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A deal that let hundreds of IS fighters and their families escape from Raqqa
- cloakandswagger 9y agoNot sure how much of a secret this really was. One of these convoys got stuck in the Syrian desert on its way to Iraq and was widely reported on.
- ezconnect 9y agoThat's a different convoy, from Lebanon and it's in southern Syria.
- inconv 9y agoIt is a well known fact that ISIS was instructed by SAS and American special forces. They have also been reported that ISIS commanders where airlifted by American helicopters. So much about fighting terrorism. United States along with Britain and other European nations have been become the epiphany of hypocrisy( remember the bombing of Libya where British and French were giving a hand to the Americans?). These facts should make every American feel deep shame for their country, but shame was not a human trait when I was living in the States a long time ago. Let's make a million dollars, no matter who dies is the American Motto.
- fujvvvv 9y agoSources please
- Terr_ 9y agoFor such a "well-known fact", I haven't heard of it. (I suppose it could be true in the sense that some nonzero number of ISIS members were formerly part of local militaries.) Where did you hear it, Mr. Throwaway-account created just 9 minutes ago?
- Dolores12 9y ago>Where did you hear it, Mr. Throwaway-account created just 9 minutes ago? Seeing so many downvotes for an honest opinion seems like it was wise desicion.
- deleted 9y ago[deleted]
- icebraining 9y agoThose were not just opinions, those were also unsupported factual claims.
- endymi0n 9y ago[citation needed]
- forvelin 9y agoCan you please give sources, how do you know that they are instructed by SAS ? This is very common theory with no backing that I know.
- Dolores12 9y agothis video can give you few hints. i have struggled to find it, seems like rt videos are penalized. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1mliCy4GN2w https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1mliCy4GN2w here is text version http://www.vrenergie.com/index.php/fuel-qxxi-centuryq/2329-breaking-russia-presents-satellite-proof-of-us-troops-collaborating-with-isis-in-syria.html http://www.vrenergie.com/index.php/fuel-qxxi-centuryq/2329-b...
- def_true_false 9y agoLet's not pretend that RT is any more trustworthy than infowars.
- mrarjen 9y agoOnly sources on this I can find is that in a way the US created ISIS by bombing a whole lot of civilians in the region and thus fueling an uprising. Nothing concrete regarding the SAS or Special Forces training them.
- jacobush 9y agoNot exactly, but instead along these lines: The US civil administrator of Iraq fired 400 000 Army men, majority sunni. Now, you have 400 000 families with no food on the table. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Paul_Bremer#Disbanding_the_Iraqi_Army https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Paul_Bremer#Disbanding_the_Ira... Cue 15 years of chaos and strife, and the ISIS has fertile ground to sow their seeds of hatred in. A significant fraction of these disgruntled 400 000 army men apparently decided to lend their services to ISIS. Edit: to voiceless down voters - of course your standpoint is that doing the above was of no consequence, or maybe even helped delay the creation of ISIS? So absurd... Edit2: Se child comment.
- dba7dba 9y agoI always wanted to know who made the idiotic decision to disband the ENTIRE Iraqi army. Was it from the white house or someone in Iraq like P. Beemer? A lot of the ills of Iraq after Saddam fell was due to disbanding of the army. Imho.
- jacobush 9y ago”On May 23, 2003, Bremer issued Order Number 2, in effect dissolving the entire former Iraqi army[40] and putting 400,000 former Iraqi soldiers out of work.” As for who made him do it, I don’t know. But as you said, it was idiotic. And that’s worse than evil. Dietrich Bonhoeffer would agree with me.
- wolco 9y agoI'm not sure it was a bad move. Leaving the army and power structures in place would have created conditions for a civil war that could have spilled over the entire region. Leaving the defeated minority population to continue ruling over the south and kurds would have been a blood bath. Disbanding created isis but not disbanding would have been worse. We'll never know how worse things could have gotten.
- asfbaofbaso 9y agoI haven't heard this claim before but here's more solid stuff: - How the US disbanding the Iraqi Army created the environment for ISIS to form. http://time.com/3900753/isis-iraq-syria-army-united-states-military/ http://time.com/3900753/isis-iraq-syria-army-united-states-m... - The US is always giving arms and training to "moderate" groups throughout the middle east. It's so frequent that without a doubt, I can predict that some of those groups were later acquired by ISIS or had members trained by the US desert for ISIS. This kind of thing happens so frequently that the main conclusion you can draw, along with the rest of the contextual evidence that is too lengthy to go into detail here relating to drone strikes, the invasion of Iraq and Afghanistan, etc is that the US just does not give a fuck about supporting or creating more terror groups in the name of dominating strategic geopolitical territories.
- TausAmmer 9y agoNo government is your friend, don't be outraged, consider them as lowest of the scum that rule by power and fear, that is it. Life makes more sense then.
- jokoon 9y agoI'm tired of reading this crap again and again. First, IS is always recruiting and trying to turn people to their sides. Secondly, it's impossible to know the ideology of every armed group, as there are many nuances, and that's what makes this war complex, you don't know who to root for. Third, when a secular group like the FSA is losing battles, IS is getting hands on weapons and military gear, so stop saying that the west is arming terrorists. They captured those guns who were given to good enough guys. Fourth, this conflict is ongoing, is very messy and disorganized (involved: russia, the US, european countries, irak, IS, the kurds, assad, the FSA, other groups financed by who knows, Iran? saudi arabia?), and it's not a secret that intel agencies will do whatever they can to calm things down, but it's not easy because they use secrecy as they should. So you don't bring proof, and you don't bring any solution to the problem either. You just sow distrust and confusion which makes everything worse. Stop with those conspiracy theories.
- jankotek 9y ago> US jet flew very low and deployed flares to light up the area. IS fighters shat their pants. .....%$#%^
- alain_gilbert 9y agoI cannot find any specific date on this article. I wonder if it is the same convoy. http://www.bestgore.com/murder/video-isis-convoy-safe-evacuation-raqqa-thank-wp-cover-us-military/ http://www.bestgore.com/murder/video-isis-convoy-safe-evacua... I would say no since the article says: No flags or banners would be allowed to be flown from the convoy as it left the city, the deal stipulated Otherwise, this kind of escape date from june 13, 2017. Edit: The article says "But when he and his fellow drivers assembled their convoy early on 12 October"
- arlk 9y agoThis is an old video from Deir Al-Zoor and it says in Arabic 'Caliphate army mobilizing to assist Deir Al-zoor'. Not from Raqqa. Citing Al-Masdar propaganda website should be enough to know how credible is this.
- alain_gilbert 9y agoI'm not very knowledgeable about all of this. But looking at the map, it seems like Deir Al-zoor is more or less where they said the convoy went. (Sections of convoy later spotted here) Saying "mobilizing to assist Deir Al-zoor" sounds better (on a IS point of view) than "evacuating Raqqah".
- frandroid 9y agoBasically, either you let ISIS escape, or you completely flatten the city to get rid of them. I mean considering the way Raqqa looks now, I'm not sure it was effective in preventing much destruction, but if you have an opportunity to save a large city, you try to.
- JohnStrange 9y agoSeconded. This sounds like a reasonable deal that probably prevented a lot of civilian deaths of people who could have been caught in the crossfire.
- cm2187 9y agoBut the potential price is more suicide attacks in the streets of Paris or London. Not a concern of the SDF of course (and who could blame them?), but what outcome is more desirable from a western point of view is less obvious to me.
- raverbashing 9y agoThen maybe the west should actually check who crosses their borders instead of just waving anyone through if they come from a boat And increase their intelligence resources and not be afraid to act on radical preachers
- icebraining 9y agoWhat makes you think the West doesn't check who crosses the borders? What do you think the dozens of thousands of people stuck in detaining centers all over Greece and Italy are waiting for?
- emn13 9y agoYou do realize that e.g. the US spends approximately as much on the DHS (which is primarily borders+immigration stuff) as on the FBI, CIA, NSA, DEA and FBP (federal prisons) combined? And that's the US, which through history and geography has had the luck of relatively trivial borders? Border control is a huge focus! It's also an almost impossible task, which is not something people want to hear. It'd be easier to claim western countries spend too much on controlling their borders simply because all that cash doesn't seem to have had the desired effect, judging by popular opinion.
- Dolores12 9y agoIt was so nice of United States to make sure none of ISIS fighters were harmed. It is just unbelievable. They make deals with terrorists.
- swombat 9y agoThe only people who don't make deals with terrorists are in the movies. All the world's governments make deals with terrorists.
- Dolores12 9y agoIs it totally fine for lets say Mexican government to make a deal with terrorists on american territory and let them go?
- chmod775 9y agoI never understood how any armed muslim automatically becomes a "terrorist" in the eyes of the world. Most ISIS fighters aren't terrorists.
- type0 9y ago> Most ISIS fighters aren't terrorists. What are they then, freedom fighters?
- dagw 9y agoWhat's wrong with 'militants'?
- chmod775 9y agoThey're a militant group, and they claim to be a state, though they are unrecognized. I don't even understand how the label "terrorist" applies to the lot of them. It's like everyone has forgotten what the term terrorist means. We might as well change the dictionary definition to "armed muslim" now.
- status 9y agoPeople are still in denial of the double game US government is playing in Syria. The same way one couldn't deny that US government trained and supplied Talibans with stinger rockets. The very same people that now US condemn as terrorist and fight with. The Talibans were the good freedom fighters when they fought with Russia now they are the bad once what is this? "It also seems like you're willfully ignoring the history about the US allying with the Taliban during the Soviet invasion." Nope you are ignoring the fact that US is applying military force to keep the pro-western government in Afghanistan otherwise it will be long time gone. Isn't that an invasion?
- Haydos585x2 9y agoThe US strategy seems pretty simple. A free, democratic or perhaps autocratic pro-western government. It also seems like you're willfully ignoring the history about the US allying with the Taliban during the Soviet invasion.
- tryingagainbro 9y agoNo Iranian and no Russian influence. ISIS and others may seem as a temporary thing that will go away after a few bombings but keeping Russia out of ME and Iran contained is very important. Israel wants the same, coincidentally ;)
- Udik 9y agoWhat they really want is having no semblance of a state that might have interests conflicting with those of a few friends, namely Israel and Saudi Arabia. Anything else, including pure chaos, terrorism, misery and starvation seems to be a perfectly acceptable alternative.
- RaleyField 9y ago> The same way one couldn't deny Taliban were formed after Soviets pulled out so maybe one could deny that. But why research your history when one could repeat contrarian narratives.
- jacobr 9y agoThis was an agreement between local tribes and the Syrian Democratic Forces to limit the already immense destruction of Raqqa and protect civilians that were held as human shields. If the Syrian Democratic Forces and the US to just say "No survivors!" and release the MOAB they would likely have a very hard time gaining the trust of the local tribes and communities in the future. "This was a local solution to local issue. Coalition did not fully agree, but respected our partners decision." - https://twitter.com/OIRSpox/status/930166228727066626 https://twitter.com/OIRSpox/status/930166228727066626
- w458cmau 9y agoIs it a local issue if those who were let go (with weapons and ammunition) immediately take up their weapons in a different part of the region?
- gumby 9y agoDid anyone even read that article? You have to scroll a lot to get a tiny fragment of text, so I gave up. It must be depressing to be a BBC writer and then see your hard work shredded into tiny chunks.
- thebiglebrewski 9y agoI was listening to this on NPR and saw that they also allowed them to take 10 trucks of weapons with them...I mean...couldn't they have just targeted those trucks once the convoy left? I don't get it.