14 ms·

It's not only to make them run longer - they're reducing the peak demand on the batteries to avoid spontaneous shutdown when the aged battery can't handle the l

It's not only to make them run longer - they're reducing the peak demand on the batteries to avoid spontaneous shutdown when the aged battery can't handle the load. This seems like a good idea, and it appears to be well executed (ie it's not apparently based just on age or milage like a crappy car maintenance reminder), but Apple should probably have something in iOS that tells people their phone is running slow because the battery is 2 years old. [1] https://techcrunch.com/2017/12/20/apple-addresses-why-people-are-saying-their-iphones-with-older-batteries-are-running-slower/ https://techcrunch.com/2017/12/20/apple-addresses-why-people...

IBM 9y ago
It does say in iOS that your battery needs to be replaced [1]. Everyone keeps saying they never told anyone about this but they basically announced it to the press with a statement (as well as the notice in iOS) when iOS 10.2.1 was released [2]. [1] https://support.apple.com/en-us/HT207453 https://support.apple.com/en-us/HT207453 [2] https://techcrunch.com/2017/02/23/apple-says-ios-10-2-1-has-reduced-unexpected-iphone-6s-shutdown-issues-by-80/ https://techcrunch.com/2017/02/23/apple-says-ios-10-2-1-has-...
- ben_jones 9y ago
  Millions of people own iPhone's and don't jump up and down meticulously reading every press release or notification. Hell I can't remember the last notification that didn't catch be at a bad time, prompting me to punt it off my screen as quickly as possible.
  - squiggleblaz 9y ago
    Yeah, iPhone's notification system is terrible. Based around "deal with it now because we told you to!". Makes me sad.
- was_boring 9y ago
  I read both, and couldn't find any verbiage indicating they limited the cpu speed based upon the condition of the battery. Only that they "fixed a bug" to reduce "unexpected shutdowns."
  - IBM 9y ago
    Yes I think it's safe to assume that Apple is not going to be notifying users about CPU speed adjustments and when those occur, given that it changes based on anything from cold to hot temperatures.
    - frogpelt 9y ago
      It wouldn't have to be an event notification. It could be a once-a-month reminder that performance may be degraded.
      - nielsbot 9y ago
        Or even a one time notification on OS upgrade. Perhaps with a note next to the "you should replace your battery" text in Settings.app. E.g. "this may affect phone performance, tap here for more info..."
        valuearb 9y ago
        A one time notification would be all they need. I'm an iOS developer and didn't even know that settings tells me when I need a new battery. Once told, I'd never forget.
- unreal37 9y ago
  My wife's iPhone has been running slow ever since she upgraded to iOS 11. Literally the day she upgraded, she's regretted. I'll run the speed test later to confirm. But there is absolutely NO warning in iOS that I can see that says it's been put into low-speed mode.
  - IBM 9y ago
    That's because there is no low-speed mode. It changes based on a variety of conditions including how degraded the battery is (the OS tells you when it needs to be serviced once it's near the end of its life, 500 cycles), cold or hot temperatures, and the remaining battery life (low power mode decreases performance).
    - shock-value 9y ago
      How did you come to this conclusion? My 6S was running in this “low speed mode” (as confirmed by Geekbench 4 results) even when the battery was at 100%, phone plugged in, placed at my desk at room temperature all afternoon. Only relevant variable seemed to be the battery age, and the results improved (along with subjective perceived performance increase) only when I recently had it replaced.
      - IBM 9y ago
        Those 3 conditions are literally what Apple said influence performance in the story you're commenting on.
- komali2 9y ago
  Upgrading the battery doesn't restore speed, though.
  - IBM 9y ago
    Replacing the battery does in fact "restore speed".
Blazespinnaker 9y ago
How about just the ability for a user to replace the battery? Should be a law to cut down on ewaste.
- jrs95 9y ago
  Most phones are probably getting recycled now anyways, so it really doesn’t matter. In fact, I would think user serviceability would increase waste because people would throw their old batteries away.
  - justonepost 9y ago
    Not if you have a fee on the battery such that you have to provide the old one to get a discount.
- derpaderp1 9y ago
  If they did that then the NSA couldn't turn back on a "powered off" device while you are asleep to bombard you with ultrasonic waves.
- IBM 9y ago
  iPhones have the longest life of any smartphone and you can verify that yourself by looking at the used market for it (and any Apple product). User replaceable batteries may ironically decrease that and increase waste.
  - justonepost 9y ago
    How would replaceable batteries decrease the life of the smartphone?
    - jhiska 9y ago
      It wouldn't. It would obviously increase the lifespan of it. The spinsters are deliberately confusing "lifespan" with "resale value".
jrs95 9y ago
It IS a good idea. My step mom had a high end Samsung phone (not sure exactly which one) and it’s battery degraded enough within a year that it began to shut down randomly a lot.
- jhiska 9y ago
  I guess that means all Samsung phones ("not sure which ones") are inferior to Apple phones, hm? ;)
  - jrs95 9y ago
    Haha, no. It just wasn’t a Note or Galaxy S, but it still cost like $700. Was a bit smaller. No idea what device it was specifically. And she couldn’t replace the battery easily, either. It was non-removable, as are basically all high end Android devices now.
    - wccrawford 9y ago
      I had to replace the batteries in our Nexus 6Ps recently. I didn't buy from Google, so they wouldn't deal with it out of warranty, despite it being a defect. They're replaceable, but they are clearly not meant to be done by the user. There were many opportunities to break pieces of the phone or ruin it completely. It's a horrible design.
      - jhiska 9y ago
        Both the iPhone and the Nexus 6Ps have horrible battery-swap design, but I still don't want to pay middle-men for what should be simple service I should be able to do at home.
        wccrawford 9y ago
        I fully agree. When I said I replaced the batteries, I meant it literally. I did the work. It was ugly. But it was a hell of a lot cheaper than the quote I got from the repair shop, and I didn't break anything. (Which isn't a surprise... I like fixing things.)
basseq 9y ago
This comment deserves more attention. And, in fact, means the headline is wrong. Apple is not slowing down devices to extend battery life. Apple is slowing down devices to prevent the thing from crapping out entirely ("unexpectedly shutting down"). Arguably, this does more to prevent obsolescence than plan it. Agreed with @djrogers suggestion to alert the user to the situation. It should not be a user choice. "Last year we released a feature for iPhone 6, iPhone 6s and iPhone SE to smooth out the instantaneous peaks only when needed to prevent the device from unexpectedly shutting down during these conditions [cold, low battery, battery age]."
- mempko 9y ago
  Strange, I have an old HP veer That is 6 years old and it doesn't spontaneously shut down. I have a 3 year old android phone that doesn't spontaneously shut down. What is so special about iPhones and why do they crap out in 2 years?
  - swiley 9y ago
    All of the Android phones I've had do when the battery starts to get old, Especially when you use the camera while it's low. Maybe you take better care of your batteries?
  - nogridbag 9y ago
    My 2013 Macbook Pro would spontaneously shut down with anywhere between 30-40% battery. I tried a few tips I found online to fix it, but nothing seemed to work.
  - esmi 9y ago
    This post gives us an estimate for what percentage of the iPhones are getting throttled by this issue. I think it's reasonable to use this as a proxy to estimate how many units were at risk of shutting down and it is the minority of units. Happily it appears both of your devices are in the majority of units which don't exhibit this issue. https://www.geekbench.com/blog/2017/12/iphone-performance-and-battery-age/ https://www.geekbench.com/blog/2017/12/iphone-performance-an...
jhiska 9y ago
You make a good point. If you consider that you can't easily change the battery in an iPhone without voiding the warranty or paying a premium price to Apple Support then one can make a strong argument that it's sneaky planned obsolescence. Then again, a battery that dies down after a few years and is so difficult to replace is also planned obsolescence.
- justonepost 9y ago
  It's just another nail in the coffin. OS upgrades requiring more CPU usage, the lack of repair-ability, dying batteries, and now this CPU tweak. It's pretty obvious what apple is doing. We need a law to make them stop or at least one which requires them to declare in obvious language about the things that reduce the functioning of their devices over time.
caconym_ 9y ago
Yeah, this is a real problem that I’ve had with devices in the past and as someone who doesn’t buy the hot new phone every year, I appreciate that Apple is taking steps to keep my 5S happy. That’s a commitment to long-term support that I would not expect from the average Android phone vendor.
scotty79 9y ago
> they're reducing the peak demand on the batteries to avoid spontaneous shutdown when the aged battery can't handle the load. It doesn't seem to help my gf had an iPhone 5 that started dying on peak demand but only after it got upgraded to new ios (i guess 8.0). We replaced it (it had bad battery from the start and apple had a program for replacing those). After few years on new battery it started doing the same thing again. I replaced the battery and it stopped. But I know what I can expect in two years or so. Maybe I should stock on iPhone 5 batteries? Do they age less if they are unused?
- valuearb 9y ago
  All batteries wear out after a few years of use.
  - scotty79 9y ago
    I understand lasting shorter on charge but shutting down when I turn on the camera while on 40% is uniquely apple experience.
    - shoobedowop 9y ago
      nope.
    - nradov 9y ago
      I've seen the same shutdown problem on multiple different Android devices with degraded batteries.
      - scotty79 9y ago
        I must have been lucky then.
deleted 9y ago
[deleted]
jtbayly 9y ago
I think the problem is deeper. They put batteries in these devices that cannot handle load the rest of the hardware demands. Their solution is to just slow down the rest of the hardware. I've got a phone that is nowhere near to needing a new battery. It holds 87% of its original charge capacity. Yet it never runs above 50% speed unless it is above 97% charged, and even then it only runs at 2/3rds original speed.
- compiler-guy 9y ago
  The batteries handle the load just fine until they start wearing out around 500 cycles.
  - JustSomeNobody 9y ago
    How are people getting to 500 cycles in one year?
    - xenadu02 9y ago
      It isn't purely about cycle count. If you ever forget and leave your phone on the car dash in the summer that heat has a permanent negative effect on your battery.
shill 9y ago
My geekbench CPU scores (single-core 1458, multi-core 2480) show that my 6s has been throttled but honestly I hadn't noticed a slowdown. In which apps would I notice a significant difference if I replace my battery? If Safari page load speeds increased I would be happy, but I assume that is more influenced by bandwidth and mobile optimization.
zkms 9y ago
> It's not only to make them run longer - they're reducing the peak demand on the batteries to avoid spontaneous shutdown when the aged battery can't handle the load. Yes. I used to have spontaneous shutdowns on my iPhone 6 in cold weather when the fuel gauge indicated a number like 20% and it was this sort of problem that was meant to be fixed: the CPU using too much current, causing the battery voltage to drop enough to trigger the low-voltage/brownout detector, causing the phone to die. The battery would last long enough (from last full charge to needing to recharge) -- it wasn't inadequate in the energy department -- it just couldn't deliver enough power in cold conditions. Throttling the CPU in those cases (when the aged battery can't deliver enough current) is sensical and extends the life of the phone -- the only serious issue is that the user might think that there is a problem with the CPU or the software (and replace the whole phone) when the problem can be adequately fixed with a new battery (far less expensive than a new phone). The feature is good but Apple's software should be far more proactive in notifying users that this is happening, if only because users jump to a conclusion of "my old phone can't handle this new iOS update, damn Apple making me buy a new phone" rather than "my battery is too old to reliably deliver whatever current the SOC wants".
- nielsbot 9y ago
  I think you wanted sensical -> sensible. I'll show myself out.
  - valuearb 9y ago
    Stop being non-sensical. Just be sensical, man.
- twoodfin 9y ago
  I think there’s more to this story than mere aging batteries. I had the exact symptoms of this issue with my one year old iPhone 6 Plus in fall of 2015. Add in some very strange battery % readings: Even when it failed to shut down, the phone would drop rapidly from 20% to 1% but then remain there for ten minutes or more. Bizarrely, this behavior (albeit less frequent or severe) jumped to my brand new iPhone 6S Plus in November of that year when I restored it from a backup of the 6 Plus. Both phones had Geniuses run battery diagnostics without finding any unusual degradation. My guess: Apple’s battery “farming” code designed to maximize its life, level drain and charge across the cells, manage load, estimate charge % remaining... is incredibly sophisticated, even so far as to profile your typical use of a device to inform these decisions and estimates. There have been user-visible bugs in this code related to manual clock updates (something I did a fair bit while traveling), and I bet some fraction of these downclocked users have been the victim of that or related bugs. If the code is “farming” the battery incorrectly, some cells may be charged or drained too much for too long, and greatly increase a phone’s susceptibility to these voltage drops, even while the global status of the battery reads as fine.
LusoTycoon 9y ago
Apple did that and people would start cracking iphones open to replace batteries. Not in line with Apple's philosphy.
dbingham 9y ago
Or they could, you know, design the thing so that the battery is replaceable and provide easily accessible replacement batteries.
- cjensen 9y ago
  Apple will replace the battery for $79 [1]. When you consider the cost for a battery, the labor for replacement, the confidence that this is not a junk replacement, and the warranty for the service, that's a very reasonable price. There is no way Apple is making money on this. [1] https://support.apple.com/iphone/repair/battery-power https://support.apple.com/iphone/repair/battery-power
blensor 9y ago
I can't tell how well it's executed but the major issue I have with this is that this is not properly communicated to the user. I guess most people already get the feeling that their devices slow down after time, or the new apps/OS's just require more potent hardware and replacement of the devices is necessary as time goes by. But for many of those it seems that a "simple" battery replacement would have done the trick as well. If my device has to substantially throttle the performance to avoid a complete shutdown I expect a major notification that something is terribly wrong and I better do something about it. My car had an occasional issue with an exhaust regulation valve and drastically reduced the performance in those situations. Every time I received a notification on the dashboard that the power was reduced but that I can continue driving but that I should visit a service partner as soon as possible. That would be exactly what I expect from a smart device
- xster 9y ago
  > not properly communicated to the user s/user/buyer Selling a car that markets 300,000 miles but can't drive over 3,000 rpm anymore after the first year is not a car, and marketing it as such is fraud.
  - blensor 9y ago
    In my car case it was a know issue of this model and repaired for free within one hour. And while a degraded battery is nothing that needs to be replaced for free, the manufacturer of the phone probably sunk a lot of time and money into developing a strategy to cope with the phone shutdowns due to a degraded battery. During that process it is hard to imagine that no one ever came up with the notion that maybe it would be a good idea to also notify the user that a serious issue is developing which should be handled some time. After all this is not going to get better since the battery will continue degrading (and probably with increasing rate) if it is not replaced.
deleted 9y ago
[deleted]
falcolas 9y ago
> avoid spontaneous shutdown when the aged battery can't handle the load This doesn't make sense to me. I've been playing with LiPo batteries on quadcopters for a few years now, and I've found that battery capacity is directly related to its voltage, and the voltage decreases in a deterministic fashion according to use. High quality and well maintained LiPo batteries just don't behave randomly - that's why we feel safe attaching them to our houses in the form of Tesla Powercells. Or, in other words, if a phone is showing 40% charge when it shuts down, that's not the battery "spontaneously" being unable to cope with load; that's a bad charge indicator.
xster 9y ago
It's fine rationalizing it but how is that conceptually different from say Comcast saying: "Well actually your 100Mbps connection was just a first year promotional speed and now dropped to 20Mbps unless you sign another limited period contract. Oh, and actually, it's all for good reasons because the crappy modem that you rented at 10$ a month just kinda starts melting if it keeps transmitting at 100Mbps so we just saved your house from burning down. No need to thank us. Sorry we didn't disclose any of this to new customers but don't worry, just give us more money and everything will be ok."
racl101 9y ago
> but Apple should probably have something in iOS that tells people their phone is running slow because the battery is 2 years old. Or a disclaimer telling people the caveats (or cons) of upgrading their OS. More transparency would be great instead of making people feel like the company is pushing them out of their, otherwise, perfectly functional smartphone which cost them a fortune.

IBM 9y ago

It does say in iOS that your battery needs to be replaced [1]. Everyone keeps saying they never told anyone about this but they basically announced it to the press with a statement (as well as the notice in iOS) when iOS 10.2.1 was released [2]. [1] https://support.apple.com/en-us/HT207453 https://support.apple.com/en-us/HT207453 [2] https://techcrunch.com/2017/02/23/apple-says-ios-10-2-1-has-reduced-unexpected-iphone-6s-shutdown-issues-by-80/ https://techcrunch.com/2017/02/23/apple-says-ios-10-2-1-has-...

ben_jones 9y ago
Millions of people own iPhone's and don't jump up and down meticulously reading every press release or notification. Hell I can't remember the last notification that didn't catch be at a bad time, prompting me to punt it off my screen as quickly as possible.
- squiggleblaz 9y ago
  Yeah, iPhone's notification system is terrible. Based around "deal with it now because we told you to!". Makes me sad.
was_boring 9y ago
I read both, and couldn't find any verbiage indicating they limited the cpu speed based upon the condition of the battery. Only that they "fixed a bug" to reduce "unexpected shutdowns."
- IBM 9y ago
  Yes I think it's safe to assume that Apple is not going to be notifying users about CPU speed adjustments and when those occur, given that it changes based on anything from cold to hot temperatures.
  - frogpelt 9y ago
    It wouldn't have to be an event notification. It could be a once-a-month reminder that performance may be degraded.
    - nielsbot 9y ago
      Or even a one time notification on OS upgrade. Perhaps with a note next to the "you should replace your battery" text in Settings.app. E.g. "this may affect phone performance, tap here for more info..."
      - valuearb 9y ago
        A one time notification would be all they need. I'm an iOS developer and didn't even know that settings tells me when I need a new battery. Once told, I'd never forget.
unreal37 9y ago
My wife's iPhone has been running slow ever since she upgraded to iOS 11. Literally the day she upgraded, she's regretted. I'll run the speed test later to confirm. But there is absolutely NO warning in iOS that I can see that says it's been put into low-speed mode.
- IBM 9y ago
  That's because there is no low-speed mode. It changes based on a variety of conditions including how degraded the battery is (the OS tells you when it needs to be serviced once it's near the end of its life, 500 cycles), cold or hot temperatures, and the remaining battery life (low power mode decreases performance).
  - shock-value 9y ago
    How did you come to this conclusion? My 6S was running in this “low speed mode” (as confirmed by Geekbench 4 results) even when the battery was at 100%, phone plugged in, placed at my desk at room temperature all afternoon. Only relevant variable seemed to be the battery age, and the results improved (along with subjective perceived performance increase) only when I recently had it replaced.
    - IBM 9y ago
      Those 3 conditions are literally what Apple said influence performance in the story you're commenting on.
komali2 9y ago
Upgrading the battery doesn't restore speed, though.
- IBM 9y ago
  Replacing the battery does in fact "restore speed".

Blazespinnaker 9y ago

How about just the ability for a user to replace the battery? Should be a law to cut down on ewaste.

jrs95 9y ago
Most phones are probably getting recycled now anyways, so it really doesn’t matter. In fact, I would think user serviceability would increase waste because people would throw their old batteries away.
- justonepost 9y ago
  Not if you have a fee on the battery such that you have to provide the old one to get a discount.
derpaderp1 9y ago
If they did that then the NSA couldn't turn back on a "powered off" device while you are asleep to bombard you with ultrasonic waves.
IBM 9y ago
iPhones have the longest life of any smartphone and you can verify that yourself by looking at the used market for it (and any Apple product). User replaceable batteries may ironically decrease that and increase waste.
- justonepost 9y ago
  How would replaceable batteries decrease the life of the smartphone?
  - jhiska 9y ago
    It wouldn't. It would obviously increase the lifespan of it. The spinsters are deliberately confusing "lifespan" with "resale value".

jrs95 9y ago

It IS a good idea. My step mom had a high end Samsung phone (not sure exactly which one) and it’s battery degraded enough within a year that it began to shut down randomly a lot.

jhiska 9y ago
I guess that means all Samsung phones ("not sure which ones") are inferior to Apple phones, hm? ;)
- jrs95 9y ago
  Haha, no. It just wasn’t a Note or Galaxy S, but it still cost like $700. Was a bit smaller. No idea what device it was specifically. And she couldn’t replace the battery easily, either. It was non-removable, as are basically all high end Android devices now.
  - wccrawford 9y ago
    I had to replace the batteries in our Nexus 6Ps recently. I didn't buy from Google, so they wouldn't deal with it out of warranty, despite it being a defect. They're replaceable, but they are clearly not meant to be done by the user. There were many opportunities to break pieces of the phone or ruin it completely. It's a horrible design.
    - jhiska 9y ago
      Both the iPhone and the Nexus 6Ps have horrible battery-swap design, but I still don't want to pay middle-men for what should be simple service I should be able to do at home.
      - wccrawford 9y ago
        I fully agree. When I said I replaced the batteries, I meant it literally. I did the work. It was ugly. But it was a hell of a lot cheaper than the quote I got from the repair shop, and I didn't break anything. (Which isn't a surprise... I like fixing things.)

basseq 9y ago

This comment deserves more attention. And, in fact, means the headline is wrong. Apple is not slowing down devices to extend battery life. Apple is slowing down devices to prevent the thing from crapping out entirely ("unexpectedly shutting down"). Arguably, this does more to prevent obsolescence than plan it. Agreed with @djrogers suggestion to alert the user to the situation. It should not be a user choice. "Last year we released a feature for iPhone 6, iPhone 6s and iPhone SE to smooth out the instantaneous peaks only when needed to prevent the device from unexpectedly shutting down during these conditions [cold, low battery, battery age]."

mempko 9y ago
Strange, I have an old HP veer That is 6 years old and it doesn't spontaneously shut down. I have a 3 year old android phone that doesn't spontaneously shut down. What is so special about iPhones and why do they crap out in 2 years?
- swiley 9y ago
  All of the Android phones I've had do when the battery starts to get old, Especially when you use the camera while it's low. Maybe you take better care of your batteries?
- nogridbag 9y ago
  My 2013 Macbook Pro would spontaneously shut down with anywhere between 30-40% battery. I tried a few tips I found online to fix it, but nothing seemed to work.
- esmi 9y ago
  This post gives us an estimate for what percentage of the iPhones are getting throttled by this issue. I think it's reasonable to use this as a proxy to estimate how many units were at risk of shutting down and it is the minority of units. Happily it appears both of your devices are in the majority of units which don't exhibit this issue. https://www.geekbench.com/blog/2017/12/iphone-performance-and-battery-age/ https://www.geekbench.com/blog/2017/12/iphone-performance-an...

jhiska 9y ago

You make a good point. If you consider that you can't easily change the battery in an iPhone without voiding the warranty or paying a premium price to Apple Support then one can make a strong argument that it's sneaky planned obsolescence. Then again, a battery that dies down after a few years and is so difficult to replace is also planned obsolescence.

justonepost 9y ago
It's just another nail in the coffin. OS upgrades requiring more CPU usage, the lack of repair-ability, dying batteries, and now this CPU tweak. It's pretty obvious what apple is doing. We need a law to make them stop or at least one which requires them to declare in obvious language about the things that reduce the functioning of their devices over time.

caconym_ 9y ago

Yeah, this is a real problem that I’ve had with devices in the past and as someone who doesn’t buy the hot new phone every year, I appreciate that Apple is taking steps to keep my 5S happy. That’s a commitment to long-term support that I would not expect from the average Android phone vendor.

scotty79 9y ago

> they're reducing the peak demand on the batteries to avoid spontaneous shutdown when the aged battery can't handle the load. It doesn't seem to help my gf had an iPhone 5 that started dying on peak demand but only after it got upgraded to new ios (i guess 8.0). We replaced it (it had bad battery from the start and apple had a program for replacing those). After few years on new battery it started doing the same thing again. I replaced the battery and it stopped. But I know what I can expect in two years or so. Maybe I should stock on iPhone 5 batteries? Do they age less if they are unused?

valuearb 9y ago
All batteries wear out after a few years of use.
- scotty79 9y ago
  I understand lasting shorter on charge but shutting down when I turn on the camera while on 40% is uniquely apple experience.
  - shoobedowop 9y ago
    nope.
  - nradov 9y ago
    I've seen the same shutdown problem on multiple different Android devices with degraded batteries.
    - scotty79 9y ago
      I must have been lucky then.

deleted 9y ago

[deleted]

jtbayly 9y ago

I think the problem is deeper. They put batteries in these devices that cannot handle load the rest of the hardware demands. Their solution is to just slow down the rest of the hardware. I've got a phone that is nowhere near to needing a new battery. It holds 87% of its original charge capacity. Yet it never runs above 50% speed unless it is above 97% charged, and even then it only runs at 2/3rds original speed.

compiler-guy 9y ago
The batteries handle the load just fine until they start wearing out around 500 cycles.
- JustSomeNobody 9y ago
  How are people getting to 500 cycles in one year?
  - xenadu02 9y ago
    It isn't purely about cycle count. If you ever forget and leave your phone on the car dash in the summer that heat has a permanent negative effect on your battery.

shill 9y ago

My geekbench CPU scores (single-core 1458, multi-core 2480) show that my 6s has been throttled but honestly I hadn't noticed a slowdown. In which apps would I notice a significant difference if I replace my battery? If Safari page load speeds increased I would be happy, but I assume that is more influenced by bandwidth and mobile optimization.

zkms 9y ago

> It's not only to make them run longer - they're reducing the peak demand on the batteries to avoid spontaneous shutdown when the aged battery can't handle the load. Yes. I used to have spontaneous shutdowns on my iPhone 6 in cold weather when the fuel gauge indicated a number like 20% and it was this sort of problem that was meant to be fixed: the CPU using too much current, causing the battery voltage to drop enough to trigger the low-voltage/brownout detector, causing the phone to die. The battery would last long enough (from last full charge to needing to recharge) -- it wasn't inadequate in the energy department -- it just couldn't deliver enough power in cold conditions. Throttling the CPU in those cases (when the aged battery can't deliver enough current) is sensical and extends the life of the phone -- the only serious issue is that the user might think that there is a problem with the CPU or the software (and replace the whole phone) when the problem can be adequately fixed with a new battery (far less expensive than a new phone). The feature is good but Apple's software should be far more proactive in notifying users that this is happening, if only because users jump to a conclusion of "my old phone can't handle this new iOS update, damn Apple making me buy a new phone" rather than "my battery is too old to reliably deliver whatever current the SOC wants".

nielsbot 9y ago
I think you wanted sensical -> sensible. I'll show myself out.
- valuearb 9y ago
  Stop being non-sensical. Just be sensical, man.
twoodfin 9y ago
I think there’s more to this story than mere aging batteries. I had the exact symptoms of this issue with my one year old iPhone 6 Plus in fall of 2015. Add in some very strange battery % readings: Even when it failed to shut down, the phone would drop rapidly from 20% to 1% but then remain there for ten minutes or more. Bizarrely, this behavior (albeit less frequent or severe) jumped to my brand new iPhone 6S Plus in November of that year when I restored it from a backup of the 6 Plus. Both phones had Geniuses run battery diagnostics without finding any unusual degradation. My guess: Apple’s battery “farming” code designed to maximize its life, level drain and charge across the cells, manage load, estimate charge % remaining... is incredibly sophisticated, even so far as to profile your typical use of a device to inform these decisions and estimates. There have been user-visible bugs in this code related to manual clock updates (something I did a fair bit while traveling), and I bet some fraction of these downclocked users have been the victim of that or related bugs. If the code is “farming” the battery incorrectly, some cells may be charged or drained too much for too long, and greatly increase a phone’s susceptibility to these voltage drops, even while the global status of the battery reads as fine.

LusoTycoon 9y ago

Apple did that and people would start cracking iphones open to replace batteries. Not in line with Apple's philosphy.

dbingham 9y ago

Or they could, you know, design the thing so that the battery is replaceable and provide easily accessible replacement batteries.

cjensen 9y ago
Apple will replace the battery for $79 [1]. When you consider the cost for a battery, the labor for replacement, the confidence that this is not a junk replacement, and the warranty for the service, that's a very reasonable price. There is no way Apple is making money on this. [1] https://support.apple.com/iphone/repair/battery-power https://support.apple.com/iphone/repair/battery-power

blensor 9y ago

I can't tell how well it's executed but the major issue I have with this is that this is not properly communicated to the user. I guess most people already get the feeling that their devices slow down after time, or the new apps/OS's just require more potent hardware and replacement of the devices is necessary as time goes by. But for many of those it seems that a "simple" battery replacement would have done the trick as well. If my device has to substantially throttle the performance to avoid a complete shutdown I expect a major notification that something is terribly wrong and I better do something about it. My car had an occasional issue with an exhaust regulation valve and drastically reduced the performance in those situations. Every time I received a notification on the dashboard that the power was reduced but that I can continue driving but that I should visit a service partner as soon as possible. That would be exactly what I expect from a smart device

xster 9y ago
> not properly communicated to the user s/user/buyer Selling a car that markets 300,000 miles but can't drive over 3,000 rpm anymore after the first year is not a car, and marketing it as such is fraud.
- blensor 9y ago
  In my car case it was a know issue of this model and repaired for free within one hour. And while a degraded battery is nothing that needs to be replaced for free, the manufacturer of the phone probably sunk a lot of time and money into developing a strategy to cope with the phone shutdowns due to a degraded battery. During that process it is hard to imagine that no one ever came up with the notion that maybe it would be a good idea to also notify the user that a serious issue is developing which should be handled some time. After all this is not going to get better since the battery will continue degrading (and probably with increasing rate) if it is not replaced.

deleted 9y ago

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falcolas 9y ago

> avoid spontaneous shutdown when the aged battery can't handle the load This doesn't make sense to me. I've been playing with LiPo batteries on quadcopters for a few years now, and I've found that battery capacity is directly related to its voltage, and the voltage decreases in a deterministic fashion according to use. High quality and well maintained LiPo batteries just don't behave randomly - that's why we feel safe attaching them to our houses in the form of Tesla Powercells. Or, in other words, if a phone is showing 40% charge when it shuts down, that's not the battery "spontaneously" being unable to cope with load; that's a bad charge indicator.

xster 9y ago

It's fine rationalizing it but how is that conceptually different from say Comcast saying: "Well actually your 100Mbps connection was just a first year promotional speed and now dropped to 20Mbps unless you sign another limited period contract. Oh, and actually, it's all for good reasons because the crappy modem that you rented at 10$ a month just kinda starts melting if it keeps transmitting at 100Mbps so we just saved your house from burning down. No need to thank us. Sorry we didn't disclose any of this to new customers but don't worry, just give us more money and everything will be ok."

racl101 9y ago

> but Apple should probably have something in iOS that tells people their phone is running slow because the battery is 2 years old. Or a disclaimer telling people the caveats (or cons) of upgrading their OS. More transparency would be great instead of making people feel like the company is pushing them out of their, otherwise, perfectly functional smartphone which cost them a fortune.