10 ms·

I hate to be negative, but that will never happen with the current leadership at Mozilla. They are simply no longer willing to disrupt the status quo, even to

I hate to be negative, but that will never happen with the current leadership at Mozilla. They are simply no longer willing to disrupt the status quo, even to help their users. They are far more motivated to be "popular", and have a big "audience", and a respected "brand", than about sticking up for their users. The fact that they even think about software development in terms of "building an audience(?)" shows that they are way off course. The most important software we use that is actively developed is made by people who are primarily concerned with making good software, not with this pseudo public relations cargo cult corporate speak. Hint: Go back and look at what Firefox used to be like 10 years ago, and notice the difference in culture. The fact is, if Mozilla took a proactive stand against Google Apple and Microsoft, that would greatly increase their popularity. The old Firefox was "irresponsible" by including a popup blocker by default, and upset a lot of people. Firefox also refused to support any of Microsoft's early web DRM. People said that not supporting DRM would lock users out of content, but it actually probably contributed to the death of those systems. Google has been slowly clamping down on user freedoms. Just one example, Google removed the option to save html5 video[1] (I'm sure users were begging for that "feature"). I would honestly not be surprised if the UX clowns at Mozilla remove that function from Firefox as well. How long until they remove the "view source" option because being able to view source is confusing to people who have never used a browser and it is used less than 1% of the time or some other flimsy justification? There have been people within Mozilla who just want to abandon their own code and simply release a re-branded Chromium. Because they only care about their precious brand and keeping the donations coming, and they are truly terrible stewards of the software they have inherited. Besides, once they stop actually developing their own software, they will have lots of money leftover to give themselves bonuses and throw expensive galas. [1]: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=14124294 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=14124294

mconley 8y ago
> They are simply no longer willing to disrupt the status quo, even to help their users. This is just false. I guess you're not aware of the content blocking work we've been focusing on lately?: https://www.theverge.com/2018/8/30/17800714/mozilla-firefox-block-web-trackers-targeted-ads-cookies https://www.theverge.com/2018/8/30/17800714/mozilla-firefox-... Disclosure: I work for Mozilla on Firefox. I can say, without hesitation, that we definitely give a damn about protecting the user and protecting the health of the web.
- nanna 8y ago
  Thank you for all the work you and everyone at Mozilla do. Without you the web would be... oy gevalt.
  - shrimp_emoji 8y ago
    >oy gevalt. There's no reason for this kind of dog whistling.
    - herpes 8y ago
      I don't understand the meaning of either this or the parent comment. Can someone please explain them for me?
- stephenhuey 8y ago
  Keep up the good work! I’m upset that Firefox is blocked in the corporation when I work, but glad you have some fighting spirit yet.
- Endy 8y ago
  Do more to show it then. Firefox has consistently been clamping down on user freedom and aping Chrome as closely as possible, instead of actually focusing on doing the right thing. Google is not the health of the web. Helping Google is contributing to the largest walled-garden that exists.
  - tim1994 8y ago
    > Firefox has consistently been clamping down on user freedom Can you give an example? While I personally don't agree with everything Mozilla has done in the last couple of years (like the native pocket integration for example) I do not agree with that statement.
    - Endy 8y ago
      That's a recent part of it. Pocket integration, removal of about:config entries, moving to WebExtensions so that the user has less control over their browser both in terms of appearance and function, changing the appearance in a way the user has little way of altering to a more functional display, now removing Bookmark Descriptions, using random non-user-audited data transmitted from random Firefox installs to determine the focus and goals of the browser, etc.
dblohm7 8y ago
Mozilla employee here. > There have been people within Mozilla who just want to abandon their own code and simply release a re-branded Chromium. Citation needed. Here's my quote: we're committed to Gecko.
- mook 8y ago
  roc did, supposedly, in late 2007. See https://robert.ocallahan.org/2018/01/ancient-browser-wars-history-md5-hashed.html https://robert.ocallahan.org/2018/01/ancient-browser-wars-hi... It dates from back when Mozilla seemed to be losing quickly, and actually rebranding Chrome (with their own changes) might have made sense. I'm glad they didn't, of course. I have no reason believe he, or anybody else at Mozilla, currently thinks that way.
  - gsnedders 8y ago
    Obviously by 2013 his views had changed: See https://robert.ocallahan.org/2013/02/and-then-there-were-three.html https://robert.ocallahan.org/2013/02/and-then-there-were-thr... on Presto's demise (except it lives on after death in Opera Mini, to this day!) And https://robert.ocallahan.org/2013/04/blink.html https://robert.ocallahan.org/2013/04/blink.html on the Blink fork.
    - andrewshadura 8y ago
      According to the developers of Opera, they have actually switched to Blink for Opera Mini pretty soon.
- seabrookmx 8y ago
  I believe you, and honestly with the latest improvements with Quantum I can see why. I _am_ curious about the motivation behind Firefox Focus though. I use vanilla Firefox on Android and really enjoy it.. what was the motivation for using a Webkit base for Focus? Seems like the stripped down, privacy focused experience would have worked fine based on Firefox proper?
  - 8y ago
badsoftwaredev 8y ago
Their old culture lost to Chrome. They are fighting against complete domination by Chrome right now.
Rapzid 8y ago
What IS going on with DRM? Edge is the only windows 10 browser that will play 1080p Neflix and possibly Amazon..
- Fnoord 8y ago
  DRM being DRM, see [1]. [1] https://github.com/truedread/netflix-1080p/issues/15#issuecomment-398256248 https://github.com/truedread/netflix-1080p/issues/15#issueco...

mconley 8y ago

> They are simply no longer willing to disrupt the status quo, even to help their users. This is just false. I guess you're not aware of the content blocking work we've been focusing on lately?: https://www.theverge.com/2018/8/30/17800714/mozilla-firefox-block-web-trackers-targeted-ads-cookies https://www.theverge.com/2018/8/30/17800714/mozilla-firefox-... Disclosure: I work for Mozilla on Firefox. I can say, without hesitation, that we definitely give a damn about protecting the user and protecting the health of the web.

nanna 8y ago
Thank you for all the work you and everyone at Mozilla do. Without you the web would be... oy gevalt.
- shrimp_emoji 8y ago
  >oy gevalt. There's no reason for this kind of dog whistling.
  - herpes 8y ago
    I don't understand the meaning of either this or the parent comment. Can someone please explain them for me?
stephenhuey 8y ago
Keep up the good work! I’m upset that Firefox is blocked in the corporation when I work, but glad you have some fighting spirit yet.
Endy 8y ago
Do more to show it then. Firefox has consistently been clamping down on user freedom and aping Chrome as closely as possible, instead of actually focusing on doing the right thing. Google is not the health of the web. Helping Google is contributing to the largest walled-garden that exists.
- tim1994 8y ago
  > Firefox has consistently been clamping down on user freedom Can you give an example? While I personally don't agree with everything Mozilla has done in the last couple of years (like the native pocket integration for example) I do not agree with that statement.
  - Endy 8y ago
    That's a recent part of it. Pocket integration, removal of about:config entries, moving to WebExtensions so that the user has less control over their browser both in terms of appearance and function, changing the appearance in a way the user has little way of altering to a more functional display, now removing Bookmark Descriptions, using random non-user-audited data transmitted from random Firefox installs to determine the focus and goals of the browser, etc.

dblohm7 8y ago

Mozilla employee here. > There have been people within Mozilla who just want to abandon their own code and simply release a re-branded Chromium. Citation needed. Here's my quote: we're committed to Gecko.

mook 8y ago
roc did, supposedly, in late 2007. See https://robert.ocallahan.org/2018/01/ancient-browser-wars-history-md5-hashed.html https://robert.ocallahan.org/2018/01/ancient-browser-wars-hi... It dates from back when Mozilla seemed to be losing quickly, and actually rebranding Chrome (with their own changes) might have made sense. I'm glad they didn't, of course. I have no reason believe he, or anybody else at Mozilla, currently thinks that way.
- gsnedders 8y ago
  Obviously by 2013 his views had changed: See https://robert.ocallahan.org/2013/02/and-then-there-were-three.html https://robert.ocallahan.org/2013/02/and-then-there-were-thr... on Presto's demise (except it lives on after death in Opera Mini, to this day!) And https://robert.ocallahan.org/2013/04/blink.html https://robert.ocallahan.org/2013/04/blink.html on the Blink fork.
  - andrewshadura 8y ago
    According to the developers of Opera, they have actually switched to Blink for Opera Mini pretty soon.
seabrookmx 8y ago
I believe you, and honestly with the latest improvements with Quantum I can see why. I _am_ curious about the motivation behind Firefox Focus though. I use vanilla Firefox on Android and really enjoy it.. what was the motivation for using a Webkit base for Focus? Seems like the stripped down, privacy focused experience would have worked fine based on Firefox proper?
- 8y ago

badsoftwaredev 8y ago

Their old culture lost to Chrome. They are fighting against complete domination by Chrome right now.

Rapzid 8y ago

What IS going on with DRM? Edge is the only windows 10 browser that will play 1080p Neflix and possibly Amazon..

Fnoord 8y ago
DRM being DRM, see [1]. [1] https://github.com/truedread/netflix-1080p/issues/15#issuecomment-398256248 https://github.com/truedread/netflix-1080p/issues/15#issueco...