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> Sorry, this content is not available in your region. I guess Fox 4 KC didn't want to implement the GDPR… But what happens with the GDPR if I, a European citi

by Cynddl 8y ago

> Sorry, this content is not available in your region. I guess Fox 4 KC didn't want to implement the GDPR… But what happens with the GDPR if I, a European citizen in Europe, access this website (blocking EU IP addresses) using a VPN? The heuristic they use (IP address = country on which the user lives) is not a perfect method to assess whether they need to apply the GDPR regulation.

gattilorenz 8y ago
Strangely, it does not work using archive.is either. But I think this is the same event: https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-6338113/Familys-Nest-home-monitoring-hacked-stranger.html https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-6338113/Familys-Nes...
- codetrotter 8y ago
  > Strangely, it does not work using archive.is either. That’s because archive.is crawlers are hosted in Netherlands, Europe.
milesokeefe 8y ago
Article text: LONG ISLAND, N.Y. -- A mother in Long Island says a stranger hacked her family’s Nest camera and tried having a conversation with her five-year-old son, according to WPIX. Nest ads will show you beautiful images of mother nature captured on their outdoor cameras, life’s silly moments and even those moments when your child is up to no good. But for this Long Island mother, the Nest cam she and her husband set up around their home to act as a nanny cam became a full-on nightmare. “My son came running out of the playroom and found me in the kitchen and said 'it’s not daddy talking to me. It’s not daddy.'” Nearly every day, after school, this mother, who asked PIX11 to hide her identity, said her 5-year-old son chats with her husband through the Nest cam, a home monitoring system users can connect through their cell phones. This time, however, it was a complete stranger on the other end. “He asked my son if he took the school bus home and he was asking him about the toys he was playing with and when my son said 'mommy, mommy,' he told him to shut up,” she recalled. When she walked into her child’s playroom, the ominous voice addressed her directly. Now she is frightened and wonders how long a complete stranger was watching her family. Since this frightening violation, this mother called police, who, while sympathetic, said there was little they could do. As for Nest? She was simply told to change her password and switch to a two-factor verification when logging on, but for this mom it’s not enough. She wants to speak out to warn others about this potential danger lurking in their home. A Nest spokesperson responded to our request for comment and issued this statement: "We have seen instances where a small number of Nest customers have re-used passwords that were previously exposed through breaches on other websites, and made public. None of these breaches involved Nest. This exposes these customers to other people using the credentials to log into their Nest account. We are proactively alerting affected customers to reset their passwords and set up two-factor authentication, which adds another layer of account security. Customers can reach out to Nest customer support with questions or report anything suspicious to security@nest.com."
mattarnster 8y ago
I tend to use Outline.com whenever I can't access an article because of a region-lock/paywall. https://outline.com/https://fox4kc.com/2018/10/31/family-traumatized-after-home-monitoring-system-hacked-by-stranger/ https://outline.com/https://fox4kc.com/2018/10/31/family-tra...
Grangar 8y ago
Easier than vpn: prefix the website with outline.com/
crysin 8y ago
They're being considerate by using your IP. They're not a EU company. They have no obligation or requirement to respect the EU laws, so them adding that feature is them at least acknowledging the EU has regulations they do not follow. If you want to circumvent that by using a VPN and deceive their servers, go ahead. While sure, under the GDPR that would still hold them liable, they're not located in the EU and therefore have no reason to spend the extra effort to find extra ways to try and prevent you from accessing their content.
esotericn 8y ago
For the most part it forms a clear statement that the site operator does not wish to deal with EU clients. So, yeah, if the odd EU-based client like me decides to VPN/Tor their way in, then legal action against the site operators for not dealing with my data appropriately shouldn't stand up. Just a guess. IANAL.
ihuman 8y ago
Is there a better heuristic they could use? Outside of of using HTML5 Geolocation APIs, there's not much else they could do.
paulcole 8y ago
> I guess Fox 4 KC didn't want to implement the GDPR I think the content you're seeing, "Sorry, this content is not available in your region." is an implementation of GDPR compliance, no?
- hadrien01 8y ago
  It's not an implementation of GDPR because the website doesn't have the right to exclude you from accessing the content even if you have not opted-in to trackers. It's a refusal to implement GDPR and having any business with European citizens (which for a local network affiliate is not a hard choice to make).
  - freehunter 8y ago
    Refusal to do business in the EU certainly is an implementation of GDPR. The GDPR only applies to EU citizens, so not serving them means you meet all the compliance mandates.
  - deleted 8y ago
    [deleted]
  - paulcole 8y ago
    > because the website doesn't have the right to exclude you from accessing the content even if you have not opted-in to trackers Of course it does! It's their website. You don't have some god-given right to view fox4kc.com on your own terms.
adventured 8y ago
> But what happens with the GDPR if I, a European citizen in Europe, access this website (blocking EU IP addresses) using a VPN? WDAF Kansas City, is a Fox affiliate located out of Missouri state. GDPR is an EU regulation, not a global regulation, nor a US regulation. The EU and GDPR has no legal standing over most media companies in the US and very few US Web sites, because they do no business in the EU and are not bound by EU laws. It does not matter if you're an European citizen in Europe or not, if GDPR does not apply to the owner of the server you're accessing. If I - an American citizen - access a server in China, US laws are not what govern what they can do with my information. That is governed by Chinese law.
- mh8h 8y ago
  If I - an American citizen - access a server in China, US laws are not what govern what they can do with my information. That is governed by Chinese law. The US government apparently has a different interpretation. For example, they asked Microsoft for the information of a user from the servers in Ireland.
- kevin_b_er 8y ago
  Tribune Media would be subject to fines if they ever tried to do business in Europe.
dragonwriter 8y ago
> But what happens with the GDPR if I, a European citizen in Europe, access this website (blocking EU IP addresses) using a VPN? Then everyone involved (except the lawyers, who will make out quite well) can risk getting wiped out as the EU’s extraterritorial application of privacy regulation and the US’s civil and criminal laws on unauthorized access combine into a firestorm of transatlantic litigation.

by Cynddl 8y ago

gattilorenz 8y ago

Strangely, it does not work using archive.is either. But I think this is the same event: https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-6338113/Familys-Nest-home-monitoring-hacked-stranger.html https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-6338113/Familys-Nes...

codetrotter 8y ago
> Strangely, it does not work using archive.is either. That’s because archive.is crawlers are hosted in Netherlands, Europe.

milesokeefe 8y ago

Article text: LONG ISLAND, N.Y. -- A mother in Long Island says a stranger hacked her family’s Nest camera and tried having a conversation with her five-year-old son, according to WPIX. Nest ads will show you beautiful images of mother nature captured on their outdoor cameras, life’s silly moments and even those moments when your child is up to no good. But for this Long Island mother, the Nest cam she and her husband set up around their home to act as a nanny cam became a full-on nightmare. “My son came running out of the playroom and found me in the kitchen and said 'it’s not daddy talking to me. It’s not daddy.'” Nearly every day, after school, this mother, who asked PIX11 to hide her identity, said her 5-year-old son chats with her husband through the Nest cam, a home monitoring system users can connect through their cell phones. This time, however, it was a complete stranger on the other end. “He asked my son if he took the school bus home and he was asking him about the toys he was playing with and when my son said 'mommy, mommy,' he told him to shut up,” she recalled. When she walked into her child’s playroom, the ominous voice addressed her directly. Now she is frightened and wonders how long a complete stranger was watching her family. Since this frightening violation, this mother called police, who, while sympathetic, said there was little they could do. As for Nest? She was simply told to change her password and switch to a two-factor verification when logging on, but for this mom it’s not enough. She wants to speak out to warn others about this potential danger lurking in their home. A Nest spokesperson responded to our request for comment and issued this statement: "We have seen instances where a small number of Nest customers have re-used passwords that were previously exposed through breaches on other websites, and made public. None of these breaches involved Nest. This exposes these customers to other people using the credentials to log into their Nest account. We are proactively alerting affected customers to reset their passwords and set up two-factor authentication, which adds another layer of account security. Customers can reach out to Nest customer support with questions or report anything suspicious to security@nest.com."

mattarnster 8y ago

I tend to use Outline.com whenever I can't access an article because of a region-lock/paywall. https://outline.com/https://fox4kc.com/2018/10/31/family-traumatized-after-home-monitoring-system-hacked-by-stranger/ https://outline.com/https://fox4kc.com/2018/10/31/family-tra...

Grangar 8y ago

Easier than vpn: prefix the website with outline.com/

crysin 8y ago

They're being considerate by using your IP. They're not a EU company. They have no obligation or requirement to respect the EU laws, so them adding that feature is them at least acknowledging the EU has regulations they do not follow. If you want to circumvent that by using a VPN and deceive their servers, go ahead. While sure, under the GDPR that would still hold them liable, they're not located in the EU and therefore have no reason to spend the extra effort to find extra ways to try and prevent you from accessing their content.

esotericn 8y ago

For the most part it forms a clear statement that the site operator does not wish to deal with EU clients. So, yeah, if the odd EU-based client like me decides to VPN/Tor their way in, then legal action against the site operators for not dealing with my data appropriately shouldn't stand up. Just a guess. IANAL.

ihuman 8y ago

Is there a better heuristic they could use? Outside of of using HTML5 Geolocation APIs, there's not much else they could do.

paulcole 8y ago

> I guess Fox 4 KC didn't want to implement the GDPR I think the content you're seeing, "Sorry, this content is not available in your region." is an implementation of GDPR compliance, no?

hadrien01 8y ago
It's not an implementation of GDPR because the website doesn't have the right to exclude you from accessing the content even if you have not opted-in to trackers. It's a refusal to implement GDPR and having any business with European citizens (which for a local network affiliate is not a hard choice to make).
- freehunter 8y ago
  Refusal to do business in the EU certainly is an implementation of GDPR. The GDPR only applies to EU citizens, so not serving them means you meet all the compliance mandates.
- deleted 8y ago
  [deleted]
- paulcole 8y ago
  > because the website doesn't have the right to exclude you from accessing the content even if you have not opted-in to trackers Of course it does! It's their website. You don't have some god-given right to view fox4kc.com on your own terms.

adventured 8y ago

> But what happens with the GDPR if I, a European citizen in Europe, access this website (blocking EU IP addresses) using a VPN? WDAF Kansas City, is a Fox affiliate located out of Missouri state. GDPR is an EU regulation, not a global regulation, nor a US regulation. The EU and GDPR has no legal standing over most media companies in the US and very few US Web sites, because they do no business in the EU and are not bound by EU laws. It does not matter if you're an European citizen in Europe or not, if GDPR does not apply to the owner of the server you're accessing. If I - an American citizen - access a server in China, US laws are not what govern what they can do with my information. That is governed by Chinese law.

mh8h 8y ago
If I - an American citizen - access a server in China, US laws are not what govern what they can do with my information. That is governed by Chinese law. The US government apparently has a different interpretation. For example, they asked Microsoft for the information of a user from the servers in Ireland.
kevin_b_er 8y ago
Tribune Media would be subject to fines if they ever tried to do business in Europe.

dragonwriter 8y ago

> But what happens with the GDPR if I, a European citizen in Europe, access this website (blocking EU IP addresses) using a VPN? Then everyone involved (except the lawyers, who will make out quite well) can risk getting wiped out as the EU’s extraterritorial application of privacy regulation and the US’s civil and criminal laws on unauthorized access combine into a firestorm of transatlantic litigation.