5 ms·

The article "Rameses II and the tobacco beetle" (PC Buckland, E Panagiotakopulu Antiquity, 2001) has a more probable take. In the century-plus these mummies we

by dzdt 9y ago

The article "Rameses II and the tobacco beetle" (PC Buckland, E Panagiotakopulu Antiquity, 2001) has a more probable take. In the century-plus these mummies were in museums, they were subjected to various insecticide treatments. Among these was almost surely nicotine applied as an insecticide. Cocaine may have been introduced similarly or accidentally in this timespan. 19th century and early 20th century museums did not document anything and had by modern standards extremely poor conservation approaches. [1] http://citeseerx.ist.psu.edu/viewdoc/download?doi=10.1.1.490.846&rep=rep1&type=pdf http://citeseerx.ist.psu.edu/viewdoc/download?doi=10.1.1.490...

stinos 9y ago
Accprding to other articles and some comments here, nictoine could only be in hair if it was ingested and cannot get there by external application, if I understand it correctly. That, plus there being 9 different mummies from different museums, at least does raise some questions about the insecticide treatment theory.
- jcranmer 9y ago
  I don't know the historical context of those mummies, but if they correspond to a wide range of historical time periods, it increases the likelihood that the explanation is contamination. A wider time period would imply that the contact would have been more sustained, which makes it harder to explain why there's no other evidence of contact.
  - api 9y ago
    Where did mesoamerican people get the idea for pyramids? It's possible that it is just a logical easy to build structure, but I've always wondered. There are other similarities too. I seem to recall an attempt to cross the Atlantic with modern replicas of Egyptian style vessels but I don't recall if it was successful.
    - johnnyOnTheSpot 9y ago
      The new world "pyramids" were nothing like those of Egypt. Stepped temples is a more accurate term.
    - jcranmer 9y ago
      One mistake people commonly make is that they assume independent discovery is difficult. When you look at the seminal inventions of prehistory, independent rediscovery is the norm, not the exception: agriculture was developed no fewer than 9 times, writing about 3-5 times, urban civilization at least 6. Pyramidal structures themselves are evident in most ancient urban civilizations without much evidence of direct transmission to or from Egypt. It's not sufficient to just say "this looks similar." You have to explain how the designs were transmitted, what else was or wasn't transmitted, why evidence is or isn't present in supporting records such as contemporary accounts. There is very strong presumption against pre-Columbian trans-oceanic contact (based in part of our knowledge of ancient shipbuilding techniques and maritime practices), so you need a very high burden of proof here. Vikings and Polynesians are exceptions to the rule here because we know they were both able to make the journey, there's corroborating evidence that's multifaceted, there's explanations of why the contact was ultimately transient in nature, etc.
- DoctorOetker 9y ago
  Nicotine is poisonous when ingested, so that perheaps explains why the mummies are dead.

by dzdt 9y ago

stinos 9y ago

Accprding to other articles and some comments here, nictoine could only be in hair if it was ingested and cannot get there by external application, if I understand it correctly. That, plus there being 9 different mummies from different museums, at least does raise some questions about the insecticide treatment theory.

jcranmer 9y ago
I don't know the historical context of those mummies, but if they correspond to a wide range of historical time periods, it increases the likelihood that the explanation is contamination. A wider time period would imply that the contact would have been more sustained, which makes it harder to explain why there's no other evidence of contact.
- api 9y ago
  Where did mesoamerican people get the idea for pyramids? It's possible that it is just a logical easy to build structure, but I've always wondered. There are other similarities too. I seem to recall an attempt to cross the Atlantic with modern replicas of Egyptian style vessels but I don't recall if it was successful.
  - johnnyOnTheSpot 9y ago
    The new world "pyramids" were nothing like those of Egypt. Stepped temples is a more accurate term.
  - jcranmer 9y ago
    One mistake people commonly make is that they assume independent discovery is difficult. When you look at the seminal inventions of prehistory, independent rediscovery is the norm, not the exception: agriculture was developed no fewer than 9 times, writing about 3-5 times, urban civilization at least 6. Pyramidal structures themselves are evident in most ancient urban civilizations without much evidence of direct transmission to or from Egypt. It's not sufficient to just say "this looks similar." You have to explain how the designs were transmitted, what else was or wasn't transmitted, why evidence is or isn't present in supporting records such as contemporary accounts. There is very strong presumption against pre-Columbian trans-oceanic contact (based in part of our knowledge of ancient shipbuilding techniques and maritime practices), so you need a very high burden of proof here. Vikings and Polynesians are exceptions to the rule here because we know they were both able to make the journey, there's corroborating evidence that's multifaceted, there's explanations of why the contact was ultimately transient in nature, etc.
DoctorOetker 9y ago
Nicotine is poisonous when ingested, so that perheaps explains why the mummies are dead.