6 ms·

Unsurprising results- calories intake & expenditure defines weight loss/gain, not other nutrition information like fat, carbs, vitamins, etc.

JohnJamesRambo 9y ago
I'm actually relieved by the result. It makes things make sense again a little more.
geowwy 9y ago
It is surprising if you believe the insulin-obesity hypothesis. A lot of people do these days.
callesgg 9y ago
I my mind the point of these special diets is to alter the food habits making it so that you take in less total energy. By essentially forcing you to think more about your food. Not that one diet wound automatically burn more energy than the other.
pesfandiar 9y ago
True; however, they may be very different practically. Few people are going to measure calories for every single thing they eat. Most will rely on the sense of hunger and urge to eat certain things. I wouldn't be surprised if low-carb diets outperform low-fat ones in that department, since carbs tend to keep people urging for more through rapid blood sugar fluctuation.
- wnevets 9y ago
  > I wouldn't be surprised if low-carb diets outperform low-fat ones in that department, since carbs tend to keep people urging for more through rapid blood sugar fluctuation. This is exactly why low carb has works so well for me. My cravings for snacks become virtually disappear.
- kasey_junk 9y ago
  That result is literally what this study is saying they didn’t find. Perhaps you can make the argument that the study is flawed statistically or that 12 month weight loss is not long term enough or that the diet sessions caused the lack of difference?
- beager 9y ago
  This has been my experience, and I wonder if part of the efficacy of macronutrient-centric dieting is about cultivating self-control. That would be an activity that would be hard to measure in a study where the participants know they’re participating and have a sense of duty to remain committed. Healthy low fat vs healthy low carb will yield the same results, roughly, with the same caloric intake. Any macro combination will, really. But carbohydrate restriction is something I’ve personally found to be a good way to stay on the rails.
20180201 9y ago
calorie intake and expenditure is a description not a prescription. this is about as useful as saying "make more money than you spend" in order to become wealthy. sure, that's true, but it won't help you make $10 million. how do you eliminate the desire to waste time and money on useless pursuits? that is the analogy we need to use to reframe this discussion. yes, there is a certain level of maturity and self-control involved, but you need to know what NOT to do first. what is causing people the intense desire to overeat, and the intense lethargy that follows? probably insulin-spiking processed carbs and sugar. have you seen anyone in the throes of a carb addiction/crash cycle? it's damn near supernatural the amount of power these foods have over people. at this point i consider them about the same level as cigarettes or alcohol. cheap, widely availabe, intensely addictive, and people who don't have a problem just telling you to "use less", "it's so easy". okay. sure. "how do i graduate college?" "take more credits than it requires to graduate." try telling this to the person who got sucked into the for-profit university and is $50k in debt. the world is not as cut and dry as it seems, especially if you are burdened with a low IQ like the people who most easily fall for these schemes.
- bobdole1234 9y ago
  I'd say it's harder to quit eating badly than it is to quit cigarettes: You can live a long life without ever touching a cigarette again. But you won't get far with going cold turkey on food.
  - headsoup 9y ago
    Food is also harder because a) the healthy option is more expensive and b) sugar and heavy processing is in so much of the food available that it's hard to avoid, or sometimes even detect.
    - tdb7893 9y ago
      Healthy food is often more expensive but there are healthy options for cheap. Rice, beans, and vegetables are all pretty cheap and can form the base for a lot of different meals. The hardest part for me eating healthy was having to relearn a completely different set of recipes
RachelF 9y ago
Exactly. The good old "eat less" diet works, but is not as sexy as all the fad ones.
- headsoup 9y ago
  So I can eat just cardboard, so long as I don't eat so much of it that I can't expend the energy? It's nowhere near as simple as that.
  - taneq 9y ago
    You can eat whatever the hell you want, so long as you don't eat so much of it that you don't burn off the energy. It's precisely that simple. Of course, you could say it's complex because you have to choose to reduce your energy intake, and the way that we make that choice is complex. But in that sense, everything is complex.
    - headsoup 9y ago
      So all food/non-food is useful to the body in the same way? Just so long as you burn it off? Is all energy expenditure by the human body the same?
      - taneq 9y ago
        Micronutrients, obviously not. You have to get your required vitamins and minerals etc. or you'll get sick. But for macronutrients (basically carbs/fats) then yes, basically. Maybe you'll be slightly more or less efficient with some types of food, but in the end, if you eat a calorie you have to burn a calorie or you'll put on weight. The key factor is to realise that it's relative to your body. Maybe for you, personally, a gram of fat is more efficiently metabolized than a gram of carbs. Whatever. You have to close the loop. If you're above your target weight, eat progressively less until you start losing weight, then maintain that intake until your target weight. If you're below your target weight, eat progressively more until you're gaining weight, then maintain that intake until your target weight.
daxfohl 9y ago
It's a bit surprising that the number of degrees burning your food will raise the temperature of water is related to weight gain. I find it more surprising that this simple relation has withstood the test of time.
- sokoloff 9y ago
  Can’t tell if sarcastic or not. Burning food to release chemically stored energy therein seems like it would correlate naturally to the chemical energy an organism could extract.
  - daxfohl 9y ago
    Not at all sarcastic. I mean, we're told this process all the time so it seems like "duh", but if you really think about it there are lots of jumps and hand waving in that process.
megaman22 9y ago
For me, the easiest way to eat less calories is to eat a low-carb diet. The reason is this: my typical meal consists of three parts; meat, vegetable, and starch. The least healthy and highest calorie part is the starch. Cut the starch, cut most of the caloric intake. Besides, if I cut enough carbs, I get into ketosis, and then I stop being hungry.

JohnJamesRambo 9y ago

I'm actually relieved by the result. It makes things make sense again a little more.

geowwy 9y ago

It is surprising if you believe the insulin-obesity hypothesis. A lot of people do these days.

callesgg 9y ago

I my mind the point of these special diets is to alter the food habits making it so that you take in less total energy. By essentially forcing you to think more about your food. Not that one diet wound automatically burn more energy than the other.

pesfandiar 9y ago

True; however, they may be very different practically. Few people are going to measure calories for every single thing they eat. Most will rely on the sense of hunger and urge to eat certain things. I wouldn't be surprised if low-carb diets outperform low-fat ones in that department, since carbs tend to keep people urging for more through rapid blood sugar fluctuation.

wnevets 9y ago
> I wouldn't be surprised if low-carb diets outperform low-fat ones in that department, since carbs tend to keep people urging for more through rapid blood sugar fluctuation. This is exactly why low carb has works so well for me. My cravings for snacks become virtually disappear.
kasey_junk 9y ago
That result is literally what this study is saying they didn’t find. Perhaps you can make the argument that the study is flawed statistically or that 12 month weight loss is not long term enough or that the diet sessions caused the lack of difference?
beager 9y ago
This has been my experience, and I wonder if part of the efficacy of macronutrient-centric dieting is about cultivating self-control. That would be an activity that would be hard to measure in a study where the participants know they’re participating and have a sense of duty to remain committed. Healthy low fat vs healthy low carb will yield the same results, roughly, with the same caloric intake. Any macro combination will, really. But carbohydrate restriction is something I’ve personally found to be a good way to stay on the rails.

20180201 9y ago

calorie intake and expenditure is a description not a prescription. this is about as useful as saying "make more money than you spend" in order to become wealthy. sure, that's true, but it won't help you make $10 million. how do you eliminate the desire to waste time and money on useless pursuits? that is the analogy we need to use to reframe this discussion. yes, there is a certain level of maturity and self-control involved, but you need to know what NOT to do first. what is causing people the intense desire to overeat, and the intense lethargy that follows? probably insulin-spiking processed carbs and sugar. have you seen anyone in the throes of a carb addiction/crash cycle? it's damn near supernatural the amount of power these foods have over people. at this point i consider them about the same level as cigarettes or alcohol. cheap, widely availabe, intensely addictive, and people who don't have a problem just telling you to "use less", "it's so easy". okay. sure. "how do i graduate college?" "take more credits than it requires to graduate." try telling this to the person who got sucked into the for-profit university and is $50k in debt. the world is not as cut and dry as it seems, especially if you are burdened with a low IQ like the people who most easily fall for these schemes.

bobdole1234 9y ago
I'd say it's harder to quit eating badly than it is to quit cigarettes: You can live a long life without ever touching a cigarette again. But you won't get far with going cold turkey on food.
- headsoup 9y ago
  Food is also harder because a) the healthy option is more expensive and b) sugar and heavy processing is in so much of the food available that it's hard to avoid, or sometimes even detect.
  - tdb7893 9y ago
    Healthy food is often more expensive but there are healthy options for cheap. Rice, beans, and vegetables are all pretty cheap and can form the base for a lot of different meals. The hardest part for me eating healthy was having to relearn a completely different set of recipes

RachelF 9y ago

Exactly. The good old "eat less" diet works, but is not as sexy as all the fad ones.

headsoup 9y ago
So I can eat just cardboard, so long as I don't eat so much of it that I can't expend the energy? It's nowhere near as simple as that.
- taneq 9y ago
  You can eat whatever the hell you want, so long as you don't eat so much of it that you don't burn off the energy. It's precisely that simple. Of course, you could say it's complex because you have to choose to reduce your energy intake, and the way that we make that choice is complex. But in that sense, everything is complex.
  - headsoup 9y ago
    So all food/non-food is useful to the body in the same way? Just so long as you burn it off? Is all energy expenditure by the human body the same?
    - taneq 9y ago
      Micronutrients, obviously not. You have to get your required vitamins and minerals etc. or you'll get sick. But for macronutrients (basically carbs/fats) then yes, basically. Maybe you'll be slightly more or less efficient with some types of food, but in the end, if you eat a calorie you have to burn a calorie or you'll put on weight. The key factor is to realise that it's relative to your body. Maybe for you, personally, a gram of fat is more efficiently metabolized than a gram of carbs. Whatever. You have to close the loop. If you're above your target weight, eat progressively less until you start losing weight, then maintain that intake until your target weight. If you're below your target weight, eat progressively more until you're gaining weight, then maintain that intake until your target weight.

daxfohl 9y ago

It's a bit surprising that the number of degrees burning your food will raise the temperature of water is related to weight gain. I find it more surprising that this simple relation has withstood the test of time.

sokoloff 9y ago
Can’t tell if sarcastic or not. Burning food to release chemically stored energy therein seems like it would correlate naturally to the chemical energy an organism could extract.
- daxfohl 9y ago
  Not at all sarcastic. I mean, we're told this process all the time so it seems like "duh", but if you really think about it there are lots of jumps and hand waving in that process.

megaman22 9y ago

For me, the easiest way to eat less calories is to eat a low-carb diet. The reason is this: my typical meal consists of three parts; meat, vegetable, and starch. The least healthy and highest calorie part is the starch. Cut the starch, cut most of the caloric intake. Besides, if I cut enough carbs, I get into ketosis, and then I stop being hungry.