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Why You Should Build a Hackintosh

182 points by jalan 8y ago

rootedbox 8y ago
Besides the pain of when there is a major os upgrade.. I love my mackintosh.
frusciante29 8y ago
weekly hackintosh post, we've been expecting you!
dvfjsdhgfv 8y ago
I'm still using the tower version of Mac Pro with High Sierra and it rocks. I upgraded RAM to 32 GB and the Xeon processors handle everything I throw at them. Opening it and changing drives is a pure pleasure. I really, really don't understand why Apple gave up on these towers and came up with something as inflexible as the current design.
- fetus8 8y ago
  Would you mind sharing the model num of the Mac Pro your using?
  - iseyler 8y ago
    I'm not the OP but I use a 2008 Mac Pro: https://everymac.com/systems/apple/mac_pro/specs/mac-pro-eight-core-2.8-2008-specs.html https://everymac.com/systems/apple/mac_pro/specs/mac-pro-eig... 8 cores, 32GB of RAM, 4 SATA drive slots - found it used for only $400 CAD. A 2010 or newer Mac Pro would allow you to run the latest macOS version.
  - dvfjsdhgfv 8y ago
    Mac Pro 3.1 from 2008 with 2 quad core Xeons at 2,8. You can get one of these very cheap (300 euro maybe if you buy the memory separately). As the other poster says, the only drawback is SATA2 disks speed.
- ynniv 8y ago
  From the beginning... "[Steve Jobs] decreed that the Macintosh would remain perpetually bereft of slots, enclosed in a tightly sealed case, with only the limited expandability of the two serial ports." https://www.folklore.org/StoryView.py?project=Macintosh&story=Diagnostic_Port.txt* https://www.folklore.org/StoryView.py?project=Macintosh&stor...
  - avree 8y ago
    There is a trailing asterisk in your link, breaking the pointer. https://www.folklore.org/StoryView.py?project=Macintosh&story=Diagnostic_Port.txt https://www.folklore.org/StoryView.py?project=Macintosh&stor... is the proper URL (for those like me who are curious, and want to see what you're talking about!)
- johnbellone 8y ago
  I am using this model as well, but I've added a bunch of cards and replaced the BT module so that I could get Handoff support. The biggest downside right now is the fact that the motherboard is SATA2 instead of SATA3. The disk speed is abysmal.
- Patrick_Devine 8y ago
  I've got a Mac Pro 1,1 which I've been debating about upgrading. Apparently you can new processors and hack around the 32bit EFI bootloader issues. It's a bit of a pain, but seems like a cheap way of getting a faster machine. The bus access is still going to be slow, but for most tasks, it seems pretty reasonable.
  - PascLeRasc 8y ago
    I've got one too. X5650s on ebay are about $20 for 2, 16gb of ram was $15, and you can flash it to a 2,1 easily and take it up to El Capitan.
e40 8y ago
I maintained one for a couple of years. I had a troubling configuration to support (RAID 1 for system partition, no Windows). Every time I updated (minor macOS releases), it was a nail-biting experience, and sometimes it would take me hours to recover. The forums (tonymacx86) weren't much help, even though my hardware was supported (according to them). Overall, it was a frustrating and not that rewarding experience. Lightroom is actually faster on my 2013 Pro, even though the video card I used in the hackintosh was way more powerful, so I literally do not miss anything from those 2 years.
ironjunkie 8y ago
I really don't get it. The biggest appeal of Apple is their wonderful hardware. I dislike MacOS and it has been worse over the last years. It seems to me that a Hackintosh is the worst of both worlds. If you spend that much time hacking around the hardware anyways, why not use Linux ?
- iBelieve 8y ago
  One reason would be to use non-Mac hardware and Windows or Linux as your primary OS, but still have access to macOS for the times that you need it, for example to do iOS development. I do some iOS development and primarily use a Dell XPS 13 with Linux on it, and have to switch computers any time I need to work on an iOS project. And specifically about the Mac hardware - I agree MacBooks are the best available, especially the touchpads. But Linux doesn't really support my 2016 MacBook Pro, so I have to use the XPS to run Linux.
  - cortesoft 8y ago
    Man, I would so love to be able to run MacOS in a VM on my non-mac machine. I have a crazy powerful desktop, better than any mac hardware I could buy, so that I can run all the different things I want in a VM. I can kind of run a MacOS vm, but the performance is garbage. I just want to be able to run all the operating systems on a single machine, so I can not be limited. Is that too much to ask?
    - komali2 8y ago
      I've been in your boat so many times, and I similarly thought good performance was impossible. Just out of curiousity, did you spend much time tweaking the VM? Out of the box, for example, a Debian VM on my fast hardware does not perform very well. However, if I tweak the amount of RAM it gets (not too much, not too little, juuuuust right), the number of processors, amp up the video memory, try switching on/off 3d acceleration, and mess around with the actual Debian settings as well, I now have near perfect performance on it. There's usually big threads out there on stackoverflow and forums with performance tips for your given host/guest/VM software.
collinf 8y ago
Couldn't help but notice the irony behind this post in your "Previous Posts" section: https://martinhering.me/post/0/everything-thats-wrong-with-hackintosh https://martinhering.me/post/0/everything-thats-wrong-with-h... Also, I've always been curious what the process for upgrading to new OS versions on a Hackintosh is like. Is it expected that once you get the machine in a working state, you are better off not to touch it?
- wjdp 8y ago
  I used to image my boot disk before each update, saved me a few times when I needed the machine to just work again. Then moved to Linux in 2013, never needed to go back.
- spork12 8y ago
  You can upgrade like you would on normal mac hardware
  - saagarjha 8y ago
    …but things often break, do they not?
    - spork12 8y ago
      For major releases like sierra -> high sierra it pays to wait 2-3 weeks and check around on forums for any issues. I had a few issues with some drivers going from Yosemite to El Capitan. My Sierra to High Sierra upgrade had no issues though. I have noticed bugs in the upgrade process have generally declined pretty steadily since I first started hackintoshing with Mavericks. I never had any issues with minor releases with Sierra or High Sierra.
jasonm89 8y ago
I feel like the post didn't really give me any reasons why I should build a Hackintosh. Also, I wish they went more into their Hackintosh build and not what they want from a mac.
mprev 8y ago
I moved to a Mac after a decade of Linux on the desktop. After years of fiddling with drivers, crappy trackpad behaviours and so on, I wanted a computer that got out of my way and just worked. MacOS is far from perfect but it works perfectly with Apple hardware. If I wanted to go back to seeing my operating system as a hobby then Linux would be mostly a better option.
- komali2 8y ago
  Funny, I'm the opposite. I was tired of jumping through insane hoops for years to get Mac to have good window management, or make keybindings the same in all apps, or have my desktop look the way I wanted, so I switched to Ubuntu 18. I actually scheduled a PTO day for it because I thought it would take like 18 hours to get drivers config'd and all that (my last try was like Ubuntu 14 or something), but it literally worked out of the box, other than needing to mess with getting s2idle to not drain battery (a single line into the GRUB config).
  - BillinghamJ 8y ago
    I think that's one of the key things about using Apple products. If you want to have a good time, you need to embrace the way Apple wants you to use the product. And then generally, you'll find that it really does "just work", most of their decisions were right and you can get on with just using the thing. For the more "power users" who prefer to customise things to a fine degree and make particular choices a typical user doesn't want/need, Apple products aren't always the right option.
    - dkonofalski 8y ago
      I run into this all the time with Windows users switching to a Mac. I do a lot of training for new users when it comes to using Macs and the Windows users are always the worst when compared to people learning for the first time because Windows users always want to do it "the Windows way" and so they get frustrated when all their right clicking doesn't pan out. They bought a Mac because they were frustrated by Windows but then they expect their Mac to just be "Windows without the problems". They rarely are open to using the product differently than before and don't even consider that part of what's "better" is that you use it differently and think about it differently. Case in point - I recently had a user who did all kinds of audio editing for foley sound effects and had organized them all into folders himself. When he switched to the Mac, we were using software that has a very iTunes-focused mentality and it imported all the sounds into a library. He could not get over the fact that everything was flat and that he couldn't view his folder structure and was so frustrated because he couldn't find anything. It took me days to get the point across to him that a library system was much more powerful than a strict hierarchy because he could tag sounds with multiple keywords instead of just relying on his memory to remember which folder he had put a particular clip in. It's now been about 6 months and he has converted so many people to the Mac just by showing them how he can search tags for "flute", "wood", and "horror" and get a listing instead of having to remember that it was in his "horror" folder and then inside the "flute" folder with some weirdly numbered filename. It's so nice when the computer just gets out of the way and lets you worry about the work and not about futzing with everything in the background.
peatmoss 8y ago
Most people invoking a moral imperative to not make hackintoshes are coming from the angle that it’s stealing from Apple. I look at it another way. Apple, as a company is failing to meet the needs of some of its users: - You can’t get an upgradable pro machine - you can’t get a good keyboard (for some definitions of good) - macOS gets more iOS-ified with each release and some people don’t like that Every Hackintosh continues to add momentum to that platform ecosystem, enriching it so that Apple can continue on more or less as they want. I use Linux (and OpenBSD occasionally) these days, and I do so in part so that I can sometimes be the guy who sands off a rough corner or two. Even by using the platform and occasionally submitting bug reports, you’re enriching a platform that may be the last un-nerfed general purpose computing platform standing. If we lose general purpose computing to a world of app-store enabled iPad Pros and Windows Store-locked Surfaces, we will have lost something important I think.
- tokenizerrr 8y ago
  I really don't get why I would want to run an operating system where the vendor refuses to support my hardware. Also, the font color on this blog is absolutely horrible.
  - suprfnk 8y ago
    > the font color on this blog is absolutely horrible. Yeah, I've noticed more sites do this. Super annoying. I made this bookmark for those cases: javascript:(()=>{document.querySelectorAll("p,div,article,section,ul,ol,li").forEach(x=>{x.style["color"]="black";});})();
    - MisterTea 8y ago
      Thank you for that. Nothing worse than shitty web design.
  - pmiller2 8y ago
    I think this is the real reason not to build a hackintosh. I don’t find the “theft” argument compelling, because Apple doesn’t even sell OSX anymore. They’re a hardware company.
ofcrpls 8y ago
Archive Link since the main blog is dead for now https://web.archive.org/web/20180807171806/https://martinhering.me/post/why-you-should-build-a-hackintosh https://web.archive.org/web/20180807171806/https://martinher...
mitchtbaum 8y ago
Anyone have an ultrabook with macOS?
MikeKusold 8y ago
I ran a hackintosh around 2009-2010. I will never do it again. When I first got it all setup and had everything working, I thought it was the best thing ever. Then a security update came out and it completely wrecked my setup. I didn't own any Apple computers at the time, so to fix my broken setup I had to borrow a friend's macbook to fix my desktop. This happened to me 2-3 times before I reformatted and installed Linux. Fast forward to present day, I have both a personal and a work macbook. I badly miss my Linux setup, but there aren't any other laptops that can compete with a MBP. I've debated installing Linux on my MBP, but then I'd be back to forcing an operating system to work on unsupported hardware.
- spork12 8y ago
  The hackintosh scene has come a long way since then.
- radarsat1 8y ago
  I ran Linux on the last two MBPs that I used (from my work, can't afford one myself). Best Linux laptops I've used. And physically solid, I like the hardware quality. Only struggle was the HiDPI stuff which takes a bit of setup (some environment variables to set, basically) but once it works, it works. I wouldn't say that MBP is "unsupported hardware" for Ubuntu. I rebooted to OS X only rarely, for testing Mac programs, or sometimes for Skype and doing presentations, when I really didn't want to fuss with projector problems. (These days Skype is working a lot better on Linux..)
  - mnm1 8y ago
    My 2013 retina mbpro couldn't run Linux successfully including Ubuntu. It's somewhat supported. Except for the trackpad (which you can sort of get working, just not well), dual graphics switching (and therefore decent battery life), crap external monitor support, and the random crashes. After this last one, I just gave up and I realized I was blaming Linux when in reality it was my fault for using unsupported hardware and trying to run Linux on it. Hadn't had such an unreliable system since the old windows days and that's after days and days of setting it up, trying different distros, etc.
jdietrich 8y ago
Why you shouldn't build a Hackintosh: it's a pain in the ass, things will probably break after a major OSX update and the usability gap between OSX and Windows 10 has closed considerably over the past few years.
- old-gregg 8y ago
  > usability gap between OSX and Windows 10 has closed considerably over the past few years. What do you mean? A few examples would be helpful. I am not a frequent Windows user but my impressions, mostly confirmed by seeing other people comment online, is that Windows 7 was the "zenith of Windows UX", with a major step back due to "tabletization" with Windows 8 and partial return to glory with Windows 10. The fact that some apps are designed for touch and look ridiculous on a desktop (calculator), others exist in two forms (the control panel) only makes Windows 10 more confusing, not less.
  - Jonnax 8y ago
    People saying that Windows 7 is some holy grail are not worth listening to when comparing modern systems. The operating system came out 9 years ago. Windows 8 was a massive misstep but they've righted the ship somewhat with 10. There's two control panels bit in each update more functionality moves into the Windows 10 style control panel. The calculator is just a flat styled application not sure why it's rediculus. But tbh I use Google, Excel or Wolfram to do my calculations rather than that app. Features that Windows 10 has for usability. Well there's multiple desktops, small things like built in f.lux. It's nice that you can set a device specific pin for your account. Though having a cloud based account like Android or iPhone may upset some. Also there's excellent touch screen support as a lot of laptops these days support it. Unloke OSX. Sometimes it's just better to scroll using your hands. There's a lot of things under the hood that make it faster and more secure. There are downsides like Random reboots for updates.
    - dep_b 8y ago
      I think under the hood Windows is ahead of macOS. But simple user facing stuff like NSDocument just doesn't exist. Meaning most programs don't return to their state when you reboot, which makes installing updates such a chore since your work is really cut. I had to Google to find the thrash can. Systray icons are not completely killed but very minimized, replaced by nothing. Always alerts and flags that give you a vague sense of something being wrong with your system. Never a clear idea where to find settings. It was already a mess in older versions of Windows like 7, being less crappy than Windows 8 in that sense for me is not really any kind of achievement. I mean I can work with it, no problem. Especially if you pay me to use it. But the user exists to support the system, not the other way around.
rconti 8y ago
This doesn't explain why I should build a Hackintosh. I did it about 8 or so years ago on a Thinkpad T60. It was fine, and basically worked. But my time was more valuable than the incremental cost for Apple hardware.
rock_artist 8y ago
For desktop, running macOS on a custom PC is the way to go. For mobile, where you do want decent battery life and power management I still use Apple's machines. Many people here are UN*X ppl and that's great. But for people doing creative work such as Video, Audio, Graphics there are only 2 platforms - macOS / Windows. I hope and believe Linux will catch up... there are already some products available in Linux flavor. But until then and when Apple's in-house ARM will be old enough to ditch Intel machines... That's one of the most valid choices.
joshmn 8y ago
I have a very well-equipped Hackintosh that has been my daily driver for the last 3 years. I've upgraded from Yosemite to El Capitan to Sierra without any issues, even when using the official upgrade method via iTunes. It sleeps, has working Bluetooth; FaceTime works too. It's incredibly stable. I also have a pair of rMBPs. I dual boot with Windows 10 so I can game when I want to. It's all about getting a very compatible motherboard. If you don't do your research, it's going to be a battle.
- dragonshed 8y ago
  > It's all about getting a very compatible motherboard. 100% agree. When buying, if one keeps to the specific hardware listed in the buyers guide and golden builds from tonymacx86, that alone should alleviate the majority of issues one could run into when building a hackintosh.
lowlevel 8y ago
I feel we're kind of going into a dark age... Apple's software and hardware is suffering from major design flaws, and Microsoft is trying to be more like Apple... linux on the desktop is becoming less laughable with each os update or product refresh...
theak 8y ago
Honestly as someone who used to use a Hackintosh as my daily driver, I can't recommend building one to anyone. Everything from getting drivers to work, to handling updates, is a major pain. The whole point of the mac is that just works, and a Hackintosh is the furthest possible thing from that.
qubex 8y ago
If the next official Mac Pro doesn’t totally blow me away I’m getting a dual POWER9 Talos workstation, putting it in a Level 10case for proud display, and switching to open source. I’m fed up of all this shit. I want a powerful machine and I want to be in charge of it, and if I have to pay premium prices, it might as well be for something usefully exotic.
tomphoolery 8y ago
I own a 2008 Mac Pro, and High Sierra isn't available for my machine. Why should I buy a new machine if my current one works just fine? Note: I need High Sierra because I use this particular machine for music production, and the latest Logic Pro X requires High Sierra, and all of my collaborators have updated so I can't open tracks originated by them anymore.
- PascLeRasc 8y ago
  This will get you onto High Sierra: http://dosdude1.com/highsierra/ http://dosdude1.com/highsierra/
dep_b 8y ago
I won't use a Hackintosh as my main development machine but with all that AMD goodness around it might be a very cool project to build a MegaMac around a 32 core ThreadRipper. I'm not the Mac Pro customer (just programming) to begin with and I am satisfied with the 2015 and 2018 MacBook Pro's. Just as I don't even have a car let alone need a Lamborghini for groceries. But it would be nice for once just to step on the pedal of one and hear it roar. If you know what I mean BIG GRIN I don't think the Mac Pro will ever have USB-A again but surprise me.
S_A_P 8y ago
I can also add a solid reason to build a hackintosh: There is a systemic, as yet unresolved issue that a non trivial percentage of users are experiencing with the iMac Pro and 2018 refresh Macbook Pro. While unproven, it seems related to the T2 chip and it causes kernel panics in certain cases. There is a lengthy thread on the apple support community about this[1], and Ive worked with an apple engineer off and on for a few weeks to gather information about my system. The symptoms are a kernel panic occurs when the system is allowed to sleep overnight with certain OS options enabled. The panic also occurs when the TB bus is loaded down or daisy chained and accessed by an application. So far there is no fix but ways to decrease the kernel panics. The affected users appears to be anyone with an iMac Pro or 2018 macbook pro. I happen to have both of the affected products, but fortunately my macbook pro is not having this issue. In my case, I was able to turn off things like powernap, unlock with apple watch, and some other energy saving functions, but I dont want that to be a permanent configuration. I still get crashes when using applications that access the TB bus as well. [1]https://discussions.apple.com/message/33728078 https://discussions.apple.com/message/33728078
- dddddaviddddd 8y ago
  Occasional unresolved kernel panics are a common feature on Hackintoshes. Why trust enthusiasts to provide support better than Apple?
- sneak 8y ago
  Counter anecdata: my iMac Pro has never kernel paniced in months of heavy daily use.
mawburn 8y ago
Hackintosh, for when you want MacOS for all the wrong reasons. Throw that hardware compatibility and stability out the window.
lazerwalker 8y ago
I recently switched from a Hackintosh to a brand-new MacBook Pro. My desktop was/is way more powerful than the new laptop, but MAN is the new MBP more enjoyable to use. Some things I ran into on a daily basis: * GPU support (at least with Nvidia) is terrible. Anything GPU-bound was absolutely horrendous. The OS would just freeze and reboot itself a dozen times a day due to the GPU (and not obviously e.g. overheating issues). No issues at all when running Windows on the same box. And this was after I spent hours trawling forum posts and fiddling around with kexts and patches and installing random tools off GitHub that would let you downgrade from the latest Nvidia drivers to the last "known good" ones. This didn't used to be as bad, but High Sierra really fucked things over. * I never got non-Bluetooth audio working. The community recommended a USB audio adapter; never worked for me. I'd occasionally connect AirPods, but not having proper support for the fast device switching meant it was a pain in the ass. * iMessage worked... maybe 30-40% of the time? Switching over to my new Mac, I'm amazed how I'd trained myself away from sending text messages on my Mac purely because I didn't expect it to work reliably. * Other little things didn't work that you wouldn't reasonably expect to work. Apple Pay in Safari via your phone, unlocking your computer with an Apple Watch, remote iOS debugging in Xcode / Safari, etc. Little things that I didn't really notice at the time, but are so much nicer now that I'm back in first-party hardware land. I'm glad I did the experiment, and I'm glad I still have my custom box lying around for Windows gaming, but man am I happy to be back on first-party hardware. If I needed to switch back to using my tower as my primary computer, I'd definitely use Linux or Windows before going back to a Hackintosh.
deleted 8y ago
[deleted]
ageitgey 8y ago
I can tell you from experience that building a Hackintosh is a terrible idea for almost all people. I have no moral objection to it and I totally understand the motivation. Apple is completely failing to provide hardware that runs at a fraction of the performance you'd get from building a commodity $2500 AMD/Nvidia desktop even if you give Apple $7000 for a Pro model. Apple's platform especially sucks if you do anything with deep learning since they refuse to sell anything with Nvidia GPUs anymore. But the actual experience of running a Hackintosh is terrible. Even if you buy exactly the right components, it will still take you days to get everything patched and working perfectly. And then every minor security patch will completely break your system, so you end up never updating. Finally you hit a point where your system is so far behind that you give up and either buy a Mac or just install Linux/Windows.
- nwhatt 8y ago
  This was my experience as well. It reminded of running Gentoo Linux a long time ago. Awesome feeling of accomplishment, but not practical if you have a day job.
  - vasili111 8y ago
    Gentoo? I don't think it is quite good comparision.
    - nwhatt 8y ago
      Fair enough :) The complexity that my brain could handle 15 years ago has decreased, and the amount of real work I need to get done has increased.
    - jonathanoliver 8y ago
      How about Arch Linux then? I love it and hate it at the same time. Rolling updates are amazing until they hose your system and you have to roll back updates.
      - berti 8y ago
didip 8y ago
I don't get it. If you are going to pave your own path, rejecting Apple ecosystem, then why not just be part of Linux ecosystem? It probably takes less money and effort to simply buy a Linux laptop.
kstenerud 8y ago
You could also install a virtual hackintosh. It's relatively easy to get going under KVM: https://github.com/kstenerud/virtual-builders/tree/master/machine-builders/macos https://github.com/kstenerud/virtual-builders/tree/master/ma... It's also possible to pass through a graphics card.
op00to 8y ago
Why you shouldn't: you're installing untrusted, totally unverified code at the lowest system levels which opens you up to not only malicious backdoors in the software that bypasses Apple's hardware copy protection, but vulnerabilities that might be discovered in that functionality the future. If you care at all about your personal data, you probably shouldn't take that risk.
crispinb 8y ago
Why you should stop parroting the trite off-the-shelf "Why you should .." title cliche.
peterbmarks 8y ago
When an article talks about "thunderbold" ports and having a desk "littled" with cables I question the accuracy of the rest of it I'm afraid.
true_tuna 8y ago
Remind me again later. Or maybe I’ll run an OS that lets me say “no”
uberman 8y ago
Funny that the article is titled "WHY YOU SHOULD BUILD A HACKINTOSH" yet links to an article by the same author with a conclusion of "I would never recommend to anybody to build a hackintosh..."
outworlder 8y ago
> Apple, if you do that, I am on board again. I would't be. It doesn't matter if they build the dream "pro" machine today if they are not going to refresh the line for 10 years.
rosege 8y ago
Another alternative is to rent one - there are various places that sell you time on them
writepub 8y ago
What Mac only software requires you to use OS-X/hackintosh? Have you looked for alternatives on Ubuntu? At the cost you've stated, your Ubuntu machine will fly, even compared to the Mac. Most often, even at half the cost, you'll end up with most use cases covered on Ubuntu
johnalamos 8y ago
Mac os lol Just stick to windows you disgusting hipster
nottorp 8y ago
Three arguments for hackintosh on the desktop: 1. Apple desktop hardware 2. Windows OS software 3. Linux OS software Laptops are another matter, I buy actual Apple hardware. But then I don't want a super powerful laptop, I have a desktop hackintosh for that ;)
deleted 8y ago
[deleted]

182 points by jalan 8y ago

rootedbox 8y ago

Besides the pain of when there is a major os upgrade.. I love my mackintosh.

frusciante29 8y ago

weekly hackintosh post, we've been expecting you!

dvfjsdhgfv 8y ago

I'm still using the tower version of Mac Pro with High Sierra and it rocks. I upgraded RAM to 32 GB and the Xeon processors handle everything I throw at them. Opening it and changing drives is a pure pleasure. I really, really don't understand why Apple gave up on these towers and came up with something as inflexible as the current design.

fetus8 8y ago
Would you mind sharing the model num of the Mac Pro your using?
- iseyler 8y ago
  I'm not the OP but I use a 2008 Mac Pro: https://everymac.com/systems/apple/mac_pro/specs/mac-pro-eight-core-2.8-2008-specs.html https://everymac.com/systems/apple/mac_pro/specs/mac-pro-eig... 8 cores, 32GB of RAM, 4 SATA drive slots - found it used for only $400 CAD. A 2010 or newer Mac Pro would allow you to run the latest macOS version.
- dvfjsdhgfv 8y ago
  Mac Pro 3.1 from 2008 with 2 quad core Xeons at 2,8. You can get one of these very cheap (300 euro maybe if you buy the memory separately). As the other poster says, the only drawback is SATA2 disks speed.
ynniv 8y ago
From the beginning... "[Steve Jobs] decreed that the Macintosh would remain perpetually bereft of slots, enclosed in a tightly sealed case, with only the limited expandability of the two serial ports." https://www.folklore.org/StoryView.py?project=Macintosh&story=Diagnostic_Port.txt* https://www.folklore.org/StoryView.py?project=Macintosh&stor...
- avree 8y ago
  There is a trailing asterisk in your link, breaking the pointer. https://www.folklore.org/StoryView.py?project=Macintosh&story=Diagnostic_Port.txt https://www.folklore.org/StoryView.py?project=Macintosh&stor... is the proper URL (for those like me who are curious, and want to see what you're talking about!)
johnbellone 8y ago
I am using this model as well, but I've added a bunch of cards and replaced the BT module so that I could get Handoff support. The biggest downside right now is the fact that the motherboard is SATA2 instead of SATA3. The disk speed is abysmal.
Patrick_Devine 8y ago
I've got a Mac Pro 1,1 which I've been debating about upgrading. Apparently you can new processors and hack around the 32bit EFI bootloader issues. It's a bit of a pain, but seems like a cheap way of getting a faster machine. The bus access is still going to be slow, but for most tasks, it seems pretty reasonable.
- PascLeRasc 8y ago
  I've got one too. X5650s on ebay are about $20 for 2, 16gb of ram was $15, and you can flash it to a 2,1 easily and take it up to El Capitan.

e40 8y ago

I maintained one for a couple of years. I had a troubling configuration to support (RAID 1 for system partition, no Windows). Every time I updated (minor macOS releases), it was a nail-biting experience, and sometimes it would take me hours to recover. The forums (tonymacx86) weren't much help, even though my hardware was supported (according to them). Overall, it was a frustrating and not that rewarding experience. Lightroom is actually faster on my 2013 Pro, even though the video card I used in the hackintosh was way more powerful, so I literally do not miss anything from those 2 years.

ironjunkie 8y ago

I really don't get it. The biggest appeal of Apple is their wonderful hardware. I dislike MacOS and it has been worse over the last years. It seems to me that a Hackintosh is the worst of both worlds. If you spend that much time hacking around the hardware anyways, why not use Linux ?

iBelieve 8y ago
One reason would be to use non-Mac hardware and Windows or Linux as your primary OS, but still have access to macOS for the times that you need it, for example to do iOS development. I do some iOS development and primarily use a Dell XPS 13 with Linux on it, and have to switch computers any time I need to work on an iOS project. And specifically about the Mac hardware - I agree MacBooks are the best available, especially the touchpads. But Linux doesn't really support my 2016 MacBook Pro, so I have to use the XPS to run Linux.
- cortesoft 8y ago
  Man, I would so love to be able to run MacOS in a VM on my non-mac machine. I have a crazy powerful desktop, better than any mac hardware I could buy, so that I can run all the different things I want in a VM. I can kind of run a MacOS vm, but the performance is garbage. I just want to be able to run all the operating systems on a single machine, so I can not be limited. Is that too much to ask?
  - komali2 8y ago
    I've been in your boat so many times, and I similarly thought good performance was impossible. Just out of curiousity, did you spend much time tweaking the VM? Out of the box, for example, a Debian VM on my fast hardware does not perform very well. However, if I tweak the amount of RAM it gets (not too much, not too little, juuuuust right), the number of processors, amp up the video memory, try switching on/off 3d acceleration, and mess around with the actual Debian settings as well, I now have near perfect performance on it. There's usually big threads out there on stackoverflow and forums with performance tips for your given host/guest/VM software.

collinf 8y ago

Couldn't help but notice the irony behind this post in your "Previous Posts" section: https://martinhering.me/post/0/everything-thats-wrong-with-hackintosh https://martinhering.me/post/0/everything-thats-wrong-with-h... Also, I've always been curious what the process for upgrading to new OS versions on a Hackintosh is like. Is it expected that once you get the machine in a working state, you are better off not to touch it?

wjdp 8y ago
I used to image my boot disk before each update, saved me a few times when I needed the machine to just work again. Then moved to Linux in 2013, never needed to go back.
spork12 8y ago
You can upgrade like you would on normal mac hardware
- saagarjha 8y ago
  …but things often break, do they not?
  - spork12 8y ago
    For major releases like sierra -> high sierra it pays to wait 2-3 weeks and check around on forums for any issues. I had a few issues with some drivers going from Yosemite to El Capitan. My Sierra to High Sierra upgrade had no issues though. I have noticed bugs in the upgrade process have generally declined pretty steadily since I first started hackintoshing with Mavericks. I never had any issues with minor releases with Sierra or High Sierra.

jasonm89 8y ago

I feel like the post didn't really give me any reasons why I should build a Hackintosh. Also, I wish they went more into their Hackintosh build and not what they want from a mac.

mprev 8y ago

I moved to a Mac after a decade of Linux on the desktop. After years of fiddling with drivers, crappy trackpad behaviours and so on, I wanted a computer that got out of my way and just worked. MacOS is far from perfect but it works perfectly with Apple hardware. If I wanted to go back to seeing my operating system as a hobby then Linux would be mostly a better option.

komali2 8y ago
Funny, I'm the opposite. I was tired of jumping through insane hoops for years to get Mac to have good window management, or make keybindings the same in all apps, or have my desktop look the way I wanted, so I switched to Ubuntu 18. I actually scheduled a PTO day for it because I thought it would take like 18 hours to get drivers config'd and all that (my last try was like Ubuntu 14 or something), but it literally worked out of the box, other than needing to mess with getting s2idle to not drain battery (a single line into the GRUB config).
- BillinghamJ 8y ago
  I think that's one of the key things about using Apple products. If you want to have a good time, you need to embrace the way Apple wants you to use the product. And then generally, you'll find that it really does "just work", most of their decisions were right and you can get on with just using the thing. For the more "power users" who prefer to customise things to a fine degree and make particular choices a typical user doesn't want/need, Apple products aren't always the right option.
  - dkonofalski 8y ago
    I run into this all the time with Windows users switching to a Mac. I do a lot of training for new users when it comes to using Macs and the Windows users are always the worst when compared to people learning for the first time because Windows users always want to do it "the Windows way" and so they get frustrated when all their right clicking doesn't pan out. They bought a Mac because they were frustrated by Windows but then they expect their Mac to just be "Windows without the problems". They rarely are open to using the product differently than before and don't even consider that part of what's "better" is that you use it differently and think about it differently. Case in point - I recently had a user who did all kinds of audio editing for foley sound effects and had organized them all into folders himself. When he switched to the Mac, we were using software that has a very iTunes-focused mentality and it imported all the sounds into a library. He could not get over the fact that everything was flat and that he couldn't view his folder structure and was so frustrated because he couldn't find anything. It took me days to get the point across to him that a library system was much more powerful than a strict hierarchy because he could tag sounds with multiple keywords instead of just relying on his memory to remember which folder he had put a particular clip in. It's now been about 6 months and he has converted so many people to the Mac just by showing them how he can search tags for "flute", "wood", and "horror" and get a listing instead of having to remember that it was in his "horror" folder and then inside the "flute" folder with some weirdly numbered filename. It's so nice when the computer just gets out of the way and lets you worry about the work and not about futzing with everything in the background.

peatmoss 8y ago

Most people invoking a moral imperative to not make hackintoshes are coming from the angle that it’s stealing from Apple. I look at it another way. Apple, as a company is failing to meet the needs of some of its users: - You can’t get an upgradable pro machine - you can’t get a good keyboard (for some definitions of good) - macOS gets more iOS-ified with each release and some people don’t like that Every Hackintosh continues to add momentum to that platform ecosystem, enriching it so that Apple can continue on more or less as they want. I use Linux (and OpenBSD occasionally) these days, and I do so in part so that I can sometimes be the guy who sands off a rough corner or two. Even by using the platform and occasionally submitting bug reports, you’re enriching a platform that may be the last un-nerfed general purpose computing platform standing. If we lose general purpose computing to a world of app-store enabled iPad Pros and Windows Store-locked Surfaces, we will have lost something important I think.

tokenizerrr 8y ago
I really don't get why I would want to run an operating system where the vendor refuses to support my hardware. Also, the font color on this blog is absolutely horrible.
- suprfnk 8y ago
  > the font color on this blog is absolutely horrible. Yeah, I've noticed more sites do this. Super annoying. I made this bookmark for those cases: javascript:(()=>{document.querySelectorAll("p,div,article,section,ul,ol,li").forEach(x=>{x.style["color"]="black";});})();
  - MisterTea 8y ago
    Thank you for that. Nothing worse than shitty web design.
- pmiller2 8y ago
  I think this is the real reason not to build a hackintosh. I don’t find the “theft” argument compelling, because Apple doesn’t even sell OSX anymore. They’re a hardware company.

ofcrpls 8y ago

Archive Link since the main blog is dead for now https://web.archive.org/web/20180807171806/https://martinhering.me/post/why-you-should-build-a-hackintosh https://web.archive.org/web/20180807171806/https://martinher...

mitchtbaum 8y ago

Anyone have an ultrabook with macOS?

MikeKusold 8y ago

I ran a hackintosh around 2009-2010. I will never do it again. When I first got it all setup and had everything working, I thought it was the best thing ever. Then a security update came out and it completely wrecked my setup. I didn't own any Apple computers at the time, so to fix my broken setup I had to borrow a friend's macbook to fix my desktop. This happened to me 2-3 times before I reformatted and installed Linux. Fast forward to present day, I have both a personal and a work macbook. I badly miss my Linux setup, but there aren't any other laptops that can compete with a MBP. I've debated installing Linux on my MBP, but then I'd be back to forcing an operating system to work on unsupported hardware.

spork12 8y ago
The hackintosh scene has come a long way since then.
radarsat1 8y ago
I ran Linux on the last two MBPs that I used (from my work, can't afford one myself). Best Linux laptops I've used. And physically solid, I like the hardware quality. Only struggle was the HiDPI stuff which takes a bit of setup (some environment variables to set, basically) but once it works, it works. I wouldn't say that MBP is "unsupported hardware" for Ubuntu. I rebooted to OS X only rarely, for testing Mac programs, or sometimes for Skype and doing presentations, when I really didn't want to fuss with projector problems. (These days Skype is working a lot better on Linux..)
- mnm1 8y ago
  My 2013 retina mbpro couldn't run Linux successfully including Ubuntu. It's somewhat supported. Except for the trackpad (which you can sort of get working, just not well), dual graphics switching (and therefore decent battery life), crap external monitor support, and the random crashes. After this last one, I just gave up and I realized I was blaming Linux when in reality it was my fault for using unsupported hardware and trying to run Linux on it. Hadn't had such an unreliable system since the old windows days and that's after days and days of setting it up, trying different distros, etc.

jdietrich 8y ago

Why you shouldn't build a Hackintosh: it's a pain in the ass, things will probably break after a major OSX update and the usability gap between OSX and Windows 10 has closed considerably over the past few years.

old-gregg 8y ago
> usability gap between OSX and Windows 10 has closed considerably over the past few years. What do you mean? A few examples would be helpful. I am not a frequent Windows user but my impressions, mostly confirmed by seeing other people comment online, is that Windows 7 was the "zenith of Windows UX", with a major step back due to "tabletization" with Windows 8 and partial return to glory with Windows 10. The fact that some apps are designed for touch and look ridiculous on a desktop (calculator), others exist in two forms (the control panel) only makes Windows 10 more confusing, not less.
- Jonnax 8y ago
  People saying that Windows 7 is some holy grail are not worth listening to when comparing modern systems. The operating system came out 9 years ago. Windows 8 was a massive misstep but they've righted the ship somewhat with 10. There's two control panels bit in each update more functionality moves into the Windows 10 style control panel. The calculator is just a flat styled application not sure why it's rediculus. But tbh I use Google, Excel or Wolfram to do my calculations rather than that app. Features that Windows 10 has for usability. Well there's multiple desktops, small things like built in f.lux. It's nice that you can set a device specific pin for your account. Though having a cloud based account like Android or iPhone may upset some. Also there's excellent touch screen support as a lot of laptops these days support it. Unloke OSX. Sometimes it's just better to scroll using your hands. There's a lot of things under the hood that make it faster and more secure. There are downsides like Random reboots for updates.
  - dep_b 8y ago
    I think under the hood Windows is ahead of macOS. But simple user facing stuff like NSDocument just doesn't exist. Meaning most programs don't return to their state when you reboot, which makes installing updates such a chore since your work is really cut. I had to Google to find the thrash can. Systray icons are not completely killed but very minimized, replaced by nothing. Always alerts and flags that give you a vague sense of something being wrong with your system. Never a clear idea where to find settings. It was already a mess in older versions of Windows like 7, being less crappy than Windows 8 in that sense for me is not really any kind of achievement. I mean I can work with it, no problem. Especially if you pay me to use it. But the user exists to support the system, not the other way around.

rconti 8y ago

This doesn't explain why I should build a Hackintosh. I did it about 8 or so years ago on a Thinkpad T60. It was fine, and basically worked. But my time was more valuable than the incremental cost for Apple hardware.

rock_artist 8y ago

For desktop, running macOS on a custom PC is the way to go. For mobile, where you do want decent battery life and power management I still use Apple's machines. Many people here are UN*X ppl and that's great. But for people doing creative work such as Video, Audio, Graphics there are only 2 platforms - macOS / Windows. I hope and believe Linux will catch up... there are already some products available in Linux flavor. But until then and when Apple's in-house ARM will be old enough to ditch Intel machines... That's one of the most valid choices.

joshmn 8y ago

I have a very well-equipped Hackintosh that has been my daily driver for the last 3 years. I've upgraded from Yosemite to El Capitan to Sierra without any issues, even when using the official upgrade method via iTunes. It sleeps, has working Bluetooth; FaceTime works too. It's incredibly stable. I also have a pair of rMBPs. I dual boot with Windows 10 so I can game when I want to. It's all about getting a very compatible motherboard. If you don't do your research, it's going to be a battle.

dragonshed 8y ago
> It's all about getting a very compatible motherboard. 100% agree. When buying, if one keeps to the specific hardware listed in the buyers guide and golden builds from tonymacx86, that alone should alleviate the majority of issues one could run into when building a hackintosh.

lowlevel 8y ago

I feel we're kind of going into a dark age... Apple's software and hardware is suffering from major design flaws, and Microsoft is trying to be more like Apple... linux on the desktop is becoming less laughable with each os update or product refresh...

theak 8y ago

Honestly as someone who used to use a Hackintosh as my daily driver, I can't recommend building one to anyone. Everything from getting drivers to work, to handling updates, is a major pain. The whole point of the mac is that just works, and a Hackintosh is the furthest possible thing from that.

qubex 8y ago

If the next official Mac Pro doesn’t totally blow me away I’m getting a dual POWER9 Talos workstation, putting it in a Level 10case for proud display, and switching to open source. I’m fed up of all this shit. I want a powerful machine and I want to be in charge of it, and if I have to pay premium prices, it might as well be for something usefully exotic.

tomphoolery 8y ago

I own a 2008 Mac Pro, and High Sierra isn't available for my machine. Why should I buy a new machine if my current one works just fine? Note: I need High Sierra because I use this particular machine for music production, and the latest Logic Pro X requires High Sierra, and all of my collaborators have updated so I can't open tracks originated by them anymore.

PascLeRasc 8y ago
This will get you onto High Sierra: http://dosdude1.com/highsierra/ http://dosdude1.com/highsierra/

dep_b 8y ago

I won't use a Hackintosh as my main development machine but with all that AMD goodness around it might be a very cool project to build a MegaMac around a 32 core ThreadRipper. I'm not the Mac Pro customer (just programming) to begin with and I am satisfied with the 2015 and 2018 MacBook Pro's. Just as I don't even have a car let alone need a Lamborghini for groceries. But it would be nice for once just to step on the pedal of one and hear it roar. If you know what I mean BIG GRIN I don't think the Mac Pro will ever have USB-A again but surprise me.

S_A_P 8y ago

I can also add a solid reason to build a hackintosh: There is a systemic, as yet unresolved issue that a non trivial percentage of users are experiencing with the iMac Pro and 2018 refresh Macbook Pro. While unproven, it seems related to the T2 chip and it causes kernel panics in certain cases. There is a lengthy thread on the apple support community about this[1], and Ive worked with an apple engineer off and on for a few weeks to gather information about my system. The symptoms are a kernel panic occurs when the system is allowed to sleep overnight with certain OS options enabled. The panic also occurs when the TB bus is loaded down or daisy chained and accessed by an application. So far there is no fix but ways to decrease the kernel panics. The affected users appears to be anyone with an iMac Pro or 2018 macbook pro. I happen to have both of the affected products, but fortunately my macbook pro is not having this issue. In my case, I was able to turn off things like powernap, unlock with apple watch, and some other energy saving functions, but I dont want that to be a permanent configuration. I still get crashes when using applications that access the TB bus as well. [1]https://discussions.apple.com/message/33728078 https://discussions.apple.com/message/33728078

dddddaviddddd 8y ago
Occasional unresolved kernel panics are a common feature on Hackintoshes. Why trust enthusiasts to provide support better than Apple?
sneak 8y ago
Counter anecdata: my iMac Pro has never kernel paniced in months of heavy daily use.

mawburn 8y ago

Hackintosh, for when you want MacOS for all the wrong reasons. Throw that hardware compatibility and stability out the window.

lazerwalker 8y ago

I recently switched from a Hackintosh to a brand-new MacBook Pro. My desktop was/is way more powerful than the new laptop, but MAN is the new MBP more enjoyable to use. Some things I ran into on a daily basis: * GPU support (at least with Nvidia) is terrible. Anything GPU-bound was absolutely horrendous. The OS would just freeze and reboot itself a dozen times a day due to the GPU (and not obviously e.g. overheating issues). No issues at all when running Windows on the same box. And this was after I spent hours trawling forum posts and fiddling around with kexts and patches and installing random tools off GitHub that would let you downgrade from the latest Nvidia drivers to the last "known good" ones. This didn't used to be as bad, but High Sierra really fucked things over. * I never got non-Bluetooth audio working. The community recommended a USB audio adapter; never worked for me. I'd occasionally connect AirPods, but not having proper support for the fast device switching meant it was a pain in the ass. * iMessage worked... maybe 30-40% of the time? Switching over to my new Mac, I'm amazed how I'd trained myself away from sending text messages on my Mac purely because I didn't expect it to work reliably. * Other little things didn't work that you wouldn't reasonably expect to work. Apple Pay in Safari via your phone, unlocking your computer with an Apple Watch, remote iOS debugging in Xcode / Safari, etc. Little things that I didn't really notice at the time, but are so much nicer now that I'm back in first-party hardware land. I'm glad I did the experiment, and I'm glad I still have my custom box lying around for Windows gaming, but man am I happy to be back on first-party hardware. If I needed to switch back to using my tower as my primary computer, I'd definitely use Linux or Windows before going back to a Hackintosh.

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ageitgey 8y ago

I can tell you from experience that building a Hackintosh is a terrible idea for almost all people. I have no moral objection to it and I totally understand the motivation. Apple is completely failing to provide hardware that runs at a fraction of the performance you'd get from building a commodity $2500 AMD/Nvidia desktop even if you give Apple $7000 for a Pro model. Apple's platform especially sucks if you do anything with deep learning since they refuse to sell anything with Nvidia GPUs anymore. But the actual experience of running a Hackintosh is terrible. Even if you buy exactly the right components, it will still take you days to get everything patched and working perfectly. And then every minor security patch will completely break your system, so you end up never updating. Finally you hit a point where your system is so far behind that you give up and either buy a Mac or just install Linux/Windows.

nwhatt 8y ago
This was my experience as well. It reminded of running Gentoo Linux a long time ago. Awesome feeling of accomplishment, but not practical if you have a day job.
- vasili111 8y ago
  Gentoo? I don't think it is quite good comparision.
  - nwhatt 8y ago
    Fair enough :) The complexity that my brain could handle 15 years ago has decreased, and the amount of real work I need to get done has increased.
  - jonathanoliver 8y ago
    How about Arch Linux then? I love it and hate it at the same time. Rolling updates are amazing until they hose your system and you have to roll back updates.
    - berti 8y ago

didip 8y ago

I don't get it. If you are going to pave your own path, rejecting Apple ecosystem, then why not just be part of Linux ecosystem? It probably takes less money and effort to simply buy a Linux laptop.

kstenerud 8y ago

You could also install a virtual hackintosh. It's relatively easy to get going under KVM: https://github.com/kstenerud/virtual-builders/tree/master/machine-builders/macos https://github.com/kstenerud/virtual-builders/tree/master/ma... It's also possible to pass through a graphics card.

op00to 8y ago

Why you shouldn't: you're installing untrusted, totally unverified code at the lowest system levels which opens you up to not only malicious backdoors in the software that bypasses Apple's hardware copy protection, but vulnerabilities that might be discovered in that functionality the future. If you care at all about your personal data, you probably shouldn't take that risk.

crispinb 8y ago

Why you should stop parroting the trite off-the-shelf "Why you should .." title cliche.

peterbmarks 8y ago

When an article talks about "thunderbold" ports and having a desk "littled" with cables I question the accuracy of the rest of it I'm afraid.

true_tuna 8y ago

Remind me again later. Or maybe I’ll run an OS that lets me say “no”

uberman 8y ago

Funny that the article is titled "WHY YOU SHOULD BUILD A HACKINTOSH" yet links to an article by the same author with a conclusion of "I would never recommend to anybody to build a hackintosh..."

outworlder 8y ago

> Apple, if you do that, I am on board again. I would't be. It doesn't matter if they build the dream "pro" machine today if they are not going to refresh the line for 10 years.

rosege 8y ago

Another alternative is to rent one - there are various places that sell you time on them

writepub 8y ago

What Mac only software requires you to use OS-X/hackintosh? Have you looked for alternatives on Ubuntu? At the cost you've stated, your Ubuntu machine will fly, even compared to the Mac. Most often, even at half the cost, you'll end up with most use cases covered on Ubuntu

johnalamos 8y ago

Mac os lol Just stick to windows you disgusting hipster

nottorp 8y ago

Three arguments for hackintosh on the desktop: 1. Apple desktop hardware 2. Windows OS software 3. Linux OS software Laptops are another matter, I buy actual Apple hardware. But then I don't want a super powerful laptop, I have a desktop hackintosh for that ;)

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