7 ms·

Of course that the owner of the medical services company being accused of not treating patients properly claims that they are doing everything properly. What el

by blub 8y ago

Of course that the owner of the medical services company being accused of not treating patients properly claims that they are doing everything properly. What else could they say?! On the other hand we have Anna Watson, a medical professional which was fired by said owner after raising concerns about their disregard for the patients' well-being. She's making very serious allegations and is risking a lot by blowing the whistle... We have several (ex)-employees coming forward and claiming that their injuries were allegedly downplayed. There's no fucking way that one should take a Lyft to the hospital if they can't walk, sit or stand straight -> this indicates a potential spinal injury. Same goes for mangled hands. And yeah, even for amputated fingertips, the person is probably under shock! And as always temps are getting screwed. They were allegedly turned away when requesting medical care. There's even more criticism from anonymous employees, including medical assistants. This smells to me like typical corporate bullshit, whatever the corporate doc says. Disclaimer: I work for a Tesla competitor. Usually I try to stay away from this topic, but corporate callousness makes me angry. I don't care if Tesla suceeds or not, but they should treat their employees properly and obey the law. Edit: there's obviously downvote brigading taking place on this topic. I've posted several relevant pieces of information, which according to the site rules should not be downvoted.

Fricken 8y ago
I guess we're supposed to be upset because they didn't call an ambulance for workers who were feeling light headed, or had crushed or severed fingers. These are the examples provided, and it isn't stuff you need to call an ambulance for. And I'm a big Tesla critic, I get really excited when there's a Tesla scandal, but this article is a baseless hit piece. The concrete examples they provided were dealt with appropriately and the rest is pretty nebulous.
- zimpenfish 8y ago
  > I guess we're supposed to be upset because they didn't call an ambulance for workers who were feeling light headed, or had crushed or severed fingers. (added emph) Um, yeah, I would be. > it isn't stuff you need to call an ambulance for If you crush or sever your fingers, you really do need to call an ambulance.
  - StavrosK 8y ago
    Why? Why do you need the equipment in an ambulance for a crushed or severed hand? Wouldn't you be better served in literally halving the time it took for you to get to the hospital (driving one way vs waiting for the ambulance to come pick you up) so you can be treated there?
    - athenot 8y ago
      Ambulances don't come from the hospital. They are stationed a bit all over and listen for emergencies. They also listen on the police scanners and can get to an emergency before actually being requested. The gas station right next to my house has EMT vehicles almost every night hanging out and waiting to interveene in the area.
  - loceng 8y ago
    You need to get them to the hospital ASAP - yes, where doctors can start to work on the finger(s). I can't imagine they are going to do anything in the ambulance that the doctors on-site at Tesla aren't capable of stabilizing/prepping for care at a hospital.
  - kryogen1c 8y ago
    > > it isn't stuff you need to call an ambulance for > If you crush or sever your fingers, you really do need to call an ambulance. Why? It's not life threatening, you're diverting critical life-saving public resources from someone else, you can definitely get to a hospital faster on your own and probably faster with a ride share, and you are incurring a very high cost. Furthermore, it's not like they get to the hospital and then are seen immediately because they showed up in an ambulance. They still have to wait in line because the injury is simply not severe If they have first responders on site, there's no reason they can't get gauze and then go see a surgeon.
    - anigbrowl 8y ago
      It's not life threatening Questionable you're diverting critical life-saving public resources from someone else Why, do we have a desperate shortage of such resources? Then maybe we should build more of them instead of guilt tripping people who have suffered severe and perhaps permanent maiming. Furthermore, it's not like they get to the hospital and then are seen immediately because they showed up in an ambulance. They still have to wait in line because the injury is simply not severe Of course it's severe. It's not the worst thing that can happen to someone, but then ERs aren't swamped 24/7 either, and to the extent that they are overburdened we should do something about that rather than minimize the problem.
- PhasmaFelis 8y ago
  > crushed or severed fingers [...] isn't stuff you need to call an ambulance for. What?
  - loceng 8y ago
    In the context of there being doctors on-site at Tesla who would be assessing/caring for the injured person, if the person is stable/stabilized and the severity of the injury requires treatment at a hospital (say surgery but they're not bleeding out etc) - just getting them to the hospital in a reasonable manner should be the goal, yes? We can make assumptions about what would take longer to get to the workplace and then to the hospital - a Lyft nearby or an ambulance who perhaps has to travel further.
    - danso 8y ago
      A severed finger is a pretty serious and catastrophic injury. You think workplace clinic has the ability stabilize that kind of injury, such that there's little difference between a 10 minute and a 30 minute trip to the hospital? Don't you there's a better outcome than the patient not bleeding to death, like getting to a surgeon ASAP to increase the chances of a successful reattachment surgery? Besides the dickishness of pressing a typical Uber/Lyft driver into emergency service, ambulances have other advantages, such as the legal authority to speed and clear roads, and on-board medical equipment to continue stabilizing the patient during the trip.
      - loceng 8y ago
        Like I said, we can make assumptions about travel time difference between Lyft and an ambulance - however unless we're in the actual scenario and know the circumstances, and likely times/estimates for each, a private driver can certainly be faster than when an ambulance can arrive (and likewise what is the indirect cost if not using that ambulance means someone else gets an ambulance faster who more reasonably needs it?).
        danso 8y ago
- primitivesuave 8y ago
  An EMT friend told me that the best times to call an ambulance are when you need immediate medical attention, if it would take you much longer to get to the hospital yourself, or if there's a reasonable chance you would distract the driver (e.g. screaming pregnant woman, someone heaving and clawing for air during an asthma attack). While having broken/severed fingers sounds awful, I would probably make the same call (take this as hearsay + a non-medical opinion)
martythemaniak 8y ago
> On the other hand we have Anna Watson, a medical professional... No, it is Basil Besh who is the medical professional. Anna Watson is a physician assistant. Basil Besh is a doctor. Part of having your doctor's license is being subject to an oversight board of your peers. As a patient you can complain to this board and if the doctor cannot prove that he has provided adequate care, he can lose his very expensive livelihood. They key here is that he has to justify himself to his peers, ie doctors who would look at the patient records and his notes and judge whether he provided a standard of care by calling or not calling an ambulance, etc. Randos on the internet speculating about patients they know nothing about is PR, not medicine. The way you will know whether this story is real or another one of the endless Telsa hate pieces is that this guy will lose his license if it is real.
- cowsandmilk 8y ago
  Everything you state about doctors applies to PAs as well. Like most states, California has a PA board [0] and patients can complain to the board. Sure, a doctor has more responsibilities, but a PA is also a medical professional. [0] https://www.pac.ca.gov https://www.pac.ca.gov
- adrr 8y ago
  Anna is a physician assistant, she can literally do almost anything a doctor can do(prescribe drugs, diagnosis etc) and has almost as much training as a doctor.
  - jrowley 8y ago
    PAs can do a lot of the same things that physicians do, and are of vital importance but are distinct from physicians. For one, physicians in the US complete 4 years of medical school, then a residency, and then possibly a fellowship. On the other hand a PA is generally done in 3 years, total. Additionally PAs can prescribe many drugs in most states, but the supervising physician is ultimately responsible for the patients care. Finally there are numerous subspecialties that simply aren’t available to PAs.
    - 8y ago
eduah 8y ago
Or, believe the org just proven liars after publishing similar accusations by disgruntled ex employees by an OSHA investigation.

by blub 8y ago

Fricken 8y ago

I guess we're supposed to be upset because they didn't call an ambulance for workers who were feeling light headed, or had crushed or severed fingers. These are the examples provided, and it isn't stuff you need to call an ambulance for. And I'm a big Tesla critic, I get really excited when there's a Tesla scandal, but this article is a baseless hit piece. The concrete examples they provided were dealt with appropriately and the rest is pretty nebulous.

zimpenfish 8y ago
> I guess we're supposed to be upset because they didn't call an ambulance for workers who were feeling light headed, or had crushed or severed fingers. (added emph) Um, yeah, I would be. > it isn't stuff you need to call an ambulance for If you crush or sever your fingers, you really do need to call an ambulance.
- StavrosK 8y ago
  Why? Why do you need the equipment in an ambulance for a crushed or severed hand? Wouldn't you be better served in literally halving the time it took for you to get to the hospital (driving one way vs waiting for the ambulance to come pick you up) so you can be treated there?
  - athenot 8y ago
    Ambulances don't come from the hospital. They are stationed a bit all over and listen for emergencies. They also listen on the police scanners and can get to an emergency before actually being requested. The gas station right next to my house has EMT vehicles almost every night hanging out and waiting to interveene in the area.
- loceng 8y ago
  You need to get them to the hospital ASAP - yes, where doctors can start to work on the finger(s). I can't imagine they are going to do anything in the ambulance that the doctors on-site at Tesla aren't capable of stabilizing/prepping for care at a hospital.
- kryogen1c 8y ago
  > > it isn't stuff you need to call an ambulance for > If you crush or sever your fingers, you really do need to call an ambulance. Why? It's not life threatening, you're diverting critical life-saving public resources from someone else, you can definitely get to a hospital faster on your own and probably faster with a ride share, and you are incurring a very high cost. Furthermore, it's not like they get to the hospital and then are seen immediately because they showed up in an ambulance. They still have to wait in line because the injury is simply not severe If they have first responders on site, there's no reason they can't get gauze and then go see a surgeon.
  - anigbrowl 8y ago
    It's not life threatening Questionable you're diverting critical life-saving public resources from someone else Why, do we have a desperate shortage of such resources? Then maybe we should build more of them instead of guilt tripping people who have suffered severe and perhaps permanent maiming. Furthermore, it's not like they get to the hospital and then are seen immediately because they showed up in an ambulance. They still have to wait in line because the injury is simply not severe Of course it's severe. It's not the worst thing that can happen to someone, but then ERs aren't swamped 24/7 either, and to the extent that they are overburdened we should do something about that rather than minimize the problem.
PhasmaFelis 8y ago
> crushed or severed fingers [...] isn't stuff you need to call an ambulance for. What?
- loceng 8y ago
  In the context of there being doctors on-site at Tesla who would be assessing/caring for the injured person, if the person is stable/stabilized and the severity of the injury requires treatment at a hospital (say surgery but they're not bleeding out etc) - just getting them to the hospital in a reasonable manner should be the goal, yes? We can make assumptions about what would take longer to get to the workplace and then to the hospital - a Lyft nearby or an ambulance who perhaps has to travel further.
  - danso 8y ago
    A severed finger is a pretty serious and catastrophic injury. You think workplace clinic has the ability stabilize that kind of injury, such that there's little difference between a 10 minute and a 30 minute trip to the hospital? Don't you there's a better outcome than the patient not bleeding to death, like getting to a surgeon ASAP to increase the chances of a successful reattachment surgery? Besides the dickishness of pressing a typical Uber/Lyft driver into emergency service, ambulances have other advantages, such as the legal authority to speed and clear roads, and on-board medical equipment to continue stabilizing the patient during the trip.
    - loceng 8y ago
      Like I said, we can make assumptions about travel time difference between Lyft and an ambulance - however unless we're in the actual scenario and know the circumstances, and likely times/estimates for each, a private driver can certainly be faster than when an ambulance can arrive (and likewise what is the indirect cost if not using that ambulance means someone else gets an ambulance faster who more reasonably needs it?).
      - danso 8y ago
primitivesuave 8y ago
An EMT friend told me that the best times to call an ambulance are when you need immediate medical attention, if it would take you much longer to get to the hospital yourself, or if there's a reasonable chance you would distract the driver (e.g. screaming pregnant woman, someone heaving and clawing for air during an asthma attack). While having broken/severed fingers sounds awful, I would probably make the same call (take this as hearsay + a non-medical opinion)

martythemaniak 8y ago

> On the other hand we have Anna Watson, a medical professional... No, it is Basil Besh who is the medical professional. Anna Watson is a physician assistant. Basil Besh is a doctor. Part of having your doctor's license is being subject to an oversight board of your peers. As a patient you can complain to this board and if the doctor cannot prove that he has provided adequate care, he can lose his very expensive livelihood. They key here is that he has to justify himself to his peers, ie doctors who would look at the patient records and his notes and judge whether he provided a standard of care by calling or not calling an ambulance, etc. Randos on the internet speculating about patients they know nothing about is PR, not medicine. The way you will know whether this story is real or another one of the endless Telsa hate pieces is that this guy will lose his license if it is real.

cowsandmilk 8y ago
Everything you state about doctors applies to PAs as well. Like most states, California has a PA board [0] and patients can complain to the board. Sure, a doctor has more responsibilities, but a PA is also a medical professional. [0] https://www.pac.ca.gov https://www.pac.ca.gov
adrr 8y ago
Anna is a physician assistant, she can literally do almost anything a doctor can do(prescribe drugs, diagnosis etc) and has almost as much training as a doctor.
- jrowley 8y ago
  PAs can do a lot of the same things that physicians do, and are of vital importance but are distinct from physicians. For one, physicians in the US complete 4 years of medical school, then a residency, and then possibly a fellowship. On the other hand a PA is generally done in 3 years, total. Additionally PAs can prescribe many drugs in most states, but the supervising physician is ultimately responsible for the patients care. Finally there are numerous subspecialties that simply aren’t available to PAs.
  - 8y ago

eduah 8y ago

Or, believe the org just proven liars after publishing similar accusations by disgruntled ex employees by an OSHA investigation.