can Eat" buffet everyday. Same thing will eventually happen with information.
  - octosphere 8y ago
    The bulk of the problem is the linear-thinking brain. If we could devise a way for the brain to think exponentially (something computers are good at) - then we have a suitable way to deal with information overload. My only gripe with augmented brain capacity is that it could spiral away from us, and then lose touch with our original linear thought patterns. Something we have to eventually come to terms with.
    - ben_w 8y ago
      We don’t think linearly (we’re extremely parallel) and computers don’t think exponentially (just quickly, ironically enough that’s because it was easier to run ten times faster than on ten things at once).
zwarag 8y ago
When you open Social Media there is a reason for that. I figured - for me at least - it comes from an emotional impulse. By concentrating on that impulse, I discovered that it comes from “need” to socialize. Trying to fulfill that need by going on a social media platform is just convenient but does not really satisfy that need. So instead, I now call or meet with some family members/friends. In the progress of growing up I kinda unlearned that. But know that I rediscovered it, I feel much better/balanced. Other benefits are that I can concentrate and perform at my studies/work much better than before. I don’t know if that helps anybody but I thought I’d share this experience.
Chazprime 8y ago
Facebook was so much better before it started hosting news sites, and Twitter...it’s just a toilet. I think the best thing a parent can do for their children now is limit exposure to these sites, and emphasize real-life engagement.
8bitsrule 8y ago
My favorite long-term shared-post-and-comments site - far and away the most friendly and community-like - does not have downvotes. You can only 'favorite' a user comment. If your comment is not 'favorited' it is also not slapped with a downvote. (I find downvotes to be counterproductive and often arbitrary if not malicious. And one sows another.) Moderators decide only what posts are productive. A dozen or so a day result. No topic is too 'far out' or rarified. The posts themselves may also be heavily-favorited, but almost always are at least lightly-favorited by a few readers. There is very rarely any criticism or argument. The are not nested, they only appear in time-order. This keeps directed replies (and extended snark-fests) to a minimum. The resulting 'civilized adultness' of the site is fairly unique on the Internet. Oh, and there's a small fee to join.
- newen 8y ago
  Metafilter? Pretty sure the reason there are no arguments is they purged everyone who doesn't follow the groupthink. And the fee helps with banned people not rejoining ofcourse.
  - nhauz 8y ago
    So mefi is the same as HN but you even have to pay on top of it? ;P
    - 8bitsrule 8y ago
      I'm pretty sure that what I described is -not- the same as HN. New here? The advantage of one, small, upfront payment is that it discourages sockpuppeting, and thus anonymous sniping. The only way to 'downvote' something is with another piece of text with a username on it ... a lot more revealing of motive than a reflexive button-click. Discouraging for sick puppies. You know (or don't) ... like The Well was back in the day.
Maro 8y ago
Recently I did an experiment with myself where I didn't use FB for 30 days. After about 5 days I didn't miss it, but I was not happier. After the experiment, my usage rebounded, but significantly below prior levels (I post a lot less, so there's less feedback to get me to engage).
internet555 8y ago
Frankly, I only go on Facebook a few times a month to occasionally check in. I feel like logging in daily is not the point of the service.
- jaggednad 8y ago
  It shouldn’t be the point, but Facebook wants it to be, because the more eyeballs looking at their site, the more money they get. In order to maximize eyeballs, they make their site as addictive as possible.
anoncoward111 8y ago
Social media is literally my only hobby and has kept me very happy and safe-feeling for years now. I love browsing and discovering random things. Interacting with people in person can be very taxing after a long day of work, aka, interacting with people.
- SlowRobotAhead 8y ago
  Is it a concern that you don’t consider social media usage as “interacting with people”? If you were browsing wikipedia I’d understand. But your in the comment section talking to me, believe it or not, a real person.
  - genidoi 8y ago
    Who are you? In the absence of knowing literally anything about you it's challenging to "humanize" your comment. It's just another in a sea of anonymous comments written by arbitrary commentators. Sure I can trawl through your post history to try to better understand through what lens you see the world, but I don't have the time to do that for every single comment that I read on HN/Reddit.
  - matz1 8y ago
    I certainly don’t consider stranger random people on social media as “interacting with people” either, this include my respond to your comment.
  - anoncoward111 8y ago
    It's easier for me to interact with your statements via text than it is for me to engage with you emotionally, politically, physically etc like how workplaces inevitably are ://
deleted 8y ago
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greendestiny_re 8y ago
Social media use Pavlovian conditioning to drive adoption. Even the notification icon is – a bell. I stopped using all of them and I suggest you do too. If needed to stay in touch, send your friends and family a voice message as an email attachment, they'll appreciate the sound of your voice more than generic emojis.
- rdruxn 8y ago
  >a voice message as an email attachment Dear god why
  - greendestiny_re 8y ago
    Normal speaking speed is 150 words per minute, which when recorded equals to a ~1MB M4A file. I typically send 7-minute audio recordings, meaning roughly 1,000 words or about 2 pages of A4 text. Rather than getting slammed with a wall of text, the recipient of my audio message can listen to it as they're driving, cooking or eating breakfast. Human voice is expressive and the audio message conveys nuance that gets lost texting. Finally, all text messages are being monitored in some fashion but I do believe audio recordings are still relatively safe and private.
schindlabua 8y ago
My policy is to decrease on push notifications as far as possible. WhatsApp and Telegram still have the privilege but that's it. I feel like by seeking out information rather than it coming to me, I at least am making a conscious decision to waste time on social media. Interestingly, implementing that had the effect of me now spending hardly any time on there at all. Funny how that works!
- xfitm3 8y ago
  I’m really glad to see your comment. You control your phone, it doesn’t control you.
- a_wild_dandan 8y ago
  That's a great point. I went into the Android settings, pressed the toggle to disable all notifications, then went through and re-enabled the few necessary apps (text messenger, Spotify, etc). It helped immensely.
- jeffhiggins 8y ago
  I’ve started leaving DND mode on 24/7. I go to my notifications, they don’t come to me anymore. This also prevents your iPhone from being DOS’d by a phone call at any moment.
  - Fnoord 8y ago
    I'm doing the same (on Android, and push notification is broken anyway on microG). Sometimes I get 'anonymous' phone calls. Those are annoying. But people who know me, know I prefer e-mail etc.
- biophysboy 8y ago
  Something I did in addition to removing push notifications was deleting the apps. When I want to look at a Reddit thread or a tweet, I have to use my mobile browser, and endure their painful UI. Some might consider this paranoid or masochistic, but I find that for me it prevents further exploration beyond the thread/tweet I was originally interested in.
yyww 8y ago
This is probably true, but I don't know what else to do (counting HN as social media) - I don't really have any friends or interesting activities. Basically go to work, do work, go home, repeat. Anyone have any suggestions on how I could live a more interesting life and/or have friends? Sorta pathetic to be posting this here but since every other comment is talking out eliminating social media use, maybe some comments on what to replace it with would be helpful.
- SolaceQuantum 8y ago
  Well, you can begin to develop a hobby and then attend meetups associated. Find a swing dance group on meetup.com that is beginner friendly. Find an outdoor hiking group. Look for community or religious centers (if you’re religious) on coffeeshop ad boards... Friends tend to occur from there, as you meet more people. You could also take classes, make small talk with classmates and eventually do study groups.
- village-idiot 8y ago
  I recommend a gym, specifically a class based one like a boot camp or CrossFit. These tend to have a similar cohort of people who show up at the same time every week, so you’ll get an hour of exercise and social time wrapped up into one package. Friendship is created by repeated interaction. Anything that has you running into the same people repeatedly will typically create friendships.
- graeme 8y ago
  Find a hobby you enjoy and do that. Also, fix any obvious flaws, such as poor dress, being out of shape, persnonal hygiene, etc. lastly, practice small talk: when at a store, make a comment to the clerk, try to make them smile, etc The goal is basically improve socialization skills (small talk), remove frictin to friendships (hygiene, fitness, fashion), and then put yourself in situations where you meet people (hobbies). A local couchsuefing group can also be good, if you staet couchsurfing hosting.
- andrew_ 8y ago
  If you're not already active, get a cheap gym membership and force yourself to go for a few hours a week. I'm not talking about the meat-head bodybuilding sort. You may enjoy it, you'll be healthier for it, and you may meet others there which share interests.
vthallam 8y ago
My life has come a full circle. Moved to the facebook messenger, WhatsApp, Snapchat for texting and now only prefer iMessage or text messages. The number of groups you added to in WhatsApp and the meaningless forwards make me open those apps even lesser. On the social sharing front, I only use Snapchat to share what I am up to some close friends. Limited FB, Instagram to once a week casual check-in and never been happier.
prolikewh0a 8y ago
I've been off social media for years now, entirely, and I'm back to a point where the rest of my friends and just society itself are so fully entrenched into some sort of social media that I'm getting very lonely and depressed. I've actually thought about making a Facebook or Instagram account again and just placing strict rules on it, but even that really creeps me out. My friends are always telling me about cool events on Facebook, their Instagram stories at the really fun and cool places they work non-profit, all of these cool groups. I feel super detached from even my best friends, and feel like I don't get a full friend experience. While our relationships are strong and have been for years, they're kinda dull because they use social media so much. They understand why I don't use it and don't give me a hard time (anymore), but always bother me to come back.
- drewmate 8y ago
  I'm kind of in the same boat. I assumed that I would be able to participate in normal friendships without social media (the way people did for generations before me). Instead, I think people just assume I'm ignoring them on facebook because I'm anti-social. I've learned to be more proactive in maintaining relationships, but it often feels very one-sided since many other people are used to just getting passive status updates and feeling 'connected' to their friends.
  - Aeolun 8y ago
    I’ve had people genuinely get angry at me because I’d just been ignoring all IM’s for a few days. They were worried about whether I was still alive, but the concept of calling to confirm was apparently foreign. I kind of want to stop using social media, but I guess everyone will think I hate them or something.
    - coralreef 8y ago
      I wouldn't really classify instant messaging as social media, even though all social media platforms have messengers attached nowadays. Also, if your friends are making an effort to keep in contact with you, why are you faulting them for choosing X medium instead of Y?
annadane 8y ago
How do we define social media, though? I think Facebook is more damaging than all of them just by their use of attention grabbing techniques and total lack of privacy options.
deleted 8y ago
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nilshauk 8y ago
I quit my Facebook account in April and have not looked back. I connect with people in Signal, Twitter, Slack and LinkedIn. Quitting Facebook felt like uninstalling a program which was eating up a lot of ram in my life.
nercht12 8y ago
I joined Meetup.com, and now I have a growing number of friends every week. It helps to have an interest that other people can join you in. You could start a tech group, a language group, a movie group. Find a place to have a discussion, a small conference, or give a presentation. The fact is, social media isn't going to satisfy your craving with feeling connected. The digital world isn't a substitute for face-to-face conversation, so it's sad to see people resort to text-messaging the person in front of them. However, you CAN look for events for where to connect to people. That said, Meetup.com is a huge blessing.
jeromebaek 8y ago
I think social media is fine as a way to connect, it just shouldn't be the only or even major way to connect. In particular I think News Feed is a horrible way to "connect" with anyone. So I unfollowed every one of my friends on Facebook and keep a pristine blank news feed. If I want to know what someone's up to, I message them or visit their profile. It makes social media usage a lot more deliberate.
laurex 8y ago
It's interesting that messaging and social media are conflated by some people and not others. It stands to reason that direct communication is helpful to the problem of loneliness, whereas "observing the sanitised version of other people's lives from the outside" is not.
rubellion82 8y ago
try Diaspora (social network)
strikelaserclaw 8y ago
Humans are social creatures, and we are more isolated than we've ever been even though we are better connected than we've ever been. I don't think social media is to blame, just as i don't think fast food is to blame for obscenity epidemic, but i do think that social media has certainly, consciously leveraged certain weakness of humans in modern society to create addictive substances which cause more harm than good for most people.

327 points by T-A 8y ago

I agree with the conclusions. I got rid of all social media except for Reddit ( for ML related discussions) and Hacker News. I always calmer since. It amazing how fast my mind felt better from the negativity.

Kiro 8y ago
Hacker News and Reddit are the worst though.
- stareatgoats 8y ago
  Reddit can be, but HN is IMO the best social media site there is in the IT space, because of the clear guidelines, active moderation and well thought out mechanics which for example enables both flame-war suppression and anonymity, no small feat.
  - Kiro 8y ago
    Two problems I see with HN: 1. It's the most addictive social media I know. 2. Due to the "downvote if you disagree" policy you get downvoted for simple opinions and that makes you really depressed when you happen to have opinions about stuff that's not in line with the general HN crowd.
    - mav3rick 8y ago
      You shouldn't take the internet so seriously. Don't let any rando hurt your self esteem. If someone says you're wrong try to find out if there is some truth in their argument. Best case you grow , worst case life remains the same.
    - petra 8y ago
      I agree HN is very addictive, maybe the most of all social media. but why ?
      - eeZah7Ux 8y ago
        Because it focuses on topics rather than facebook nonversations
  - clarry 8y ago
    IMO the guidelines, moderation and mechanics all work way better on lobste.rs than here. Here the hivemind effect is pretty damn strong too, so it's going to be frustrating to try have a fruitful discussion if your opinion doesn't align with the group. Here there are enough toxic people that discussions often turn into tiresome, flamey back-and-forth between a handful of people. And here there are too many people with opinions but no expertise. So the signal to noise ratio gets really bad and you can't assume the people reading your comments can understand subtler points; if you do, it's quite inevitable that a bunch of people with opinions but no expertise will pile up on the comment and it feels like flamebait. When I post here, I kinda have to indulge in a ton of self-censorship. Most of the time I end up not posting the comment I wrote because it feels like it won't be a worthwhile discussion. Or it'll be just another comment buried among a few hundred others; just noise, not discussion. It's not satisfying.
    - bengale 8y ago
      Why do you think it’s different there. Also, how do you go about getting an account over there?
      - clarry 8y ago
        It helps that the community is smaller and we've had the occasional meta thread discussing rules & phenomenons, with moderators and active posters alike present. We also have a somewhat tight knit community of active participants & mods on IRC. I think this makes the whole thing more human. There are other factors, for example downvoting because you disagree isn't seen as a valid reason for downvotes on Lobsters. In fact, when you downvote, you must specify a reason (there's a list of choices). Of course people can abuse the system, but I think it sort of encourages people to go down the right path. The invite system probably helps keep worst of the worst out. Tags help people ignore the topics they find frustrating. Speaking of tags, all stories must be tagged and if you can't find an appropriate tag, the story most likely doesn't belong. We've been trying to focus on purely technical content (and by that I mean really technical and not non-technical stories that are somehow related to technology) with some art, while avoiding politics, inactionable news, opinion pieces and the like. To be fair, as the community has grown larger, it seems like we've been slipping more and more from this ideal and opinion pieces about "practices" (that's a tag) and "culture" (yeah...) have gotten annoyingly common. We can still filter out those tags. As for getting an account... I think there's something written about that on the site.
- icelancer 8y ago
  For that to be true you have to have one hell of a selective group of people you follow on Facebook and Twitter. Hacker News is without question the best "social media" site I read and has mostly maintained its quality over the years I've been here. Reddit, however, is godawful.
  - SlowRobotAhead 8y ago
    Yea? Have a pro-gun discussion on HackerNews and tell me how it’s so much better than Reddit. HN has its own problems. For one, there is a growing discontent for different opinions (downvote happy), and two, there is one “channel”, so it’s mob rule for opinion.
    - JoeAltmaier 8y ago
      Downvoting is simple disagreement (by policy) not some attempt to quash discussion. I know folks guard their karma jealously, which leads to resentment about downvoting. Add to that the 'greyed out' feature on downvoted comments which does look like censorship. But as an automatic mechanism for self-moderation it works ok, not perfect. Just look at the stuff at the bottom of a long discussion to see the quashed stuff, and tell me it doesn't belong there.
      - SlowRobotAhead 8y ago
        Except that downvotes do exactly that. A couple and you’re marked as downvoted by fading, a few more and your comment is collapsed. “By policy” or not. It’s treated as a “make the bad man who said the mean things go away so he won’t fool or sway other people”. Just like Reddit.
        FiveSquared 8y ago
        Well, America has xtreme gun conrol laws, so the rest of the wolrd thinks you aree extreme, which elads to downvotes. BTW, mass shooting are EVERY WEEK IN THE USA. Swisterland has guns and yet they have feweer. Its the culture and lack of traiining.
- b3b0p 8y ago
  I feel it greatly depends on what subreddits you follow. I find that limiting it to only a few (at a time) and those aren't toxic (socially, work related, or effect you emotionally) aren't bad and actually are about one of the only places to stay up to date and learn.

rwnspace 8y ago

I've deleted all my social media accounts besides Reddit and HN. The only thing that's stopping me from visiting these two is addiction. I don't read the news, mostly, why bother? It does much more harm than good. You don't need 1000 hrs of newsreading to vote effectively. My next step is to make a personal website with some contact details and a scraper script for the links in the HN top 30-40 that I can run as a cronjob. While cutting social media is not a panacea, I have found a significant improvement in the amount of free time I have, and I don't compulsively think about what other people are doing. It's a good exercise to assume that engagement in social media is work and multiply how many hours you've sunk into it by your usual hourly wage...

icelancer 8y ago
> I don't read the news, mostly, why bother? It does much more harm than good. It's weird that this is a minority opinion (I happen to agree with you). Some 20 years ago we lacked the ability to consume even 10% of the news we are exposed to today if we just open Twitter, and democracy wasn't collapsing. (some argue we are in a worse spot today, though I disagree - strife does not equal inequality) The cable news cycle combined with social media with the majority of people thinking that their opinion is worth something has led to some interesting results. I expect the next generation of people in the United States to mostly get over this bug in the system via selective apathy.
- rcMgD2BwE72F 8y ago
  > with the majority of people thinking that their opinion is worth something has led to some interesting results What do you mean?
  - Zelphyr 8y ago
    Everybody is shouting at each other about how right they are and not listening to what others are saying to try to understand their point of view. The net result being giant echo chambers clashing against one another and the media using that for fun and profit.
- 8y ago

KozmoNau7 8y ago

Luckily I never got into Instagram or Twitter, but I was big into both Reddit and Facebook for a long time. I cut off Reddit completely after a run-in with yet another subreddit wannabe dictator mod. It just wasn't worth the drama, not to mention the crappy usability of the site, especially on mobile. For Facebook, I can't cut it off completely, it is unfortunately indispensable for arranging events and interacting with my group of friends/acquaintances. I mostly interact in a couple of concert/festival-related groups, and run one of them myself. That said, I have cut off all games and apps, and I mute all the stupid meme pages that people like to share from. New ones do pop up once in a while, and obviously those get muted too. The result is that my Facebook experience is 90% chatting with like-minded people about music. I use a Chromium plugin to delete all of posts and likes that are more than ~6 months old, because nobody should care about old FB posts. I also keep my FB account for Messenger, as it has become the de facto standard instant messaging service here in Denmark. For discussion on other subjects, I'm a long-time member of an old-school forum that charges $10 for an account. That seems to weed out most of the low-content trolls and idiots, and aside from a few deliberately stupid subforums, the discussions are relatively intelligent and entertaining.

selimthegrim 8y ago
If this is the forum I suspect (goon?), I’m certainly pleasantly surprised it is no longer known as a source of trolls.
- KozmoNau7 8y ago
  Yeah, the days of troll raids are long gone, thankfully.

szilardboy 8y ago

The abstract mentions limiting social media use to about 30 minutes a day. Why not eliminate it completely? I'd imagine the gains from maintaining relationships can be found elsewhere (e.g. phone calls or real life meetups).

KozmoNau7 8y ago
For all its faults, Facebook is very useful for arranging events and makes it easy for people to RSVP and provide/ask for more information in the event posting itself. It also provides a low barrier of entry and low complexity way of creating groups for discussion and sharing between friends. This is extremely helpful for people who aren't super tech-savvy. Yes, you can do this stuff elsewhere, manually keeping email and phone chains going, but FB does put all of this stuff in one place and makes it relatively easy to use. That is not the problem with FB. The problem is all of the other junk they keep pushing, all the ads and games and gamification.

User23 8y ago

Sartre was right

baumgarn 8y ago
can you add some context?
- neals 8y ago
  () => "Sartre was right";
- User23 8y ago
  “Hell is other people” evidently applies to social media.
- 0xcde4c3db 8y ago
  One of Sartre's most (in)famous quotations is usually translated as "Hell is other people". In context, he was apparently getting at something closer to: Hell is the inevitability of seeing yourself through the eyes of others, as an object rather than a subject.

skilled 8y ago

I have a Twitter account that I don't post on, but use it to follow a few people whose content I enjoy and so it gives me a nice 'latest feed' I can check once a day. My Reddit use is in a similar place, but I do see myself using it more often whenever I want to burn some time. And HN for the latest news in Tech and other interesting (not watered down) topics. Deleted my Facebook account simply because FB as a platform sucks. I could log back on in 5 years and my feed would still look the same. Never used Instagram before. If you want to socialize on the web, then IMO, it's better to work on something you like -- project, website, etc, -- and build a community around that. I'll occasionally check Quora since sometimes people ask you to answer questions, but that's about it.

FahadUddin92 8y ago

So let me explain it. I started being active on the internet after learning no one would be friends with me (I was in class 6 back then). I would spend time figuring out things, talking to people and then social media evolved. I am still pretty active on social media but the main reason people are active on social media is they don't have people around them that listen to them.

hippich 8y ago
That what many miss about social networks (and long-distance communication overall, i.e. IRC, ICQ, etc) - it is not always about looking at other people fancy moments (which is probably some type of social networks promote today) but it is to have a connection with people, which otherwise you would not get locally.

jelly_dev 8y ago

About half way through my college education I decided I would only use Facebook for messages and otherwise eliminated all social media from my life aside from Reddit and Hacker news. Since then I found my outlook on life has improved dramatically and recommend most people do that. The problem with social media is you only see the interesting parts of people's lives, so you're forced into a loop of thinking your life is pointless and boring, while for the most part everyone's life is pretty boring aside from some brief moments

deleted 8y ago
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kopo 8y ago
HN and Reddit arent that different from other social media sites. All of them in my mind are "All You Can Eat" info buffet tables. This is just the current approach we have of dealing with a new world overloaded by info. It will change as we learn more and more about how it effects people. In the real world nobody healthy visits an "All You Can Eat" buffet everyday. Same thing will eventually happen with information.
- octosphere 8y ago
  The bulk of the problem is the linear-thinking brain. If we could devise a way for the brain to think exponentially (something computers are good at) - then we have a suitable way to deal with information overload. My only gripe with augmented brain capacity is that it could spiral away from us, and then lose touch with our original linear thought patterns. Something we have to eventually come to terms with.
  - ben_w 8y ago
    We don’t think linearly (we’re extremely parallel) and computers don’t think exponentially (just quickly, ironically enough that’s because it was easier to run ten times faster than on ten things at once).

zwarag 8y ago

When you open Social Media there is a reason for that. I figured - for me at least - it comes from an emotional impulse. By concentrating on that impulse, I discovered that it comes from “need” to socialize. Trying to fulfill that need by going on a social media platform is just convenient but does not really satisfy that need. So instead, I now call or meet with some family members/friends. In the progress of growing up I kinda unlearned that. But know that I rediscovered it, I feel much better/balanced. Other benefits are that I can concentrate and perform at my studies/work much better than before. I don’t know if that helps anybody but I thought I’d share this experience.

Chazprime 8y ago

Facebook was so much better before it started hosting news sites, and Twitter...it’s just a toilet. I think the best thing a parent can do for their children now is limit exposure to these sites, and emphasize real-life engagement.

8bitsrule 8y ago

My favorite long-term shared-post-and-comments site - far and away the most friendly and community-like - does not have downvotes. You can only 'favorite' a user comment. If your comment is not 'favorited' it is also not slapped with a downvote. (I find downvotes to be counterproductive and often arbitrary if not malicious. And one sows another.) Moderators decide only what posts are productive. A dozen or so a day result. No topic is too 'far out' or rarified. The posts themselves may also be heavily-favorited, but almost always are at least lightly-favorited by a few readers. There is very rarely any criticism or argument. The are not nested, they only appear in time-order. This keeps directed replies (and extended snark-fests) to a minimum. The resulting 'civilized adultness' of the site is fairly unique on the Internet. Oh, and there's a small fee to join.

newen 8y ago
Metafilter? Pretty sure the reason there are no arguments is they purged everyone who doesn't follow the groupthink. And the fee helps with banned people not rejoining ofcourse.
- nhauz 8y ago
  So mefi is the same as HN but you even have to pay on top of it? ;P
  - 8bitsrule 8y ago
    I'm pretty sure that what I described is -not- the same as HN. New here? The advantage of one, small, upfront payment is that it discourages sockpuppeting, and thus anonymous sniping. The only way to 'downvote' something is with another piece of text with a username on it ... a lot more revealing of motive than a reflexive button-click. Discouraging for sick puppies. You know (or don't) ... like The Well was back in the day.

Maro 8y ago

Recently I did an experiment with myself where I didn't use FB for 30 days. After about 5 days I didn't miss it, but I was not happier. After the experiment, my usage rebounded, but significantly below prior levels (I post a lot less, so there's less feedback to get me to engage).

internet555 8y ago

Frankly, I only go on Facebook a few times a month to occasionally check in. I feel like logging in daily is not the point of the service.

jaggednad 8y ago
It shouldn’t be the point, but Facebook wants it to be, because the more eyeballs looking at their site, the more money they get. In order to maximize eyeballs, they make their site as addictive as possible.

anoncoward111 8y ago

Social media is literally my only hobby and has kept me very happy and safe-feeling for years now. I love browsing and discovering random things. Interacting with people in person can be very taxing after a long day of work, aka, interacting with people.

SlowRobotAhead 8y ago
Is it a concern that you don’t consider social media usage as “interacting with people”? If you were browsing wikipedia I’d understand. But your in the comment section talking to me, believe it or not, a real person.
- genidoi 8y ago
  Who are you? In the absence of knowing literally anything about you it's challenging to "humanize" your comment. It's just another in a sea of anonymous comments written by arbitrary commentators. Sure I can trawl through your post history to try to better understand through what lens you see the world, but I don't have the time to do that for every single comment that I read on HN/Reddit.
- matz1 8y ago
  I certainly don’t consider stranger random people on social media as “interacting with people” either, this include my respond to your comment.
- anoncoward111 8y ago
  It's easier for me to interact with your statements via text than it is for me to engage with you emotionally, politically, physically etc like how workplaces inevitably are ://

deleted 8y ago

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greendestiny_re 8y ago

Social media use Pavlovian conditioning to drive adoption. Even the notification icon is – a bell. I stopped using all of them and I suggest you do too. If needed to stay in touch, send your friends and family a voice message as an email attachment, they'll appreciate the sound of your voice more than generic emojis.

rdruxn 8y ago
>a voice message as an email attachment Dear god why
- greendestiny_re 8y ago
  Normal speaking speed is 150 words per minute, which when recorded equals to a ~1MB M4A file. I typically send 7-minute audio recordings, meaning roughly 1,000 words or about 2 pages of A4 text. Rather than getting slammed with a wall of text, the recipient of my audio message can listen to it as they're driving, cooking or eating breakfast. Human voice is expressive and the audio message conveys nuance that gets lost texting. Finally, all text messages are being monitored in some fashion but I do believe audio recordings are still relatively safe and private.

schindlabua 8y ago

My policy is to decrease on push notifications as far as possible. WhatsApp and Telegram still have the privilege but that's it. I feel like by seeking out information rather than it coming to me, I at least am making a conscious decision to waste time on social media. Interestingly, implementing that had the effect of me now spending hardly any time on there at all. Funny how that works!

xfitm3 8y ago
I’m really glad to see your comment. You control your phone, it doesn’t control you.
a_wild_dandan 8y ago
That's a great point. I went into the Android settings, pressed the toggle to disable all notifications, then went through and re-enabled the few necessary apps (text messenger, Spotify, etc). It helped immensely.
jeffhiggins 8y ago
I’ve started leaving DND mode on 24/7. I go to my notifications, they don’t come to me anymore. This also prevents your iPhone from being DOS’d by a phone call at any moment.
- Fnoord 8y ago
  I'm doing the same (on Android, and push notification is broken anyway on microG). Sometimes I get 'anonymous' phone calls. Those are annoying. But people who know me, know I prefer e-mail etc.
biophysboy 8y ago
Something I did in addition to removing push notifications was deleting the apps. When I want to look at a Reddit thread or a tweet, I have to use my mobile browser, and endure their painful UI. Some might consider this paranoid or masochistic, but I find that for me it prevents further exploration beyond the thread/tweet I was originally interested in.

yyww 8y ago

This is probably true, but I don't know what else to do (counting HN as social media) - I don't really have any friends or interesting activities. Basically go to work, do work, go home, repeat. Anyone have any suggestions on how I could live a more interesting life and/or have friends? Sorta pathetic to be posting this here but since every other comment is talking out eliminating social media use, maybe some comments on what to replace it with would be helpful.

SolaceQuantum 8y ago
Well, you can begin to develop a hobby and then attend meetups associated. Find a swing dance group on meetup.com that is beginner friendly. Find an outdoor hiking group. Look for community or religious centers (if you’re religious) on coffeeshop ad boards... Friends tend to occur from there, as you meet more people. You could also take classes, make small talk with classmates and eventually do study groups.
village-idiot 8y ago
I recommend a gym, specifically a class based one like a boot camp or CrossFit. These tend to have a similar cohort of people who show up at the same time every week, so you’ll get an hour of exercise and social time wrapped up into one package. Friendship is created by repeated interaction. Anything that has you running into the same people repeatedly will typically create friendships.
graeme 8y ago
Find a hobby you enjoy and do that. Also, fix any obvious flaws, such as poor dress, being out of shape, persnonal hygiene, etc. lastly, practice small talk: when at a store, make a comment to the clerk, try to make them smile, etc The goal is basically improve socialization skills (small talk), remove frictin to friendships (hygiene, fitness, fashion), and then put yourself in situations where you meet people (hobbies). A local couchsuefing group can also be good, if you staet couchsurfing hosting.
andrew_ 8y ago
If you're not already active, get a cheap gym membership and force yourself to go for a few hours a week. I'm not talking about the meat-head bodybuilding sort. You may enjoy it, you'll be healthier for it, and you may meet others there which share interests.

vthallam 8y ago

My life has come a full circle. Moved to the facebook messenger, WhatsApp, Snapchat for texting and now only prefer iMessage or text messages. The number of groups you added to in WhatsApp and the meaningless forwards make me open those apps even lesser. On the social sharing front, I only use Snapchat to share what I am up to some close friends. Limited FB, Instagram to once a week casual check-in and never been happier.

prolikewh0a 8y ago

I've been off social media for years now, entirely, and I'm back to a point where the rest of my friends and just society itself are so fully entrenched into some sort of social media that I'm getting very lonely and depressed. I've actually thought about making a Facebook or Instagram account again and just placing strict rules on it, but even that really creeps me out. My friends are always telling me about cool events on Facebook, their Instagram stories at the really fun and cool places they work non-profit, all of these cool groups. I feel super detached from even my best friends, and feel like I don't get a full friend experience. While our relationships are strong and have been for years, they're kinda dull because they use social media so much. They understand why I don't use it and don't give me a hard time (anymore), but always bother me to come back.

drewmate 8y ago
I'm kind of in the same boat. I assumed that I would be able to participate in normal friendships without social media (the way people did for generations before me). Instead, I think people just assume I'm ignoring them on facebook because I'm anti-social. I've learned to be more proactive in maintaining relationships, but it often feels very one-sided since many other people are used to just getting passive status updates and feeling 'connected' to their friends.
- Aeolun 8y ago
  I’ve had people genuinely get angry at me because I’d just been ignoring all IM’s for a few days. They were worried about whether I was still alive, but the concept of calling to confirm was apparently foreign. I kind of want to stop using social media, but I guess everyone will think I hate them or something.
  - coralreef 8y ago
    I wouldn't really classify instant messaging as social media, even though all social media platforms have messengers attached nowadays. Also, if your friends are making an effort to keep in contact with you, why are you faulting them for choosing X medium instead of Y?

annadane 8y ago

How do we define social media, though? I think Facebook is more damaging than all of them just by their use of attention grabbing techniques and total lack of privacy options.

deleted 8y ago

[deleted]

nilshauk 8y ago

I quit my Facebook account in April and have not looked back. I connect with people in Signal, Twitter, Slack and LinkedIn. Quitting Facebook felt like uninstalling a program which was eating up a lot of ram in my life.

nercht12 8y ago

I joined Meetup.com, and now I have a growing number of friends every week. It helps to have an interest that other people can join you in. You could start a tech group, a language group, a movie group. Find a place to have a discussion, a small conference, or give a presentation. The fact is, social media isn't going to satisfy your craving with feeling connected. The digital world isn't a substitute for face-to-face conversation, so it's sad to see people resort to text-messaging the person in front of them. However, you CAN look for events for where to connect to people. That said, Meetup.com is a huge blessing.

jeromebaek 8y ago

I think social media is fine as a way to connect, it just shouldn't be the only or even major way to connect. In particular I think News Feed is a horrible way to "connect" with anyone. So I unfollowed every one of my friends on Facebook and keep a pristine blank news feed. If I want to know what someone's up to, I message them or visit their profile. It makes social media usage a lot more deliberate.

laurex 8y ago

It's interesting that messaging and social media are conflated by some people and not others. It stands to reason that direct communication is helpful to the problem of loneliness, whereas "observing the sanitised version of other people's lives from the outside" is not.

rubellion82 8y ago

try Diaspora (social network)

strikelaserclaw 8y ago

Humans are social creatures, and we are more isolated than we've ever been even though we are better connected than we've ever been. I don't think social media is to blame, just as i don't think fast food is to blame for obscenity epidemic, but i do think that social media has certainly, consciously leveraged certain weakness of humans in modern society to create addictive substances which cause more harm than good for most people.