7 ms·
Commercial pilot here, currently flying transatlantic routes. I avoided Irma last week while flying to Buenos Aires (it was not this big yet). I have partners i
by omegant 9y ago
Commercial pilot here, currently flying transatlantic routes. I avoided Irma last week while flying to Buenos Aires (it was not this big yet). I have partners in San Juan at this moment, bunkered in the hotel.
We see this as a crazy move, very well executed, but too risky for the plane itself (not so much for the crew).
Let me explain, the metar and tafors (the airport meteorological reports we use) during the flight in San Juan show that the flight was doable. No crazy winds during landing, and worsening during take of but well within the limits you may find in a local thunderstorm.
The predictions allowed them to see the window to fly in and out. If arriving the weather was too bad or you see the hurricane getting too close to the airport,they could have got away without landing.
For take off either you have the right conditions (under the legal limits) or you don't.
What they risked IMHO is having some kind of technical problem or delay once in San Juan and having to stay there to weather the hurricane. That could mean heavy damage to the airplane while on the airport, even a total loss.
That said for me the most amazing of it all, is not the short stay at the ground. While very fast is not uncommon to see them with an experieced team, the slower part is the disembarking and embarking of the passengers, and they surely were all motivated to hurry.
The most impressive is how they followed the quite thin alley between the hurricane arms till they were clear of the bad weather. In a situation like that you only see red and magenta in your radar and a narrow black or green zone where you can fly safely. That's surely was the most scary part for them beyond the adrenalin of a fast and potentially dangerous operation.
Looks like the typical movie scene of a spaceship passing between closing doors!!
Certainly brass balls.
Edit: some typos and a "don't" that I left behind and was changing the meaning of a sentence. Sorry written from the cellphone.
- narvind 9y agoNot sure if there were really any passengers disembarking in San Juan. I would guess that it was pretty much an empty flight flying in. What a heroic effort! Salute to the entire team!
- what_ever 9y agoThere were 30 people on the flight to San Juan.
- Jare 9y agoEach one of them must be quite a story. Being in San Juan despite the danger must have been very important for most, and they almost were unable to make it.
- snowwrestler 9y agoPerhaps disaster response folks pre-positioning. Red Cross, etc.
- Chaebixi 9y agoOr people rejoining elderly relatives or other dependents...
- hueving 9y agoAirfare was cheap to make it an attractive mileage run.
- giancarlostoro 9y agoHonestly wondered if Jim Cantore was on that plane.
- 9y ago
- lucb1e 9y agoThank you for the insightful explanation!
- mschaef 9y agoThis comment is a great example of why I read the comments on this site. Thanks for the answer. It provided some context I'd been wondering about.
- collinmanderson 9y agoAmazing. Anyone have a video of the flight path with radar?
- CoffeeDregs 9y agohttps://www.flightradar24.com/data/flights/dl302#ec2eb82 https://www.flightradar24.com/data/flights/dl302#ec2eb82
- MichaelApproved 9y agoIs it possible to show the playback of the flight with weather?
- digi_owl 9y agoseems various weather layers are included in the higher tiers of payment packages (the business package in particular). Not sure if they are also part of recorded flights though.
- omegant 9y agoPictures of the departure with weather radar. http://www.miamiherald.com/news/nation-world/world/article171577632.html http://www.miamiherald.com/news/nation-world/world/article17...
- jshelly 9y agoThank you for the details from a Pilot's point of view. I was watching this flight play out live and it was certainly a nail biter. I couldn't believe they were going to land let alone take off.
- SoMisanthrope 9y agoAlso a pilot of 31 years (jeeze has it been that long!) apparently they should have crewed the other flights with military transport pilots. They would NOT have turned around... how many flights flipped a bitch without trying to find the hole? LOL All macho talk aside, good on that Delta crew!!! That's worth a case of beer, on the Ada boy scale!
- digi_owl 9y agoNow i wonder who in Delta management were willing to put the plane, never mind the crew, on the line for this flight. It if was totaled by the hurricane it would not have looked good on the company books.
- joering2 9y agoVery good question. Whether Im stockholder or shareholder in this position I want to know why and why is risking hundreds of millions of dollars in my rolling stock not to mention lost lives and PR disaster. Honestly there is NO reasonable explanation. But wait few days to find out there was some high ranking company member or CEO/C level exec or his/her family stuck over there and thats why they send a plane. And no - if it wouldnt take off that minute, you are talking about wreck taken off the books.
- whack 9y agoThe optimist in me would like to believe that Delta took this risk, because they considered their humanitarian mission more important that the mechanical integrity of one plane. I would encourage each and every company I own stocks in, to prioritize their goals similarly.
- Reason077 9y agoAs explained by omegant in the post above, lives were not at risk here. The risk was to the aircraft: if it had been delayed on the ground at SJU for any reason, it might not have be able to depart before the storm hit and would likely have suffered severe damage.
- mmirate 9y agoNormally I would think that > hundreds of millions of dollars in my rolling stock would refer to the aircraft ... except that's a nearly 1-order-of-magnitude overestimate of it's value (a single $100M, not multiple).
- deleted 9y ago
- KeepTalking 9y agoOne often neglected risk is the risk to the ramp crew from lightning. For a quick turn around in the middle of a storm like this, someone needs to neglect their own personal safety. Many times lighting is less risky to the plane but even before the storms roll in the lighting picks up.
- wtallis 9y agoHurricanes tend to have far less lightning than everyday storm fronts.
- deleted 9y ago[deleted]
- unionemployee 9y agoIt's interesting that a commercial pilot would buy in to the "risk" bent of this article. Are you an inexperienced/new pilot? I flew into and out of the outer bands of Harvey last month. That portion of the system is no different than any storm. Nor is flying between the bands. That gap is huge compared to a little tiny airplane. No "adrenaline" or "balls" were involved here. Just competence. I'm sure the pilots have had far more harrowing experiences flying back and forth across the US in the summer and the departing passengers were in no danger.
- malmsteen 9y agoStupid question: what about flying above the hurricane on the way back ? Possible ?
- askvictor 9y agoDepends how tall the storm is. Planes engines breathe air, and there is less air the higher you go, so there's a limit to how high you can go; roughly 10km for commerical jets (actually it's a factor of altitude and speed; at high altitude, you need to go at least a certain speed to get enough air into the engines, but if you go too fast the plane breaks apart). I think big storms are about 10km tall.
- rowyourboat 9y agoIt's actually less about the engines and more about the wings. As altitude increases, the air becomes thinner. That means that wings stall speed increases. At the same time, as the air becomes thinner, the speed of sound decreases - and breaking the sound barrier will break your plane. As you go higher, the stall speed and the speed of sound converge. The point where they meet is called "coffin corner". It is really not a nice place to be: If you are in coffin corner, if you try to descend, you risk speeding up and breaking the plane. If you try to slow down, you risk stalling - although it is possible to recover from a stall, you cannot recover without speeding up. It is generally advisable stop climbing before you box yourself in like that.
- colejohnson66 9y agoWhat would a pilot do in a situation like that?
- Dylan16807 9y agoDescend very gently.
- blorsh 9y agoThis is exactly what you'd do in a Concorde, U-2, SR-71, F-15, or F-22. All of these can get to the required FL600, at 60000 feet. The F-15 and F-22 have an extra bonus. They can climb straight up through the eye. The U-2 could probably manage a spiral climb within the eye.
- parisivy 9y agoDid you fly Atlanta - Buenos Aires? I flew on Wednesday 6th. Were you my pilot? :)