9 ms·

If you'd ask me personally I think Article 15 is far worse than Article 13. Computer programs are also copyrighted so this would make really hard time for anyon

If you'd ask me personally I think Article 15 is far worse than Article 13. Computer programs are also copyrighted so this would make really hard time for anyone trying to maintain the business once it grows. If this is passed (if I understand this correctly) a subcontractor could sue you for extra money you gained on some of his contributions. It's like contracts no longer define how much you owe to people because everything may change if you succeed. How do you reinvest the money in such conditions? Do you hold some cash just in case someone pops up demanding more money?

matte_black 8y ago
So don’t hire an EU contractor.
bluecalm 8y ago
I think that when you hire someone you are not: entering into a contract for the exploitation of the rights because you are the of the rights yourself. The person you hired to write a program for you doesn't have any rights to it. That being said, the whole article is ridiculous. If it passes you will be on the hook for % of the profits you make possibly forever if you licensed any kind of work to run your business. Maybe they should add another article where you can apply to get some of your money back if you don't make or lose money trying to run your business.
- 6ue7nNMEEbHcM 8y ago
  Thanks for slightly optimistic reply in this regard. But I think it will all come down to how this will be implemented in member states (and I'm sure it will be far from common in EU), here where I live not all rights are transferred as part of the contract, some rights are non-transferable. Nevertheless it's scary how this is developing, I wonder who will be deciding about "fairness" of compensation, will it be courts deciding how much some services are worth... I wonder if UK will accept it, if not I'd expected lots of business moving there from EU.
  - madhadron 8y ago
    "Work for hire" rights have been enshrined for a long, long time, and don't affect just software. It would affect every memo, marketing campaign, advertisement, or drawing made for pay. Something that would destroy the entire white collar economy would get fixed pretty fast.
    - walterbell 8y ago
      Or, we could avoid breaking the economy while hoping that it can be fixed quickly.
- baybal2 8y ago
  Yes, the general impression is that proposal articles almost feel being written under somebody's dictation, for the benefit of a single market player.
- ouid 8y ago
  perhaps it just means that you have to pay in equity.
ddebernardy 8y ago
As things stand right now insofar as I can recollect, copyright is inalienable in the EU. That is, in contrast to the US, you can't give it away. But that's fine in practice, because you can still grant an exclusive royalty-free license. Is article 15 changing that?
- incompatible 8y ago
  I believe you can still transfer copyright to somebody else in the EU. Only certain "moral rights" are inalienable. I don't know of any copyright law in any country that provides a way to "destroy" copyright before its term has elapsed. In the US, it seems to be held to be possible by legal tradition.
  - anticensor 8y ago
    Yes but public domain release usually requires government initiative in EU.
- mattmanser 8y ago
  That's a load of nonsense, no idea where you picked that up, but you can assign copyright in the EU and it is written into contracts with contractors.
  - ddebernardy 8y ago
    My bad; this might be specific to France (and some other countries) rather than the EU as a whole: https://www.legifrance.gouv.fr/affichCode.do;jsessionid=52B3E53A7F8E9AA8B245E70C1F24DA93.tpdjo14v_3?idSectionTA=LEGISCTA000006161636&cidTexte=LEGITEXT000006069414&dateTexte=20080129 https://www.legifrance.gouv.fr/affichCode.do;jsessionid=52B3... L121-1 > L'auteur jouit du droit au respect de son nom, de sa qualité et de son oeuvre. > Ce droit est attaché à sa personne. > Il est perpétuel, inaliénable et imprescriptible.
ouid 8y ago
I cannot find the text of article 15 anywhere online.
- 6ue7nNMEEbHcM 8y ago
  My comment was basing on this: https://eur-lex.europa.eu/legal-content/EN/TXT/HTML/?uri=CELEX:52016PC0593 https://eur-lex.europa.eu/legal-content/EN/TXT/HTML/?uri=CEL... But AFAIK they have already changed that and this text doesn't reflect the recent changes (it's the proposal of the comission AFAIK).

matte_black 8y ago

So don’t hire an EU contractor.

bluecalm 8y ago

I think that when you hire someone you are not: entering into a contract for the exploitation of the rights because you are the of the rights yourself. The person you hired to write a program for you doesn't have any rights to it. That being said, the whole article is ridiculous. If it passes you will be on the hook for % of the profits you make possibly forever if you licensed any kind of work to run your business. Maybe they should add another article where you can apply to get some of your money back if you don't make or lose money trying to run your business.

6ue7nNMEEbHcM 8y ago
Thanks for slightly optimistic reply in this regard. But I think it will all come down to how this will be implemented in member states (and I'm sure it will be far from common in EU), here where I live not all rights are transferred as part of the contract, some rights are non-transferable. Nevertheless it's scary how this is developing, I wonder who will be deciding about "fairness" of compensation, will it be courts deciding how much some services are worth... I wonder if UK will accept it, if not I'd expected lots of business moving there from EU.
- madhadron 8y ago
  "Work for hire" rights have been enshrined for a long, long time, and don't affect just software. It would affect every memo, marketing campaign, advertisement, or drawing made for pay. Something that would destroy the entire white collar economy would get fixed pretty fast.
  - walterbell 8y ago
    Or, we could avoid breaking the economy while hoping that it can be fixed quickly.
baybal2 8y ago
Yes, the general impression is that proposal articles almost feel being written under somebody's dictation, for the benefit of a single market player.
ouid 8y ago
perhaps it just means that you have to pay in equity.

ddebernardy 8y ago

As things stand right now insofar as I can recollect, copyright is inalienable in the EU. That is, in contrast to the US, you can't give it away. But that's fine in practice, because you can still grant an exclusive royalty-free license. Is article 15 changing that?

incompatible 8y ago
I believe you can still transfer copyright to somebody else in the EU. Only certain "moral rights" are inalienable. I don't know of any copyright law in any country that provides a way to "destroy" copyright before its term has elapsed. In the US, it seems to be held to be possible by legal tradition.
- anticensor 8y ago
  Yes but public domain release usually requires government initiative in EU.
mattmanser 8y ago
That's a load of nonsense, no idea where you picked that up, but you can assign copyright in the EU and it is written into contracts with contractors.
- ddebernardy 8y ago
  My bad; this might be specific to France (and some other countries) rather than the EU as a whole: https://www.legifrance.gouv.fr/affichCode.do;jsessionid=52B3E53A7F8E9AA8B245E70C1F24DA93.tpdjo14v_3?idSectionTA=LEGISCTA000006161636&cidTexte=LEGITEXT000006069414&dateTexte=20080129 https://www.legifrance.gouv.fr/affichCode.do;jsessionid=52B3... L121-1 > L'auteur jouit du droit au respect de son nom, de sa qualité et de son oeuvre. > Ce droit est attaché à sa personne. > Il est perpétuel, inaliénable et imprescriptible.

ouid 8y ago

I cannot find the text of article 15 anywhere online.

6ue7nNMEEbHcM 8y ago
My comment was basing on this: https://eur-lex.europa.eu/legal-content/EN/TXT/HTML/?uri=CELEX:52016PC0593 https://eur-lex.europa.eu/legal-content/EN/TXT/HTML/?uri=CEL... But AFAIK they have already changed that and this text doesn't reflect the recent changes (it's the proposal of the comission AFAIK).