8 ms·

Well with WhatsApp being so popular in Europe it is almost impossible to uninstall it.

teekert 9y ago
I'm taking baby steps towards Signal. I think 10% now of my regular "apping" is on Signal. There is still some on Telegram as well.
- Brakenshire 9y ago
  I've been wondering about alternatives, do you find Signal to work well? Can non-technical people install and use it without problems?
  - tonyztan 9y ago
    My (non-technical) friends have found Signal to be mostly easy to use. You should give it a try yourself!
  - arkitaip 9y ago
    I gave Signal a try the other day and the installation and daily usage has been easy and straightforward, very similar to Viber, WhatsApp, etc. I just like the idea of a privacy first messaging app where I can send gifs through Gboard.
  - teekert 9y ago
    Indeed, Signal is nice, a bit lagging in features with respect to Telegram for example, and there are no Group admins which can lead to annoying situations (someone gets a new number, you keep getting error messages until the owner removes himself.) But it's minimal, fast and you have end-to-end encryption with no one storing you phone book (afaik). Self erasing messages can also be handy. I must admit I use that mainly to communicate to myself... for password or wallet public keys etc (desktop app to mobile and vice versa). I have also noticed that even phone calls to the other side of the world are crystal clear, really nice.
  - on_and_off 9y ago
    I have been pushing people towards Telegram (I have never tried Signal). It works a lot like WhatsApp so I don't think anybody has been confused by it.
  - mikehotel 9y ago
    They have made big improvements in their iOS app. One resolved issue that impacted usability was they used to send pics from the selector screen without confirmation, and this resulted in some funny/awkward situations in group chats. Winning people's confidence back is not easy to do, but they have done a remarkable job.
- mancerayder 9y ago
  I love Signal but the reason why WhatsApp is so appealing is that there's a desktop client. I hate having to rely on my phone for texting people.
  - xwvvvvwx 9y ago
    Signal has a desktop client (mac / win / linux): https://signal.org/download/ https://signal.org/download/
  - mkmk 9y ago
    https://signal.org/blog/standalone-signal-desktop/ https://signal.org/blog/standalone-signal-desktop/ :-)
  - teekert 9y ago
    Well... read the reactions... It a cross platform electron app, works really well. I agree, it is a must have imo as well.
  - paimpozhil 9y ago
    Telegram is even better, has a nice desktop client which doesn't really depend on the mobile . Whatsapp's web client is just an UI to the mobile app meaning you also need to have phone connected to internet always for it to work. Telegram is much more responsive compared to the Whatsapp.
    - pmlnr 9y ago
      Telegram is brilliant: small, fast, efficient client for virtually anything, including bitlbee. On the other side, it's probably hacked by most of the agencies, but to be honest: meh. Someone will spy on me anyway; at least I have an efficient, open source client, which isn't trying to spy on me every possible way.
      - lucb1e 9y ago
        > it's probably hacked by most of the agencies umm... citation needed?
- cJ0th 9y ago
  My advice would be Xmpp with OMEMO encryption. On mobile, you can get the Conversations App for Android via Fdroid (no google play!), for the iPhone there is Chatsecure and on the Desktop you can use Gajim. The advantage over Signal would be that 1.) you don't have to share your telephone number and 2.) you don't rely on a single service provider/accounts are decentralized (there are various services for free and paid accounts and you could also host your own server) e: Dear stranger, I'd be very interested in an explanation for your downvote. thanks!
  - StavrosK 9y ago
    I didn't downvote you, but I imagine the counterpoint goes something like "The advantage of Signal over your solution is that more than 3% of the population can set it up".
    - JepZ 9y ago
      The 3% get a little larger when you give them this link (German) ;-) https://www.jabber.de/clients/android-ios/conversations-guide/ https://www.jabber.de/clients/android-ios/conversations-guid... But I agree: it should be even simpler to set up.
      - StavrosK 9y ago
        Conversations does optimize for ease of use versus configurability, which is great, but most people have stuff to do, and figuring out what XMPP parameters to use etc isn't in that list. That's why making something that's as simple as possible is very important. Conversations could go even further and hide the XMPP details, connecting to (or creating an account on) a default server, and have the "advanced" settings behind a "I already have an XMPP account" link.
    - fineng123 9y ago
      Lol he doesn't get it I think those types live in this world where everyone is savvy enough to do these things
  - 9y ago
- mtgx 9y ago
  Get people to use Signal as a text messaging replacement app (the default Android one isn't that great anyway). Then, when they send you a message from it, the message will be E2E because you have Signal installed, too.
  - izacus 9y ago
    Signal severely breaks SMS handling on Android (it hijacks the store and stops reporting SMS to the OS, breaking backups, sync and other uses) so that's really not a good idea.
  - jorams 9y ago
    The problem with that approach is that in Europe (at least parts of it, I'm from the Netherlands and this probably doesn't apply to every single country), "text messaging" was largely replaced by WhatsApp. Getting someone to contact you over SMS instead of WhatsApp already requires a change in behavior. Once you have to explain to someone why you want them to contact you through something other than WhatsApp, the SMS angle is already irrelevant.
- amelius 9y ago
  Who do you app with? Yourself? :)
rihegher 9y ago
Once/If ethereum payment get popular message apps like toshi or status.im may get popular as well
lucb1e 9y ago
I installed WhatsApp two months ago for the chat group of our class, and intend to uninstall it by June again when this study is over. On Telegram I have at least twenty chats active daily (people and several groups, and an HN bot). Everyone I want to talk to, except for that one class-wide group, is on Telegram. Even the people I do projects with in class have Telegram (I feel like there's a correlation to be drawn...), just not everybody had it so the class-wide group turned into a WhatsApp group and I had to acquiesce. It's not impossible to uninstall. I hear this sentiment from most people, and most people are surprised I can live without WhatsApp. I am surprised they're surprised: it's not a bother at all. Almost everybody that I wanted to talk to had Telegram already anyway, and the three or so others installed it (I mean, if you're selling your soul anyway, you might as well install another...). Even some of the IRC-based groups have bridges to Telegram (via bots that forward things in between), though I still run a bouncer so IRC would be no issue.

I'm taking baby steps towards Signal. I think 10% now of my regular "apping" is on Signal. There is still some on Telegram as well.

Brakenshire 9y ago
I've been wondering about alternatives, do you find Signal to work well? Can non-technical people install and use it without problems?
- tonyztan 9y ago
  My (non-technical) friends have found Signal to be mostly easy to use. You should give it a try yourself!
- arkitaip 9y ago
  I gave Signal a try the other day and the installation and daily usage has been easy and straightforward, very similar to Viber, WhatsApp, etc. I just like the idea of a privacy first messaging app where I can send gifs through Gboard.
- teekert 9y ago
  Indeed, Signal is nice, a bit lagging in features with respect to Telegram for example, and there are no Group admins which can lead to annoying situations (someone gets a new number, you keep getting error messages until the owner removes himself.) But it's minimal, fast and you have end-to-end encryption with no one storing you phone book (afaik). Self erasing messages can also be handy. I must admit I use that mainly to communicate to myself... for password or wallet public keys etc (desktop app to mobile and vice versa). I have also noticed that even phone calls to the other side of the world are crystal clear, really nice.
- on_and_off 9y ago
  I have been pushing people towards Telegram (I have never tried Signal). It works a lot like WhatsApp so I don't think anybody has been confused by it.
- mikehotel 9y ago
  They have made big improvements in their iOS app. One resolved issue that impacted usability was they used to send pics from the selector screen without confirmation, and this resulted in some funny/awkward situations in group chats. Winning people's confidence back is not easy to do, but they have done a remarkable job.
mancerayder 9y ago
I love Signal but the reason why WhatsApp is so appealing is that there's a desktop client. I hate having to rely on my phone for texting people.
- xwvvvvwx 9y ago
  Signal has a desktop client (mac / win / linux): https://signal.org/download/ https://signal.org/download/
- mkmk 9y ago
  https://signal.org/blog/standalone-signal-desktop/ https://signal.org/blog/standalone-signal-desktop/ :-)
- teekert 9y ago
  Well... read the reactions... It a cross platform electron app, works really well. I agree, it is a must have imo as well.
- paimpozhil 9y ago
  Telegram is even better, has a nice desktop client which doesn't really depend on the mobile . Whatsapp's web client is just an UI to the mobile app meaning you also need to have phone connected to internet always for it to work. Telegram is much more responsive compared to the Whatsapp.
  - pmlnr 9y ago
    Telegram is brilliant: small, fast, efficient client for virtually anything, including bitlbee. On the other side, it's probably hacked by most of the agencies, but to be honest: meh. Someone will spy on me anyway; at least I have an efficient, open source client, which isn't trying to spy on me every possible way.
    - lucb1e 9y ago
      > it's probably hacked by most of the agencies umm... citation needed?
cJ0th 9y ago
My advice would be Xmpp with OMEMO encryption. On mobile, you can get the Conversations App for Android via Fdroid (no google play!), for the iPhone there is Chatsecure and on the Desktop you can use Gajim. The advantage over Signal would be that 1.) you don't have to share your telephone number and 2.) you don't rely on a single service provider/accounts are decentralized (there are various services for free and paid accounts and you could also host your own server) e: Dear stranger, I'd be very interested in an explanation for your downvote. thanks!
- StavrosK 9y ago
  I didn't downvote you, but I imagine the counterpoint goes something like "The advantage of Signal over your solution is that more than 3% of the population can set it up".
  - JepZ 9y ago
    The 3% get a little larger when you give them this link (German) ;-) https://www.jabber.de/clients/android-ios/conversations-guide/ https://www.jabber.de/clients/android-ios/conversations-guid... But I agree: it should be even simpler to set up.
    - StavrosK 9y ago
      Conversations does optimize for ease of use versus configurability, which is great, but most people have stuff to do, and figuring out what XMPP parameters to use etc isn't in that list. That's why making something that's as simple as possible is very important. Conversations could go even further and hide the XMPP details, connecting to (or creating an account on) a default server, and have the "advanced" settings behind a "I already have an XMPP account" link.
  - fineng123 9y ago
    Lol he doesn't get it I think those types live in this world where everyone is savvy enough to do these things
- 9y ago
mtgx 9y ago
Get people to use Signal as a text messaging replacement app (the default Android one isn't that great anyway). Then, when they send you a message from it, the message will be E2E because you have Signal installed, too.
- izacus 9y ago
  Signal severely breaks SMS handling on Android (it hijacks the store and stops reporting SMS to the OS, breaking backups, sync and other uses) so that's really not a good idea.
- jorams 9y ago
  The problem with that approach is that in Europe (at least parts of it, I'm from the Netherlands and this probably doesn't apply to every single country), "text messaging" was largely replaced by WhatsApp. Getting someone to contact you over SMS instead of WhatsApp already requires a change in behavior. Once you have to explain to someone why you want them to contact you through something other than WhatsApp, the SMS angle is already irrelevant.
amelius 9y ago
Who do you app with? Yourself? :)

rihegher 9y ago

Once/If ethereum payment get popular message apps like toshi or status.im may get popular as well

lucb1e 9y ago

I installed WhatsApp two months ago for the chat group of our class, and intend to uninstall it by June again when this study is over. On Telegram I have at least twenty chats active daily (people and several groups, and an HN bot). Everyone I want to talk to, except for that one class-wide group, is on Telegram. Even the people I do projects with in class have Telegram (I feel like there's a correlation to be drawn...), just not everybody had it so the class-wide group turned into a WhatsApp group and I had to acquiesce. It's not impossible to uninstall. I hear this sentiment from most people, and most people are surprised I can live without WhatsApp. I am surprised they're surprised: it's not a bother at all. Almost everybody that I wanted to talk to had Telegram already anyway, and the three or so others installed it (I mean, if you're selling your soul anyway, you might as well install another...). Even some of the IRC-based groups have bridges to Telegram (via bots that forward things in between), though I still run a bouncer so IRC would be no issue.