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California Now World's 5th Largest Economy, Surpassing UK
- lightedman 8y agoYou mean once again. It has been #5 before.
- Circumnavigate 8y ago5th largest in the world and yet where is all of the money going? California is in a huge deficit.
- jrobn 8y agoThe US government doesn’t care about deficits, so it would seem.
- DubiousPusher 8y agoThis is not the US government's debt. It is debt belonging to the State of California. And California certainly does care about deficits. States do not have the same leeway handling their indebtedness that the federal government does.
- davidw 8y agoTo landlords, mostly. If you look at the numbers, the deficit has mostly shrunk after some truly huge ones.
- genefriend 8y agoCalifornia budget deficit: $1.6 billion California GDP: $2.7 trillion I think California will be fine.
- carbocation 8y ago"Annual income twenty pounds, annual expenditure nineteen nineteen and six, result happiness. Annual income twenty pounds, annual expenditure twenty pounds ought and six, result misery." (Though, in the end, I agree with you.)
- nradov 8y agoThere's really no sensible comparison between an individual on a fixed income versus a sovereign with taxing authority.
- jlmorton 8y agoWhere do you come up with a $1.6 billion deficit? There is currently a $6.1 billion surplus, which actually understates the strength of the budget, given debt deleveraging.
- DrScump 8y agohttp://www.latimes.com/politics/la-pol-sac-jerry-brown-budget-trump-risks-20170110-story.html http://www.latimes.com/politics/la-pol-sac-jerry-brown-budge...
- r00fus 8y agoInteresting - this article seems to say the opposite: https://www.wsj.com/articles/jerry-browns-legacy-a-6-1-billion-budget-surplus-in-california-1515624022 https://www.wsj.com/articles/jerry-browns-legacy-a-6-1-billi...
- ddoolin 8y agoCalifornia has a high amount of debt, particularly per household, when compared to (some) other U.S. states. However, the last few years under governor Brown have led to a budget surplus for those years, which is commonly attributed to the tax hikes of Proposition 30, among better spending decisions. We're looking at a pretty substantial surplus for this year's budget, which will be finalized in June, and lawmakers have different ideas about what to do with it. Governor Brown wants to put it in the rainy day fund, conservatives largely want to enact tax relief for some Californians, and the state's liberal politicians largely want to spend it on other things. Personally, I'd like if California used at least the bulk of it to pay down some of our unfunded liabilities with regards to pension programs, of which we still have about $275 billion (of over $400 billion in total debt). There are plans to take care of these over the next 3 decades, but settling it a bit earlier never hurt.
- DrScump 8y agothe last few years under governor Brown have led to a budget surplus for those years no, it wasn't a surplus. 2017 showed a $1.6 Billion deficit[0]. [0] http://www.latimes.com/politics/la-pol-sac-jerry-brown-budget-trump-risks-20170110-story.html http://www.latimes.com/politics/la-pol-sac-jerry-brown-budge...
- deleted 8y ago[deleted]
- ddoolin 8y agoYou're right -- due to some (must-have-been-pretty-awful) miscalculations about the cost of a certain program that pushed it into deficit territory. My mistake! I was also considering 2017 as this year since a budget spans two years. For completeness, CA roughly carried a deficit from '02-'03 to '12-'13, and then roughly a surplus from '13-'14 onwards, except for 2017.
- nradov 8y agoExactly. Fund the existing pension liabilities now while money is relatively cheap. Then transition all state employees to defined contribution retirement plans going forward so that it will be closer become impossible to ever have underfunded pension plans in the future.
- jedberg 8y agoYour data is a bit out of date. California has a surplus now. There is an underfunded pension but the payments aren't due for many years in the future.
- DrScump 8y agoCalifornia has a surplus now. What budget year are you talking about, where an actual surplus was evident when the budget year closed? Projections are just projections and can be seriously wrong. A projected $2.8 billion surplus[0] quickly changed to being a $1.6 billion deficit[1]. [0] https://www.scpr.org/news/2016/11/17/66216/california-analyst-projects-2-8-billion-budget-sur/ https://www.scpr.org/news/2016/11/17/66216/california-analys... [1] http://www.latimes.com/politics/la-pol-sac-jerry-brown-budget-trump-risks-20170110-story.html http://www.latimes.com/politics/la-pol-sac-jerry-brown-budge...
- dmode 8y agoYour links are from Jan 2017. Those were projections. 2017-2018 was $6bn budget surplus on top a $8bn rainy day fund. Here's the WSJ link from Jan 2018 https://www.wsj.com/articles/jerry-browns-legacy-a-6-1-billion-budget-surplus-in-california-1515624022 https://www.wsj.com/articles/jerry-browns-legacy-a-6-1-billi...
- api 8y agoUK has a huge deficit too. Most highly developed countries do.
- grandmczeb 8y agoCountries have the power to print money. California does not.
- icebraining 8y agoEuro countries don't either.
- gpderetta 8y agoUK is not in the eurozone
- icebraining 8y agoI know, but GP also mentioned "most highly developed countries", and parent replied in the plural.
- jlmorton 8y agoCalifornia currently has a rainy day fund of $8 billion and a current budget surplus of $6.1 billion. https://www.wsj.com/articles/jerry-browns-legacy-a-6-1-billion-budget-surplus-in-california-1515624022 https://www.wsj.com/articles/jerry-browns-legacy-a-6-1-billi...
- craftyguy 8y agoNot even close to as bad as the world's largest economy and their deficit.
- beefman 8y agoNo reason to use a paywalled version of this AP story https://www.apnews.com/dfe5adff6d3640249e63f5637dfeb995 https://www.apnews.com/dfe5adff6d3640249e63f5637dfeb995
- ProfessorLayton 8y agoThe question is what is CA going to do when its municipalities indirectly cap GDP via their terrible housing policies. The entire state is under a slow boil by NIMBYism that will eventually choke its otherwise impressive economy.
- deanmoriarty 8y agotypos: it's -> its
- nradov 8y agoI'm not a NIMBY myself, but most of them would claim that preserving quality of life for existing residents is more important than maximizing GDP or making space for newcomers. If you want to improve housing policies then you'll have to find a way to counteract those objections.
- rak00n 8y agoHow about existing residents who rent in CA cities? Your argument doesn't stand.
- nradov 8y agoVery few of the hard-core NIMBYs are renters. My argument still stands.
- twiceaday 8y agoHomeowners and renters are affected by these policies differently, often in opposite ways. That's the point. Obviously these NIMBYs are homeowners because their position grossly favors existing homeowners. Mortgage payments are not affected by a constant influx of new people but rent prices are. Stalling is a win for one side only. Anybody can wish for "preserving quality of life." But while they are wishing homeowners are reaping all of the benefits and renters are getting screwed.
- caio1982 8y agoHow's wealth and welfare distribution around the state though?
- O1111OOO 8y agoThis was the same question I had. According to the recent Federal Data, California had a GDP $2.747 trillion[0]. In 2016, Los Angeles' GDP was a little over 1 trillion by itself[1]. A quick search revealed this too[2] (because I was curious about the impact "Hollywood" has on the economy): > According to a recent report by the Los Angeles County Economic Development Corporation, motion picture and sound recording jobs accounted for just 2.4 percent of the private sector labor force in the city of L.A. in 2015. (Note: I couldn't quickly find total Hollywood revenue, plus there's the "creative accounting" issue[3] too) It's certainly a rabbit hole of data analysis. [0] http://www.businessinsider.com/california-economy-ranks-5th-in-the-world-beating-the-uk-2018-5 http://www.businessinsider.com/california-economy-ranks-5th-... [1] https://www.statista.com/statistics/183822/gdp-of-the-los-angeles-metro-area/ https://www.statista.com/statistics/183822/gdp-of-the-los-an... [2] http://www.laweekly.com/news/how-much-does-hollywood-contribute-to-las-economy-not-as-much-as-you-think-8798404 http://www.laweekly.com/news/how-much-does-hollywood-contrib... [3] https://duckduckgo.com/?q=hollywood+creative+accounting&ia=web https://duckduckgo.com/?q=hollywood+creative+accounting&ia=w...
- nerfhammer 8y agoIt has more poverty than every other less developed state if you subtract living costs: http://www.politifact.com/california/statements/2017/jan/20/chad-mayes/true-california-has-nations-highest-poverty-rate-w/ http://www.politifact.com/california/statements/2017/jan/20/...
- dmode 8y agoThis is truly incredible and speaks to the amazing spirit of people and government of California. These numbers become even more incredible when you consider that UK has 66 million people. And CA is also a net donor state when it comes to Federal taxes. If you add that spending back, the economy would be even bigger. Most articles here and in the internet speak to a dislike of California. But for me, everyday I feel lucky to live here.