11 ms·

The iPhones 8

115 points by msh 9y ago

pupppet 9y ago
Hey look, another glowing review from Apple's favorite cheerleader.
- emsy 9y ago
  I think Gruber's pieces about Apple are mostly useless, because he always seems heavily biased. Compare that to e.g. the ATP podcast, which is hosted by Apple fans but seems to contain more criticism and less apologism.
  - atonse 9y ago
    Yup I relate a lot more to ATP than The Talk Show because of the amazing mental gymnastics Gruber goes through to justify all kinds of things that are objectively issues I have with my Apple gear. It's no surprise that Apple executives give him all kinds of exclusives.
  - iClaudiusX 9y ago
    John Siracusa and Marco Arment are great at getting to the parts where Apple can improve. My only fault with them is their idea of Windows seems stuck in the days of XP. Casey Liss, however, is just a cheerleader who would rather self-flagellate about his unworthiness to see Apple's blinding genius.
    - orbitur 9y ago
      Since you brought him up, Liss gets on my nerves because not only does he insist that something works fine for him, but he goes on extended rants about how everything is fine and he can't see what Arment/Siracusa are talking about. Like, he spends a lot of time claiming everything is fine but in an argumentative way. It's boring and frustrating. Marco's problematic/annoying in his own way, but Casey is aggressively... status quo???
      - atonse 9y ago
        But the fact that they have 3 distinct personalities also makes the show interesting, rather than many other podcasts where people just agree with each other (like the aforementioned Talk Show)
- orbitur 9y ago
  Do you actually think there's anything bad to write about with these?
- matwood 9y ago
  He's been critical of the camera bump and the notch. The main thing he's fighting against is this review is that the 8 is _not_ an upgrade over the 7. I think it is, but YMMV.
- zeveb 9y ago
  What's remarkable is how muted it is. If Apple decided to publish date of birth, Social Security number, mother's maiden name & complete chat history for all iOS users Gruber would write a blog detailing how this would be a welcome radical move to total transparency which will encourage the U.S. financial system to switch to more secure authentication options &c. &c. &c. The fact that his review is not 'this is the best, greatest, most wonderful thing that has ever happened in the entire history of mankind; Apple is mother, Apple is father; hail Jobs!' indicates how very unimpressing the newest iPhones are.
  - elicash 9y ago
    Or maybe it indicates that your caricature isn't rooted in fact?
asafira 9y ago
Why is this the review that is making it to the front page? There are lots of sources that have, or will have, much better insights into the phone and tech that will spur much better conversation on HN; I hope one of those surfaces, too.
- Brendinooo 9y ago
  I think the author is a homer for sure, but his reviews are a lot more practical, more Walt Mossberg than Ars Technica. It's nice to know what's under the hood but it's also nice to know what the phone feels like in day-to-day use, and I think Mr. Gruber covers that well. And, for anyone who's already in the ecosystem, I think he's really good at relating new products to existing ones.
  - asafira 9y ago
    Can you give an example of how Mr. Gruber covers something "day-to-day" well? Not that examples don't exist, but I have a pretty unhappy relationship with more touchy-feely metrics. Example: battery life. A good description of how battery life is dealt with in most reviews is "awfully": battery life depends on a crazy number of details that it is really hard to properly capture "day-to-day" usage in a review. A person that rarely uses their phone vs. one that plays games all day vs. one that uses the web browser all the time vs one that uses navigation all the time vs one that snapchats all day are going to see very different battery life performance; unless the phone is atrociously bad (which has happened before, too), it's hard to be able to properly gauge battery life.
whitehouse3 9y ago
> These are solid year-over-year updates — at least as impressive as the iPhone 7 was over the iPhone 6S. If they hadn’t debuted alongside the iPhone X we’d be arguing about whether these are the most impressive new iPhone models since the iPhone 6. There’s a lot to love about them and nothing to dislike. People who buy the iPhone 8 won't feel the satisfaction of owning the latest and greatest iPhone. That's what makes this update boring. It's already out of date.
- Geee 9y ago
  People who want a great phone buy the 8. People who are Apple fanatics and/or too rich and/or need a status symbol buy the X.
  - ceejayoz 9y ago
    I'm personally considering the X because I suspect folks will do cool stuff with the new sensors. The dot projector, in particular, seems like it may be useful for 3D mapping of objects - would be pretty cool to wave your phone at something and be able to send the scan straight to a printer.
    - izacus 9y ago
      I didn't find any APIs for the new sensors - are those even exposed to the developers?
      - ropiku 9y ago
        Not directly but ARKit exposes face tracking, expressions and other info: https://developer.apple.com/videos/play/fall2017/601/ https://developer.apple.com/videos/play/fall2017/601/ https://developer.apple.com/documentation/arkit/creating_face_based_ar_experiences https://developer.apple.com/documentation/arkit/creating_fac...
    - problems 9y ago
      Unfortunately, Apple being Apple - doesn't expose those new sensors in any APIs.
mozumder 9y ago
One advantage of the iPhone 8+ over the iPhone X is that the display is wider, and that makes it easier to read larger accessibility fonts. My parents are keeping the plus size because of that.
- merpnderp 9y ago
  That's something I noticed too. I don't like the new aspect ratio of the X, but I want rid of the home button so much I'll deal with it.
- jghn 9y ago
  One advantage of the iPhone 8 over the iPhone X is that it's not a monstrous size. Even though the iPhone X is only slightly larger than the iPhone 7, the screen is still ridiculously larger, particularly since they got rid of the feature where it'll shrink the screen. I don't know why the market has decided that two hand smartphone usage is king, but it makes me sad. As someone who is frequently forced to use my device one handed and on the move its getting harder and harder to deal with.
  - jcadam 9y ago
    I know. I wish they would update the iPhone SE (my current phone). As it is, looks like I'm not upgrading anytime soon.
    - jghn 9y ago
      I got sort of used to the size of the 7. After a year I'm still at the point where it annoys me at times but otherwise is fine. A hair smaller in height would be perfect for my needs. I was intrigued by the X in that I was willing to go a hair higher in height for a much larger screen until I realized they got rid of the small-scaling feature I still can't think of the name of. Considering I already use that all the time on my 7 and the screen is about to get much larger, it'd be necessary for me to get by.
  - musage 9y ago
    Having a flip phone I get a kick out of it how dorky people look using their gadgets, the same way the one button mouse made me laugh when I had an actual one. More of all that, please. As long as it's more than a piece of cloth people chew on while staring off into the distance it's still way too useful and all the important people know it.
hectorlorenzo 9y ago
> After six days of daily use, this iPhone 8 shows no scratches or “micro-abrasions” whatsoever. When did we start having such low expectations of products? (my italics) Edit: grammar.
- elicash 9y ago
  His point was that while it has the same feel of the last-generation jet black version, it doesn't have the same downside of it.
  - hectorlorenzo 9y ago
    I understand. My point is broader. Even if he's comparing to last year's product, he promotes this as a bonus. He is happy that the product is in mint condition after 6 days. Not even a week. It's slightly sad.
    - michaelt 9y ago
      Ugh, I noticed the same thing a few weeks ago reading reviews of battery life. Apparently "good" battery life these days means "in more sedate conditions it's easily going to get you home to a charger." When did people's expectations get so low?
    - rwc 9y ago
      You're reading too much into it. It was never presented as a "bonus", rather an honest accounting of why one material may be better than another. Both are "tacky" feeling, but only one didn't show wear and tear just one week into use.
- sp332 9y ago
  I got a noticeable scratch on my Galaxy S6 in less than a week. And it's not even made of glass. I don't expect anything I put in my pockets to remain in "mint condition" for very long.
- pornel 9y ago
  He couldn't test for longer, so it's not expectation of short lifetime, but stated limitation of the test. Plus, there is a very high expectation of having a material that is pleasant to touch, easy to grip, but is extremely hard, does not shatter and does not scratch even on a micro level.
basseq 9y ago
A lot of people out there have been asking me who the iPhone 8 is for, other than people who can’t or don’t want to spend $999 or more on an iPhone X. Well... Jesus. "Only cheapskates buy the 8", apparently. I pre-ordered the 8 Plus, because: - It was available a month sooner and I need a new phone. - The 8 Plus has all the same internals and features. I really just wanted the camera. - Face unlock seems gimmicky. Maybe next generation. - $200+ for what amounts to a "better" screen and "cooler" form factor: not worth it. So I guess I do fall into the "don't want to spend $999" category. Look down on me, pedants!
- noncoml 9y ago
  Don’t take it personally, nobody call you cheapskate. What I actually think that he means is that there is pretty much no difference between the two, other than the price and the form factor. But I will give you one more reason to not stick with 8: it’s a safer bet, it’s the fourth iteration of a well tested design, so I don’t expect to have any problems. On the other hand I am afraid the usual first Apple product generation problems will be there in X.
- philtar 9y ago
  Why not order a 7?
  - dagw 9y ago
    The 8 has a better camera.
  - fish_fan 9y ago
    Inductive charging!
    - basseq 9y ago
      I do like inductive charging, but I often find myself futzing about on my phone in bed at the end of the day, and my phone's on 5%. So I plug it in and keep using it. Hard to do that with inductive charging. Granted, my current iPhone is literally dying a protracted death[1], so YMMV. [1] Battery jumps around, screen doesn't work half the time, etc.
TurboHaskal 9y ago
> I like this change from three sizes to just two. Oh, come on...
bane 9y ago
This was a weirdly subdued review by Gruber, it even brings up areas where competitors have been doing something for a while without going through the normal Gruberian mental gymnastics to justify it. He even brings up Apple's inexplicable need to have a 16 GB base model until this year without trying to justify it. Gruber often gets himself in trouble by omission as much as by the circus-show of what he writes. But there's very little of that here. This reads like an honest review. My tl;dr of it is "It's a solid year over year update from the 7." note Not to worry, his previous articles will send the critically thinking reader down the road to infuration just like one might expect...I was afraid Gruber was losing his edge.
- Eridrus 9y ago
  All of the phones Apple released are boring, so it's kind of not surprising that people aren't worked up about it. At least to people who watch gadgets. The Mi Mix was a revelation, the iPhone X is just what people expected before all the leaks, with the exception of FaceID, which got leaked. Still, every time I see someone writing about Apple design, it seems like it's great when Apple does it - its even better than last year's model! - but it's always bad when competitors were. I'm still completely jealous of iPhone battery life though.
  - currysausage 9y ago
    > the iPhone X is just what people expected But that's the point of iPhones nowadays, isn't it? Shipping features only when they feel ready (e.g. I guess this [1] won't be possible with Face ID). I switched from Android to iOS when I decided that I want a boring (but elegant) smartphone that bothers me as little as possible. > Apple design, it seems like it's great when Apple does it What many of their customers value, I think, is that Apple tends to get the big picture and the details right quite often. The big picture: When I buy an Apple phone, I can be quite sure not to see this on the default lockscreen: [2]. The details: [3]. You don't have to appreciate this level of detail, but some people do. That being said, not even Gruber claims that recent iPhones are "perfect" design-wise. [4] Just more detail-oriented than most competitors. > I'm still completely jealous of iPhone battery life though. Bought an iPhone 7 ½ year ago. I don't think battery life is anything to be jealous about. I hear good things about the Plus models though. [1] http://www.businessinsider.com/samsung-galaxy-note-8-facial-recognition-tricked-with-a-photo-2017-9 http://www.businessinsider.com/samsung-galaxy-note-8-facial-... [2] https://twitter.com/dcseifert/status/905104470429851648 https://twitter.com/dcseifert/status/905104470429851648 [3] https://www.imore.com/sites/imore.com/files/styles/larger/public/field/image/2015/04/galaxy-s6-bottom-alignment.jpg https://www.imore.com/sites/imore.com/files/styles/larger/pu... [4] https://daringfireball.net/2017/09/iphone_x_event_thoughts_and_observations#fn1-2017-09-14 https://daringfireball.net/2017/09/iphone_x_event_thoughts_a... (Footnote 1)
bischofs 9y ago
The pricing has changed slightly since last year. Last year’s entry model iPhone 7 cost $649. This year’s 64 GB iPhone 8 costs $699. Apple, of course, has no explanation for this. Since the price of new iphones is obviously rising faster than inflation, it begs the question; where is the market willing to go? Are most people okay with monthly payments on phones when they were never at that point with computers?
- criddell 9y ago
  > Are most people okay with monthly payments on phones They have been so far.
- MBCook 9y ago
  The explanation stated/assumed elsewhere is that the price of flash has gone up significantly in the last year and may go up further. Apple is changing the price now. Obviously they could have just taken a hit to their margins instead, but that wouldn’t be Apple-like. (I’m an Apple fan, but they love their margins)
- orbitur 9y ago
  Anyone who does even a little research knows flash storage prices are going up. And anyone who pays attention to Apple knows that they have a target margin on their hardware (non-cable, non-accessory), and it's immovable. They will not budge on it. It's frustrating. I have no doubt current RAM prices also contribute to the MBP's overpriced feeling, and it's also why 32GB is seemingly unimportant to Apple at the moment.
- vvhn 9y ago
  There’s some interesting pricing games being played by Apple. For all new models, The 256GB price is the same, the 128GB and 32GB have been eliminated and in their place a single 64GB model in between ( 700 ) the price of the 32 ( 649 ) and the 64 (749 ). Personally the 128 GB was the sweet spot - 32/64 are too little and 256 is too much
- always_good 9y ago
  >Are most people okay with monthly payments on phones when they were never at that point with computers? Huh? Do you think people don't use minimum monthly payment financing on laptops and desktop computers? There are people who use that option for anything that costs in the 3 digits. How is a phone any different?
TYPE_FASTER 9y ago
The thing that struck me watching the keynote was the positioning of the iPhone 8 and the iPhone X. I think Apple knows the majority of people will buy the iPhone 8 Plus, and the X is targeted at two niches: pro Instagrammers, and kids who always get the flagship and use Snapchat. For social media pros, max selfie is a revenue stream, and the X will get them more views. The X is the modern Mac Pro, since the modern content creator is living in Instagram. I have a 6, and would like an 8 Plus. The difference between the camera on the 6 and the 7 in indoor lighting is noticeable to me, and I use my phone mostly as a camera these days.
- MBCook 9y ago
  I’ll be getting an X because I think it’s neat, I’ve got a 7 now. I agree with reviews I’ve seen elsewhere. If you have a 6 or 6S it will be a huge jump in performance and camera quality, totally worth it. If you have a 7 it’s a nice upgrade (especially for TrueTone) but you could easily go without. The 7 was a massive jump over my 6. The 8 is a huge jump (in performance) over the 7. Coming from a 6? You’ll love it.
davidivadavid 9y ago
I don't understand his rant about "wireless" charging. He wrote a whole article about it with two dictionary definitions that completely contradict his own point, too. Wireless means there's no wire and you don't need to plug your phone to charge it. So it's wireless charging.
- jmull 9y ago
  I think the objection is because there's still a wire between the wall and the pad, and your phone still has to be on the pad. That is, your phone still has to be physically connected, through a wire, to an electrical outlet. Maybe "plugless" is a term that more accurately describes the benefit. IMO, it's a very nice benefit so I don't mean to minimize it. We suppose that eventually there will be some kind of charging where you don't even have to set your device on a pad -- I guess it will charge if you just get it into a charging area or room. Then we might want to call that wireless but the term will be taken. I don't think that's really an issue though. That's a marketing issue we can let the marketing people solve if/when we get there. I'd probably try to call it "True Wireless" or "Long Wireless" but that's probably a sign of why I'm not a marketing person.
- SirHound 9y ago
  It's wireless to a pedant. The interface isn't a wire going physically into the phone, but the phone has to be physically connected to the pad. In some ways it's even less convenient than wired charging. Try reading and charging in bed. The term "wireless" clearly invokes imagery of a kind of ambient charging. Marketeers know this, and the term is used in bad faith.
- clashmoore 9y ago
  The rant is about how to charge the iPhone or any device with "wireless" charging is that you still need the wire to be touching the phone or device. There is still a wire involved and they're calling it "wireless".
  - jbob2000 9y ago
    It's a petty semantic argument. You don't need to plug it into your phone, which is the annoying part. You just plug the pad in and leave it plugged in forever. You require much less accuracy to charge your phone now. It will be a boon to people who suffer from tremors or have weak hands.
vladdanilov 9y ago
To recap: Glass + Stainless Steel > Aluminum / Plastic > Glass + Aluminum > Glass + Stainless Steel 2010 > 2017 > The lighting effects in Portrait mode, though, are interesting… There have also been a few [shots] where the edges … have confused the hell out of the iPhone’s depth sensing… original Portrait mode last year shipped in similar state… When it works, though, … > … what exactly was “bionic” about the A11 chip … from Apple marketing-speak to plain English, is that The Bionic Man and Woman were cool, and the A11 chip is very cool. Brand new iPhone 8 “high-speed charging” vs year-old iPhone 7 charging: > 30 minutes it was at 54 percent, and at 45 minutes it was at 72 percent > 30 minutes it was at 43 percent, and at 45 minutes it was at 65 percent True Tone, mostly software and probably $10 of hardware, is the only noticeable display improvement. > Last year’s entry model iPhone 7 cost $649. This year’s 64 GB iPhone 8 costs $699. Apple, of course, has no explanation for this.
deleted 9y ago
[deleted]
davidcollantes 9y ago
> But they did debut alongside the iPhone X, and because of that almost nobody is excited about them... Only thing I don't agree with on this post. Because of the price tag, and the notch -- mostly -- the X hasn't impressed me much. The 8, and 8Plus, on the other hand, are closer to what I was expecting: an iPhone with upgraded hardware, and unique features (compared to the previous versions).

The iPhones 8

115 points by msh 9y ago

pupppet 9y ago

Hey look, another glowing review from Apple's favorite cheerleader.

emsy 9y ago
I think Gruber's pieces about Apple are mostly useless, because he always seems heavily biased. Compare that to e.g. the ATP podcast, which is hosted by Apple fans but seems to contain more criticism and less apologism.
- atonse 9y ago
  Yup I relate a lot more to ATP than The Talk Show because of the amazing mental gymnastics Gruber goes through to justify all kinds of things that are objectively issues I have with my Apple gear. It's no surprise that Apple executives give him all kinds of exclusives.
- iClaudiusX 9y ago
  John Siracusa and Marco Arment are great at getting to the parts where Apple can improve. My only fault with them is their idea of Windows seems stuck in the days of XP. Casey Liss, however, is just a cheerleader who would rather self-flagellate about his unworthiness to see Apple's blinding genius.
  - orbitur 9y ago
    Since you brought him up, Liss gets on my nerves because not only does he insist that something works fine for him, but he goes on extended rants about how everything is fine and he can't see what Arment/Siracusa are talking about. Like, he spends a lot of time claiming everything is fine but in an argumentative way. It's boring and frustrating. Marco's problematic/annoying in his own way, but Casey is aggressively... status quo???
    - atonse 9y ago
      But the fact that they have 3 distinct personalities also makes the show interesting, rather than many other podcasts where people just agree with each other (like the aforementioned Talk Show)
orbitur 9y ago
Do you actually think there's anything bad to write about with these?
matwood 9y ago
He's been critical of the camera bump and the notch. The main thing he's fighting against is this review is that the 8 is _not_ an upgrade over the 7. I think it is, but YMMV.
zeveb 9y ago
What's remarkable is how muted it is. If Apple decided to publish date of birth, Social Security number, mother's maiden name & complete chat history for all iOS users Gruber would write a blog detailing how this would be a welcome radical move to total transparency which will encourage the U.S. financial system to switch to more secure authentication options &c. &c. &c. The fact that his review is not 'this is the best, greatest, most wonderful thing that has ever happened in the entire history of mankind; Apple is mother, Apple is father; hail Jobs!' indicates how very unimpressing the newest iPhones are.
- elicash 9y ago
  Or maybe it indicates that your caricature isn't rooted in fact?

asafira 9y ago

Why is this the review that is making it to the front page? There are lots of sources that have, or will have, much better insights into the phone and tech that will spur much better conversation on HN; I hope one of those surfaces, too.

Brendinooo 9y ago
I think the author is a homer for sure, but his reviews are a lot more practical, more Walt Mossberg than Ars Technica. It's nice to know what's under the hood but it's also nice to know what the phone feels like in day-to-day use, and I think Mr. Gruber covers that well. And, for anyone who's already in the ecosystem, I think he's really good at relating new products to existing ones.
- asafira 9y ago
  Can you give an example of how Mr. Gruber covers something "day-to-day" well? Not that examples don't exist, but I have a pretty unhappy relationship with more touchy-feely metrics. Example: battery life. A good description of how battery life is dealt with in most reviews is "awfully": battery life depends on a crazy number of details that it is really hard to properly capture "day-to-day" usage in a review. A person that rarely uses their phone vs. one that plays games all day vs. one that uses the web browser all the time vs one that uses navigation all the time vs one that snapchats all day are going to see very different battery life performance; unless the phone is atrociously bad (which has happened before, too), it's hard to be able to properly gauge battery life.

whitehouse3 9y ago

> These are solid year-over-year updates — at least as impressive as the iPhone 7 was over the iPhone 6S. If they hadn’t debuted alongside the iPhone X we’d be arguing about whether these are the most impressive new iPhone models since the iPhone 6. There’s a lot to love about them and nothing to dislike. People who buy the iPhone 8 won't feel the satisfaction of owning the latest and greatest iPhone. That's what makes this update boring. It's already out of date.

Geee 9y ago
People who want a great phone buy the 8. People who are Apple fanatics and/or too rich and/or need a status symbol buy the X.
- ceejayoz 9y ago
  I'm personally considering the X because I suspect folks will do cool stuff with the new sensors. The dot projector, in particular, seems like it may be useful for 3D mapping of objects - would be pretty cool to wave your phone at something and be able to send the scan straight to a printer.
  - izacus 9y ago
    I didn't find any APIs for the new sensors - are those even exposed to the developers?
    - ropiku 9y ago
      Not directly but ARKit exposes face tracking, expressions and other info: https://developer.apple.com/videos/play/fall2017/601/ https://developer.apple.com/videos/play/fall2017/601/ https://developer.apple.com/documentation/arkit/creating_face_based_ar_experiences https://developer.apple.com/documentation/arkit/creating_fac...
  - problems 9y ago
    Unfortunately, Apple being Apple - doesn't expose those new sensors in any APIs.

mozumder 9y ago

One advantage of the iPhone 8+ over the iPhone X is that the display is wider, and that makes it easier to read larger accessibility fonts. My parents are keeping the plus size because of that.

merpnderp 9y ago
That's something I noticed too. I don't like the new aspect ratio of the X, but I want rid of the home button so much I'll deal with it.
jghn 9y ago
One advantage of the iPhone 8 over the iPhone X is that it's not a monstrous size. Even though the iPhone X is only slightly larger than the iPhone 7, the screen is still ridiculously larger, particularly since they got rid of the feature where it'll shrink the screen. I don't know why the market has decided that two hand smartphone usage is king, but it makes me sad. As someone who is frequently forced to use my device one handed and on the move its getting harder and harder to deal with.
- jcadam 9y ago
  I know. I wish they would update the iPhone SE (my current phone). As it is, looks like I'm not upgrading anytime soon.
  - jghn 9y ago
    I got sort of used to the size of the 7. After a year I'm still at the point where it annoys me at times but otherwise is fine. A hair smaller in height would be perfect for my needs. I was intrigued by the X in that I was willing to go a hair higher in height for a much larger screen until I realized they got rid of the small-scaling feature I still can't think of the name of. Considering I already use that all the time on my 7 and the screen is about to get much larger, it'd be necessary for me to get by.
- musage 9y ago
  Having a flip phone I get a kick out of it how dorky people look using their gadgets, the same way the one button mouse made me laugh when I had an actual one. More of all that, please. As long as it's more than a piece of cloth people chew on while staring off into the distance it's still way too useful and all the important people know it.

hectorlorenzo 9y ago

> After six days of daily use, this iPhone 8 shows no scratches or “micro-abrasions” whatsoever. When did we start having such low expectations of products? (my italics) Edit: grammar.

elicash 9y ago
His point was that while it has the same feel of the last-generation jet black version, it doesn't have the same downside of it.
- hectorlorenzo 9y ago
  I understand. My point is broader. Even if he's comparing to last year's product, he promotes this as a bonus. He is happy that the product is in mint condition after 6 days. Not even a week. It's slightly sad.
  - michaelt 9y ago
    Ugh, I noticed the same thing a few weeks ago reading reviews of battery life. Apparently "good" battery life these days means "in more sedate conditions it's easily going to get you home to a charger." When did people's expectations get so low?
  - rwc 9y ago
    You're reading too much into it. It was never presented as a "bonus", rather an honest accounting of why one material may be better than another. Both are "tacky" feeling, but only one didn't show wear and tear just one week into use.
sp332 9y ago
I got a noticeable scratch on my Galaxy S6 in less than a week. And it's not even made of glass. I don't expect anything I put in my pockets to remain in "mint condition" for very long.
pornel 9y ago
He couldn't test for longer, so it's not expectation of short lifetime, but stated limitation of the test. Plus, there is a very high expectation of having a material that is pleasant to touch, easy to grip, but is extremely hard, does not shatter and does not scratch even on a micro level.

basseq 9y ago

A lot of people out there have been asking me who the iPhone 8 is for, other than people who can’t or don’t want to spend $999 or more on an iPhone X. Well... Jesus. "Only cheapskates buy the 8", apparently. I pre-ordered the 8 Plus, because: - It was available a month sooner and I need a new phone. - The 8 Plus has all the same internals and features. I really just wanted the camera. - Face unlock seems gimmicky. Maybe next generation. - $200+ for what amounts to a "better" screen and "cooler" form factor: not worth it. So I guess I do fall into the "don't want to spend $999" category. Look down on me, pedants!

noncoml 9y ago
Don’t take it personally, nobody call you cheapskate. What I actually think that he means is that there is pretty much no difference between the two, other than the price and the form factor. But I will give you one more reason to not stick with 8: it’s a safer bet, it’s the fourth iteration of a well tested design, so I don’t expect to have any problems. On the other hand I am afraid the usual first Apple product generation problems will be there in X.
philtar 9y ago
Why not order a 7?
- dagw 9y ago
  The 8 has a better camera.
- fish_fan 9y ago
  Inductive charging!
  - basseq 9y ago
    I do like inductive charging, but I often find myself futzing about on my phone in bed at the end of the day, and my phone's on 5%. So I plug it in and keep using it. Hard to do that with inductive charging. Granted, my current iPhone is literally dying a protracted death[1], so YMMV. [1] Battery jumps around, screen doesn't work half the time, etc.

TurboHaskal 9y ago

> I like this change from three sizes to just two. Oh, come on...

bane 9y ago

This was a weirdly subdued review by Gruber, it even brings up areas where competitors have been doing something for a while without going through the normal Gruberian mental gymnastics to justify it. He even brings up Apple's inexplicable need to have a 16 GB base model until this year without trying to justify it. Gruber often gets himself in trouble by omission as much as by the circus-show of what he writes. But there's very little of that here. This reads like an honest review. My tl;dr of it is "It's a solid year over year update from the 7." note Not to worry, his previous articles will send the critically thinking reader down the road to infuration just like one might expect...I was afraid Gruber was losing his edge.

Eridrus 9y ago
All of the phones Apple released are boring, so it's kind of not surprising that people aren't worked up about it. At least to people who watch gadgets. The Mi Mix was a revelation, the iPhone X is just what people expected before all the leaks, with the exception of FaceID, which got leaked. Still, every time I see someone writing about Apple design, it seems like it's great when Apple does it - its even better than last year's model! - but it's always bad when competitors were. I'm still completely jealous of iPhone battery life though.
- currysausage 9y ago
  > the iPhone X is just what people expected But that's the point of iPhones nowadays, isn't it? Shipping features only when they feel ready (e.g. I guess this [1] won't be possible with Face ID). I switched from Android to iOS when I decided that I want a boring (but elegant) smartphone that bothers me as little as possible. > Apple design, it seems like it's great when Apple does it What many of their customers value, I think, is that Apple tends to get the big picture and the details right quite often. The big picture: When I buy an Apple phone, I can be quite sure not to see this on the default lockscreen: [2]. The details: [3]. You don't have to appreciate this level of detail, but some people do. That being said, not even Gruber claims that recent iPhones are "perfect" design-wise. [4] Just more detail-oriented than most competitors. > I'm still completely jealous of iPhone battery life though. Bought an iPhone 7 ½ year ago. I don't think battery life is anything to be jealous about. I hear good things about the Plus models though. [1] http://www.businessinsider.com/samsung-galaxy-note-8-facial-recognition-tricked-with-a-photo-2017-9 http://www.businessinsider.com/samsung-galaxy-note-8-facial-... [2] https://twitter.com/dcseifert/status/905104470429851648 https://twitter.com/dcseifert/status/905104470429851648 [3] https://www.imore.com/sites/imore.com/files/styles/larger/public/field/image/2015/04/galaxy-s6-bottom-alignment.jpg https://www.imore.com/sites/imore.com/files/styles/larger/pu... [4] https://daringfireball.net/2017/09/iphone_x_event_thoughts_and_observations#fn1-2017-09-14 https://daringfireball.net/2017/09/iphone_x_event_thoughts_a... (Footnote 1)

bischofs 9y ago

The pricing has changed slightly since last year. Last year’s entry model iPhone 7 cost $649. This year’s 64 GB iPhone 8 costs $699. Apple, of course, has no explanation for this. Since the price of new iphones is obviously rising faster than inflation, it begs the question; where is the market willing to go? Are most people okay with monthly payments on phones when they were never at that point with computers?

criddell 9y ago
> Are most people okay with monthly payments on phones They have been so far.
MBCook 9y ago
The explanation stated/assumed elsewhere is that the price of flash has gone up significantly in the last year and may go up further. Apple is changing the price now. Obviously they could have just taken a hit to their margins instead, but that wouldn’t be Apple-like. (I’m an Apple fan, but they love their margins)
orbitur 9y ago
Anyone who does even a little research knows flash storage prices are going up. And anyone who pays attention to Apple knows that they have a target margin on their hardware (non-cable, non-accessory), and it's immovable. They will not budge on it. It's frustrating. I have no doubt current RAM prices also contribute to the MBP's overpriced feeling, and it's also why 32GB is seemingly unimportant to Apple at the moment.
vvhn 9y ago
There’s some interesting pricing games being played by Apple. For all new models, The 256GB price is the same, the 128GB and 32GB have been eliminated and in their place a single 64GB model in between ( 700 ) the price of the 32 ( 649 ) and the 64 (749 ). Personally the 128 GB was the sweet spot - 32/64 are too little and 256 is too much
always_good 9y ago
>Are most people okay with monthly payments on phones when they were never at that point with computers? Huh? Do you think people don't use minimum monthly payment financing on laptops and desktop computers? There are people who use that option for anything that costs in the 3 digits. How is a phone any different?

TYPE_FASTER 9y ago

The thing that struck me watching the keynote was the positioning of the iPhone 8 and the iPhone X. I think Apple knows the majority of people will buy the iPhone 8 Plus, and the X is targeted at two niches: pro Instagrammers, and kids who always get the flagship and use Snapchat. For social media pros, max selfie is a revenue stream, and the X will get them more views. The X is the modern Mac Pro, since the modern content creator is living in Instagram. I have a 6, and would like an 8 Plus. The difference between the camera on the 6 and the 7 in indoor lighting is noticeable to me, and I use my phone mostly as a camera these days.

MBCook 9y ago
I’ll be getting an X because I think it’s neat, I’ve got a 7 now. I agree with reviews I’ve seen elsewhere. If you have a 6 or 6S it will be a huge jump in performance and camera quality, totally worth it. If you have a 7 it’s a nice upgrade (especially for TrueTone) but you could easily go without. The 7 was a massive jump over my 6. The 8 is a huge jump (in performance) over the 7. Coming from a 6? You’ll love it.

davidivadavid 9y ago

I don't understand his rant about "wireless" charging. He wrote a whole article about it with two dictionary definitions that completely contradict his own point, too. Wireless means there's no wire and you don't need to plug your phone to charge it. So it's wireless charging.

jmull 9y ago
I think the objection is because there's still a wire between the wall and the pad, and your phone still has to be on the pad. That is, your phone still has to be physically connected, through a wire, to an electrical outlet. Maybe "plugless" is a term that more accurately describes the benefit. IMO, it's a very nice benefit so I don't mean to minimize it. We suppose that eventually there will be some kind of charging where you don't even have to set your device on a pad -- I guess it will charge if you just get it into a charging area or room. Then we might want to call that wireless but the term will be taken. I don't think that's really an issue though. That's a marketing issue we can let the marketing people solve if/when we get there. I'd probably try to call it "True Wireless" or "Long Wireless" but that's probably a sign of why I'm not a marketing person.
SirHound 9y ago
It's wireless to a pedant. The interface isn't a wire going physically into the phone, but the phone has to be physically connected to the pad. In some ways it's even less convenient than wired charging. Try reading and charging in bed. The term "wireless" clearly invokes imagery of a kind of ambient charging. Marketeers know this, and the term is used in bad faith.
clashmoore 9y ago
The rant is about how to charge the iPhone or any device with "wireless" charging is that you still need the wire to be touching the phone or device. There is still a wire involved and they're calling it "wireless".
- jbob2000 9y ago
  It's a petty semantic argument. You don't need to plug it into your phone, which is the annoying part. You just plug the pad in and leave it plugged in forever. You require much less accuracy to charge your phone now. It will be a boon to people who suffer from tremors or have weak hands.

vladdanilov 9y ago

To recap: Glass + Stainless Steel > Aluminum / Plastic > Glass + Aluminum > Glass + Stainless Steel 2010 > 2017 > The lighting effects in Portrait mode, though, are interesting… There have also been a few [shots] where the edges … have confused the hell out of the iPhone’s depth sensing… original Portrait mode last year shipped in similar state… When it works, though, … > … what exactly was “bionic” about the A11 chip … from Apple marketing-speak to plain English, is that The Bionic Man and Woman were cool, and the A11 chip is very cool. Brand new iPhone 8 “high-speed charging” vs year-old iPhone 7 charging: > 30 minutes it was at 54 percent, and at 45 minutes it was at 72 percent > 30 minutes it was at 43 percent, and at 45 minutes it was at 65 percent True Tone, mostly software and probably $10 of hardware, is the only noticeable display improvement. > Last year’s entry model iPhone 7 cost $649. This year’s 64 GB iPhone 8 costs $699. Apple, of course, has no explanation for this.

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davidcollantes 9y ago

> But they did debut alongside the iPhone X, and because of that almost nobody is excited about them... Only thing I don't agree with on this post. Because of the price tag, and the notch -- mostly -- the X hasn't impressed me much. The 8, and 8Plus, on the other hand, are closer to what I was expecting: an iPhone with upgraded hardware, and unique features (compared to the previous versions).