13 ms·

Apple Plans Giant High-End iPhone, Lower-Priced Model

77 points by uptown 9y ago

taylodl 9y ago
"Apple has tried selling cheaper phones in the past with poor results." I love the iPhone SE. They can keep gradually improving that model and I'm good.
- hgontijo 9y ago
  I have an iPhone 6/64GB and it has been running really slow. Last thing I tried is to disable all location services (besides for specific maps apps) and helped a little bit. Apple diagnosed that its battery still good. Question, how is your iPhone SE performance?
  - dep_b 9y ago
    The iPhone SE I bought recently is really fast. Waited a while to update to the latest iOS version as it didn't look that good judging by the betas I was using on my iPad before it's official release. But it's running great after holding off for two months, zero problems. GeekBench is like one or two dollar in the AppStore. If the score has a significant difference with other iPhone 6's probably you're having a battery problem. Also factory resetting the phone can help. Try to figure out if there are any apps using a lot of battery in your battery overview. Some apps consume more in terms of background activity than others.
  - hnrodey 9y ago
    I'd still replace the battery regardless of what they tell you. Apple once told me I had a good battery even though my phone would randomly shut off and attaching to a charger was the only solution to get the phone to turn on. Thankfully I had AppleCare and pushed for them to replace the phone.
    - eisa01 9y ago
      Yup, download GeekBench and do a test My iPhone 7 was had a crippled batter after one year - it performed like an iPhone 6..
    - specialist 9y ago
      coconutBattery now also reports the battery health of connected iOS devices. I wish this functionality was built-in. http://www.coconut-flavour.com/coconutbattery/ http://www.coconut-flavour.com/coconutbattery/
  - aero142 9y ago
    I had to upgrade from an iPhone 6 that I liked just fine, because the OS keeps getting slower and slower. I suspect it relates back to the 3d shimmer effects and adding depth to everything, and transition animations. I suspect Ives needs to be knocked down a peg so that the phone stops getting worse. Apple is still selling the 6s so they test that one a bit more, and it it's completely dead, but it's still pretty laggy compared to how it was when it first shipped.
    - twtw 9y ago
      People tend to disregard statements like this, but they are absolutely 100% true. I'm still using my iPhone 5S on iOS 8, and I am very happy with its performance. I've never had any issues with sluggishness, lag, etc.
      - vlan0 9y ago
        >on iOS 8 That's the ticket. The further the OS drifts the the original hardware, the more painful the experience.
  - oldcynic 9y ago
    Switched to iPhone SE (after a few years on Android) 12 months ago. I have yet to encounter any situation where I've been annoyed with the phone's performance. Best, and snappiest, smart phone I've ever owned. Annoyance has been reserved for individual apps, and the change of Control Centre in iOS 11.
    - epmaybe 9y ago
      Only thing I'm bothered by is the speed of the fingerprint scanner. It's the same scanner from the 5s, so 1st gen touch ID. Makes for a less than ideal wait time for what is a generally snappy phone. Battery life is fantastic as well. I paired mine up with a thin silicone case and Qi receiver for wireless charging.
  - Brendinooo 9y ago
    I believe the SE is running on 6S internals, so it should be improved over the 6.
  - limeblack 9y ago
    Back when Apple allowed downgrading, I would downgrade others phones to the original OEM version and the speed was quite good. Now a days I upgrade one revision and nothing more. The only apps I really need are Safari and mail which work fine.
  - dade_ 9y ago
    I loved the performance and battery life of the phone, but I finally gave up on the form factor. Apple and developers now support the screen size as an afterthought and I'd become increasingly frustrated by new version of apps that squish their 5.5" UI into 4, so I finally had it and switched to a compact Android device. Apple could have avoided this by maintaining the size of the phone and reducing bezels, but it seems clear that they consider smaller phones a niche market that isn't interesting.
  - artimaeis 9y ago
    I had some issues with a relatively slow iPhone 6 recently - it didn't register as battery throttling. So I made an iTunes backup, factory reset the device, and restored from backup. That got it back to about the speed I'd expect it to be. I still suspect that I'll take it in for a battery swap before the end of the year - but it might be worth trying if it's the slowness is a hindrance for you.
    - specialist 9y ago
      I did this as well for an iPhone 6 and 6s. Worked.
  - protomyth 9y ago
    The iPhone 6 has an A8 where the iPhone SE has an A9. My iPhone 6 also says the battery is good and its a year old (2017-02-21) since I had to pay for the replacement since the old battery swelled and killed the touch screen ($159.62), but it is really slowing down in the last 2 months and getting hot after about 3 minutes of use.
  - kokey 9y ago
    I replaced my iPhone 6 with an iPhone SE a few weeks ago. It was like having an old friend back, especially since I had an iPhone 4 for 4 years before the iPhone 6. It was nice to have a phone I can operate with one hand again, it felt very familiar, but at the same time it also worked better. Compared to the iPhone 6 it's is certainly faster, has a better battery life and also supports hey siri even when not plugged into the charger.
  - sk1pper 9y ago
    I bought the SE when it came out almost two years ago and still love it. No performance issues at all. Only thing I’ve noticed is that some websites clearly don’t really expect phones’ screens to be this small any more, though.
- mtgx 9y ago
  It has had poor success because they've been trying to sell a $400 device with the specs of a $150 device.
  - mhb 9y ago
    New iPhone SE is $160 new or $110 refurbished from Consumer Cellular. So ???
    - jdietrich 9y ago
      Apple's price is $349 for the 32gb model and $449 for the 128gb model. The US cellular market might obfuscate the actual price of hardware through subsidies and bundling, but that's not the case in most international markets. The iPhone SE doesn't look like a particularly good deal compared to a similarly-priced handset from Xiaomi or Huawei - $349 is practically flagship territory these days. https://www.apple.com/shop/buy-iphone/iphone-se#00,20,30 https://www.apple.com/shop/buy-iphone/iphone-se#00,20,30
      - goerz 9y ago
        Considering that Xiaomi or Huawei don't run iOS, it seems like a good deal to me ;-)
  - kec 9y ago
    Isn't it the other way around? The SE was released concurrently with the 6S and uses the same CPU even though it sold at a much lower price point.
- gnicholas 9y ago
  It was weird that in mentioning the “cheaper phones” that Apple has sold, they only mention the 5c, not the SE. The SE has sold surprisingly well, and it’s still available now. Why just dredge up the 5c and ignore the current model?
- starsinspace 9y ago
  Yes, but please Apple, improvements only! Do not touch the headphone jack or the fingerprint reader!
  - criddell 9y ago
    Is the SE an iPhone 6 or 7? I'm going to get a new phone in a week or so and didn't even know about the SE.
    - tbirrell 9y ago
      Its a 6 in a 5's body. It was released 5-6 months before the 7 irrc.
      - saagarjha 9y ago
        It's a 6s, actually, without the larger screen, faster Touch ID, 3D Touch, and barometer.
        earenndil 9y ago
        It doesn't have 3d touch.
        saagarjha 9y ago
        Yeah, that's what I said. It's missing 3D Touch along with all those other things.
    - starsinspace 9y ago
      It is much of the internal hardware of an iPhone 6S (A9 processor, 12MP rear camera) in the case of an iPhone 5.
      - criddell 9y ago
        Well that's a bummer. I'd like a phone that's going to be updated for at least 2 and hopefully 3 years. If it's already from the 6S generation I'm not too confident in it getting patched for the next 3 years.
- Anechoic 9y ago
  I'll take one iPhone X in an iPhone SE-sized body please. Preferably with the headphone jack. The biggest turnoffs of the new iPhones are the increased sizes. I know people like the bigger phones, but I can't be the only one who prefers the smaller size. In my case, it's because I run/cycle with my phone (I'm not getting the Apple Watch so don't even suggest it) and the bulk of the 6/7/8/X series is way too much for me.
  - pcmaffey 9y ago
    Yup, I still have a 5s for this very reason. I dread having to "upgrade" to something bigger... Would probably use a Zoolander phone if existed.
    - CharlesW 9y ago
      > Would probably use a Zoolander phone if existed. This effectively exists in the form of the Apple Watch Series 3 LTE, although it's smaller than Zoolander's phone (which had to be flipped open to use). I've had it for a few weeks and can still hardly believe I can make and receive phone calls on the thing.
      - dingaling 9y ago
        I am baffled as to your amazement given that LTE-enabled smartwatches have been coming out of Chinese manufacturers such as No.1 for several years.
  - shinratdr 9y ago
    > In my case, it's because I run/cycle with my phone (I'm not getting the Apple Watch so don't even suggest it) and the bulk of the 6/7/8/X series is way too much for me. ...ok? I mean people would suggest it because it's the solution to your problem. It doesn't have to be the Apple Watch, but some sort of fitness band seems to be a much better solution than hoping against logic that phones will suddenly become tiny again.
    - 9y ago
- bunderbunder 9y ago
  I'm in a similar boat. I'm unlikely to go for a bigger phone, and, seeing as the traffic lights in my city interfere with Bluetooh, I'm simply not going to go for a phone with no headphone jack. But all signs indicate that it's just not happening. The thing that pretty well convinced me that the SE will be the last small iPhone is the new control center. Cramming so many things in there that key touch targets are too small to quickly hit with a thumb on an SE-sized screen seemed like a pretty clear, if tacit, statement of intent.
- MBCook 9y ago
  They’re probably referring to the 5c which clearly didn’t do well at all. The SE is the cheap phone now but there are a lot of people (I’m guessing like you) who really like the form factor and don’t want a 6/7/8 sized phone let alone an X or a Plus.
  - m1sta_ 9y ago
    I’m one of those people. I want smaller than a 6/7/8 and I want Spotify on an Apple Watch. I don’t care the price.
  - goerz 9y ago
    Yes! I can't wait for an update to the SE (hopefully using the exact same form factor, just updated internals)
    - zelos 9y ago
      An updated screen would be the biggest improvement for me: the contrast ratio and black levels are much worse on the SE than other iPhones.
oflannabhra 9y ago
> Despite months of breathless hype, the iPhone X hasn’t sold as well as expected since its debut last year. Apple sold 77.3 million iPhones in the final quarter of 2017, below analysts’ projections of 80.2 million units. Some consumers were turned off by the iPhone X’s $1,000 price despite liking the design even as they wanted something more cutting-edge than the cheaper iPhone 8. With its next lineup, Apple is seeking to rekindle sales by offering a model for everyone. This seems like color commentary that isn't supported by their sources, or data. I'm not sure how they are supporting this statement. Apple's recent quarterly earnings [0] showed iPhone sales as (essentially) stable, year over year. ASP increased to $800 dollars (!) which would point to the iPhone X doing relatively well, despite not being available for the entire quarter. Even beyond that, there is no way for Apple to begin product development at a point after they saw the Q4 results. There is far to much lead-time required for them to be able to wait until now to do so. My guess is that 1) the rumors of these 2 new models are true, 2) Apple committed to this product roadmap a long time ago, and 3) Bloomberg is adding it's own spin to make the leaks more salacious. [0] - https://sixcolors.com/post/2018/02/apple-reports-its-holiday-2017-earnings-today/ https://sixcolors.com/post/2018/02/apple-reports-its-holiday...
- akvadrako 9y ago
  There is a decent amount of evidence that Apple's sales from the iPhone X (specifically) are less than expected, including 2-for-1 deals and Samsung cutting production of OLEDs. At the same time the margins on the X are better than ever. I agree it's unnecessary commentary, but based in fact without too much speculation.
  - IBM 9y ago
    BOGO deals always come out of the carrier's pocket. The iPhone is the best customer acquisition tool so it all works out for the carrier in the end. Apple is certainly not going to cut prices to enable that.
  - oflannabhra 9y ago
    I haven't seen any iPhone X 2-for-1 deals, in the US at least. Samsung's OLED production glut can't be pinned solely on Apple [0]. Most of the "Apple slashes iPhone X production forecast" rumors seem to be... unreliable at best [1] [2]. [0] - http://www.patentlyapple.com/patently-apple/2018/02/apples-iphone-x-is-the-instant-scapegoat-for-samsungs-failure-to-win-oled-orders-from-chinese-vendors.html http://www.patentlyapple.com/patently-apple/2018/02/apples-i... [1] - https://www.ped30.com/2018/02/20/nikkei-slashes-apple/ https://www.ped30.com/2018/02/20/nikkei-slashes-apple/ [2] - https://twitter.com/rjonesy/status/958421107245232128 https://twitter.com/rjonesy/status/958421107245232128
thomasedwards 9y ago
> Despite months of breathless hype, the iPhone X hasn’t sold as well as expected since its debut last year. Apple sold 77.3 million iPhones in the final quarter of 2017, below analysts’ projections of 80.2 million units. Considering the iPhone was going to be a flop by those same analysts, I’d say selling 77.3 million of them is pretty good. Who actually writes this rubbish? They missed out on 3 million phones, based on a number you made up? It was out of stock for weeks and is only now really available.
- astrodust 9y ago
  Analysts always make these wildly stupid predictions and then throw a fit when Apple magically doesn't meet them. It's absurd. Meanwhile other companies like Uber lose "only" a billion dollars and the analysts are losing their minds.
  - dep_b 9y ago
    It's kind of weird that gaining marketshare in a shrinking market while increasing revenue per sold phone would be a bad thing just because some analist thought it would even sell better.
    - astrodust 9y ago
      Apple has always had a strange relationship with analysts, but post Jobs they started to generate increasingly insane projections. Part of the blame here is on Apple, they run an unusually secretive operation, where other companies would give a lot more in the way of guidance to help keep expectations more realistic.
      - allwein 9y ago
        They don't provide guidance on product mix, but they do provide guidance on expected revenue and margin. For Q1 2018 they projected between $84-$87 billion and came in at $88.3 billion. Apple has been historically accurate in nailing their projections, yet when analysts calculate the expected product mix, they either forget the mix and assume Apple is going to sell $80 billion in only iPhones, or they include the mix, which must mean they expect Apple to sell $120 billion worth of stuff.
40acres 9y ago
I keep wondering when Apple will bite the bullet and make a phone for the emerging market. The smartphone market is getting more and more mature and if Apple want's to keep sales up I think segmentation will be key. I would not be surprised if there is a philosophical battle going on in Apple right now about whether or not to make a phone for India & Africa, but the market is there.
- cycrutchfield 9y ago
  Why would they bother making a device with presumably low margins? That doesn’t seem like their MO.
  - 40acres 9y ago
    Apple is squeezing as much as they can get out of their existing user base. Look at home pod, the watch, and apple music -- all great services that basically need an iPhone to work. I could see them adding more services to compliment the iPhone but I'm not sure how much more they can get from their existing users. Android dominates by market share and eventually I can see Apple trying to shorten the gap.. I guess it really depends on how many more services they can provide around the iPhone.
    - seanmcdirmid 9y ago
      Apple has around 80% of the profits in the smart phone industry already. iPhone doesn't drive service monetization, rather services drive iPhone monetization, so unlike Google, Apple can't win with cheaper phones.
- sf_rob 9y ago
  The budget market is generally a race to the bottom, and I don't see Apple interested in such a market. I know the counter will be that Apple can combine quality with fairly low price, but I think that's quite a high risk proposition.
  - redditmigrant 9y ago
betoharres 9y ago
Apple just lost time with iPhone X, they don't know what they're doing, they're loosing time tasting the market and giving away their path to competition. Clearly someone with more vision is making the difference here.
jeffbax 9y ago
Hopefully lower-priced isn't just cheaper parts alone, but also the option for a smaller phone. Edge-to-edge, I want a phone the size of a 6/7 screen. Smaller form factor without losing usable area is my dream iPhone, not something larger or even the X size.
rjplatte 9y ago
As long as they don't kill the SE, this is fine. I like having a truly functional decently new iPhone.
Kattywumpus 9y ago
I do not want FaceID, and will resist it as long as possible. I do not want to normalize the idea that security should depend on a camera taking images of my face and environment. I am not alone in this, and believe this is one reason the iPhone X is selling poorly.
- DonaldPShimoda 9y ago
  FaceID doesn't "take images of your face and environment" though. It uses a dot projection (the pattern is unique to each phone) to produce a 3D approximation of your face's structure, and collapses this into some sort of mathematical representation of your face. This information is stored in a separate chip on the phone which the OS does not have access to (and it never leaves your phone; Apple isn't using your face for processing in the cloud or anything). By their statistics, FaceID is an order of magnitude less likely to result in false positives than TouchID. And aside from this, for people who are truly concerned about security, Apple recommends not using either FaceID or TouchID anyway (as both can be compelled by court order in the US).
  - Kattywumpus 9y ago
    > FaceID doesn't "take images of your face and environment" though. From "How Apple's New FaceID Works" at Gizmodo: "Face ID starts with an image of your face, but builds on top of it with the TrueDepth’s dot projector, which will invisibly project over 30,000 dots onto your face each time you look at your phone, creating and building on its map of your features. "'We use the image and the dot pattern to push through neural networks to create a mathematical model of your face,' Apple’s Phil Schiller explained." - https://gizmodo.com/how-apples-new-face-id-works-1803813400 https://gizmodo.com/how-apples-new-face-id-works-1803813400 Your objection to my objection might be that FaceID doesn't store the images it takes, but uses them to construct a facial map that it stores instead. But even if that were any better, that's not true, either. From Apple's iOS Security Guide: "Once it confirms the presence of an attentive face, the TrueDepth camera projects and reads over 30,000 infrared dots to form a depth map of the face, along with a 2D infrared image. This data is used to create a sequence of 2D images and depth maps, which are digitally signed and sent to the Secure Enclave." - https://www.apple.com/business/docs/iOS_Security_Guide.pdf https://www.apple.com/business/docs/iOS_Security_Guide.pdf The public nature of your face inherently makes access to your phone less secure than the private nature of your fingerprints or even a PIN. But it's not the security of the phone, or the photos or face map stored on it that trouble me. It's the camera-based security paradigm I reject. It reduces resistance to a surveillance society, and increases the incentives for other businesses to use face-identifying software, which destroys privacy in the real world. I don't want people to get used to surrendering their privacy to access their data, and I won't buy a phone that sends a market signal telling the corporate world that I accept these kind of privacy-destroying technologies. Anyway, thanks for the thoughtful response.
egypturnash 9y ago
I keep on thinking about ditching my iPhone for a Mini with cellular capability. I never make phone calls any more; mostly it gets used for Mastodon, IM, email, and running the Kindle app. Maybe I'll try that when the next upgrade happens. If it does; MacRumors says the main rumor is of it being discontinued soon...
s2g 9y ago
Hmm, maybe I should buy a couple spare 7 or 8. I’m not buying a phone without touchid.
Bokanovsky 9y ago
Do you know what I really want from an iPhone? A more stable iOS. They've got a lot of bugs creeping in that seem like regressions. Little cracks appearing around the corners. Stuff that shouldn't really be bugs as they should have tests in place for this. I don't want fancy talking animated emoji. Or balloons flying around when I send an iMessage. I just want something solid. One of the most annoying issues I have is with basic SMS from a non-iPhone user. The notification doesn't give me the sender's name, it just gives me their number, even though it's in my Contacts and I've just sent them an SMS. Not everyone I send messages to lives in an iMessage bubble or has WhatsApp or whatever. I've raised this as bug with Apple and they've flagged it as a duplicate. Many iOS updates later it somtimes it says [Maybe: <Person's Name>] as the notification. Why maybe? It never use to say that.
- CharlesW 9y ago
  > Do you know what I really want from an iPhone? A more stable iOS. Apple (apparently) hears you: https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2018-02-12/how-apple-plans-to-root-out-bugs-revamp-iphone-software https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2018-02-12/how-apple... I also recommend this Steven Sinofsky tweetstorm: https://twitter.com/stevesi/status/963142502604779520?lang=en https://twitter.com/stevesi/status/963142502604779520?lang=e...
- mr_toad 9y ago
  ‘Maybe’ implies that the name and number has been found somewhere other than your contacts, usually in an email signature.
- tkxxx7 9y ago
  Oftentimes the 'maybe' is because they included their own name in the text or signature.
tyingq 9y ago
I'm an Android user because I don't want to spend more than $250 on the device in my arsenal that takes the most abuse. A good Apple product that competed with, for example, the Moto G4, could change the game. I'd love a mostly disposable iPhone that was as good as a mid-range Android.
- tyingq 9y ago
  Not really understanding the downvotes here. I'm a potential Apple afficiciando, but at the Moto G4 pricepoint. Does that make me fodder of some sort?
  - grzm 9y ago
    Only reason I can think of is that it shows a bit of a misunderstanding of Apple's business model. They've never competed on price in the phone market and are unlikely to start any time soon.

77 points by uptown 9y ago

"Apple has tried selling cheaper phones in the past with poor results." I love the iPhone SE. They can keep gradually improving that model and I'm good.

hgontijo 9y ago
I have an iPhone 6/64GB and it has been running really slow. Last thing I tried is to disable all location services (besides for specific maps apps) and helped a little bit. Apple diagnosed that its battery still good. Question, how is your iPhone SE performance?
- dep_b 9y ago
  The iPhone SE I bought recently is really fast. Waited a while to update to the latest iOS version as it didn't look that good judging by the betas I was using on my iPad before it's official release. But it's running great after holding off for two months, zero problems. GeekBench is like one or two dollar in the AppStore. If the score has a significant difference with other iPhone 6's probably you're having a battery problem. Also factory resetting the phone can help. Try to figure out if there are any apps using a lot of battery in your battery overview. Some apps consume more in terms of background activity than others.
- hnrodey 9y ago
  I'd still replace the battery regardless of what they tell you. Apple once told me I had a good battery even though my phone would randomly shut off and attaching to a charger was the only solution to get the phone to turn on. Thankfully I had AppleCare and pushed for them to replace the phone.
  - eisa01 9y ago
    Yup, download GeekBench and do a test My iPhone 7 was had a crippled batter after one year - it performed like an iPhone 6..
  - specialist 9y ago
    coconutBattery now also reports the battery health of connected iOS devices. I wish this functionality was built-in. http://www.coconut-flavour.com/coconutbattery/ http://www.coconut-flavour.com/coconutbattery/
- aero142 9y ago
  I had to upgrade from an iPhone 6 that I liked just fine, because the OS keeps getting slower and slower. I suspect it relates back to the 3d shimmer effects and adding depth to everything, and transition animations. I suspect Ives needs to be knocked down a peg so that the phone stops getting worse. Apple is still selling the 6s so they test that one a bit more, and it it's completely dead, but it's still pretty laggy compared to how it was when it first shipped.
  - twtw 9y ago
    People tend to disregard statements like this, but they are absolutely 100% true. I'm still using my iPhone 5S on iOS 8, and I am very happy with its performance. I've never had any issues with sluggishness, lag, etc.
    - vlan0 9y ago
      >on iOS 8 That's the ticket. The further the OS drifts the the original hardware, the more painful the experience.
- oldcynic 9y ago
  Switched to iPhone SE (after a few years on Android) 12 months ago. I have yet to encounter any situation where I've been annoyed with the phone's performance. Best, and snappiest, smart phone I've ever owned. Annoyance has been reserved for individual apps, and the change of Control Centre in iOS 11.
  - epmaybe 9y ago
    Only thing I'm bothered by is the speed of the fingerprint scanner. It's the same scanner from the 5s, so 1st gen touch ID. Makes for a less than ideal wait time for what is a generally snappy phone. Battery life is fantastic as well. I paired mine up with a thin silicone case and Qi receiver for wireless charging.
- Brendinooo 9y ago
  I believe the SE is running on 6S internals, so it should be improved over the 6.
- limeblack 9y ago
  Back when Apple allowed downgrading, I would downgrade others phones to the original OEM version and the speed was quite good. Now a days I upgrade one revision and nothing more. The only apps I really need are Safari and mail which work fine.
- dade_ 9y ago
  I loved the performance and battery life of the phone, but I finally gave up on the form factor. Apple and developers now support the screen size as an afterthought and I'd become increasingly frustrated by new version of apps that squish their 5.5" UI into 4, so I finally had it and switched to a compact Android device. Apple could have avoided this by maintaining the size of the phone and reducing bezels, but it seems clear that they consider smaller phones a niche market that isn't interesting.
- artimaeis 9y ago
  I had some issues with a relatively slow iPhone 6 recently - it didn't register as battery throttling. So I made an iTunes backup, factory reset the device, and restored from backup. That got it back to about the speed I'd expect it to be. I still suspect that I'll take it in for a battery swap before the end of the year - but it might be worth trying if it's the slowness is a hindrance for you.
  - specialist 9y ago
    I did this as well for an iPhone 6 and 6s. Worked.
- protomyth 9y ago
  The iPhone 6 has an A8 where the iPhone SE has an A9. My iPhone 6 also says the battery is good and its a year old (2017-02-21) since I had to pay for the replacement since the old battery swelled and killed the touch screen ($159.62), but it is really slowing down in the last 2 months and getting hot after about 3 minutes of use.
- kokey 9y ago
  I replaced my iPhone 6 with an iPhone SE a few weeks ago. It was like having an old friend back, especially since I had an iPhone 4 for 4 years before the iPhone 6. It was nice to have a phone I can operate with one hand again, it felt very familiar, but at the same time it also worked better. Compared to the iPhone 6 it's is certainly faster, has a better battery life and also supports hey siri even when not plugged into the charger.
- sk1pper 9y ago
  I bought the SE when it came out almost two years ago and still love it. No performance issues at all. Only thing I’ve noticed is that some websites clearly don’t really expect phones’ screens to be this small any more, though.
mtgx 9y ago
It has had poor success because they've been trying to sell a $400 device with the specs of a $150 device.
- mhb 9y ago
  New iPhone SE is $160 new or $110 refurbished from Consumer Cellular. So ???
  - jdietrich 9y ago
    Apple's price is $349 for the 32gb model and $449 for the 128gb model. The US cellular market might obfuscate the actual price of hardware through subsidies and bundling, but that's not the case in most international markets. The iPhone SE doesn't look like a particularly good deal compared to a similarly-priced handset from Xiaomi or Huawei - $349 is practically flagship territory these days. https://www.apple.com/shop/buy-iphone/iphone-se#00,20,30 https://www.apple.com/shop/buy-iphone/iphone-se#00,20,30
    - goerz 9y ago
      Considering that Xiaomi or Huawei don't run iOS, it seems like a good deal to me ;-)
- kec 9y ago
  Isn't it the other way around? The SE was released concurrently with the 6S and uses the same CPU even though it sold at a much lower price point.
gnicholas 9y ago
It was weird that in mentioning the “cheaper phones” that Apple has sold, they only mention the 5c, not the SE. The SE has sold surprisingly well, and it’s still available now. Why just dredge up the 5c and ignore the current model?
starsinspace 9y ago
Yes, but please Apple, improvements only! Do not touch the headphone jack or the fingerprint reader!
- criddell 9y ago
  Is the SE an iPhone 6 or 7? I'm going to get a new phone in a week or so and didn't even know about the SE.
  - tbirrell 9y ago
    Its a 6 in a 5's body. It was released 5-6 months before the 7 irrc.
    - saagarjha 9y ago
      It's a 6s, actually, without the larger screen, faster Touch ID, 3D Touch, and barometer.
      - earenndil 9y ago
        It doesn't have 3d touch.
        saagarjha 9y ago
        Yeah, that's what I said. It's missing 3D Touch along with all those other things.
  - starsinspace 9y ago
    It is much of the internal hardware of an iPhone 6S (A9 processor, 12MP rear camera) in the case of an iPhone 5.
    - criddell 9y ago
      Well that's a bummer. I'd like a phone that's going to be updated for at least 2 and hopefully 3 years. If it's already from the 6S generation I'm not too confident in it getting patched for the next 3 years.
Anechoic 9y ago
I'll take one iPhone X in an iPhone SE-sized body please. Preferably with the headphone jack. The biggest turnoffs of the new iPhones are the increased sizes. I know people like the bigger phones, but I can't be the only one who prefers the smaller size. In my case, it's because I run/cycle with my phone (I'm not getting the Apple Watch so don't even suggest it) and the bulk of the 6/7/8/X series is way too much for me.
- pcmaffey 9y ago
  Yup, I still have a 5s for this very reason. I dread having to "upgrade" to something bigger... Would probably use a Zoolander phone if existed.
  - CharlesW 9y ago
    > Would probably use a Zoolander phone if existed. This effectively exists in the form of the Apple Watch Series 3 LTE, although it's smaller than Zoolander's phone (which had to be flipped open to use). I've had it for a few weeks and can still hardly believe I can make and receive phone calls on the thing.
    - dingaling 9y ago
      I am baffled as to your amazement given that LTE-enabled smartwatches have been coming out of Chinese manufacturers such as No.1 for several years.
- shinratdr 9y ago
  > In my case, it's because I run/cycle with my phone (I'm not getting the Apple Watch so don't even suggest it) and the bulk of the 6/7/8/X series is way too much for me. ...ok? I mean people would suggest it because it's the solution to your problem. It doesn't have to be the Apple Watch, but some sort of fitness band seems to be a much better solution than hoping against logic that phones will suddenly become tiny again.
  - 9y ago
bunderbunder 9y ago
I'm in a similar boat. I'm unlikely to go for a bigger phone, and, seeing as the traffic lights in my city interfere with Bluetooh, I'm simply not going to go for a phone with no headphone jack. But all signs indicate that it's just not happening. The thing that pretty well convinced me that the SE will be the last small iPhone is the new control center. Cramming so many things in there that key touch targets are too small to quickly hit with a thumb on an SE-sized screen seemed like a pretty clear, if tacit, statement of intent.
MBCook 9y ago
They’re probably referring to the 5c which clearly didn’t do well at all. The SE is the cheap phone now but there are a lot of people (I’m guessing like you) who really like the form factor and don’t want a 6/7/8 sized phone let alone an X or a Plus.
- m1sta_ 9y ago
  I’m one of those people. I want smaller than a 6/7/8 and I want Spotify on an Apple Watch. I don’t care the price.
- goerz 9y ago
  Yes! I can't wait for an update to the SE (hopefully using the exact same form factor, just updated internals)
  - zelos 9y ago
    An updated screen would be the biggest improvement for me: the contrast ratio and black levels are much worse on the SE than other iPhones.

oflannabhra 9y ago

> Despite months of breathless hype, the iPhone X hasn’t sold as well as expected since its debut last year. Apple sold 77.3 million iPhones in the final quarter of 2017, below analysts’ projections of 80.2 million units. Some consumers were turned off by the iPhone X’s $1,000 price despite liking the design even as they wanted something more cutting-edge than the cheaper iPhone 8. With its next lineup, Apple is seeking to rekindle sales by offering a model for everyone. This seems like color commentary that isn't supported by their sources, or data. I'm not sure how they are supporting this statement. Apple's recent quarterly earnings [0] showed iPhone sales as (essentially) stable, year over year. ASP increased to $800 dollars (!) which would point to the iPhone X doing relatively well, despite not being available for the entire quarter. Even beyond that, there is no way for Apple to begin product development at a point after they saw the Q4 results. There is far to much lead-time required for them to be able to wait until now to do so. My guess is that 1) the rumors of these 2 new models are true, 2) Apple committed to this product roadmap a long time ago, and 3) Bloomberg is adding it's own spin to make the leaks more salacious. [0] - https://sixcolors.com/post/2018/02/apple-reports-its-holiday-2017-earnings-today/ https://sixcolors.com/post/2018/02/apple-reports-its-holiday...

akvadrako 9y ago
There is a decent amount of evidence that Apple's sales from the iPhone X (specifically) are less than expected, including 2-for-1 deals and Samsung cutting production of OLEDs. At the same time the margins on the X are better than ever. I agree it's unnecessary commentary, but based in fact without too much speculation.
- IBM 9y ago
  BOGO deals always come out of the carrier's pocket. The iPhone is the best customer acquisition tool so it all works out for the carrier in the end. Apple is certainly not going to cut prices to enable that.
- oflannabhra 9y ago
  I haven't seen any iPhone X 2-for-1 deals, in the US at least. Samsung's OLED production glut can't be pinned solely on Apple [0]. Most of the "Apple slashes iPhone X production forecast" rumors seem to be... unreliable at best [1] [2]. [0] - http://www.patentlyapple.com/patently-apple/2018/02/apples-iphone-x-is-the-instant-scapegoat-for-samsungs-failure-to-win-oled-orders-from-chinese-vendors.html http://www.patentlyapple.com/patently-apple/2018/02/apples-i... [1] - https://www.ped30.com/2018/02/20/nikkei-slashes-apple/ https://www.ped30.com/2018/02/20/nikkei-slashes-apple/ [2] - https://twitter.com/rjonesy/status/958421107245232128 https://twitter.com/rjonesy/status/958421107245232128

thomasedwards 9y ago

> Despite months of breathless hype, the iPhone X hasn’t sold as well as expected since its debut last year. Apple sold 77.3 million iPhones in the final quarter of 2017, below analysts’ projections of 80.2 million units. Considering the iPhone was going to be a flop by those same analysts, I’d say selling 77.3 million of them is pretty good. Who actually writes this rubbish? They missed out on 3 million phones, based on a number you made up? It was out of stock for weeks and is only now really available.

astrodust 9y ago
Analysts always make these wildly stupid predictions and then throw a fit when Apple magically doesn't meet them. It's absurd. Meanwhile other companies like Uber lose "only" a billion dollars and the analysts are losing their minds.
- dep_b 9y ago
  It's kind of weird that gaining marketshare in a shrinking market while increasing revenue per sold phone would be a bad thing just because some analist thought it would even sell better.
  - astrodust 9y ago
    Apple has always had a strange relationship with analysts, but post Jobs they started to generate increasingly insane projections. Part of the blame here is on Apple, they run an unusually secretive operation, where other companies would give a lot more in the way of guidance to help keep expectations more realistic.
    - allwein 9y ago
      They don't provide guidance on product mix, but they do provide guidance on expected revenue and margin. For Q1 2018 they projected between $84-$87 billion and came in at $88.3 billion. Apple has been historically accurate in nailing their projections, yet when analysts calculate the expected product mix, they either forget the mix and assume Apple is going to sell $80 billion in only iPhones, or they include the mix, which must mean they expect Apple to sell $120 billion worth of stuff.

40acres 9y ago

I keep wondering when Apple will bite the bullet and make a phone for the emerging market. The smartphone market is getting more and more mature and if Apple want's to keep sales up I think segmentation will be key. I would not be surprised if there is a philosophical battle going on in Apple right now about whether or not to make a phone for India & Africa, but the market is there.

cycrutchfield 9y ago
Why would they bother making a device with presumably low margins? That doesn’t seem like their MO.
- 40acres 9y ago
  Apple is squeezing as much as they can get out of their existing user base. Look at home pod, the watch, and apple music -- all great services that basically need an iPhone to work. I could see them adding more services to compliment the iPhone but I'm not sure how much more they can get from their existing users. Android dominates by market share and eventually I can see Apple trying to shorten the gap.. I guess it really depends on how many more services they can provide around the iPhone.
  - seanmcdirmid 9y ago
    Apple has around 80% of the profits in the smart phone industry already. iPhone doesn't drive service monetization, rather services drive iPhone monetization, so unlike Google, Apple can't win with cheaper phones.
sf_rob 9y ago
The budget market is generally a race to the bottom, and I don't see Apple interested in such a market. I know the counter will be that Apple can combine quality with fairly low price, but I think that's quite a high risk proposition.
- redditmigrant 9y ago

betoharres 9y ago

Apple just lost time with iPhone X, they don't know what they're doing, they're loosing time tasting the market and giving away their path to competition. Clearly someone with more vision is making the difference here.

jeffbax 9y ago

Hopefully lower-priced isn't just cheaper parts alone, but also the option for a smaller phone. Edge-to-edge, I want a phone the size of a 6/7 screen. Smaller form factor without losing usable area is my dream iPhone, not something larger or even the X size.

rjplatte 9y ago

As long as they don't kill the SE, this is fine. I like having a truly functional decently new iPhone.

Kattywumpus 9y ago

I do not want FaceID, and will resist it as long as possible. I do not want to normalize the idea that security should depend on a camera taking images of my face and environment. I am not alone in this, and believe this is one reason the iPhone X is selling poorly.

DonaldPShimoda 9y ago
FaceID doesn't "take images of your face and environment" though. It uses a dot projection (the pattern is unique to each phone) to produce a 3D approximation of your face's structure, and collapses this into some sort of mathematical representation of your face. This information is stored in a separate chip on the phone which the OS does not have access to (and it never leaves your phone; Apple isn't using your face for processing in the cloud or anything). By their statistics, FaceID is an order of magnitude less likely to result in false positives than TouchID. And aside from this, for people who are truly concerned about security, Apple recommends not using either FaceID or TouchID anyway (as both can be compelled by court order in the US).
- Kattywumpus 9y ago
  > FaceID doesn't "take images of your face and environment" though. From "How Apple's New FaceID Works" at Gizmodo: "Face ID starts with an image of your face, but builds on top of it with the TrueDepth’s dot projector, which will invisibly project over 30,000 dots onto your face each time you look at your phone, creating and building on its map of your features. "'We use the image and the dot pattern to push through neural networks to create a mathematical model of your face,' Apple’s Phil Schiller explained." - https://gizmodo.com/how-apples-new-face-id-works-1803813400 https://gizmodo.com/how-apples-new-face-id-works-1803813400 Your objection to my objection might be that FaceID doesn't store the images it takes, but uses them to construct a facial map that it stores instead. But even if that were any better, that's not true, either. From Apple's iOS Security Guide: "Once it confirms the presence of an attentive face, the TrueDepth camera projects and reads over 30,000 infrared dots to form a depth map of the face, along with a 2D infrared image. This data is used to create a sequence of 2D images and depth maps, which are digitally signed and sent to the Secure Enclave." - https://www.apple.com/business/docs/iOS_Security_Guide.pdf https://www.apple.com/business/docs/iOS_Security_Guide.pdf The public nature of your face inherently makes access to your phone less secure than the private nature of your fingerprints or even a PIN. But it's not the security of the phone, or the photos or face map stored on it that trouble me. It's the camera-based security paradigm I reject. It reduces resistance to a surveillance society, and increases the incentives for other businesses to use face-identifying software, which destroys privacy in the real world. I don't want people to get used to surrendering their privacy to access their data, and I won't buy a phone that sends a market signal telling the corporate world that I accept these kind of privacy-destroying technologies. Anyway, thanks for the thoughtful response.

egypturnash 9y ago

I keep on thinking about ditching my iPhone for a Mini with cellular capability. I never make phone calls any more; mostly it gets used for Mastodon, IM, email, and running the Kindle app. Maybe I'll try that when the next upgrade happens. If it does; MacRumors says the main rumor is of it being discontinued soon...

s2g 9y ago

Hmm, maybe I should buy a couple spare 7 or 8. I’m not buying a phone without touchid.

Bokanovsky 9y ago

Do you know what I really want from an iPhone? A more stable iOS. They've got a lot of bugs creeping in that seem like regressions. Little cracks appearing around the corners. Stuff that shouldn't really be bugs as they should have tests in place for this. I don't want fancy talking animated emoji. Or balloons flying around when I send an iMessage. I just want something solid. One of the most annoying issues I have is with basic SMS from a non-iPhone user. The notification doesn't give me the sender's name, it just gives me their number, even though it's in my Contacts and I've just sent them an SMS. Not everyone I send messages to lives in an iMessage bubble or has WhatsApp or whatever. I've raised this as bug with Apple and they've flagged it as a duplicate. Many iOS updates later it somtimes it says [Maybe: <Person's Name>] as the notification. Why maybe? It never use to say that.

CharlesW 9y ago
> Do you know what I really want from an iPhone? A more stable iOS. Apple (apparently) hears you: https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2018-02-12/how-apple-plans-to-root-out-bugs-revamp-iphone-software https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2018-02-12/how-apple... I also recommend this Steven Sinofsky tweetstorm: https://twitter.com/stevesi/status/963142502604779520?lang=en https://twitter.com/stevesi/status/963142502604779520?lang=e...
mr_toad 9y ago
‘Maybe’ implies that the name and number has been found somewhere other than your contacts, usually in an email signature.
tkxxx7 9y ago
Oftentimes the 'maybe' is because they included their own name in the text or signature.

tyingq 9y ago

I'm an Android user because I don't want to spend more than $250 on the device in my arsenal that takes the most abuse. A good Apple product that competed with, for example, the Moto G4, could change the game. I'd love a mostly disposable iPhone that was as good as a mid-range Android.

tyingq 9y ago
Not really understanding the downvotes here. I'm a potential Apple afficiciando, but at the Moto G4 pricepoint. Does that make me fodder of some sort?
- grzm 9y ago
  Only reason I can think of is that it shows a bit of a misunderstanding of Apple's business model. They've never competed on price in the phone market and are unlikely to start any time soon.