5 ms·

You're missing the fact that if you sue Facebook for any patent infringement, even a legitimate one (say, you're the creator of some new hardware), Facebook wil

You're missing the fact that if you sue Facebook for any patent infringement, even a legitimate one (say, you're the creator of some new hardware), Facebook will revoke your React license. Also, Facebook has no vdom patent. It's not like you can be granted a secret, hidden patent (even the word "patent" itself means "open").

chii 9y ago
> Facebook will revoke your React license. you mean their patent grant? How can an open source license like apache, MIT or bsd be "revoked"? Do facebook have a public blacklist of people who aren't allowed to use react?
- devdoomari 9y ago
  um... because it's they can? I can make a library with MIT license to everyone else but you. MIT and BSD licenses merely provide short-cuts to understanding a project's licensing
  - gstein67 9y ago
    "everyone else but you" would no longer be an OSS license.
  - nopzor 9y ago
    Not practically, because once you make a library with an mit license available to anyone, they can give to anyone you didn't "want" to give it to, per the mit license.
- gstein67 9y ago
  Correct. Once released under an OSS license, that cannot be revoked. They can change/restrict the license on future releases, but you can also choose an older release, which uses the more favorable OSS license.
- cyphar 9y ago
  Apache revokes your rights under the patent section of the license if you sue anyone for patents granted under said license: > If You institute patent litigation against any entity (including a cross-claim or counterclaim in a lawsuit) alleging that the Work or a Contribution incorporated within the Work constitutes direct or contributory patent infringement, then any patent licenses granted to You under this License for that Work shall terminate as of the date such litigation is filed. Note that the "Grant of Copyright License" of Apache doesn't grant you the right to use the work, so revoking the patent license is effectively revoking the whole license (though you can still redistribute the work).
spacetexas 9y ago
The BSD license doesn't allow future revocation in itself. They can make a new version with a different license but not for old versions.
Lazare 9y ago
> You're missing the fact that if you sue Facebook for any patent infringement, even a legitimate one (say, you're the creator of some new hardware), Facebook will revoke your React license. Incorrect. (This has been clarified many times, including in Facebook's official FAQ about React licensing.) > Also, Facebook has no vdom patent. It's not like you can be granted a secret, hidden patent (even the word "patent" itself means "open"). I agree. Many people have looked; no one has found one. Hence why I believe there's no risk to using React.
- JoshMnem 9y ago
  Do you mean this one? https://code.facebook.com/pages/850928938376556 https://code.facebook.com/pages/850928938376556 It doesn't address the scenario of Facebook's violating your patents first.
  - Lazare 9y ago
    The key phrase I was replying to was "Facebook will revoke your React license." Facebook cannot revoke your React license in any circumstances, as that link makes clear.
    - cyphar 9y ago
      They revoke the React patent grant, which effectively downgrades "the React license" to just a stock BSD 3-clause license. At that point they will likely counter-sue you for patent infringement. In my mind that situation is effectively identical to losing "the right to use" license on grounds of patent suit (like Apache). Interestingly, in Apache you'd still be sued for patent infringement (not copyright infringement) because "right to use" is provided as a patent license.
      - Lazare 9y ago
        > They revoke the React patent grant, which effectively downgrades "the React license" to just a stock BSD 3-clause license. At that point they will likely counter-sue you for patent infringement. Yes, but for what patent? People have looked; none have been found. :)
deleted 9y ago
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chii 9y ago

> Facebook will revoke your React license. you mean their patent grant? How can an open source license like apache, MIT or bsd be "revoked"? Do facebook have a public blacklist of people who aren't allowed to use react?

devdoomari 9y ago
um... because it's they can? I can make a library with MIT license to everyone else but you. MIT and BSD licenses merely provide short-cuts to understanding a project's licensing
- gstein67 9y ago
  "everyone else but you" would no longer be an OSS license.
- nopzor 9y ago
  Not practically, because once you make a library with an mit license available to anyone, they can give to anyone you didn't "want" to give it to, per the mit license.
gstein67 9y ago
Correct. Once released under an OSS license, that cannot be revoked. They can change/restrict the license on future releases, but you can also choose an older release, which uses the more favorable OSS license.
cyphar 9y ago
Apache revokes your rights under the patent section of the license if you sue anyone for patents granted under said license: > If You institute patent litigation against any entity (including a cross-claim or counterclaim in a lawsuit) alleging that the Work or a Contribution incorporated within the Work constitutes direct or contributory patent infringement, then any patent licenses granted to You under this License for that Work shall terminate as of the date such litigation is filed. Note that the "Grant of Copyright License" of Apache doesn't grant you the right to use the work, so revoking the patent license is effectively revoking the whole license (though you can still redistribute the work).

spacetexas 9y ago

The BSD license doesn't allow future revocation in itself. They can make a new version with a different license but not for old versions.

Lazare 9y ago

> You're missing the fact that if you sue Facebook for any patent infringement, even a legitimate one (say, you're the creator of some new hardware), Facebook will revoke your React license. Incorrect. (This has been clarified many times, including in Facebook's official FAQ about React licensing.) > Also, Facebook has no vdom patent. It's not like you can be granted a secret, hidden patent (even the word "patent" itself means "open"). I agree. Many people have looked; no one has found one. Hence why I believe there's no risk to using React.

JoshMnem 9y ago
Do you mean this one? https://code.facebook.com/pages/850928938376556 https://code.facebook.com/pages/850928938376556 It doesn't address the scenario of Facebook's violating your patents first.
- Lazare 9y ago
  The key phrase I was replying to was "Facebook will revoke your React license." Facebook cannot revoke your React license in any circumstances, as that link makes clear.
  - cyphar 9y ago
    They revoke the React patent grant, which effectively downgrades "the React license" to just a stock BSD 3-clause license. At that point they will likely counter-sue you for patent infringement. In my mind that situation is effectively identical to losing "the right to use" license on grounds of patent suit (like Apache). Interestingly, in Apache you'd still be sued for patent infringement (not copyright infringement) because "right to use" is provided as a patent license.
    - Lazare 9y ago
      > They revoke the React patent grant, which effectively downgrades "the React license" to just a stock BSD 3-clause license. At that point they will likely counter-sue you for patent infringement. Yes, but for what patent? People have looked; none have been found. :)

deleted 9y ago

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