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As a French, I totally support this tax. It's easier and more expedient to do it this way than to reform the taxation policies of every European countries. Als

As a French, I totally support this tax. It's easier and more expedient to do it this way than to reform the taxation policies of every European countries. Also, why is it wrong to tax the income of corporations?

bsaul 8y ago
i meant revenue (which i think you'll understand why it's a problem if you've ever had to pay any corporate tax in your life).
- deleted 8y ago
  [deleted]
- snidane 8y ago
  I don't like income taxes either, but to be fair, all employees are paying taxes out of their 'revenues'.
  - woolvalley 8y ago
    Depends on how many deductions they get ;) I get in the USA: 1. Mortgage interest deduction (controversial) 2. Property tax deduction (now limited with trump) 3. Transit & parking deduction 4. Retirement account 'deduction' 5. Medical plan deductions (controversial vs single payer) 6. Tax free company snacks, cafeteria food, t-shirts / swag and morale events. I think on site electric car charging is tax free too? 7. Reduced sales tax rates on essentials such as food, clothing depending on the state.
  - bsaul 8y ago
    People don’t produce goods to sell ( so profits and revenue are actually not really relevant concepts). They’re the endpoint of the economy so they’re a very special item. Same reason something called VAT only apply to them.
    - lovich 8y ago
      I have food, water, shelter, and healthcare inputs to maintain my body and keep producing services. Why would my income minus those costs not map to the ideas of revenue and profit?
      - adventured 8y ago
        Because those corporate profits are owned by people, shareholders. What remains after the corporate income tax usually winds up taxed just as your income is; ie generally those profits are not just taxed once. They also get taxed again after distribution. Or if the company later spends it to eg hire someone to try to expand, that also generates income taxation. Or if they buy something with it (new equipment) to bolster their business, somewhere in that chain it's generating further income taxation related to employees (the people that manufactured the equipment, whose salaries are being paid for by the equipment sale). Consider Apple. They'll return hundreds of billions of dollars in profit to shareholders over time. Not only was the original profit taxed via a corporate income tax, the remaining profit that is distributed will then get taxed further as personal income. The owners of that profit ultimately see that profit taxed twice before it's freely in their bank account. They don't get to skip on the personal income taxes. If you perceive that corporate profits are under taxed, it's because you're not following the taxation chain all the way to its conclusion. Ireland for example does not have low personal income taxes, that's in part how they've paid for the very low corporate income taxes. Simplistically, fictional company Smithfield Inc produces $100m of taxable income, they pay a 20% rate on that. They have $80m remaining, after tax profit. That later gets distributed to the owners of the corporation. That $80m will now get taxed again. The $100m in profit Smithfield generated will see a likely minimum of a total 40% tax rate - in pretty much all developed nations - before all the income taxation is performed on the profit and finally rests with the owners of the business free & clear. Denmark has a 22% corporate tax rate. Their personal tax rate is high. That means the owners of the corporate profits will see that profit uber taxed, as much as 60% to 70% before the government is done with it. The point is that the net taxation by the government on corporate profit is much larger than just the corporate income tax rate. That's merely the beginning.
titanix2 8y ago
I support it too. Big corporations pay almost no taxes in our country; instead it is individual and small and medium entreprises that are heavily taxed. This makes it very hard to start and run a business in the long term.
- bluecalm 8y ago
  They pay VAT for sells in your country. It doesn't matter if it's consumer or a company paying the tax, the amount is added to the price. If you want them tax then increase that. Why do you feel entitled to profits of the company that isn't based in your country? It's like thinking the company should pay 5m in tax in Ireland based on sells in France while being ok with them deducting expenses from unrelated business in Ireland which you shouldn't care at all. If they paid that rate you should be happy even not even one dollar more made it to your country. The whole idea doesn't make any sense at all. You want companies to pay more in your country? Tax exactly that - consumption of their goods in your country. It's not your business to decide how other countries choose to organize their tax code. Seriously fuck you for trying to force them. Ideas like that make EU much less popular idea that it was in the past.
  - J_cst 8y ago
    AFAIK Vat is a tax which insist on consumers, not on companies.
    - njarboe 8y ago
      So an oil company that buys steel pipe to make an oil well doesn't pay VAT on the pipe? Not a European, so just asking.
      - lultimouomo 8y ago
        Either it pays the VAT and gets an equal tax credit, or it doesn't pay it at all (when applying reverse charge). Result is the same, VAT is not a cost for enteprises. Obviously the fact that end consumers pay VAT might disincentivise them to buy stuff, so companies still suffer the effects of high VAT rates.

bsaul 8y ago

i meant revenue (which i think you'll understand why it's a problem if you've ever had to pay any corporate tax in your life).

deleted 8y ago
[deleted]
snidane 8y ago
I don't like income taxes either, but to be fair, all employees are paying taxes out of their 'revenues'.
- woolvalley 8y ago
  Depends on how many deductions they get ;) I get in the USA: 1. Mortgage interest deduction (controversial) 2. Property tax deduction (now limited with trump) 3. Transit & parking deduction 4. Retirement account 'deduction' 5. Medical plan deductions (controversial vs single payer) 6. Tax free company snacks, cafeteria food, t-shirts / swag and morale events. I think on site electric car charging is tax free too? 7. Reduced sales tax rates on essentials such as food, clothing depending on the state.
- bsaul 8y ago
  People don’t produce goods to sell ( so profits and revenue are actually not really relevant concepts). They’re the endpoint of the economy so they’re a very special item. Same reason something called VAT only apply to them.
  - lovich 8y ago
    I have food, water, shelter, and healthcare inputs to maintain my body and keep producing services. Why would my income minus those costs not map to the ideas of revenue and profit?
    - adventured 8y ago
      Because those corporate profits are owned by people, shareholders. What remains after the corporate income tax usually winds up taxed just as your income is; ie generally those profits are not just taxed once. They also get taxed again after distribution. Or if the company later spends it to eg hire someone to try to expand, that also generates income taxation. Or if they buy something with it (new equipment) to bolster their business, somewhere in that chain it's generating further income taxation related to employees (the people that manufactured the equipment, whose salaries are being paid for by the equipment sale). Consider Apple. They'll return hundreds of billions of dollars in profit to shareholders over time. Not only was the original profit taxed via a corporate income tax, the remaining profit that is distributed will then get taxed further as personal income. The owners of that profit ultimately see that profit taxed twice before it's freely in their bank account. They don't get to skip on the personal income taxes. If you perceive that corporate profits are under taxed, it's because you're not following the taxation chain all the way to its conclusion. Ireland for example does not have low personal income taxes, that's in part how they've paid for the very low corporate income taxes. Simplistically, fictional company Smithfield Inc produces $100m of taxable income, they pay a 20% rate on that. They have $80m remaining, after tax profit. That later gets distributed to the owners of the corporation. That $80m will now get taxed again. The $100m in profit Smithfield generated will see a likely minimum of a total 40% tax rate - in pretty much all developed nations - before all the income taxation is performed on the profit and finally rests with the owners of the business free & clear. Denmark has a 22% corporate tax rate. Their personal tax rate is high. That means the owners of the corporate profits will see that profit uber taxed, as much as 60% to 70% before the government is done with it. The point is that the net taxation by the government on corporate profit is much larger than just the corporate income tax rate. That's merely the beginning.

titanix2 8y ago

I support it too. Big corporations pay almost no taxes in our country; instead it is individual and small and medium entreprises that are heavily taxed. This makes it very hard to start and run a business in the long term.

bluecalm 8y ago
They pay VAT for sells in your country. It doesn't matter if it's consumer or a company paying the tax, the amount is added to the price. If you want them tax then increase that. Why do you feel entitled to profits of the company that isn't based in your country? It's like thinking the company should pay 5m in tax in Ireland based on sells in France while being ok with them deducting expenses from unrelated business in Ireland which you shouldn't care at all. If they paid that rate you should be happy even not even one dollar more made it to your country. The whole idea doesn't make any sense at all. You want companies to pay more in your country? Tax exactly that - consumption of their goods in your country. It's not your business to decide how other countries choose to organize their tax code. Seriously fuck you for trying to force them. Ideas like that make EU much less popular idea that it was in the past.
- J_cst 8y ago
  AFAIK Vat is a tax which insist on consumers, not on companies.
  - njarboe 8y ago
    So an oil company that buys steel pipe to make an oil well doesn't pay VAT on the pipe? Not a European, so just asking.
    - lultimouomo 8y ago
      Either it pays the VAT and gets an equal tax credit, or it doesn't pay it at all (when applying reverse charge). Result is the same, VAT is not a cost for enteprises. Obviously the fact that end consumers pay VAT might disincentivise them to buy stuff, so companies still suffer the effects of high VAT rates.