9 ms·

Clicking the X means the tracking scripts won’t fire. GDPR forced the site to still be readable (no cookie walls allowed).

ec109685 8y ago
Not true. Certain types of “tracking scripts” are necessary to function, so forcing consent for them is okay.
- watermelon0 8y ago
  What tracking scripts are necessary for any functionality to function (except for tracking/data-mining/selling user behaviour)?
  - arianvanp 8y ago
    Anticheat software for games
    - nextlevelwizard 8y ago
      Please explain how anticheats are tracking people.
      - klez 8y ago
        There was a piece of news lately about a gaming company tracking users and exfiltrating data about their web use to catch pirates. I'm afraid I don't have a link handy.
        freeflight 8y ago
        It was probably this: https://arstechnica.com/gaming/2018/02/flight-sim-devs-say-hidden-password-dump-tool-was-used-to-fight-pirates/ https://arstechnica.com/gaming/2018/02/flight-sim-devs-say-h... Tho back then I missed their spin how they are supposedly only targeting "that one specific cracker", they must have come up with that a bit later because on their Reddit they mostly tried to argue "it's only affecting pirates".
        nextlevelwizard 8y ago
        What does this have to do with anti cheats in general?
    - gcb0 8y ago
      giving every random game root access on my machine is what killed PC gaming for me. I could play and encounter the ocasional cheatet. great f... deal. to this day I still play wii mario kart with some friends and there is still some loser spamming bombs all over the maps because nintendo screwed up (I wouldn't mind games havin root access to a console). we simply couldn't care less. yeah everyone will lose to the loser and switch servers asap, but we still had a good time. while on the PC every crap you install from steam (which already have root access, expose network ports for who knows what, etc) will also install with root access for what? so people can't cheat on solitaire2000 mmo? I gladly would like all that crap software to run securely in a sandbox and find the ocasional cheater that I will lose to and then proceed to ignore. heck a blocking list would be better than every single anti cheat code. I don't even know where I am going with this rant. giving up your entire computer to every crap game is dumb. period.
      - Moter8 8y ago
        But then, there would be no competitive gaming anymore. Or even non-competitive, but still matchmaked gaming. It would just plain suck. Nobody would have fun, not even the cheaters, when they are going to play against eachother.
        fjsolwmv 8y ago
        What about the millions of people who don't care about competitive gaming with strangers?
        Moter8 8y ago
        What about the millions of people that do? The commenter's case was about removing or not allowing it at all, but de facto it's required. I'm pretty sure non-matchmaked games don't have anticheat features -- it would be dumb, as it is an additional cost.
        feanaro 8y ago
        > What about the millions of people that do? The commenter specifically complained about giving root access to games, which is a pretty insane idea, security-wise. If anticheating techniques really require root access, then people that care about competitive gaming should have an option to consider this trade-off and turn the anticheating pieces on if they think this has a better reward/risk ratio than not giving root access to a game. It definitely shouldn't be on by default and unconfigurable, though.
  - kasey_junk 8y ago
    Recaptcha
    - gcb0 8y ago
      everything Google you mean. recaptcha was fine without even having a server side confirmation, until google improved it.
  - ec109685 8y ago
    Counting unique users. Counting the number of ads displayed, etc., etc.
- Grollicus 8y ago
  Forcing consent is never okay in the sense that it doesn't count as consent.
  - nothrabannosir 8y ago
    This is relevant to another discussion going on in society at the moment. And the same thing holds.
    - usrusr 8y ago
      ...and a “pay up or get tracked" model (vs "consent or no business") will go a long way for counting as not forced. But "pay and agree to get tracked, or else your payment will get you nothing", that would be a surefire way to get in trouble. Also unconsentable would be a carte blanche for passing on the data to undisclosed third parties for unrestricted use and redistribution. This is where many existing revenue models will still have to adapt and where a lot of bad actors will dwindle or shift from grey to deep, actionable black.
Tharkun 8y ago
This keeps coming up and people keep saying that's the way it is, but Belgium's biggest newspapers just GDPR-walled their websites. You can't read the paper unless you agree to data gathering, cookie setting and tailored advertising. Maybe what they're doing is against the rules. Maybe their interpration is different. I don't know, but it is what it is.
- OJFord 8y ago
  If I block JS, and the way they've implemented means that the site is readable and usable despite me never seeing or opting in, are they in violation, or is it on me for 'tampering' or whatever?
  - kungtotte 8y ago
    AFAIK, it's on them. They can't track you without explicit consent, and they can't force you to consent to improper tracking in order to use the service. By improper I mean something that's not literally required for the service to function; a newsletter obviously needs to know email addresses to work since that's the core operation of the service.
    - briandear 8y ago
      Isn’t revenue literally required for a service to function? Who pays for the server costs?
      - speakeron 8y ago
        Nothing stops a site showing ads; they just have to think of creative ways to target them. It's a new opportunity, as all changes of environments are.
      - virgilp 8y ago
        They are free to put up paywalls. GDPR legislates that personal information can't be used as currency - not that you can't ask for payment.

ec109685 8y ago

Not true. Certain types of “tracking scripts” are necessary to function, so forcing consent for them is okay.

watermelon0 8y ago
What tracking scripts are necessary for any functionality to function (except for tracking/data-mining/selling user behaviour)?
- arianvanp 8y ago
  Anticheat software for games
  - nextlevelwizard 8y ago
    Please explain how anticheats are tracking people.
    - klez 8y ago
      There was a piece of news lately about a gaming company tracking users and exfiltrating data about their web use to catch pirates. I'm afraid I don't have a link handy.
      - freeflight 8y ago
        It was probably this: https://arstechnica.com/gaming/2018/02/flight-sim-devs-say-hidden-password-dump-tool-was-used-to-fight-pirates/ https://arstechnica.com/gaming/2018/02/flight-sim-devs-say-h... Tho back then I missed their spin how they are supposedly only targeting "that one specific cracker", they must have come up with that a bit later because on their Reddit they mostly tried to argue "it's only affecting pirates".
      - nextlevelwizard 8y ago
        What does this have to do with anti cheats in general?
  - gcb0 8y ago
    giving every random game root access on my machine is what killed PC gaming for me. I could play and encounter the ocasional cheatet. great f... deal. to this day I still play wii mario kart with some friends and there is still some loser spamming bombs all over the maps because nintendo screwed up (I wouldn't mind games havin root access to a console). we simply couldn't care less. yeah everyone will lose to the loser and switch servers asap, but we still had a good time. while on the PC every crap you install from steam (which already have root access, expose network ports for who knows what, etc) will also install with root access for what? so people can't cheat on solitaire2000 mmo? I gladly would like all that crap software to run securely in a sandbox and find the ocasional cheater that I will lose to and then proceed to ignore. heck a blocking list would be better than every single anti cheat code. I don't even know where I am going with this rant. giving up your entire computer to every crap game is dumb. period.
    - Moter8 8y ago
      But then, there would be no competitive gaming anymore. Or even non-competitive, but still matchmaked gaming. It would just plain suck. Nobody would have fun, not even the cheaters, when they are going to play against eachother.
      - fjsolwmv 8y ago
        What about the millions of people who don't care about competitive gaming with strangers?
        Moter8 8y ago
        What about the millions of people that do? The commenter's case was about removing or not allowing it at all, but de facto it's required. I'm pretty sure non-matchmaked games don't have anticheat features -- it would be dumb, as it is an additional cost.
        feanaro 8y ago
        > What about the millions of people that do? The commenter specifically complained about giving root access to games, which is a pretty insane idea, security-wise. If anticheating techniques really require root access, then people that care about competitive gaming should have an option to consider this trade-off and turn the anticheating pieces on if they think this has a better reward/risk ratio than not giving root access to a game. It definitely shouldn't be on by default and unconfigurable, though.
- kasey_junk 8y ago
  Recaptcha
  - gcb0 8y ago
    everything Google you mean. recaptcha was fine without even having a server side confirmation, until google improved it.
- ec109685 8y ago
  Counting unique users. Counting the number of ads displayed, etc., etc.
Grollicus 8y ago
Forcing consent is never okay in the sense that it doesn't count as consent.
- nothrabannosir 8y ago
  This is relevant to another discussion going on in society at the moment. And the same thing holds.
  - usrusr 8y ago
    ...and a “pay up or get tracked" model (vs "consent or no business") will go a long way for counting as not forced. But "pay and agree to get tracked, or else your payment will get you nothing", that would be a surefire way to get in trouble. Also unconsentable would be a carte blanche for passing on the data to undisclosed third parties for unrestricted use and redistribution. This is where many existing revenue models will still have to adapt and where a lot of bad actors will dwindle or shift from grey to deep, actionable black.

Tharkun 8y ago

This keeps coming up and people keep saying that's the way it is, but Belgium's biggest newspapers just GDPR-walled their websites. You can't read the paper unless you agree to data gathering, cookie setting and tailored advertising. Maybe what they're doing is against the rules. Maybe their interpration is different. I don't know, but it is what it is.

OJFord 8y ago
If I block JS, and the way they've implemented means that the site is readable and usable despite me never seeing or opting in, are they in violation, or is it on me for 'tampering' or whatever?
- kungtotte 8y ago
  AFAIK, it's on them. They can't track you without explicit consent, and they can't force you to consent to improper tracking in order to use the service. By improper I mean something that's not literally required for the service to function; a newsletter obviously needs to know email addresses to work since that's the core operation of the service.
  - briandear 8y ago
    Isn’t revenue literally required for a service to function? Who pays for the server costs?
    - speakeron 8y ago
      Nothing stops a site showing ads; they just have to think of creative ways to target them. It's a new opportunity, as all changes of environments are.
    - virgilp 8y ago
      They are free to put up paywalls. GDPR legislates that personal information can't be used as currency - not that you can't ask for payment.