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>For some people drinking good coffee is exactly like experiencing a fine wine. I would phrase it differently. Americans have become conditioned to accept hig

>For some people drinking good coffee is exactly like experiencing a fine wine. I would phrase it differently. Americans have become conditioned to accept high prices for drinks. For lots of reasons, but mostly because they are real money makers in almost every place that sells any sort of drink. I mean, it costs up to $6 for a bottle of kombucha, and I know people who go through a couple of those a day. The next logical step is a $20 coffee. Meanwhile in Europe you can get a good espresso for a euro.

adventured 9y ago
That's obviously a false extrapolation on cultures. In Paris you're not spending one euro on espresso typically. It's going to be closer to 2.50 to 3 euros. Adjust that to dollars, you get more like $3 to $3.70, adjust for income differences you get $5 to $6 (US incomes are far higher than French incomes, and especially if we're comparing eg NYC vs Paris). https://francetravelplanner.com/go/paris/shop/costs.html https://francetravelplanner.com/go/paris/shop/costs.html Americans have not been conditioned to accept high prices for drinks. When was the last time you wandered through Walmart's beverages section? Their grocery section has half an aisle for inexpensive coffee and tea products, and then another half aisle for inexpensive soda products. As another example, cases of water at Walmart go for $4 for a brand label pack of 24 to 32 500ml bottles, or $0.13 to $0.17 per unit. If anything, most Americans are conditioned to expect to pay very cheap prices for purchased beverages. That's why Starbucks is considered expensive to the average person. A small group of high income Americans find it acceptable to spend what is a trivial sum for them, on such product experiences. The notion that many Americans are spending $15-$20 on daily beverages, is laughable. The median income is $30,000. You want me to believe a lot of people are spending $7,000 annually on beverages? Yeah right. It's equivalent to saying: in the US you can buy a vast array of great wines for $10 to $20, while in France people are paying $140 for wine. Sure, some people in France are. It'd be false to pretend a large number of people in France are doing that regularly. Few Americans are actually spending outsized sums of money on beverages.
- ardit33 9y ago
  In Rome, I bought 1.20 euro for a espresso, and 2.0 for a cappuccino, right smack in the middle of the city near the train station. In Albania, it is the 0.80 for a medium-good espresso (Lavazza or Illy), and 1.20 to 1.50 for a cappuccino. In Barcelona, a glass of wine varied between 2.5. and 3 euros. I never paid more than that. In the US? 12-15 (In NYC at least). Also, in NYC, you can't buy a bottle of water for $1, in most places, while in supermarkets in Spain was about 0.50 or 0.60 So, yeah, Americans in general pay twice as much for beverages.
  - Kephael 9y ago
    NYC unfairly keeps large grocers such as Walmart out of the city. You can order 40 water bottle packs from Costco using Instacart for 3.69 in NYC [1]. NYC Bodegas are not competitive, it is unfortunate the city allows the poor to be taken advantage of and forced to shop at such uncompetitively priced stores. [1] https://www.instacart.com/store/items/item_128043194 https://www.instacart.com/store/items/item_128043194
    - Hydraulix989 9y ago
      How does it keep them out?
      - nitrogen 9y ago
        I'm not familiar with NYC, but typical techniques involve refusing to issue business or construction permits, or imposing untenable restrictions.
  - djrogers 9y ago
    You can’t compare prices in NYC and extrapolate that to the rest of the country - it’s the most expensive place for pretty much everything.
    - ardit33 9y ago
yazr 9y ago
Ughh. The mythical 1-euro coffee persists due to cultural reasons. But also due to very depressed purchasing power in places in Greece, Italy etc Go to any capital or premium tourist location, and u too will discover the pleasures of 5euro coffee.
matwood 9y ago
> Meanwhile in Europe you can get a good espresso for a euro. Even if this is still true, you're talking about different things than what most Americans purchase. Very few Americans purchase the single shot of espresso, but last I checked Starbucks has it for ~$1.50. What many Americans consider coffee is really a milkshake flavored with a couple of shots of espresso. Then there is the size issue. If I walked into a cafe in Europe and wanted a grande sized latte it would end up being very similar in price to Starbucks (2 espresso shots and basically a glass of milk).
- vinay427 9y ago
  I'm not sure where you've gotten a latte, but I haven't noticed a significant difference between a latte from a US coffeeshop (and I've been to various across several states and regions) and a latte in Spain, for instance. I haven't been to Starbucks recently, so I can't comment on their products.
  - petecox 9y ago
    The €1 coffee is possibly more prevalent across the border in Portugal. They charge extra for milk, as black coffee is typically drunk as a side dish to iconic pasteis. https://media-cdn.tripadvisor.com/media/photo-s/08/da/d6/7b/pastel-de-belem.jpg https://media-cdn.tripadvisor.com/media/photo-s/08/da/d6/7b/...

adventured 9y ago

That's obviously a false extrapolation on cultures. In Paris you're not spending one euro on espresso typically. It's going to be closer to 2.50 to 3 euros. Adjust that to dollars, you get more like $3 to $3.70, adjust for income differences you get $5 to $6 (US incomes are far higher than French incomes, and especially if we're comparing eg NYC vs Paris). https://francetravelplanner.com/go/paris/shop/costs.html https://francetravelplanner.com/go/paris/shop/costs.html Americans have not been conditioned to accept high prices for drinks. When was the last time you wandered through Walmart's beverages section? Their grocery section has half an aisle for inexpensive coffee and tea products, and then another half aisle for inexpensive soda products. As another example, cases of water at Walmart go for $4 for a brand label pack of 24 to 32 500ml bottles, or $0.13 to $0.17 per unit. If anything, most Americans are conditioned to expect to pay very cheap prices for purchased beverages. That's why Starbucks is considered expensive to the average person. A small group of high income Americans find it acceptable to spend what is a trivial sum for them, on such product experiences. The notion that many Americans are spending $15-$20 on daily beverages, is laughable. The median income is $30,000. You want me to believe a lot of people are spending $7,000 annually on beverages? Yeah right. It's equivalent to saying: in the US you can buy a vast array of great wines for $10 to $20, while in France people are paying $140 for wine. Sure, some people in France are. It'd be false to pretend a large number of people in France are doing that regularly. Few Americans are actually spending outsized sums of money on beverages.

ardit33 9y ago
In Rome, I bought 1.20 euro for a espresso, and 2.0 for a cappuccino, right smack in the middle of the city near the train station. In Albania, it is the 0.80 for a medium-good espresso (Lavazza or Illy), and 1.20 to 1.50 for a cappuccino. In Barcelona, a glass of wine varied between 2.5. and 3 euros. I never paid more than that. In the US? 12-15 (In NYC at least). Also, in NYC, you can't buy a bottle of water for $1, in most places, while in supermarkets in Spain was about 0.50 or 0.60 So, yeah, Americans in general pay twice as much for beverages.
- Kephael 9y ago
  NYC unfairly keeps large grocers such as Walmart out of the city. You can order 40 water bottle packs from Costco using Instacart for 3.69 in NYC [1]. NYC Bodegas are not competitive, it is unfortunate the city allows the poor to be taken advantage of and forced to shop at such uncompetitively priced stores. [1] https://www.instacart.com/store/items/item_128043194 https://www.instacart.com/store/items/item_128043194
  - Hydraulix989 9y ago
    How does it keep them out?
    - nitrogen 9y ago
      I'm not familiar with NYC, but typical techniques involve refusing to issue business or construction permits, or imposing untenable restrictions.
- djrogers 9y ago
  You can’t compare prices in NYC and extrapolate that to the rest of the country - it’s the most expensive place for pretty much everything.
  - ardit33 9y ago

yazr 9y ago

Ughh. The mythical 1-euro coffee persists due to cultural reasons. But also due to very depressed purchasing power in places in Greece, Italy etc Go to any capital or premium tourist location, and u too will discover the pleasures of 5euro coffee.

matwood 9y ago

> Meanwhile in Europe you can get a good espresso for a euro. Even if this is still true, you're talking about different things than what most Americans purchase. Very few Americans purchase the single shot of espresso, but last I checked Starbucks has it for ~$1.50. What many Americans consider coffee is really a milkshake flavored with a couple of shots of espresso. Then there is the size issue. If I walked into a cafe in Europe and wanted a grande sized latte it would end up being very similar in price to Starbucks (2 espresso shots and basically a glass of milk).

vinay427 9y ago
I'm not sure where you've gotten a latte, but I haven't noticed a significant difference between a latte from a US coffeeshop (and I've been to various across several states and regions) and a latte in Spain, for instance. I haven't been to Starbucks recently, so I can't comment on their products.
- petecox 9y ago
  The €1 coffee is possibly more prevalent across the border in Portugal. They charge extra for milk, as black coffee is typically drunk as a side dish to iconic pasteis. https://media-cdn.tripadvisor.com/media/photo-s/08/da/d6/7b/pastel-de-belem.jpg https://media-cdn.tripadvisor.com/media/photo-s/08/da/d6/7b/...