13 ms·

China Mines Silicon Valley for Tech Talent

50 points by raleighm 8y ago

neonate 8y ago
http://archive.is/5jGgO http://archive.is/5jGgO
baybal2 8y ago
The case of Qian Xuesen instantly comes to mind: https://www.pri.org/stories/2017-02-06/us-trained-scientist-was-deported-then-became-father-chinese-rocketry https://www.pri.org/stories/2017-02-06/us-trained-scientist-...
tjpnz 8y ago
As much as I dislike the Chinese government I'm struggling to see an issue in this. Chinese companies are not the only ones recruiting abroad and in this particular case they seem to be only targeting Mandarin speakers. If people are concerned about a brain drain shouldn't they be more concerned with companies in countries that are actively going after English speakers? I'm a software dev in Japan, domestic tech companies here are beginning to do just that.
suhastech 8y ago
Bypass the paywall: http://facebook.com/l.php?u=https://www.wsj.com/articles/china-mines-silicon-valley-for-chinese-tech-talent-1530028118 http://facebook.com/l.php?u=https://www.wsj.com/articles/chi...
- rhapsodic 8y ago
  Open that link in a private tab to insure that it works.
beilabs 8y ago
China has been doing this for a long time now. To get a leg up in the solar industry China provided research grants to the very best in the field as a way to lure them over. Chinese investments in science and tech has skyrocketed in the last two decades. * I was one of those people who moved to China for a few years to work in software over a decade ago.
- ainiriand 8y ago
  How, if ever, you felt the lack of information freedom? Is it so polluted as it looks?
  - donttrack 8y ago
    > How, if ever, you felt the lack of information freedom? Never really thought about it except those times I forgot to pay my VPN > Is it so polluted as it looks? Cleaner than my home town in Scandinavia. Was living in South part of China.
  - beilabs 8y ago
    Had a personal VPN back then so I never had any problem there. Felt very polluted in Shanghai when I first moved there. Lived in Dalian which is one of the cleaner cities and had no issues. Moved to Beijing (before the olympics) and experienced no real issues either. I've lived in much more polluted cities since then.
  - jjcc 8y ago
    Just back to Canada from China a week ago.Commercial VPN providers like StrongVPN, PureVPN are blocked now. But there's no problem using your own VPN or any private company VPN if that's an option. Environment is improving in general. Now local governments would give up economic benefit in exchange for environment protection which is quite different mindset than a decade ago.
- bigmanwalter 8y ago
  Where would you advise someone to search for a software role in China? I figure Shanghai would be the central hub but I am curious if you had more specific advice!
fubwert 8y ago
I worry that measures by the US government aimed at stopping the sale of companies and IP undermine property rights. When the government says “they are stealing our technology,” it implies that the tech, companies, and IP are owned by the state rather than the company and inventor.
- im3w1l 8y ago
  I don't think it's a binary. The state claims some power over over it, and it claims a fraction of the profit. But not all of it. So you don't fully own it, but you kind of own it. Same goes for real estate where they reserve the right to tax it and impose restrictions on what you can do with it.
- fapjacks 8y ago
  Are you implying that there are property rights beyond those permitted by the few individuals who control the organizations whose names are sewn onto the shoulder patches worn by the men in black uniforms with automatic weapons?
l5870uoo9y 8y ago
And simultaneously the US mines Europe for tech and science talent. 15.000 Germans work in Silicon Valley. Imagine the boost they would give Germany if they returned or stayed home. It could result in 3000 highly qualified persons for each of the 5 biggest cities in Germany. It's a well known problem for Europe: > Studies of the best physicists in the world show that the Europeans working in North America are some of the most renowned in their fields. In 2014, an expert panel warned German Chancellor Angela Merkel that the country was losing its best scientists, and a recent report from the Institut Montaigne, a French think tank, argues, “The academics who leave France for the United States are the best, the most prolific and the best integrated on an international scale.” Source: https://www.foreignaffairs.com/articles/europe/2016-01-05/europes-lost-generation https://www.foreignaffairs.com/articles/europe/2016-01-05/eu...
- gaius 8y ago
  It's a well known problem for Europe No, it’s a meta-problem. The real problem is the structural underpaying of STEM workers in Europe. I mean we can go down the path of “sacrifice your own interests for the good of your country” but no one, particularly Germany wants that. So pay is the only lever. And every business manager actually knows this.
  - titanix2 8y ago
    It’s not only the pay by the way. I study and worked a bit abroad and the difference with my country’s labs are noticeable: there is way less battleling with accounting do get things done abroad. In France you need ton of papers to get your money back for professional spending and if you got it at all it comes months after the fact. I did some work for a professor there and it take a year to get the money in my pocket. I also worked for someone in Japan and I had my money two weeks after and in one case on the spot. So it makes a huge difference when working on any project that need a bit of money. Imagine having to wait a year to get a domain paid by the university or having to send a student take a whiteboard marker from another room at the beginning of each class because there are not enough for every room. That’s how shitty it is working in public research in France.
  - 8y ago
EZ-E 8y ago
The title is "China Mines Silicon Valley for Tech Talent" but according to the article, they are recruiting Chinese engineers working in USA. That's an important distinction. From my experience it's true, unless you are ethnic Chinese, most of the Chinese companies won't be interested in hiring you
segmondy 8y ago
X mines Y for talent [ IS EQUAL TO ] X pays much better than Y.
ryandrake 8y ago
A company I used to work for several years ago (technically American, but effectively a Chinese company), offered very tempting and lucrative “work in China for 6 months” incentives. Like US salary and subsidized housing in Shanghai. If I wasn’t married with a kid, I’d have jumped at the chance.

50 points by raleighm 8y ago

http://archive.is/5jGgO http://archive.is/5jGgO

The case of Qian Xuesen instantly comes to mind: https://www.pri.org/stories/2017-02-06/us-trained-scientist-was-deported-then-became-father-chinese-rocketry https://www.pri.org/stories/2017-02-06/us-trained-scientist-...

tjpnz 8y ago

As much as I dislike the Chinese government I'm struggling to see an issue in this. Chinese companies are not the only ones recruiting abroad and in this particular case they seem to be only targeting Mandarin speakers. If people are concerned about a brain drain shouldn't they be more concerned with companies in countries that are actively going after English speakers? I'm a software dev in Japan, domestic tech companies here are beginning to do just that.

suhastech 8y ago

Bypass the paywall: http://facebook.com/l.php?u=https://www.wsj.com/articles/china-mines-silicon-valley-for-chinese-tech-talent-1530028118 http://facebook.com/l.php?u=https://www.wsj.com/articles/chi...

rhapsodic 8y ago
Open that link in a private tab to insure that it works.

beilabs 8y ago

China has been doing this for a long time now. To get a leg up in the solar industry China provided research grants to the very best in the field as a way to lure them over. Chinese investments in science and tech has skyrocketed in the last two decades. * I was one of those people who moved to China for a few years to work in software over a decade ago.

ainiriand 8y ago
How, if ever, you felt the lack of information freedom? Is it so polluted as it looks?
- donttrack 8y ago
  > How, if ever, you felt the lack of information freedom? Never really thought about it except those times I forgot to pay my VPN > Is it so polluted as it looks? Cleaner than my home town in Scandinavia. Was living in South part of China.
- beilabs 8y ago
  Had a personal VPN back then so I never had any problem there. Felt very polluted in Shanghai when I first moved there. Lived in Dalian which is one of the cleaner cities and had no issues. Moved to Beijing (before the olympics) and experienced no real issues either. I've lived in much more polluted cities since then.
- jjcc 8y ago
  Just back to Canada from China a week ago.Commercial VPN providers like StrongVPN, PureVPN are blocked now. But there's no problem using your own VPN or any private company VPN if that's an option. Environment is improving in general. Now local governments would give up economic benefit in exchange for environment protection which is quite different mindset than a decade ago.
bigmanwalter 8y ago
Where would you advise someone to search for a software role in China? I figure Shanghai would be the central hub but I am curious if you had more specific advice!

fubwert 8y ago

I worry that measures by the US government aimed at stopping the sale of companies and IP undermine property rights. When the government says “they are stealing our technology,” it implies that the tech, companies, and IP are owned by the state rather than the company and inventor.

im3w1l 8y ago
I don't think it's a binary. The state claims some power over over it, and it claims a fraction of the profit. But not all of it. So you don't fully own it, but you kind of own it. Same goes for real estate where they reserve the right to tax it and impose restrictions on what you can do with it.
fapjacks 8y ago
Are you implying that there are property rights beyond those permitted by the few individuals who control the organizations whose names are sewn onto the shoulder patches worn by the men in black uniforms with automatic weapons?

l5870uoo9y 8y ago

And simultaneously the US mines Europe for tech and science talent. 15.000 Germans work in Silicon Valley. Imagine the boost they would give Germany if they returned or stayed home. It could result in 3000 highly qualified persons for each of the 5 biggest cities in Germany. It's a well known problem for Europe: > Studies of the best physicists in the world show that the Europeans working in North America are some of the most renowned in their fields. In 2014, an expert panel warned German Chancellor Angela Merkel that the country was losing its best scientists, and a recent report from the Institut Montaigne, a French think tank, argues, “The academics who leave France for the United States are the best, the most prolific and the best integrated on an international scale.” Source: https://www.foreignaffairs.com/articles/europe/2016-01-05/europes-lost-generation https://www.foreignaffairs.com/articles/europe/2016-01-05/eu...

gaius 8y ago
It's a well known problem for Europe No, it’s a meta-problem. The real problem is the structural underpaying of STEM workers in Europe. I mean we can go down the path of “sacrifice your own interests for the good of your country” but no one, particularly Germany wants that. So pay is the only lever. And every business manager actually knows this.
- titanix2 8y ago
  It’s not only the pay by the way. I study and worked a bit abroad and the difference with my country’s labs are noticeable: there is way less battleling with accounting do get things done abroad. In France you need ton of papers to get your money back for professional spending and if you got it at all it comes months after the fact. I did some work for a professor there and it take a year to get the money in my pocket. I also worked for someone in Japan and I had my money two weeks after and in one case on the spot. So it makes a huge difference when working on any project that need a bit of money. Imagine having to wait a year to get a domain paid by the university or having to send a student take a whiteboard marker from another room at the beginning of each class because there are not enough for every room. That’s how shitty it is working in public research in France.
- 8y ago

EZ-E 8y ago

The title is "China Mines Silicon Valley for Tech Talent" but according to the article, they are recruiting Chinese engineers working in USA. That's an important distinction. From my experience it's true, unless you are ethnic Chinese, most of the Chinese companies won't be interested in hiring you

segmondy 8y ago

X mines Y for talent [ IS EQUAL TO ] X pays much better than Y.

ryandrake 8y ago

A company I used to work for several years ago (technically American, but effectively a Chinese company), offered very tempting and lucrative “work in China for 6 months” incentives. Like US salary and subsidized housing in Shanghai. If I wasn’t married with a kid, I’d have jumped at the chance.