23 ms·

To add some anecdotal experience here, I replaced my 2015 MBP which I loved, with a 5th Gen Lenovo X1 Carbon and I can honestly say I have no regrets. The mac

To add some anecdotal experience here, I replaced my 2015 MBP which I loved, with a 5th Gen Lenovo X1 Carbon and I can honestly say I have no regrets. The machine is wonderful for development. Light but powerful, very pleasant to type on, checks all the right boxes. You can use Linux or Windows (which honestly has come quite a long ways and works quite well). Also, you can game with these laptops now thanks to USB-C external graphics enclosures, giving you a work machine on the go, and a gaming machine at home.

plouffy 8y ago
What about the trackpad ?
- post_break 8y ago
  It's a thinkpad, you don't use the trackpad, you use the "nub"
  - Goronmon 8y ago
    Yeah, the downside to getting used to the trackpoint is that I don't know if I can ever switch to a laptop without one. Trackpads feel so clunky now.
    - roddds 8y ago
      Do you have any tips for getting used to it? I've been using my first Thinkpad (a 5th gen X1 Carbon) and I've tried on and off to get used to it but it doesn't feel like it'll ever be better than using the trackpad.
      - appleiigs 8y ago
        Same here. I found learning vim to be easier than getting used to the nib. Would love for the nib to be effective for me. I think the nib requires to much force to push around.
        diffeomorphism 8y ago
        > I think the nib requires to much force to push around. Adjust the sensitivity upwards and it requires virtually no force at all.
        pymai 8y ago
        I'm not sure what sensitivity I have it set at but most of the time I'm only moving the tip of my finger maybe half a millimeter at the most. you shouldn't have to press it that hard but it does take a while for most poeple to get the hang of it.
        Daishiman 8y ago
        You shouldn't be applying force. The idea is to move it around like a joystick. Almost all force should be lateral.
      - jschwartzi 8y ago
        Jack up the sensitivity to maximum and it works pretty well. I don't need to carry a mouse with me when I'm traveling because the nub is so much better.
        claudius 8y ago
        To add to that, on Xfce at least it’s not enough to adapt the graphical mouse settings but one also needs to manually set (e.g.) /sys/bus/serio/devices/serio1/serio2/sensitivity to a larger value (I use 220) for a suitably fast mouse.
      - gascan 8y ago
        Disable your touchpad and never take your hands off home-row. The real "ah-ha" for me was when I became proficient at using the nub while my hands were on home-row. IMO the nub isn't more accurate or anything like that, 95% of the value is simply the position next to home-row.
  - phatboyslim 8y ago
    To be completely honest, I don't use the nub. The trackpad was 5/5 on the MBP, but I feel the trackpad is 4/5 on the X1. It's plenty fine to use... I also carry a portable mouse in my laptop bag.
    - berberous 8y ago
      To each their own, but if the MBP is 5/5 the trackpad on the X1 is still a 1/5 to me. I hate the thing. I also never use the nub. I haven't met a PC trackpad I like though.
      - dgzl 8y ago
        Learning the nub requires practice, but the payoff is huge. I'm half convinced that I won't get another laptop without one. Main benefits: + hands stay on homerow while using mouse, so I can switch from keys to mouse to keys very fast and without losing my place. + Don't need extra space for a physical mouse + Easy to use at certain angles - Not easy to use at other certain angles
        lylecubed 8y ago
        > + Easy to use at certain angles > - Not easy to use at other certain angles Any tips on what the correct angle is? Every few month for the past 3 years I've been trying to get used to the trackpoint on my lenovo. I never stick with it longer than an hour. It's just so much slower than the trackpad. Am I doing something wrong?
        nine_k 8y ago
        Try playing with acceleration factor in your OS / DE settings. I used to have trackpoint send the cursor across the screen pretty efficiently when pressed harder, while keeping it quite reasonably accurate when pressed gently. The same applies to mice, but the threshold(s) for a trackpoint differ(s) from mouse's, so it pays to tweak it until you're comfortable.
        8y ago
  - rcarmo 8y ago
    I used thinkpads for a long while, and TrackPoint eventually came to hurt my index finger--call it RSI if you will, but whenever I use TrackPoint these days the distal joints of my index finger start aching, which is the usual reminder for me to disable it and use the trackpad instead.
  - JoshTriplett 8y ago
    I have an X1 Carbon, and I use both, depending on if I want long-distance travel, scrolling, or fine manipulation.
  - squarefoot 8y ago
    Am I the only one finding the trackpad a lot more usable than that "nipple"? (And I am a trackpad hater). Most people don't realize you can have very precise movement on the trackpad just by slightly rotating the finger while mantaining it down. Try it: get to the nearest point moving the finger normally, then adjust finely by rotating the finger tip to the wanted direction. Very easy and at least to me much more accurate than that red thing.
    - suprfnk 8y ago
      Yeah, trackpad is more usable. But also more of a hassle. I do most things with the keyboard with both hands on the home row. This is great, but there are still applications and some websites where I need to use the mouse. For those things, it's great to not have to move my hands to use a mouse -- it's the reason I really like the TrackPoint. Once your hand is there though, the trackpad is better. Though you can extend that to; once your hand is on a real mouse, the real mouse is even better. But that's even farther away. And whipping your hand back and forth between mouse and keyboard is really annoying, at least to me.
      - lathiat 8y ago
        I’ve been using my thumb on MacBook trackpads without having to noticeably move my hand. In fact moving back to a desktop having to move my hand is annoying. And there on the 2012 era smaller trackpads. Probably easier on the new ones that are twice the size.
- davidandgoliath 8y ago
  No faults to speak of (~10 year macbook user here) as someone who uses an x1 c5 now. I miss using cmd-c/cmd-v & soulver (math app. on MacOS), but otherwise no drawbacks.
  - NDizzle 8y ago
    What do you mean "cmd-c/cmd-v"? Copy and paste? ctrl-c/ctrl-v...
    - eropple 8y ago
      Having copy/paste be out-of-band means that ctrl-c is not overloaded between "copy" and "terminate process".
    - bitwize 8y ago
      The Ctrl key is for sending control codes. The Command key is for sending commands. 35 years on, and Apple is still the only company that got this right.
      - nathanaldensr 8y ago
        This is a distinction that doesn't matter anymore. Keyboards aren't controlling complex mechanical systems anymore (at least not PC keyboards).
        sillyquiet 8y ago
        I use ctrl-key all the time to send signals to a running process...
        EpicEng 8y ago
        Yeah,me too, plus another 0.0001% of the computing public.
        8y ago
vlunkr 8y ago
I also recently left a MBP for a Lenovo T-series laptop. One of my favorite things is the keyboard. It doesn't compare to a mechanical keyboard or anything, but it's much nicer than anything Apple offers (Which seem to keep getting worse)
- sneak 8y ago
  The latest touchbar rMBP does offer a slight improvement over last year’s failure-prone version, but I am sure the T-series is better.
  - pimeys 8y ago
    You should definitely give it a try in a shop. My partner was for many years using MacBooks, but when he compared the new rMBP keyboard to the latest X1C, the difference is so clear for the ThinkPad that now we have again one Windows computer in the house. I think the modern ThinkPad keyboards are nice, but when I got myself the T25 I have to say it has the pinnacle of laptop keyboards. I really wish they'd release a laptop with the classic keyboard every couple of years; it'll be very hard for me to replace this. The feel of the keys is nice and soft, there's lots of key travel, it's very hard to write typos and the PgUp/PgDwn keys are in a perfect location.
    - sneak 8y ago
      Does the keyboard allow me to type iMessages and build iOS apps in Xcode?
      - davidandgoliath 8y ago
        Nope, you're stuck in your little garden by yourself for now. You can install google `messages` for android based sms now, and KDE connect lets you do the same without google involved, well, assuming you use android :) https://play.google.com/store/apps/details?id=org.kde.kdeconnect_tp https://play.google.com/store/apps/details?id=org.kde.kdecon...
      - 8y ago
knuththetruth 8y ago
>Also, you can game with these laptops now thanks to USB-C external graphics enclosures, giving you a work machine on the go, and a gaming machine at home. What setup do you use with your X1?

plouffy 8y ago

What about the trackpad ?

post_break 8y ago
It's a thinkpad, you don't use the trackpad, you use the "nub"
- Goronmon 8y ago
  Yeah, the downside to getting used to the trackpoint is that I don't know if I can ever switch to a laptop without one. Trackpads feel so clunky now.
  - roddds 8y ago
    Do you have any tips for getting used to it? I've been using my first Thinkpad (a 5th gen X1 Carbon) and I've tried on and off to get used to it but it doesn't feel like it'll ever be better than using the trackpad.
    - appleiigs 8y ago
      Same here. I found learning vim to be easier than getting used to the nib. Would love for the nib to be effective for me. I think the nib requires to much force to push around.
      - diffeomorphism 8y ago
        > I think the nib requires to much force to push around. Adjust the sensitivity upwards and it requires virtually no force at all.
      - pymai 8y ago
        I'm not sure what sensitivity I have it set at but most of the time I'm only moving the tip of my finger maybe half a millimeter at the most. you shouldn't have to press it that hard but it does take a while for most poeple to get the hang of it.
      - Daishiman 8y ago
        You shouldn't be applying force. The idea is to move it around like a joystick. Almost all force should be lateral.
    - jschwartzi 8y ago
      Jack up the sensitivity to maximum and it works pretty well. I don't need to carry a mouse with me when I'm traveling because the nub is so much better.
      - claudius 8y ago
        To add to that, on Xfce at least it’s not enough to adapt the graphical mouse settings but one also needs to manually set (e.g.) /sys/bus/serio/devices/serio1/serio2/sensitivity to a larger value (I use 220) for a suitably fast mouse.
    - gascan 8y ago
      Disable your touchpad and never take your hands off home-row. The real "ah-ha" for me was when I became proficient at using the nub while my hands were on home-row. IMO the nub isn't more accurate or anything like that, 95% of the value is simply the position next to home-row.
- phatboyslim 8y ago
  To be completely honest, I don't use the nub. The trackpad was 5/5 on the MBP, but I feel the trackpad is 4/5 on the X1. It's plenty fine to use... I also carry a portable mouse in my laptop bag.
  - berberous 8y ago
    To each their own, but if the MBP is 5/5 the trackpad on the X1 is still a 1/5 to me. I hate the thing. I also never use the nub. I haven't met a PC trackpad I like though.
    - dgzl 8y ago
      Learning the nub requires practice, but the payoff is huge. I'm half convinced that I won't get another laptop without one. Main benefits: + hands stay on homerow while using mouse, so I can switch from keys to mouse to keys very fast and without losing my place. + Don't need extra space for a physical mouse + Easy to use at certain angles - Not easy to use at other certain angles
      - lylecubed 8y ago
        > + Easy to use at certain angles > - Not easy to use at other certain angles Any tips on what the correct angle is? Every few month for the past 3 years I've been trying to get used to the trackpoint on my lenovo. I never stick with it longer than an hour. It's just so much slower than the trackpad. Am I doing something wrong?
        nine_k 8y ago
        Try playing with acceleration factor in your OS / DE settings. I used to have trackpoint send the cursor across the screen pretty efficiently when pressed harder, while keeping it quite reasonably accurate when pressed gently. The same applies to mice, but the threshold(s) for a trackpoint differ(s) from mouse's, so it pays to tweak it until you're comfortable.
        8y ago
- rcarmo 8y ago
  I used thinkpads for a long while, and TrackPoint eventually came to hurt my index finger--call it RSI if you will, but whenever I use TrackPoint these days the distal joints of my index finger start aching, which is the usual reminder for me to disable it and use the trackpad instead.
- JoshTriplett 8y ago
  I have an X1 Carbon, and I use both, depending on if I want long-distance travel, scrolling, or fine manipulation.
- squarefoot 8y ago
  Am I the only one finding the trackpad a lot more usable than that "nipple"? (And I am a trackpad hater). Most people don't realize you can have very precise movement on the trackpad just by slightly rotating the finger while mantaining it down. Try it: get to the nearest point moving the finger normally, then adjust finely by rotating the finger tip to the wanted direction. Very easy and at least to me much more accurate than that red thing.
  - suprfnk 8y ago
    Yeah, trackpad is more usable. But also more of a hassle. I do most things with the keyboard with both hands on the home row. This is great, but there are still applications and some websites where I need to use the mouse. For those things, it's great to not have to move my hands to use a mouse -- it's the reason I really like the TrackPoint. Once your hand is there though, the trackpad is better. Though you can extend that to; once your hand is on a real mouse, the real mouse is even better. But that's even farther away. And whipping your hand back and forth between mouse and keyboard is really annoying, at least to me.
    - lathiat 8y ago
      I’ve been using my thumb on MacBook trackpads without having to noticeably move my hand. In fact moving back to a desktop having to move my hand is annoying. And there on the 2012 era smaller trackpads. Probably easier on the new ones that are twice the size.
davidandgoliath 8y ago
No faults to speak of (~10 year macbook user here) as someone who uses an x1 c5 now. I miss using cmd-c/cmd-v & soulver (math app. on MacOS), but otherwise no drawbacks.
- NDizzle 8y ago
  What do you mean "cmd-c/cmd-v"? Copy and paste? ctrl-c/ctrl-v...
  - eropple 8y ago
    Having copy/paste be out-of-band means that ctrl-c is not overloaded between "copy" and "terminate process".
  - bitwize 8y ago
    The Ctrl key is for sending control codes. The Command key is for sending commands. 35 years on, and Apple is still the only company that got this right.
    - nathanaldensr 8y ago
      This is a distinction that doesn't matter anymore. Keyboards aren't controlling complex mechanical systems anymore (at least not PC keyboards).
      - sillyquiet 8y ago
        I use ctrl-key all the time to send signals to a running process...
        EpicEng 8y ago
        Yeah,me too, plus another 0.0001% of the computing public.
        8y ago

vlunkr 8y ago

I also recently left a MBP for a Lenovo T-series laptop. One of my favorite things is the keyboard. It doesn't compare to a mechanical keyboard or anything, but it's much nicer than anything Apple offers (Which seem to keep getting worse)

sneak 8y ago
The latest touchbar rMBP does offer a slight improvement over last year’s failure-prone version, but I am sure the T-series is better.
- pimeys 8y ago
  You should definitely give it a try in a shop. My partner was for many years using MacBooks, but when he compared the new rMBP keyboard to the latest X1C, the difference is so clear for the ThinkPad that now we have again one Windows computer in the house. I think the modern ThinkPad keyboards are nice, but when I got myself the T25 I have to say it has the pinnacle of laptop keyboards. I really wish they'd release a laptop with the classic keyboard every couple of years; it'll be very hard for me to replace this. The feel of the keys is nice and soft, there's lots of key travel, it's very hard to write typos and the PgUp/PgDwn keys are in a perfect location.
  - sneak 8y ago
    Does the keyboard allow me to type iMessages and build iOS apps in Xcode?
    - davidandgoliath 8y ago
      Nope, you're stuck in your little garden by yourself for now. You can install google `messages` for android based sms now, and KDE connect lets you do the same without google involved, well, assuming you use android :) https://play.google.com/store/apps/details?id=org.kde.kdeconnect_tp https://play.google.com/store/apps/details?id=org.kde.kdecon...
    - 8y ago

knuththetruth 8y ago

>Also, you can game with these laptops now thanks to USB-C external graphics enclosures, giving you a work machine on the go, and a gaming machine at home. What setup do you use with your X1?